Paypal Holds Sellers' Funds Hostage 68 comments
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Is it a glitch? Or is it another way to increase revenue? Who knows? I guess Donahoe knows but he's not talking. What am I referring to? eBay (EBAY) cleverly wove the mandatory use of Paypal into its user agreement and now that it's gone into effect, Paypal holds on sellers accounts have increased by leaps and bounds.
When is it going to end? My guess is when the State Attorneys General unite and regulate Paypal or when eBay ceases to exist – whichever comes first. My money is on eBay because there's been a 20% drop in traffic, the stock is at a low not seen in nearly 10 years, and disruptive innovations continue to drive buyers & sellers to user friendly sites like Bonanzle & Etsy.
New Glitch. On the morning of November 6 many sellers discovered they could not withdrawal funds from their Paypal accounts due to a glitch that eBay/Paypal has yet to acknowledge or resolve.
Is this related to the mysterious eCheck glitch? Sellers began reporting unexplained holds on their accounts as early as October 25 and within 2 days the glitch spread like a virus throughout the eBay selling community as one seller after another discovered their funds had cleared but were being hostage as there was no way to claim them.
No resolution appears to be in sight and eBay/Paypal has yet to make an announcement or notify members. Paypal did offer sellers a few pennies on the dollar for the use of their money (if they had a Paypal Money Market account). Anyone want to guess how much money Paypal earned?
One eBay member named Permacrisis has an interesting theory. The extra load/artificial spike imposed on October 20th overloaded Paypal's servers (insufficient band with) and Paypal had to choose between collecting funds and disbursing funds.
Sellers have also reported that their funds are being held from a few days to months. eBay/Paypal excuses range from: 1) suspicious transaction; 2) no feedback from buyer; 3) less than 100 seller feedback; 4) false positives; 5) no shipping information; etc. etc. etc. none of which have anything to do with processing a transaction.
I think this situation was best summed up by deltamaster who wrote "If Wells Fargo, Bank of America, US Bank, or any other financial institution were to conduct business in this fashion there would be regulators crawling all over them like fire ants on a grasshopper."
Which begs the question, how can anyone trust Paypal because it is not regulated, profits from its failure to perform, and operates in a shroud of secrecy?
Stock position: None.
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This article has 68 comments:
ebay won't let you do this when listing (in order to protect their profits), but once you have your listing inserted you can revise your text any way you wish.
> jack
As an aside, I was able to transfer $ from my paypal acct to my bank acct w/o a hitch last week.
Ebay and Amazon is a great place to buy a book or cd if your too lazy to go to the store. other than that forget it .....
You are absolutely correct. Same experience here before I left ebay permanently several months ago.
Whenever transferring money from paypal to my bank account, or vise versa, it took 10 days! Everyone I know has had the EXACT same experience! Of all the people a few years back who inspired me to plug in to ebay, and love it themselves, every last one of them have left and don't use it AT ALL anymore.
About a year ago my daughter my daughter executed a friendly refund on ebay as agreed with a buyer when the garment did not fit. She had to transfer the money from her bank account into paypal account. It took... wait for it ... 10 days! Fortunately, the buyer was very understanding and there was no backlash in regards to feedback!
My daughter hasn't used ebay/paypal since. Responsible people do not continue to use irresponsible venues.
As Dinah Balk has stated in previous articles, and you can verify this for yourself, ebay inc makes 10 MILLION per quarter from money on the float.
And before all the cheerleaders start crying that "every" money facility does this, not for 10 days, they don't! NONE that I know takes TEN DAYS to transfer money.
For all ebay's stiff operation requirements they hold themselves exempt.
Contemptible.
Everybody has a motive for writing an article like this. What's yours?
Also, read the seller information again. Many, many people sign up with Amazon to sell without reading up on their policy first. Amazon says what it means, and means what it says. They don't suspend for nothing. Plus, new sellers are held in review in the beginning. 10 % feedback is typical on Amazon. That's just the way it is. Read the policies. Again. ALL of them.
Where the hell is our paid officials and tax dollars going to protect us from this crap!!??
Don't forget, PayPal IS NOT A BANK and users DO NOT have the same protection as an FDIC insured financial institution! They've thought out the 500 page agreement that you have to “read” and sign very carefully so they can screw you without consequences. They can do what they want and be protected under their contract.
Let's hope our new President does away with this corporate behavior and the “read-between-the-line... & fine print” contracts.
This situation is do or die for many of us ebay sellers, because if we can't access our Paypal electronic check cleared payments BUT PAYPAL IS TELLING BUYERS THEIR E-CHECK DID CLEAR, it wouldn't take much ebay negative feedback or DSR/eBay Detailed Seller Rating "dings" to put most sellers RIGHT OUT OF BUSINESS and have their lives ruined, just like that. Yep, all due to yet another planned "glitch" that ebay and Paypal routinely take part in. They get away with it because they know they can. Ever notice that EVERY SINGLE "GLITCH" ALWAYS FALLS IN FAVOR OF EBAY/PAYPAL? Hmmm, now that's a huge coincidence.
And fellow ebay sellers, before you think it's just you and a few of other ebay sellers being cheated, lied to, and (if you call Paypal about it) treated with arrogance and ignorance over the phone, just take a glance at just ONE of the ebay discussion board discussions about this problem. This Paypal "glitch" has been going on for weeks. You can find it under ebay's "Paypal" discussion board, or you can just click this direct link below:
forums.ebay.com/db2/th...
