Who'll Blink First: Sirius, Loral or the Banks? 82 comments
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Conspiracy theorists will love this article. There are many who feel that Sirius XM Radio (SIRI) stock is heavily manipulated. In many ways, it is hard to argue against that stance. However, like many things in life, it is hard to find the smoking gun, and thus the debates begin.
Sirius XM Radio has a $100,000,000 credit facility with Loral Space (LORL). The credit was established for payments to Space Systems Loral on Sirius XM’s FM-5 and FM-6 satellites. Okay, conventional thinking states that the line of credit can not be drawn on to pay down the February debt. While this is true, there are provisions for Sirius XM to draw against payments already made. Simply stated, they could take back every nickel they have paid into the satellites and use it as working capital. Further, they could continue to draw on the facility to keep the satellite construction rolling along.
THE CATCH
Sirius XM needs to decide on whether or not to use the credit facility by December 19, 2008 (the day after the annual shareholder meeting). But Sirius XM also needs to have a market cap of at least $1,000,000,000 to borrow.
According to the Space Systems Loral 10Q for Q3 2008:
“…Under the Credit Agreement, Sirius may borrow up to an aggregate principal amount of $100 million to make milestone payments under the Satellite Purchase Agreement for the purchase of the Sirius FM-5 and FM-6 Satellites (the “Sirius Satellites”) or, on or prior to December 19, 2008, to reimburse itself for milestone payments it has previously made with its own funds. Loans made under the Sirius Credit Agreement are secured by Sirius’ right, title and interest in its rights under the Satellite Purchase Agreement, including its rights in and to the Sirius Satellites. The loans are also entitled to the benefits of a subsidiary guarantee from Satellite CD Radio, Inc. and any future material subsidiary that may be formed or acquired by Sirius, other than XM Radio and any other subsidiary designated as an “unrestricted subsidiary” under the indenture governing Sirius’s 9 5 / 8 % senior notes due 2013….”
According to Sirius XM’s 10Q:
“…The Loral Credit Agreement contains certain drawing conditions, including a requirement that SIRIUS have a market capitalization of at least $1 billion. Any loans made under the Loral Credit Agreement generally will bear interest at a variable rate equal to three-month LIBOR plus 4.75%….”
Simply stated, there is a substantial credit line available that could give Sirius XM Radio some much needed breathing room, but the clock is running short, and the market cap is too low. The market cap here at .26 cents is $855,000,000, a good $145,000,000 shy of the credit facility requirement. What does it take to get above $1,000,000,000? A stock price of .31 cents.
This is where the conspiracy theorists will go nuts. Sirius XM Radio seems stuck in its current range. Each day that passes with a market cap below $1 billion is another day where the hands of Sirius XM are tied. With the deadline only a few weeks away, and the stock price not cooperating, it is little wonder that the Board and Management are looking at several viable options. Those that feel the company is not thinking things through can rest assured that management is well aware of the situation. What we have is hesitant banks, and a deadline of December 18th on a credit facility. Someone has to blink first. Loral’s own $100,000,000 credit facility is through JP Morgan (JPM), so it is possible that somehow an arrangement between Sirius XM, Loral, and JP Morgan could be arranged, but time is getting critical.
Because of the credit facility, it is my opinion that Sirius XM will want to be able to announce some sort of refinancing prior to December 19th, in hopes that the market cap will appreciate by then, allowing the company some flexibility in their cash situation.
Is someone deliberately holding Sirius XM stock below .31 cents? The conspiracy theorists will say so, and while there is no smoking gun, it is hard to argue against their stance. The bigger question is whether Mel can exert his influence to get the financing done and see an appreciation in the stock price that will allow more room to maneuver.
All that being said, there is still no guarantee that Sirius XM has any intention of using the facility, but the leverage comes from being able to use it, not necessarily from actually doing so.
Position: Long SIRI.
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This article has 82 comments:
Still think that is SIRI can get past the debt issue a bit they will move upward, so we all have our fingers crossed.
Also, when people ask: "why has Sirius not done more advertising with the holiday shopping season approaching," management has probably thought this through as well: With all indicators pointing to dismal consumer spending during this 4th quarter shopping season, management has probably decided to sit tight on their advertising budget until after the new year and do more to keep their existing subscriber base intact -- Karmazin and his team are not a bunch of nitwits who are asleep at the wheel....
And by the way, there is one more thing: As the directors of Sirius recommended, I voted "for" on the reverse stock split. I don't care what the analysts say -- if they are so smart then I must ask, "why are they languishing behind a desk with a meager salary of $125,000 while Mel earns a few million or more per year in running a company that is worth billions of dollars"? The man's track record speaks for itself: He is not intentionally driving this company towards bankruptcy and it is sheer stupidity to believe otherwise....
Scot's Slant
Nice work on your articles latey (see? good reporting always gets kudos!). This is an interesting scenario and it is entirely possible there is a "battle of the wills" playing out with the stock...but IMHO, I don't think so in the way some might think. The current market environment is tough enough where in tech and media, if you are not flat, you are down. SIRI is in a great spot for now just being flat while the big ship is turning around...I'll take it. By way of Siriusly Depressed, looking at the MF buying action lately shows the support to keep the stock from going down--11/14 reporting was crazy and the 11/12-13 reports weren't bad either (In addition to recent analyst and MSM sentiment changes). The reported 285M short interest as of 10/31, shows the .18 decline since the last move up to .44..and we still have the hedge short to keep things topped off to the upside. But my point considering all of this is the time is near for a move up as the TRUE sentiment on the stock is changing as we speak. MF's know it, otherwise they wouldn't be pouring in like they have recently taking on large new positions and adding to existing ones significantly. The whisper is out but it is just taking a little time for the final short capitulation. They know their day is ending but why would they just give up during another of "one of the worst weeks the Street has EVER seen?" Answer is they wouldn't. They want to wait until they are sure it's truely exhausted. Cause...once this thing starts unwinding, it's going to be a big event and they know it. We saw what happened recently during the 21.5 - .44 move. That was peanuts compared to what is about to happen and they know it. This next tme, it wil not stop @ .44 because it will make much more sense for shorts to turn and ride the upside--which will only compound the squeeze-- as many others begin piling in as well. IMHO, what we're seeing now is the inability to take this down any farther (due to rising and legit support) but not yet capitulation due to market conditions.