We have been an eBay seller since the beginning, and we had some of our funds recently held as 'unclaimed' in what PayPal claimed was a 'glitch'. Dinah has it right, and it seems to me that holding these funds is close to illegal, if not outright illegal. It will likely take a court case challenge to get them to change their policies, and not many sellers will bother with that, as it is easier to just move to something else. Amazon is not the only challenge, however, as traditional bricks and mortar stores are also an option for sellers.
Ebay continues to offer nothing but dis-incentives to sellers, and it seems to me that without sellers, Ebay is going to be toast. They can import big-volume corporate sellers, but buying new commercial merchandise on eBay, is not what made them great. It was the thrill of finding something that could not be found anywhere else, that made eBay work, and John Donohue just doesn't understand that concept. Without the 'thrill of the hunt', eBay is just another big-box volume discounter.
Who comes after Donohue, is the question I think must be asked, as to continue to leave it in this guys hands is corporate suicide.
I posted here when the stock was in the mid 20's, 'Sell the stock if you own it, and short it if you don't', and that advice stands today. Donohue will not go back to the core values that made eBay work in the beginning, and that flaw will be fatal.
I know it's hard to keep track of all the glitches this company has but I'm sure you all remember and know of the continuing glitch of items being hidden from their best match search engine, right? Well, I was a victim of paying for this service and not getting it.
So, when I contacted eBay to find out about the "hidden items" glitch, I was told by a rep "when you signed the contract you agreed to accept any and all glitches." (I wished I could of sent my fist through the phone line. LMAO!). When I asked her if she expected me to keep my part of the bargain and pay my monthly eBay bill for my items not being seen or advertised as paid, she said "YES!"
IMO: This company is the worst I have ever seen. Enron should have been dismantled prior to them screwing and destroying the lives of tens of thousands of people - and so should eBay/PayPal before it's too is headline news.
"It's people like you who have ruined the market by trying to manipulate companies with near slander."
Manipulate??? Is that anything like “You asked we listened! We’ve lowered listing fees and “adjusted” Final Value Fees”???
When good and honest sellers get screwed by scammers and buyers with remorse syndrome, and are left a big fat negative feedback because the seller refuses to give them a refund, free shipping, and let them keep the item too, eBay allows that slanderous comment, and destructive feedback to remain a part of the sellers permanent feedback history. eBay says that any comment left by a scammer/buyer is only an opinion (and then comes the “we’re just a venue” part). We like to think that we who comment here are only leaving an opinion as well.
Usually, I have found that where there is smoke, the fire tends to be following very closely behind.
Maybe, Ebay should become a bit introspective and re-evaluate the causes of such supposed venom.
A message to the sellers:
What is stopping any of you from researching and finding out about the legalites of what you complain about?
I might add, there is off-ebay-site problems with Paypal use that is non-ebay related. And those are very bad and some have been newsworthy.
But the paypal-ebay umbilical cord seems very toxic.
The only money PayPal has held from customers to our little e-bay store PayPal also would not allow us to ship to the Buyer until the money actually cleared the PayPal systems.
It is interesting how the 1500 employee lay off received so much attention, however, OVER 10% of total powersellers were laid off/suspended because of flawed aggressive policy poorly implemented has not had a placement. This is proved by:
blog.sellerdome.com/?p...
This study shows that between 15k-30K e bay powersellers who account for $3000-$20,000 in seller fees paid to e bay each month from sellers. This is the only company separating itself from its long time customers, many, like myself, who has been with the company fatefully since inception and made it a community before new management. This seems a larger story than a simple layoff of e bay employees. Ebay saves money by laying off paid employees, but e bays profit takes a hit by getting rid of partners who contribute to e bay profit. For example: 20,000 powersellers/partners laid off/suspended that account for an average of $5,000 per month seller fees = $100,000,000 each month in seller fees not received by e bay. That is $1,200,000,000 per year in revenue given up for aggressively flawed policy by current management. Figure that on 20% margin and facing the headwinds of a slowed economy. The idea current ebay management had was by getting rid of 10% of its selling partners was going drive back 32% of its buyers, however, that has clearly not been the case, because the policy change was flawed and implemented with such aggression over a short period of time, 6 months total, 3 months aggressively.
Ebay seems to have driven away buyers by this and the new search method that sellers or buyers don't like with no concern of management. The company has managed to drive its investors away in the same motion as stock prices show a drop since new management put in place 6 months ago, before market crash. Ebay management charged its sellers/partners for decline in its core business and seems not to have taken into account the increased competition of walmart, best buy, circuit city and many others putting marketing dollars into the online sector of business. Ebay pushing away its partners, sellers and buyers, is only going to make profit softer and push away investors. With 70% more competitors in the market e bay only dropped 30% seems a strong market hold for e bay and a reason to support its partners in a currently working policy rather than place blame partners and will prove to decline its future market share as pointed out by many market analysis and Powersellers.
Ebay, through the wild west style new management, took a look at itself and realized it had a drop in the number of sellers buying on its site. It decided it was because of bad "buyer experience" and immediately, it seems without full thought of backfire, decided it was the sellers fault. In some cases, this may be true, but it is most likely because of a misunderstanding or lack of communication between ebay, the seller and buyer. If e bay would set up a system so that all involved understood the agreement that was fair for all, then buyer satisfaction would be a great number and managements approval ratings would not be in the 20% range "22% “Approve", see the link below and see what employees are saying about CEO John J. Donahoe:
www.glassdoor.com/Revi... to see Mr. Donahoe's DSR rating.
Note the 168 Reviews under the rating.
This is the only CEO that I know of that has its partners/buyers/seller... asking for them to step down:
www.petitiononline.com...
Notice that the former CEO WHITMAN MARGARET sold many shares before ebay implemented flawed policy:
moneycentral.msn.com/i...