Your article today is very helpful concering the 100M facility @4.75% +... and in understanding the timeframes of that facility. Now the company getting down to 210M via stock makes even more sense--as we've been calling for the 1/2 cash 1/2 facility scenario since the Q. I have made predictions where the SP will be @ meeting time and it's not .26. But it's all in its own time. We shall see...
But thanks again Tyler. Great info!
Hard to blame them these days.
A follow up to the mffais.com info
Having seen sudden changes in mffais.com, mutual fund investment, data before, I did a little research using companies adding to their position as reported. Utilizing this info and that on Edgar on line I was able to understand why the sudden change in numbers being reported. As Sirius reported it 3Q numbers, so too did many of the Mutual Funds in the form of a SEC form 13F-HR. Now mffais gets its information directly from these SEC filings. The date mffais records is the SEC filing date, not the actual transaction date.
For instance one transaction which caught my and others eye was the 174.7M shares purchase by Ameriprise and reported on mffais. Certainly these shares, if a current purchase ,would be significant in trying to figure out the financing or street sentiment. But nowhere other than mffais was this reported. In back tracking through Edgar, the transaction is recorded with a date on the 3Q 13F-hr as 174.7M shares at a purchase value of $99.6 M shares. This comes out to a $1.75 putting the purchase at just at the merger of 7/29 IMHO.
In checking into several of the other transactions recorded, since 11/3, I found that most transactions reported on mffais.com are from these mutual fund company 3Q filings on their 13F-HR forms. Although I believe that this still represents a positive trend, I do not see how the information reflects current MF manger's sentiment. If we apply the mffais reporting changes of the last two weeks to the filings of MFM's reporting to the SEC, the changes in mfais reflect this reporting not real time street sentiment.
The T Rowe Price purchase for 84.7M shares was also at a $1.75 purchase price. These two purchases reflect 250M shares bought by these two mutual funds, when the merger was announced but before the Aug 5 SEC merger filing details, which would include the 7% convertibles that immediately put a beating on everyone. Don't want to be a wet blanket here, but I don't want to be fooled again...... by skewed data, released when we would all like to hear good news.
I've reading your posts as well as sl62 and have gotten quite a bit of insight. I have a question regarding your mffais concerns. You mention below that the Ameriprise data would be from around 7/29. If you look at the 13F-HR data for Ameriprise (which you did), there is a 5/6 filing, 8/12 filing and a 11/10 filing (There are others as well). Wouldn't the 8/12 filing show everything between 7/29 and their 5/6 filing and wouldn't their 11/10 filing show everything from at least 8/1 forward?
Just curious.. don't know what overlaps or maybe "fudging" of reporting happens with these filings.
On Nov 16 12:02 PM cos1000 wrote:
> s162
>
> A follow up to the mffais.com info
>
> Having seen sudden changes in mffais.com, mutual fund investment,
> data before, I did a little research using companies adding to their
> position as reported. Utilizing this info and that on Edgar on line
> I was able to understand why the sudden change in numbers being reported.
> As Sirius reported it 3Q numbers, so too did many of the Mutual Funds
> in the form of a SEC form 13F-HR. Now mffais gets its information
> directly from these SEC filings. The date mffais records is the SEC
> filing date, not the actual transaction date.
>
> For instance one transaction which caught my and others eye was the
> 174.7M shares purchase by Ameriprise and reported on mffais. Certainly
> these shares, if a current purchase ,would be significant in trying
> to figure out the financing or street sentiment. But nowhere other
> than mffais was this reported. In back tracking through Edgar, the
> transaction is recorded with a date on the 3Q 13F-hr as 174.7M shares
> at a purchase value of $99.6 M shares. This comes out to a $1.75
> putting the purchase at just at the merger of 7/29 IMHO.
>
> In checking into several of the other transactions recorded, since
> 11/3, I found that most transactions reported on mffais.com are from
> these mutual fund company 3Q filings on their 13F-HR forms. Although
> I believe that this still represents a positive trend, I do not see
> how the information reflects current MF manger's sentiment. If we
> apply the mffais reporting changes of the last two weeks to the filings
> of MFM's reporting to the SEC, the changes in mfais reflect this
> reporting not real time street sentiment.
if you're holding onto a $0.25 stock in hopes that it will go to $0.42, that's just sad (unless you have 1,000,000 shares). this is all an academic argument. stocks under $2 are always a lot more likely to go to $0 than they are to return to the $2 level. and the only hope for this pointlessly combined company is that it will be able to stay on life support, lose more money, and *maybe* make most of its minimal debt payment on time, while cutting jobs, ruining the programming, and not offering a single new service feature for the next several years.
as a company, sirius was poorly run (xm, too, most likely). combining two losing entities will *rarely* (and by rarely i mean 0.0000001% of the time) result in a stronger combined entity. it's usually (and by usually i mean 99.9999999% of the time) just a bigger loser. as i said, their only hope was to let one or the other go under, and just take over the contracts at pennies on the dollar.
karmazin is not some brilliant businessman (where are you people getting this? from listening to howard's show for business advice?) it's a ridiculous notion. people thought the same thing about bernie ebbers -- he's so rich, he *must* be smart. well, he may be the smartest guy in federal prison today, so, good for him. karmazin is a putz. and he is largely to blame for the current condition of sat radio. it didn't get here by itself, you know.
if you're holding this stock (and i'm not, so i am *not* trying to manipulate anything; do what you want), my only suggestion would be to get your $25/share while it's still trading on a recognized market. reverse splits, prayed-for help from cash-strapped Morgan, just trying to will the stock up to $0.41/share, it's all very sad. people aren't buying new cars, they sure as hell aren't going to buy sirius. and with siri effing up the channels? this is such a classic death spiral (with the attendant spectators on the ground (or, floating a foot or two off the ground, actually) watching it and saying, 'he's hurtling toward earth on *purpose*! what a genius! he'll pull up any second now. he has to! please pull up, please!' and then the plume of smoke behind the trees, and they're still saying, 'maybe he landed safely!'), it will be written about in business school for years. and you'll have the no-value stock certificates and tax write-offs to prove it. i wish you all luck, i honestly do. but i have to tell you, you sound like the most desperate, naive, inexperienced happy jacks in the investing world today. now, please excuse me... i have to take my cool $100 gift card to the sharper image store at the mall to pick up a golf bag with a built-in segway. :)
On Nov 16 01:01 PM shutupsitdown wrote:
> who cares? xm and siri should have fought until one of them went
> chapter 11, then chapter 7, and the other one scooped up the spoils.
> it was a good technology, and a good product (i'm a 5-radio xm subscriber,
> and got my first in 2003), but there is simply no expanding market
> for this service. people worried about their jobs won't pay for radio
> for the next few years.
>
> if you're holding onto a $0.25 stock in hopes that it will go to
> $0.42, that's just sad (unless you have 1,000,000 shares). this is
> all an academic argument. stocks under $2 are always a lot more likely
> to go to $0 than they are to return to the $2 level. and the only
> hope for this pointlessly combined company is that it will be able
> to stay on life support, lose more money, and *maybe* make most of
> its minimal debt payment on time, while cutting jobs, ruining the
> programming, and not offering a single new service feature for the
> next several years.
>
> as a company, sirius was poorly run (xm, too, most likely). combining
> two losing entities will *rarely* (and by rarely i mean 0.0000001%
> of the time) result in a stronger combined entity. it's usually (and
> by usually i mean 99.9999999% of the time) just a bigger loser. as
> i said, their only hope was to let one or the other go under, and
> just take over the contracts at pennies on the dollar.
>
> karmazin is not some brilliant businessman (where are you people
> getting this? from listening to howard's show for business advice?)
> it's a ridiculous notion. people thought the same thing about bernie
> ebbers -- he's so rich, he *must* be smart. well, he may be the smartest
> guy in federal prison today, so, good for him. karmazin is a putz.
> and he is largely to blame for the current condition of sat radio.
> it didn't get here by itself, you know.
>
> if you're holding this stock (and i'm not, so i am *not* trying to
> manipulate anything; do what you want), my only suggestion would
> be to get your $25/share while it's still trading on a recognized
> market. reverse splits, prayed-for help from cash-strapped Morgan,
> just trying to will the stock up to $0.41/share, it's all very sad.
> people aren't buying new cars, they sure as hell aren't going to
> buy sirius. and with siri effing up the channels? this is such a
> classic death spiral (with the attendant spectators on the ground
> (or, floating a foot or two off the ground, actually) watching it
> and saying, 'he's hurtling toward earth on *purpose*! what a genius!
> he'll pull up any second now. he has to! please pull up, please!'
> and then the plume of smoke behind the trees, and they're still saying,
> 'maybe he landed safely!'), it will be written about in business
> school for years. and you'll have the no-value stock certificates
> and tax write-offs to prove it. i wish you all luck, i honestly do.
> but i have to tell you, you sound like the most desperate, naive,
> inexperienced happy jacks in the investing world today. now, please
> excuse me... i have to take my cool $100 gift card to the sharper
> image store at the mall to pick up a golf bag with a built-in segway.
> :)
You are write to check quarterly closing dates to make sure what is or isn't included. Ameriprise Financial 13F-HR filing of 11/10/08 was for their quarter ending 9/30/08. That quarter then would be 7/1/08 - 9/30/08. The date that I site was from a candlestick chart review and 7/29 was a day that included the 1.75 price intra-day and the Volume that day was over 250M shares, so that is my estimated transaction date. The other filing dates you stated cover 1 Q ending March 30th and filed on 5/6 and 2Q ending on June 30 th and filed on 8/12. Most companies take 4-5 weeks from the quarters closing date to report their results to the SEC.
Who the F are you? I love how these "Brilliant Strategists" have all the answers on their first posts. It is all academic right? If the nature of the stock market was all academic, then why waste time trolling blogs? Why wouldn't you spend all of your time looking at the history of the market, make your academic predictions, and rake in your millions. This guy is giving SP advice on his first post. What, did mommy and daddy buy you a 'puter for christmas?
Still.. would seem to be a positive with the numbers steadily increasing. The further we move along, the further we get away from "merger numbers" and more into post merger accumulations/reductio...
On Nov 16 01:17 PM cos1000 wrote:
> cygnus
>
> You are write to check quarterly closing dates to make sure what
> is or isn't included. Ameriprise Financial 13F-HR filing of 11/10/08
> was for their quarter ending 9/30/08. That quarter then would be
> 7/1/08 - 9/30/08. The date that I site was from a candlestick chart
> review and 7/29 was a day that included the 1.75 price intra-day
> and the Volume that day was over 250M shares, so that is my estimated
> transaction date. The other filing dates you stated cover 1 Q ending
> March 30th and filed on 5/6 and 2Q ending on June 30 th and filed
> on 8/12. Most companies take 4-5 weeks from the quarters closing
> date to report their results to the SEC.
As any good general prepares for a looming battle, a contingency plan is in place where if one avenue of attack fails, there is another viable plan to save their troops from slaughter. And this is what Mel and his team are doing with the reverse split contingency as they do not wish to leave a legacy of failure that resembles Custer's last stand in the Battle of Little Bighorn....
By the way, one more small thing: when you say, "if share price goes to high," wouldn't this be good news where more drastic contingency plans will be abandoned with the company moving in a positive direction? And as for a reverse split, what is the fear there? A split does not equate to a loss in value of shares -- it simply reduces the number of shares...