It is doubtful that the sellers, as well as buyers, who make up the success or frailer of the core business rating of John J. Donahoe would be that high. It should be noted that there was a lay off, but this rating was only 1% more well before the layoff. All you have to do is see the off e bay blogs of e bay sellers and buyers to know how they fell now. I say "off ebay" because e bay understandably deletes any blog on there site where people speak out.
Instead of working within the community, that once believed that "people are basically good", took on a policy that made its tight net community fell like "criminals under big brother" and strong feelings of dislike for the symbol that was once regarded by its employees, buyers and sellers. Ebay has aggressively pushed away its partners will prove to decline its future market share and a relationship that may go un repaired when new management is called upon. When the culture was "people are basically good" employees at e bay were chronic buyers on e bay, now that has changed. It should also be noted that the sellers they suspended are also big buyers on e bay generally.
Ebay has withstood the .com storm because of a superior system and its ability to hold steady to the working core business policy. Its customers fell that is no longer the case and many companies like bonanzle.com and OLA.COM (onlineauction.com) and Ebid.net are rushing to try to meet seller and buyer demands that ebay seems unwilling to meet. Many small auction sites have tried to compete in the past but been successful in driving traffic. Now a once complacent audience of e bay buyers and sellers are seeing the changes and the likely hood they are being driven away through aggressive, unfair, flawed policy changes and are taking note to change to someone with the old values that made ebay a community that worked. You can see from the link below the demand that is being driven away from e bay by Bonanzle, Ebid.net, onlineauction.com Ubid.com that would have been unheard of 6 months ago.
www.quantcast.com/bona...
www.quantcast.com/ebid...
www.quantcast.com/ubid...
www.quantcast.com/shop...
Notice the chart of hits per month going up on these auction sites. Now look at e bays chart, it shows the amount of volume coming to the site is declining:
www.quantcast.com/ebay...
This is a small amount of buyers and sellers compared to e bay, but it does show a market who is hungry to meet the demand of current buyers and sellers, and what is maybe most important that buyers and sellers are finding the ability for change. A safe sales platform that is demanded, products that are truly less for buyers, not just advertised as less, but are less for now because sellers are driving buyers to the site.
When e bay was a "venue", now it is felt by many of its sellers that it acts as an employer or landlord or big brother, by design of new policy, it was profitable for sellers and a great value for buyers. Sellers drove traffic to the site because buyers knew they could get many of the items for a large percentage below retail, at or below wholesale. Seller fees, total have gone up, $0.35 listings are great, but the back end is higher making the total successful sale higher for the buyer and then pushed to the customer. All the discounts given now with the new promotion is good marketing, but those discounts/profit must come from somewhere, it is a known fact that nothing is free. I suspect the seller will foot the bill for this discount, this will cause price to go up or profit to go down. Profit for sellers once offering wholesale prices. This will mean to raise prices or move to a site like OLA.COM or Ebid.net that does not charge listing or final value fee. This will make that seller profitable and give its buyer a low price.
E bay is being accused of being a follower in the last few months and is trying to make itself like Amazon and other .com retailers. Ebay sellers who use Amazon report little to no sales. E bay has a niche (wholesale products) and Amazon has a niche (books, CDs with unmatched distribution etc) and both worked independently of each other, this is why Ebay sellers are not successful on Amazon and Amazon sellers are not successful using ebay. New ebay management, and even investors, have had a hard time realizing Amazon is a different market plan. Many e bay sellers are leaving to do Amazon but it is feared this will not prove successful for them. The e bay system worked and most were satisfied, buyers and sellers could realize other bad buyers or sellers. I sold $30,000 on Amazon per year with my 82 unique product catalog, but sold 1.7 m on ebay with the same catalog. It would be much different if the items were not $100+, if they were books, cds then Amazon would by far be superior.
Buyers and sellers are not happy anymore and the numbers will continue to show as long as this management stays. Economy will play a roll, that is why ebay can't afford to gamble with management that has proven to drive its partners, sellers and buyers, away. The company is large enough it will be around for a long time, maybe not in the online auction sector effectively as it was before, but it is still a mystery to many who use or used to use the site why this management has been allowed to make this aggressive of a change. If this is where they wanted to go, it would takes years to change a company this size effectively, it can't be done in 6 months times and certainty not given a slow in the economy.
Things are not happy under new management/John Donahoe management has made no one happy, employees, sellers or buyers or its investors. It has been a 6 month meltdown since new management fumbled a working system.
I talked to the owner of onlineauction.com 1-800-900-2828, Rowen Grisham, a previous e bay powerseller who seen improper change coming long before many sellers and buyers realized. He said he had seen a flood of sellers and buyers calling to learn about the site in the last 4 months. Rowen Grishamw says they are about to roll out a goggle search program that will make it more visible. This is just one example of where e bay buyer and seller base is going. Grisham seems to want to supply its sellers and buyers with a fair service, as when the ebay site was born and acted as a venue rather than an employer. Small companies that are hungry and taking advantage of a situation where ebay is not satisfying its demand.
Anyone considering investing or putting time into future sales may want to take a look at the aggressive, flawed policy’s they have put in place, there are little to no direct policy as there has been. Sellers, buyers and investors wouldn't be leaving if there was any good reason to stay.