Scot's Slant
I've been checking MFFAIS everyday with excitement.
I started getting concerned yesterday and then more so this morning when I realized the discrepancy between the volume for SIRI on MFFAIS and the the daily volume traded for SIRI.....
My hope was that there was a 5 to 7 day delay in the reporting for MFFAIS. But as you've discovered, it's worse than that.
If this MF interest is from the time of the merger, then that means they were fooled like us.
Which makes me VERY curious as to what they've done with these shares since then............
MF could have been dumping shares for the past month and we wouldn't know it..................
I wish we could get current info on this............
I agree, I voted down both on the upcoming Vote. It seems as if the Board is manipulating the stock for a privatization, leaving us stock holders high and dry. The theory out there is that Mel is shorting his own stock to drive the price down, so why should we listen to any recommendation he makes. To all stock holders, VOTE NO to both reverse split and Dilution in upcoming meeting.
An important point and your math is correct, sorry for the mix up and thanks for double checking. There isn't any one day that the share volume was at that price in the quarter reported. Even multi day purchases would have had to have been in the last days of Sept or a private sale.
In general mffais.com reports its results on MF based on changes from each company's share volume from the last time the company reported information using SEC 13F information and the equities (SIRI's) cusip identification number. Further looking at the Ameriprise transaction, as
reported in mfais.com reveals last reporting Ameriprise had 6.35M shares and added 168.5M shares this reporting period taken off the 13F statement for now a total of 174.7M shares at an average price of $.57 cents / share. It would appear that not much more than that can be gleaned from these numbers. Dates of the purchases are not available, but as discussed above, at this price multiple purchases of shares over several days at the end of the quarter would have gotten them their. At best, without a company filing an mid quarter 13F, we are looking at quarterly changes in each company reports trend; add some, sold some, new position, sold position. For companies with comparisons available, we can also see how the fund has performed since a position was taken, in the mffais column all the way to the right. Changes in mffais reporting from week to week is less relevant than changes corresponding to MF reporting quarters, IMO.
We've talked about the low 50's,,,,,,after seeing MFFAIS, that seemed to be increasing.
BUT, now that we know that those numbers are delayed, where do we find a accurate, up to date number......
I don't like what I'm seeing on nasdaq & the brokerage sites......low 30's.
We were feeling real good about what the mutual funds were doing...
I'm now very concerned that those increases in SIRI positions were based on the merger timing...........
I wish we knew what the MF's are doing now............
The deeper we dig the more generic the info seems to become. I have heard the 50% number thrown around but, when I get a quote on Sirius on Ameritrade or E*trade that % is much lower. The overview quote is at 22.8% on both for institutional ownership. I do know that in following this number on these sites, that it has doubled in last two weeks from 11%. As you say though, I am not sure of their source or how current the number is or why such a large disparity from nasdaq. As a trend fine, but I really want to be able to see large transaction data, and direction in more current time frames. Even End of the Week numbers would be helpful.
The Nasdaq institutional holdings breakdown is more user family in being able to format the report and sort the data out. Nasdaq is showing a doubling in ownership since July 1st and confirms that the biggest changes occur 45 days after the quarter closes which would have been last week for Q3.
A quick tally on MFFAIS of shares held shows about 1.175B shares held by institutions (of which 716M shares are newly added), which with about 3.35B shares outstanding makes total held by institutions about 36.2%. I see significant increases in shares held by a few other important funds, with T Rowe Price and Vangaurd adding 84.350M and 81.165M shares respectively. Good signs indeed. The rats are returning to the ship!
Much appreciate your diligence. And yes, you're right, these are for Q ended Sept.30. So slightly more backward-looking than we'd like. I guess to find out purchase dates we have to, as you and Cygnus have done, look at the paper trail. I did so for another new holding, Rockefeller Financial Services. Clicking on their hotlink, it took me to their holdings list, then at the top is their latest Form 13F link. Scrolling down to find the SIRI buy, it states they bought 1,534,101shares for $874,000. Doing that math, it means they paid .5697/sh. So then, I checked historical prices and found something interesting. On Sept 30, the intraday low is stated as .57. Now, the Rockefeller 13F info math says .5697...hmmm, maybe they rounded it off on the 13F? Maybe after hours price? But it is damn close so conceivable I suppose. Before Sept.30, SIRI never traded below .62 so the 30th would have to be it to make it into the Q numbers at those stated amounts. SIRI actually closed @ .57 on that day.
Here's Citigroup's info:
$13K 23380 SH = (my math) .5560
$4K 6820 SH = (my math) .5865
$2962K 5196657 SH = (my math) .5699
$1K 1800 SH = (my math) .5555
300 526000 SH CALL
303 531800 SH PUT
Now, again before Sept30, SIRI never traded below .62 and on the 30th, the set a new low of .57. So I don't know where the .55/sh come into play...but that's what it says on their 13F. A little confusing. Your Ameriprise seemed to suggest .57/sh. Which again only could have been transacted on the 30th (by way of historical prices).
If it's true these purchases were made on Sept30, at these pps's, it stands to reason that most of these holders would still own their shares @ the current .27pps. Being large Funds, I would believe they would hold these at least a full Q if not longer. Typically, We the Peons, get no real help in trying to access up-to-date purchase info which might help us better understand what's going on.. There's probably more to this that we will not be able figure exactly. Anyway, I'm still encouraged by recent events and as always, we'll just have to wait and see how it keeps playing out. They sure don't make it easy on us do they?
I didn't do any exhaustive research on this, but I think the only thing magical about .57 (thereabouts) is the fact that it is the price on the last day of the quarter. Throw a dart at any of those institutions. They all seem to come up with .57ish. But.. just to try it on something different, I looked at your Citigroup and picked Frontline Ltd. Came up with a price per share of 48.04. Any guess as to what the closing price on September 30th was? Checked for PepsiCo and had the same outcome. Shares "purchased" for 71.27 and closing price on 9/30 was 71.27.
So.. still useful, but I guess not "that" useful??
On Nov 16 09:57 PM sl62 wrote:
> cos1000...
>
> Much appreciate your diligence. And yes, you're right, these are
> for Q ended Sept.30. So slightly more backward-looking than we'd
> like. I guess to find out purchase dates we have to, as you and Cygnus
> have done, look at the paper trail. I did so for another new holding,
> Rockefeller Financial Services. Clicking on their hotlink, it took
> me to their holdings list, then at the top is their latest Form 13F
> link. Scrolling down to find the SIRI buy, it states they bought
> 1,534,101shares for $874,000. Doing that math, it means they paid
> .5697/sh. So then, I checked historical prices and found something
> interesting. On Sept 30, the intraday low is stated as .57. Now,
> the Rockefeller 13F info math says .5697...hmmm, maybe they rounded
> it off on the 13F? Maybe after hours price? But it is damn close
> so conceivable I suppose. Before Sept.30, SIRI never traded below
> .62 so the 30th would have to be it to make it into the Q numbers
> at those stated amounts. SIRI actually closed @ .57 on that day.
>
>
> Here's Citigroup's info:
> $13K 23380 SH = (my math) .5560
> $4K 6820 SH = (my math) .5865
> $2962K 5196657 SH = (my math) .5699
> $1K 1800 SH = (my math) .5555
> 300 526000 SH CALL
> 303 531800 SH PUT
>
> Now, again before Sept30, SIRI never traded below .62 and on the
> 30th, the set a new low of .57. So I don't know where the .55/sh
> come into play...but that's what it says on their 13F. A little confusing.
> Your Ameriprise seemed to suggest .57/sh. Which again only could
> have been transacted on the 30th (by way of historical prices).
>
>
> If it's true these purchases were made on Sept30, at these pps's,
> it stands to reason that most of these holders would still own their
> shares @ the current .27pps. Being large Funds, I would believe they
> would hold these at least a full Q if not longer. Typically, We the
> Peons, get no real help in trying to access up-to-date purchase info
> which might help us better understand what's going on.. There's probably
> more to this that we will not be able figure exactly. Anyway, I'm
> still encouraged by recent events and as always, we'll just have
> to wait and see how it keeps playing out. They sure don't make it
> easy on us do they?
Loral Space & Communications
10Q Page 60
Liquidity & Capital Resources: Paragraph 3 & 4
SS/L has a $100 million undrawn commitment to Sirius Satellite Radio Inc. under an Amended and Restated Customer Credit Agreement, secured by the two satellites under construction and subject to a number of conditions set forth therein. (See Note 11 to the financial statements (I am adding that's on page 23, para 3 of the 10Q)). Were Sirius to meet all of these conditions and draw this commitment in full, Loral would be required to examine alternatives to preserve its liquidity, including the sale of any or all borrowings under this facility. Notwithstanding that the Sirius satellite collateral is pledged solely to SS/L, the sale of Sirius borrowings under this facility, given the current market value of Sirius unsecured debt, could be at discounts of 20% to 40% and result in SS/L incurring a significant loss. Over the next 12 months, Loral believes that it has adequate resources to operate its business in such an event.
Current economic conditions, including the credit crisis, have generated concerns regarding the ability of customers to make payments under satellite construction contracts with SS/L. Though most of our customers are substantial corporations for whom creditworthiness is generally very good, we have other customers who are either highly leveraged or are in the developmental stage and are not yet fully funded. Customers that are not fully funded or are facing near-term maturities on their existing debt present significant financing risk in today’s market. This financing risk could require them to delay payments or seek financial relief from SS/L. If customers fall behind or are unable to meet their payment obligations, SS/L’s liquidity will be adversely affected. As of September 30, 2008, customers that management believes may have significant financing risk accounted for billed and unbilled accounts
------ The 10Q of Loral does not state if any pre payments have been made, but that the $100 M facility with conditions met by Sirius, would be lent, but immediately resold on the debt market. Also that given the current rate agreement committed to by Loral to Sirius, a draw would cause a substantial loss on the credit market given Sirius' discounted debt condition to Loral on the resale of the debt.
I am not sure that having the manufacturer of your satellites not yet fully constructed or launched yet, be abused this way is a good idea. Currently, Loral has 127M in cash with around 27M restricted to meet other agreements to operate its business. The $100M facility, although committed to, would wipe Loral's cash which is why they would have to go to the debt markets and resell this debt agreement at a 20 - 40 % loss . The facility is viable but, to Loral's demise in the short run. A questionable business practice at best if used for anything but the satellite manufacture and launch IMHO
With all of the new purchases at this average price of $.59 , I can't reconcile the volume of shares that would have had to of been purchased on Sept 30th. Ameriprise 160M, T Row Price 84M, and others bring the volume over the volume way over what was recorded for those last days at this price. I can't figure it from what's reported. I like it better when I had the math wrong..... LOL
Hope all is well w/ you..
Appreciate your comments but I'm just out here trying to stay in the game like all of us. And like we've said, being under SIRI's thumb like this = not so smart (lol)...I stay mainly in tech and some biotech. Not very diversified but a little more risk makes it more exciting for me. Don't know if you heard that Obama is supposed to more favorable to the whole stemcell thing. I'm into STEM, a play that I believe will pay off very well in '09. They heated up at election time but then announced a share offering for capital recently. As we know, it's just hard for most companies to stay out of the way of shorts...tough times. Also trying to force myself to stay in some kind of cash but it's hard!