Some of E bay's management ideas were good, however, has done a poor job or implementing the new changes and communicating to its buyers, sellers only after a few months of effect, some loosing there e bay business because of improper, unmonitored data, is still learning and it seems no one knows the answers even at the top account managers level. Its buyers do not realize that the DSR DETAILED SELLER RATING, the 5 stars under the feedback rating is not based on a 100 point scale like every other system in the free world. For example, from 1 to 5, 1 is poor, 3 is average and 5 is excellent. With e bay, 4,5 is average and 5 is good, I am glad they didn't have my math teachers in Collage. So many times buyers rate a 3 when they don't realize they are giving the seller a unacceptable rating that could potentially suspend his/her account from e bay as so many has been suspended in the last 3 months because of improper data that has been now used as the bible of e bay to rate seller performance. It should also be noted that a flaw in the data of the 5 star DSR is that if a customer is happy, they fell that leaving positive feedback served its purpose and they have caused a positive vote to the seller, e bay has not educated the buyer, so they do not leave a star rating at all, and are not required to and a large % do not, but leave a positive feedback as it is not required. But the buyer who is mad and is leaving hasty feedback will be more than motivated to leave a 1 or 2 for all stars. For this reason, good sellers offering great service and products are being suspended from e bay by record numbers, this cuts the life cord of the seller as well as core business at e bay and the reason buyers come to the site and investors invest in the company.
Ebay may have ruined their market flair for both buyers and sellers forever. Too many restricting rule changes, increased charges, paypal demands, seller ratings. This has ultimately destroyed their bottom line.
Many sellers, buyers and investors alike have a dedicated special interest and hope management changes and ebay will turn themselves around, but it is going to take some quick and correct policy change back to the system that worked to undo what has been done in what would be considered by many as well as a powerseller account manager in a telephone conversation said that this is "the most aggressive change e bay has ever done" it is costing sellers there business and driving buyers away from the site. The Best Match search is fatally flawed and $0.35 listings are not going to fix that.
Sellers of the unique items that made eBay famous (and who paid listing fees) are leaving in record numbers, while eBay brokers deals with corporate sellers of new stuff you can get anywhere who don't pay listing fees deteriorate the profits. And their buyers are following them. Watch the Q4 and Q1 09 figures. A company of this size can keep up appearances for some time, but its customers, its customers customers, that is sellers and buyers, are speaking up and cannot be ignored in the long term, the leader of these policy's are and continue to drive away the core business of e bay and investors are taking notice.
E bay bought Bill Me Later, I would have been surprised just 6 months ago, but I am unhappy to report that I am not at this time, the reason is this management has taken down the tread that holds e bay together as can be seen by its buyers and sellers everywhere complaining about the flawed aggressive policies that have taken place over the last few months, maybe you have heard some of them or are one of them. Every comment citing that the previous system was not broken. E bay has had community and trust, this 13 year trust has been violated and has failed both sellers and buyers in just a few months of unfair, faulty policy change that has taken a ship this size and turned it so fast that it is out of control and is facing a challenge to bring the ship back to course as it was before in the core business, although still ignored by management at this time, this is just in the core business, this shows the danger of a lateral move like credit right now. Take into account there couldn't be worse timing as the world economy will not view this favorably given recent events. This policy change was over a short aggressive period, but the negative impact will make it difficult to navigate back in position, if this venture is not successful, it will be even worse for ebay, its investors, and the management that follows. The core business has taken a great hit world wide, now it is committed to a market that is new. A new market during the time when its core business is in jeopardy due to flawed policy and a slowed economy with management proven only to drive away customers. This will prove a challenge that may take years to repair relationships of its sellers and buyers when it has been realized by investors concerned on top of unpopular credit service. Migration back to the system with effective proven 12-15 record, built by previous management over 12-15 years, seems to be the only way to save the future profits and stability the company once enjoyed.
It could prove to be a successful venture, but e bay current management wants its investors to trust it in a huge risk buy, when the investors are clearly concerned and most can see that e bay can not run its core business in a way that is satisfying to its customers, causing them to leave, look for other suppliers that will eventually be able to meet demands of the once complacent sellers and buyers. Employees, buyers, sellers are all saying the same thing, why is e bay letting this happen. Nothing to gain, much to loose.
It would be hard for anyone with basic knowledge of the problems with recent policy of the core business to buy this, having been a seller and buyer for 10 years, it makes it even harder to buy. Why would smart investors believe they will run it any different than there core auction business.
I can say, I am happy to report my family, who bought stock when they seen my success on e bay back in the late 90s, sold there stock when I explained the new managements flawed, unfair, and aggressive policy handed down. The stock has followed since this and many are betting with there dollars fell it will continue to fall. Maybe Jim Cramer, hyper as he is, has a point when he said he could not get behind the company, and that someone should buy the company "and put them out of their misery." It is hard to argue with him, stock sold back in march, when these policies were being talked about, not yet implemented aggressively, sold ebay seems to be the smart move. Stock was $30-$32 per share at that time, March 2008 new management took over, it dropped every since as can be tracked from any stock quote chart. Yes, the economy took the abrupt hit, stock price had already plummeted by 1/3, $19-$22 per share, before it happened that our country was in trouble from bad credit/debt. Some say they wouldn't want to touch this a credit market at this time. I would also not want to answer to shareholders when they learn what long time sellers and buyers have seen in the past few months.
I think this report on NYtimes has some good in site of the problems facing the company with the current buy:bits.blogs.nytimes.com...
Maybe enough people will sign to make it worthwhile?
www.petitiononline.com...
Let me say, I LOVE E BAY, it is just sellers and buyers don't like what new management has done to its strong culture. We have a vested interest and love for the old e bay culture.
Just one of the PAST buyers and sellers temporarily driven away by new management, it will be interesting to see what the new management that is suspected to come will do to the culture. Hopefully Auctionbytes is right in looking for a replacement for JD and you can see the 150+ comments below the article shows not one good thing to say about this management blog.auctionbytes.com/...
Good thing for golden parachutes I guess, maybe that will soften the fall?