As far as SIRI...that recent squeeze taught me something about the potential (21.5 - .44). A full on squeeze should see at least the .80's approx. From my position, one thing you can count on is when shorts see exhausted downside, there has to be an exit. There was a jack in new short interest end of Oct.The mid November numbers will be out this week, let's see what it is...I know you think a higher -pps would mean no vote at meeting time but I think the opposite. Low pps will say nothing but desperation to me and every shareholder. This is much too high a profile company for the stock to remain here IF they are not going out of biz and from their Q Call, I hear nor see anything of the kind. I mean in all honesty, it's now just embarassing @ this price. And I think they will help correct it. Regardless of how recent the MF numbers are, we know there are some significant Funds still holding their shares. The company could care less about us, but them they care about. As said, if I'm top management in this high profile a company, I'm emabrrassed as hell right now. Whatever's gone on here to get hedge profits, allow people in at rock bottom lows....whatever....it... been done. They proved something in the Q and I think people have taken notice. Let's see...it's definitely time for change.
And of course IMVHO...
Yeah a lot seems not to make perfect science regarding the published numbers. Typical. Right now it just looks like a bunch of names & numbers. Like cos1000 says, if nothing else, the volume doesn't add up. I think just like the reporting itself, we're looking at arbitrary conditions. You have to ask, why wouldn't they be required to put date and pps of sale specifically (esp of such large blocks). Pretty shady. I know they used to do this reporting bi-annually and within last few years have been forced into Q reports--which I'm sure they don't want to do so they keep it vague. Who can make heads or tails of this? Can you believe this is actually designed to help indie investors? Yeah, right...3 months worth of backward-looking data without needed specifics. Worthless! ...guess we're back to instinct (lol)...
Cos1000...good info on Loral. Guess Tyler never got that far...and he's the author..
From the faq: www.sec.gov/divisions/...
Question 8
Q: What information must institutional investment managers report on Form 13F?
A: Among other things, Form 13F filings must include:
the issuer name of all Section 13(f) securities (which should be listed in alphabetical order);
a description of the class of security listed (e.g., common stock, put/call option, class A shares, convertible debenture);
the number of shares owned;
and
the fair market value of the securities listed, as of the end of the calendar quarter.
So that pretty much verifies that the numbers are simply FMV at the end of the quarter. Nothing really deceitful... just the rules/requirements.
ok, so at least there is "some" visibility. Not quite in the dark.. maybe more like in the house of mirrors :-)
Dilution:
Is very clear to me that people are getting paid to make comments.
They must be employed by the company's crook to manipulate the unsophisticated investor, that is why they are not concern.
There are many readers who can not access the analyst reports. It is one reason I do cover them. If the information seem redendant to you, I apologize. Knowing the sentiment of the street on an equity you are invested in is prudent in my opinion.
The Loral line is nothing new. However, Loral has had their own troubles of late, and I wanted to see both their report as well as Sirius'. Knowing that JP Morgan is standing behind Loral is better than not knowing it.
Sats are not launching this year, and IMO it is the ability for Sirius to draw on past payments that is the differentiating factor here. Future payments can be delayed to a certain extent. Getting cash back (agaist the credit line) on payments already made is what carries the leverage.
That was exactly my point. Deliver bare bones and backward-looking info to We the Peons. Just looking at how long of a grace they have to file after the Q(1.5 months into subsequent quarter) tells volumes. No pps, no sale dates. Not useful! EXCEPT..as cos1000 said, you at least can "kind of" glean ostensible buy/sell trends and then knowing who is doing it isn't a bad thing either. But certainly too lacking in current-enough info to assist in decision-making. But just think, if they gave We the Peons too many tools, we would make or save too much money, which would be bad (inflationary) for our standard economic structure (upper class w/much money, middle class w/a little money, lower class w/no money). This is the model that is strived for 24/7, 365. Without it, the world couldn't exist. That's kind of what we're going through now: A cleansing of the middle class assets, who's 401k's were waaaay too rich due to gains since '04ish from the likes of RIMM, AAPL, AMZN... GOOG, who IPO'd @ $80ish/sh and jacked to $800...not to mention waaay too much equity in their homes. Just can't have too many rich people. That's the law.
Thanks for the info. That explains the problem with trying to determine the date of purchase from COShare and comparing price and volume charting. At best it is back looking trend information and helps to see who is on the bus.
Onthebackline
You or Sirius couldn't afford to pay me for the information I provide. I have been a long time Sirius Investor, and because of Stock Price, knows way more than he would like to know about the workings of this company. I personally enjoy the research and think the due diligence done here, has taught me an important lesson for other equities I am invested in and will invest in going forward. You on the other hand are an anonymous basher of others work and need to check your paranoia.
Did you see the Save Sirius release this morning? I actually like what's in it for a change...I would love to see those item votes postponed. Given what we know about current COH, etc... there's no reason why they couldn't postpone those votes until next year...esp. now considering they wouldn't even be close to delisted until July (180 days post the new Jan effective date)...and they would also easily (IMO) qualify for another 30-60 day appeal time considering FCC delay in buyout. If they take care of Feb 09 the way we'd prefer and bring in a solid Q4, they shouldn't need either of the items...
Appreciate your comments...I just iggy all the noise...hope all is well in your neck!
I'm really having trouble getting over this latest understanding of the MFFAIS numbers...........I look at all of those MF transactions loading up on SIRI as merger news. I'd bet that they're at least prior to Sept. Which means they do not take into consideration the awlful auto numbers for Sept. or the continued sink of the economy.......
Not knowing what the MF's are doing right now terrifies me.........
I sincerely appreciate all of the effort given by all of you, but I feel like we're so far out of our league.......
We're trying to get into the heads of the ones pulling the strings on this mess,,,,,that's a joke.........
That's like us competing with an army of CSI detectives and all we've got is a magnifying glass and a compass..........
Everytime we think we figure something out, it's old news......
We're all waiting for one of 2 things,,,,,,a short squeeze or financing news......either one will give us the "pop" we're looking for.........so is everyone else.....................
We were all waiting for the "pop" on the merger news too.......but everyone expected it, so the powers to be played off of it and put it the other way.....
What if we're patiently waiting for the same type of set up?
I'm getting concerned that the only thing that will ever let this stock rise is performance........If that's the case,,,,,it's going to be a very long time.....
How about a STRONG HOLD..... That would be interesting....
Tyler, why dont you lead the charge in being angry with your company.... Lets get some real numbers, and honest information.... How about that for a change.....
Thanks for your sentiment. We're just trying to figure out the clues to this mystery that has become Sirius Xm. The stock can't move up with the rest of the market taking a bath... unfortunately patience is the only strategy left at this time...... unless you need to bail and at this point no one could blame anyone for that decision.....
siriusly depressed
Watson here...... wiping the smudge of my magnifying glass. Great analogy and exhaustion is a good way to describe the emotion. The tools available to the retail investor clearly outline the evidence pointing to the game being rigged against the retail investor. With the loosely defined regulation its clear that even their they are writing the rules that we play by. At this point I am in this stock to try and get some money back, and have the time put in here give me an education moving forward. Everyone is talking about a pop and short squeeze and they may be right, but my feeling is the stock price will only move on positive news, refinancing of debt and autos right now, and that may cause the pop. The catalyst will be the NEWs the result will be the short squeeze or pop up. My feeling only major positive events and positive targets from GS will move this stock over a $1.
s162
I haven't seen the latest from Sav Si group and frankly with the responses and bashing from their crew I haven't cared to follow them along. I see their posts on several boards and some of what they write about is relevant, but there is too little time in the day and too much drama for me to get involved. My filter for information is getting real tight at this point.
and on the the institutional holdings talk, etrade has it at 31.3 % , I THINK BUT IM NOT SURE a couple of weeks ago it was around 24%
With Feb converts out of the way, and with management commitment to raising SP organically based on believed positive company guidance/performance. As we have said...why not? If you say your company/model is healthy amd firing properly on metrics (which they did prove in Q), why not base controversial decisions on that and stand on it? I have to say the one thing that bothered me on the call at the end was that Mel didn't acknowledge that Delisting rule change as positive for the company (or even that the company was affected by it either way). Instead he just said he expects shareholders to vote for extra shares and reverse. IMHO, he/they need neither at this stage. My vote will most likely be no to both. Not based on emotion but on other real options available to the company that are much more positive for all shareholders (and the company itself). I expect this company to honestly work themselves (and us) out of the current SP situation in the same way they worked themselves (and us) into it. The SP tanked organically and so it should be revived organically...not by the wave of a magic wand (funny money) and then say "Oh look! we now have no debt! Now you see it, now you don't!" That's no way to be going. Hard work and honest performance is. IMHO, show people you're honest and a hard worker, and they will support you, believe in you, AND REWARD you 100%....
LOS ANGELES, Nov. 17 /PRNewswire/ -- The following is being issued by "SaveSirius.org":
SaveSirius is a group of concerned shareholders that is accusing SIRIUS XM management of unjustly enriching themselves at shareholders' expense. A derivative suit has been filed in the United States District Court by SaveSirius founder, Michael Hartleib.
SaveSirius members have served formal letters of demand on the SIRIUS XM Board of Directors. Their demands are:
-- To postpone the vote that is seeking shareholder approval to further dilute the common stock by increasing the number of shares in the fully diluted float from 4.5 billion to 8 billion.
-- To postpone the proposed reverse split, ranging from 1 for 10 to 1 for 50.
-- In light of the abysmal stock performance and dire financial situation, that all stock compensation plans and other bonuses be suspended immediately, and not be reinstated until the return to these compensation plans would be commensurate with the concept of "performance based compensation".
"Given the NASDAQ's reprieve of delisting securities below a dollar, there is sufficient time for the Board to convene an emergency meeting to consider other options, such as but not limited to, self-funding by shareholders," said Michael Hartleib on behalf of SaveSirius and its members.
They also demand the Board meet with interested parties to address alternatives that would be more in line with shareholders' interests.
"If the board continues with the scheduled vote, we will believe that to be a violation of their fiduciary duties and will have no choice but to seek injunctive relief," said Michael Hartleib on behalf of SaveSirius and its members.
"The Board has also been notified that the proxy being distributed to SIRIUS XM shareholders is deficient as there is no mention of pending litigation in Federal District Court charging management with racketeering, fraud and breach of fiduciary duties; or the appeal before the D.C. Circuit seeking review and remand of the FCC's merger decision in part due to the failure to hold management responsible for violation of the interoperability mandate and allowing such management to continue in office to the detriment of shareholders and satellite radio consumers," said Michael Hartleib on behalf of SaveSirius and its members.
The demand letters were sent certified and have been confirmed delivered. SaveSirus members await the Company's response.
SOURCE SaveSirius.org
The trend indicates moves based on the way they perceive management is going to make their move. The key point is management wants to use
shareholder money to pay off the debt. That is obvious.
From a strictly business point consider the numbers of a RS. No emotion,
no conspiracy, no manipulation theories, just numbers.
50,000 becomes 1,000, @ .25, the 50 k is $12.500, the 1 k is $12.50
pps which equals $12,500. This means the @ .25 it only has to go to
$1 to get to $50 k. The 1000 has to go $50 pps to get to $50 k.
To get $100,000 the .25 has to go to $2. The $12.50 pps of 1000
has to go to $100 pps. How is that possible?
It's obvious with just looking at the numbers there is no way a RS
will help shareholders get their money back. It's not in the math.
So why would the bosses want it? Because they can issue new shares and get the debt paid off with new shareholders money. What does that show how they feel about the other shareholders losing their money.
They don't give a crap. That is the kind of management they are.
This is a management that wants SIRIUS for themselves while using
other peoples money at the cost of shareholders losing. They could cut the expenses to the bone. Stern can postpone his salary for a year, Oprah doesn't need money, cut her back, Martha the same. In these times, cut, cut, cut. But they won't do it. They are just living fat off the
$2.7 bil revenue. Good management would get the money out of revenue
stream to pay down the debt. But they won't do it because of ulterior
motives. Hence the conspiracy theories. NO! NO! NO! RS
Management has the next 4 weeks to prove their true intentions. Certain things are acceptable and certain things are not (as you point out). Based on their own comments on the Q call, I am giving them the benefit to do what is acceptable....IMHO.