How low will Donahoe let this stock sink before he does something? Talk is cheap actions speak comes to mind. Is he that ignorant that he can't see that his new policies are not working? What will it take? A few more lousy quarters? eBay down to $5.00 a share?
A good CEO will listen to his bread and butter sellers! When they are gone they are gone! Goodbye eBay!
eBay was $41.00 dollars last year, this year eBay is $13.00 dollars. In 12 months we have sunk down to nothing! Donahoe blames it on everything except his dumb lame new policies!
I am a stock holder and as a stockholder watching my money go down the drain I feel like Donahoe is not right for this job! I say kick his butt out and quick!
Sellers and buyers want their old eBay back! We need a new CEO who will give them what they want before eBay becomes History!
Traffic is down 20%, but does that have anything to do with the current recession? How come you don't mention that? As if the 20% has nothing to do with current economic conditions. Do you pay attention to the Market, or do you have blinders on for just eBay bashing?
eBay stock is battered, but so aren't, many, many, many others. The whole market has been crushed.
Et tu Brute! how are those Amazon Fee's treating you, and the complete lack of control you have on your items? Feel like you've been squeezed into a little box? All your doing for Amazon is filling out their supply chain and nothing else. Don't you long for the days where you could retaliate against "Bad Buyers"? Oh, you can't do that on Amazon either.... LOL.
A thought: If the stock drops to 5 bucks a share, perhaps we should all gallop over and buy buy buy with the money we are making on the other venues we are all helping to build!
You don't suppose perchance Donahum is deliberately driving ebay stock down? To repurchase? For a song?
The cheerleaders all say ebay has still a healthy spreadsheet...
It’s a simple mathematical calculation that shopping on eBay is NOT a deal anymore. Buyers become more aware of their spending habits when the economy is in a crunch. They look for the place where their dollar will stretch the furthest.
You would think that online shopping with eBay would be on the increase to say the least, as wise shoppers are looking for ways to to save money.
The sad fact is eBay USED to be the place to find great deals, especially when the economy is in such sad shape. NOT anymore.
I predicted that at the rate eBay was burdening the sellers with their outrageous fees, soon, shoppers could and would find better deals at WalMart for “new” merchandise. The results are in and the facts are quite evident.
Online shopping continues to plunge and is predicted to be the worst since 1991. WalMart UP +2.4% amidst the declining economy and the only retailer reporting an increase growth in sales for the month of October (gotta love that little yellow smiley-face)
You fail to realize ebay+++, that eBay has been in a decline for several years now regardless of market trends. Unfortunately, you didn't listen and no amount of cheer leading for the has-been giant is going change that Charmin you now hold in your hands.
TRUE - Paypal works wonderfully well on other sites. I've had it on my website for years with NO problem. Its only when Ebay sales are involved that things seem to go "haywire".
Not entirely true for seasonal sales. I have been busy contacting ALL my past customers and inviting them to special sales on my site and on other sites I list on. Just had some nice big sales on Bonanzle and my own website is doing very well indeed. On the other hand, the few items I have on Ebay - that I paid fees thru the nose for - are lanquishing there with few hits and no bids. Those are the facts and its becoming evident to other sellers as well.
ebay+++ could put his eBay shares up for auction on eBay, but I doubt that he is smart enough to figure out how to sell on the site.
Then eBay/PayPal could hold his money again, with him being a new seller and all.
Probably shouldn't comment to that which you are in ignorance of.
I am a Pro Merchant. I pay a monthly fee plus commissions on sales. That's -- sales. Amazon collects the doe re mi and that's a BIG headache I don't even deal with.
Another thing. No problems with site traffic there, either. My sales are fine. Stability and rationality coupled with steady financial gain compared to incompetence and no sales... what comparison???
Sorry, pal. The only traffic down is on ebay.
Just a short note to thank everyone for their comments because everyone's opinion is important. eBay closed at 13.71 today.
If you still have stock you should be venting your frustration at ebay and the management , not folks who are exposing their snubbing of various countries trading laws and methods of extortion.
I think they will be hit hard this QTR, but much the same as all of Retail. I also think they are well positioned to weather the worst of economic climates, I can't say that about Amazon. Amazons margins are razor thin and with this environment they will sink long before eBay.
When I buy on-line I always compare Amazon to eBay, I want the best deal, not looking to give anyone free money. eBay still more often than not has the better deals, that has not changed at all.
Et tu Brute! You mean Amazon is completely immune to the recession? Thanks for you unbiased opinion, I bet you do a great Jon Lovitz impression.
log into paypal...click details beside the payments that are on hold then refund at the bottom of the screen...enter $0.01 as the amount...the rest of the payment will be released from hold immediately and can be transferred into your bank account as normal
Et tu Brute - Good to hear from you!
How to release held funds - Thanks a million for the workaround!
tree411 - Bonanzle is fantastic because 1) they are just a forum; 2) their fees are reasonable; 3) their site is clean, well structured & very user friendly; 4) their user agreement is written in plain english; 5) they don't mandate how sellers are paid. I suspect Bonanzle will eventually replace eBay so long as their technology keeps pace with the number of users & I foresee no problems because this site is well run.
Please get informed before posting here, and using childish name calling.
You can start here:
www.auctionbytes.com/c...
Me and my circle of close family and friends, about 40 folks, have ALL of us, every last one, left ebay permanently. Everybody has had ebay garbage -- ebay garbage being garbage generated exclusively by ebay. -- dealt to them. And that's the small circle.
Believe it or not, responsible people just won't bother with a venue of ANY type that is riddle with corruption from site headquarters, daily policy changes, and broken programs.
Nice try. Very transparent in origin.
And the vile practices of a company as corrupt as ebay need to be exposed. And reported, reported, reported.
Seeking Alpha is not the only site doing so. Not by a LONG shot! There are MANY other sites and blogs reporting daily on the dysfunction and deplorable practices of ebay.
And you know this. It's called "trolling".
i guess this means that you & your friends don't mind Paypal holding your funds hostage because Paypal is holding Cashback Rewards hostage for 2 months before they release the funds. And where I come from CASH BACk means exactly that - cold hard cash NOT funds deposited in a Paypal account that does nothing but benefit Paypal.
Keep up the good work, Dinah! The more harsh the smearing comments you get from the cheer leaders means you're on target!!!
ebay stock, "ebay time" (couldn't resist), is at a low of 13.19. And as I refreshed, right before my eyes, it went to 13.18.
When Wall Street closes today, where oh where will ebay stock be?
Just curious on your angle ? Your initial comments ripped Ebay and Donahoe and now you are a Poser extolling Ebay accomplishments as if you are the guy. What's up ? What happened to you on 09/16/08 ? Did Donahoe take over your body ?
For software go to:
softlinx.ecrater.com/
Do you remember about 2 months ago I predicted eBay stock would fall to $10/share by the end of the year? Perhaps I should have predicted $5/share (assuming eBay has a massive buy back) by the end of this month.
btw, Paypal debit cards are "suddenly" not working according to posts on eBay discussion boards & curiously last nite I could not access Paypal's home page but I could access anything else on the net.
Golly gee, if the stock hits Five Bucks maybe the thousands upon thousands of disgruntled ebay sellers should toddle out Buy It Now! LOL!
It might be only a drop in the ebay bucket, but you get a large enough group rocking the boat the same way and if the Board doesn't listen up finally, the boat might capsize.
Just a thought. But all you out there, take it seriously! Do!!!
I wonder if "non ebay" using Paypal users have probs with their debit cards? I just might find a reason to go out and give mine -- that has a balance from other sites -- a try! Hmmm?
Wall Street Closing at 3:54 p.m.
ebay stock rings out at $12.935 per share!
Yikes!!! Year's low to date!!!
My advice: Try selling for a living, or for supplemental income, then report back to us.
Buying is easy, and there are still many great Mom & Pop sellers on eBay, but droves of good sellers are leaving, either by force, or by choice.
Why keep posting about how great a place eBay is to buy?
Me thinks proBuyer is more interested in trying to build up his poorly performing eBay shares than what us "whiners" are saying.
www.auctionbytes.com/c...
@proBuyer
It means that eBay has succeeded in turning some sellers into sheeple.
A rise in listing numbers does not translate into conversions. Many sellers simply transferred their store listings to the Fixed Price core. It also may mean that some sellers may not yet be aware that eBay has betrayed its core customers and is out-sourcing storefronts to companies with large inventories and all the while negotiating listing and Final Value Fee deals, further destroying the small and medium seller.
eBay doesn't care where they get their money, whether it be from the small seller wondering why his inventory is just not selling anymore but hopes, and continues to pay eBay to bury his items with "Best Match", or the Diamond PowerSellers, like BUY.com, who pay nothing to list and receives a lower FVF incentive from eBay.
When the small and medium seller genocide succeeds, I hope eBay realizes that with their help, their new found Diamond PowerSeller friends will be well-known off the eBay site and on. THEY will hold ALL the cards and they will NOT need to negotiate further deals with eBay. They will simply tell them the way it is, or take themselves, their storefronts and their customer base with them. And the once loyal small, medium and veteran sellers will have already established new storefronts on sites like Bonanzle.com and will never return to eBay when the palace halls echo with emptiness.
Monopoly.... Don’t you just love it!
www.ecommerce-guide.co...
Link to the site is in the article.
Lots of new selling sites, guess time will tell which one takes the lead to replace FeeBay.
Their concilliation process is at best a joke firmly weighted against the seller. (who pays ALL of the fees)
They have been proven by the ACCC to be no more efficient or safer than any other money transfer house, like paymate or google, and not as efficient or as safe as direct deposits.
Add the fees they charge for using their services plus the almost hidden fees like their exchange rate and it becomes expensive to use.
For instance i recehntly purchased an item from USA. the offical exchange rate was 66.779 cents AU= $1 USA
Ebay/PP exchange rate 59.777. Unfortunatley until EVERYONE gets together and kicks this mob in the backside they will continue to exploit thier monopoly.
Australia has a site called OZtion which is slowly growing but being for Australia only it does not attract the number of bidders that ebay does at present./
I was a powerseller w/ ebay and before receiving my cert I was thrown off for something that a buyer had said!?!?!?!
As far as paypal goes...
...I had 324 paying members (auto monthly) at my site dailydaytrades.com and because of one chargeback from one member that they gave her $$ back after she used my service and they are not suppose to allow disputes on non-tangable goods; my acct is limited and will not allow payments in!!!! I lost my $7,000 monthly income because of these ^@%^##&@& - I am setting up autherisenet to handle my credit card pross. but i will maybe see 20% of old members back because they will have to start and join all over again. WHAT A JOKE
So predictable, so predictable.
Bob C - Thanks for the link to the auctionbytes article!
Guess I shook them up a little bit because they actually made an announcement this time. Unfortunately it won't get read by most users because they buried it on their announcement board & posted nothing on their home page.
Here's eBay's announcement so everyone can read it.
November 11, 2008 10:52AM PST/PT
Some buyer payments are currently showing as Pending in the seller's My eBay, even when payment has been completed. We are aware of this issue and are working hard to resolve it quickly. In the meantime, sellers can view their item's true payment status by logging into their PayPal account. We apologize for this inconvenience.
outside_the_square - Thank you for bringing this to my attention. It shouldn't cost Paypal a dime to exchange currency because it's done electronically & for them to add surcharge is obscene. Now I have a much better understanding why eBay is pushing worldwide sales.
At the rate things are going I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Paypal started charging members $1.00 every time they log in, lol.
eBay profits were down, The reason given: weak economy.
Could it be that you can buy the same Made in China junk, that has flooded eBay's site, down at your local Wally World for less?
To proBuyer, Please keep posting. All of us bad, bitter sellers need our daily laugh!
First you assume that we are all ex-eBay sellers, then assume we are/were bad sellers.
You call this a "s**ty blog" and yet you keep posting.
Funny stuff indeed!!
Here, the eBay seller is the "vendor" and PayPal is the "accounts payable department" of eBay.
All of these things: 21 day (or more) holds, the "glitch" described here and the forcing of sellers to accept P/P all point in the same direction.
Don't keep any more in your PrayPal account than you can afford to lose. eBay/PayPal is no longer "safe." If they ever were.......
Attention all posters:
Do not forget to check your thumbs up, thumbs down boxes as you post or check back. Please stay abreast of this new feature as it will make a statement in and of itself.
I also suspect there are those that will find ways to attempt tipping this scale.
So, no slackers! :~) Thanks!
Do you remember the name of the company that took care of the FREE keyword advertising premium stores got before Donahoe took it away? Thanks in advance.
If you want to rattle my chain, please form sensible sentences.
Statements such as "Then, who you exactly are to eBay?" won't cut it.
It is obvious that you are an "eBay haters" hater, and that your hatred seems to be effecting your thought process. Relax, take a deep breath. Perhaps go have a wonderful buying experience on eBay.
Here is a News Flash for you:
Nearly all sellers are, or were, also eBay buyers.
To Et tu, Brute!
It looks like the thumbs up/down boxes are being gamed.
This thread is pretty dead, but proBuyer's post received 4 up right after his late night post. Simple statements by others are 4 down, for no real reason. Someone needs to get a life, eh?
www.auctionbytes.com/c...
PS to proBuyer:
With my 11 years as an eBay seller perhaps you have purchased from me in the past.
If so, you were happy, since all of my 1200+ feedbacks were positive ; )
Don't think for a minute the evil you have wrought on others won't destroy you and bring down everyone of your wicked cronnies with you .Woe is the day you sent me away without any pay.
So it is written. So it shall be done. .
As for eBay & pay-pal the slime of the earth you are also in line. You should all be hung for treason. You instill anxieties fear and paranoia upon inocent humans and animals. A curse upon the ones who caused enjoyable misery upon them. A curse so hideous even hell would be a sanctuary. So be it written so it shall be done.
Beware this will come to pass
.
On Nov 12 11:41 PM proBuyer wrote:
> what all this gloating over eBay's stock price about? have you noticed
> - most of the stocks are now on multi-years lows? or the hatred clouded
> not only your minds, but eyes, too?
>
> and you seem to believe that a sh**ty blog has a power to move global
> stock prices? truly remarkable ignorance...
>
> good luck to you guys, you'll definitely need it...
I know this thread is dead, but wanted to pass along the latest Paypal scam. This is the worst yet, as there is no regard for the buyer. If your Paypal account is limited/frozen, you can no longer refund to buyers on items you did not ship. Even if the buyer files a dispute, the refund link is disabled. The buyer will have to wait til the dispute process completes in 20-30 days and then who knows what happens. Below is from a Paypal email dated 11/24. They have the funds and will not allow the seller to refund. The seller refuses to ship as Paypal has the money. The big loser is the buyer.
Thanks for contacting PayPal. I appreciate the opportunity to assist you
with your questions.
You have a limitation on your account at the present time. If you go to
the Resolution Center in your PayPal account it will walk you through
the steps to lift the limitation. Until you do so, you will not be able
to refund your Buyers.
I appreciate the opportunity to assist you. We are committed to making
your experiences at PayPal pleasant and rewarding.
P.S. The limitation is pending a laundry list of documents and might or might not be lifted. Seller won't even offer SSN as Paypal is not a bank. Won't use again.
I quote you:
"When is it going to end? My guess is when the State Attorneys General unite and regulate Paypal or when eBay ceases to exist – whichever comes first. "
you are an AMAZING WRITER!!! Very intelligent, insightful and analytical! You are a Visionary, too!!!
love n hugs,
Bob
Before you read any further, you must completely understand that fact! I sympathize completely with all of you sellers who have been robbed by dishonest buyers who've taken your merchandise and then also taken back their payment for it...and all of you buyers who've had your personal financial information taken by dishonest sellers. All of these illegal acts have been enabled and facilitated by Paypal and eBay.
Paypal holds your money for days and weeks - yet it doesn't pay you interest. A bank must pay interest by law, as regulated by the Federal banking authorities. Paypal can take money out of your personal checking/banking account. Banks can only do this with a Court order. WHEN 'THREATENED' IN THE UK, AS WELL AS IN AUSTRALIA, TO BE REGULATED UNDER THOSE COUNTRIES' BANKING LAWS, PAYPAL TURNED TAIL AND RAN, REGISTERING THEIR 'SERVICE' IN LUXEMBOURG.
You may post messages on these great and informative blogs, a public service in themselves. This is all well and good and serves to help one somewhat feel better over your losses at the hands of the Paypal and eBay thieves. But afterwards, and it only takes a few minutes, write your congressman, or write the banking authorities. Regardless of your party affiliation - we're all Americans and we need this to be done for all of our good, you can write Senator Charles Schumer from New York State (he's already received more than a few) or write Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts. New York Attorney General, Andrew Cuomo, is attuned to help consumers and definitely would like the chance to expose the deceptive practices of both Paypal and Ebay. Write and ask why is it that Paypal can operate as a bank without being regulated as a banking institution. Just yesterday, Senator Christopher Dodd of Connecticut, gave a news conference on how banks/financial institutions should be "looked into" as to the consumers' rights not be violated. he also would be an excellent choice to write to and inform him of your struggles with Paypal - more so, how Paypal can operate handling large sums of money and NOT pay interest. It is wrong! You can always write the SEC, the FDIC and the federal banking authorities and ask them to look into it. Demand that Paypal be regulated by United States banking laws. All of this thievery perpetrated by this now-bogus service will then all be held accountable. It's simple and would immediately cause a beneficial change. Just write that note. It only takes a minute and will accomplish so much! Remember: PAYPAL IS NOT A BANK - UNDERSTAND THAT FACT - it must be corrected!
It is laughable how Paypal moved quickly in reference to this eCheck scam business. Big deal - THEY STILL HAVE NO RIGHT TO GO INTO YOUR BANK ACCOUNT, HOLD MONEY WITHOUT PAYING YOU INTEREST, AND GO UNREGULATED BY US BANKING LAWS. THEY DO NOT GUARANTEE THE SAFETY OF YOUR MONEY THAT THEY HOLD. IF THERE IS ANY SORT OF LEGAL ACTION AGAINST PAYPAL AND THEIR ACCOUNTS ARE TIED UP, THERE WOULD BE NO RECOURSE FOR YOU, THE BUYERS/SELLERS, TO GET YOUR MONEY BACK. Ask PAYPAL: "Is my money insured and safe AND by what guarantee?" They could not give you an honest answer! Imagine that!!!! I'm sorry to shout - but it is a terrible thing how the scam artists of EBAY and PAYPAL are allowed to illegally run roughshod over us Americans and steal our money...be it five cents or thousands of times that.
.
On Jan 18 04:06 PM SukrPunch17 wrote:
> ATTENTION: PAYPAL IS NOT A BANK!
> Before you read any further, you must completely understand that
> fact! I sympathize completely with all of you sellers who have been
> robbed by dishonest buyers who've taken your merchandise and then
> also taken back their payment for it...and all of you buyers who've
> had your personal financial information taken by dishonest sellers.
> All of these illegal acts have been enabled and facilitated by Paypal
> and eBay.
>
> Paypal holds your money for days and weeks - yet it doesn't pay you
> interest. A bank must pay interest by law, as regulated by the Federal
> banking authorities. Paypal can take money out of your personal checking/banking
> account. Banks can only do this with a Court order. WHEN 'THREATENED'
> IN THE UK, AS WELL AS IN AUSTRALIA, TO BE REGULATED UNDER THOSE COUNTRIES'
> BANKING LAWS, PAYPAL TURNED TAIL AND RAN, REGISTERING THEIR 'SERVICE'
> IN LUXEMBOURG.
>
> You may post messages on these great and informative blogs, a public
> service in themselves. This is all well and good and serves to help
> one somewhat feel better over your losses at the hands of the Paypal
> and eBay thieves. But afterwards, and it only takes a few minutes,
> write your congressman, or write the banking authorities. Regardless
> of your party affiliation - we're all Americans and we need this
> to be done for all of our good, you can write Senator Charles Schumer
> from New York State (he's already received more than a few) or write
> Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts. New York Attorney General,
> Andrew Cuomo, is attuned to help consumers and definitely would like
> the chance to expose the deceptive practices of both Paypal and Ebay.
> Write and ask why is it that Paypal can operate as a bank without
> being regulated as a banking institution. Just yesterday, Senator
> Christopher Dodd of Connecticut, gave a news conference on how banks/financial
> institutions should be "looked into" as to the consumers' rights
> not be violated. he also would be an excellent choice to write to
> and inform him of your struggles with Paypal - more so, how Paypal
> can operate handling large sums of money and NOT pay interest. It
> is wrong! You can always write the SEC, the FDIC and the federal
> banking authorities and ask them to look into it. Demand that Paypal
> be regulated by United States banking laws. All of this thievery
> perpetrated by this now-bogus service will then all be held accountable.
> It's simple and would immediately cause a beneficial change. Just
> write that note. It only takes a minute and will accomplish so much!
> Remember: PAYPAL IS NOT A BANK - UNDERSTAND THAT FACT - it must be
> corrected!
>
> It is laughable how Paypal moved quickly in reference to this eCheck
> scam business. Big deal - THEY STILL HAVE NO RIGHT TO GO INTO YOUR
> BANK ACCOUNT, HOLD MONEY WITHOUT PAYING YOU INTEREST, AND GO UNREGULATED
> BY US BANKING LAWS. THEY DO NOT GUARANTEE THE SAFETY OF YOUR MONEY
> THAT THEY HOLD. IF THERE IS ANY SORT OF LEGAL ACTION AGAINST PAYPAL
> AND THEIR ACCOUNTS ARE TIED UP, THERE WOULD BE NO RECOURSE FOR YOU,
> THE BUYERS/SELLERS, TO GET YOUR MONEY BACK. Ask PAYPAL: "Is my money
> insured and safe AND by what guarantee?" They could not give you
> an honest answer! Imagine that!!!! I'm sorry to shout - but it is
> a terrible thing how the scam artists of EBAY and PAYPAL are allowed
> to illegally run roughshod over us Americans and steal our money...be
> it five cents or thousands of times that.
> .
I agree with you, you will probably lose. Unless this frame is some sort of antique from 2BC.