Sirius Star Oil Tanker
...SIRI is just a magnate for bad news!! lol
I am in total agreement with your analysis that by including the newly authorized shares in the R/S and those extra shares diluted and authorized, can then be sold to pay debt. So 3.5 Bil shares additionally authorized becomes 70 M with a value of 12.50 / share in a 1 to 50 RS at $.25 /share.
The current authorized shares of 4.5B become 90M shares of which 3.5B (70M) are currently outstanding or restricted, leaving 1B (20M) left for dilution. Additionally, the current shareholders who are RS will need unrealistic SP values to recoup their losses after, creating all the current shareholder dissatisfaction with this plan.
I believe that if Mel acted on this plan, in this manner to pay debt, rather than avoid delisting as he has stated, that he should and probable would be indicted and thrown in jail. To date, this is not what he has said he wanted the RS authorization for.
In my opinion any RS used without a delisting notice from NASDAQ, and the use of the 180 day period to bring the stock price above a $1, would be evidence of this misrepresentation and possible Fraud, and for that matter, conspiracy to committ a whole lot of sh**t. Excuse my legal jargon, I am obviously not a lawyer.
My opinion about Mel’s management is that he needs to execute the business plan, while paying of the debt or at least improving debt conditions to the benefit not detriment of the shareholders.
The merger debt refinancing has me giving him one big strike against him and the proxy statement with these controversial requests gives him two. Any execution of the above described dilution-RS-sell shares to pay debt action would be strike 3 and time to lock him up. He still has a chance to hit it out of the park, but there isn’t much time and it needs to be done through hard work and efficient business plan execution.
do we need a yes vote in order to get the 180 day extension?
also in earlier posts some mentioned the sp needs to be over 5.00 for big instutions to invest.
is'nt mffias showing more recent buying at the lower sp.
Proxy vote and NAS extension have NOTHING to do with one another. As it stands now, as of Jan. 16, 2009, clocks will restart where they left off on Oct 16 (the day the rule change took effect) for those already in default. Where SIRI is concerned, the last day they closed @ 1.00 was Sept. 19. So technically their 30 days trading below 1.00 would have been Oct 19--in which case they would gave received a notice and been given 180 days to comply. The only thing I'm unsure about is if a new SIRI 30 day clock starts on Jan 16 or id they then have their remaining 3 days on the old clock before receiving a notice...
So in either condition (assuming they are still below 1.00 by Jan 16), at worst their 6 month clock would start on Jan. 19 (3 remaining days of old clock) or at best, Feb 16 (30 days on totally new clock. So you are either looking at June 19 to get the price up over 1.00 or July 16. THEN...
Most companies (if they can't elevate over 1.00 for 10 consecutive days as is the rule for reinstatement) then file for an appeal upon reaching their 180 day grace. The appeal request will automatically stay the delisting until the NAS Panel reaches a decision. NAS will typically hold a hearing to consider an appeal within 45 days after the appeal is made, and it may take up to 30 days after the hearing to make a decision.
SO....WORST CASE SCENARIO...SIRI would not be delisted until:
June 19 + 45days + 30days = Sept 4, 2009.
BEST CASE SCENARIO...Siri would not be delisted until:
July 16 + 45days + 30 days = Oct 4, 2009.
It's important that all shareholders realize this timetable. Further, based on Q3 CC, and current company numbers projections by management, no one in their right mind could fathom them not making it back to 1.00 by those dates--ORGANICALLY. Just impossble.
>>Most companies (if they can't elevate over 1.00 for 10 consecutive days as is the rule for reinstatement) then file for an appeal upon reaching their 180 day grace.<<
I didn't mean "reinstatement" as no delisting has occured yet during this time period. I meant (1.00 for 10 consecutive days as the rule for compliance)
Basically, without voting yes for reverse split, no SIRI delisting would occur until approximately mid August/early September....(and that's only of course IF the price between now and then stays under 1.00. Which as said, is WAAAY unrealistic based on company projections of cash flow, Q growth, etc...
delisting time period starting point. Any Corp. in the delisting time
period would get 60 days after Jan. 16 and then a second 180
days after that. This means basically 8 mos. from Jan. 16 for a
delisting of SIRIUS. With the current market still dropping it's
possible Nasdaq will extend the delisting after Jan. 16 because
their position is that more Corp.'s are falling under a buck the
suspension was necessary. If more continue to fall then another
suspension would be in order. Mel's using the delisting as a fear
tool to get votes for RS means they don't know the Nasdaq rules and
are incompetent, or they do know and are lying to us to get the
vote they want. They can't have it both ways. If they are lying then
it adds to `they are up to something'. In law, false in one,false in all.
Delisting is not an issue at this time for SIRIUS and should not be
a factor for RS. In addition, the current press release about the
law suits also means that Nasdaq has to seriously look at fiduciary
misdeeds in the management's attempt to get votes based on false
and misleading statements not in the interest of shareholders
investments as well as possible influenced stock trading to keep
the PS in a certain range in order to facilitate a restructuring favoring
management against shareholders interest. Nasdaq and the SEC
should shortly get involved to establish if the rules concerning trading
of this stock, and the stock PS have been unduly manipulated in order
to defraud investors for specific unpublished motives of management.
This should further spur Nassaq to hold in abeyance any delisting
based on ongoing lawsuits and SEC and Nasdaq investigations.
There is a possibility that xyz company CAN organically get above 1.0 but winds up having a hard time getting maybe over 2.00 or 3.00. And, AS A HEALTHY GROWING COMPANY, they opt to reverse to get their stock maybe up to $20 or $30 (as in say a 1:10)...to make thte stock more attractive to some institutions who won't buy anything under a certain price (and to lower outstanding share count). Now, there is still a risk of being shorted back down, but if company metrics are positive, more often than not the price will thrive and continue to climb at the new levels. This is reversing under healthy conditions.
So in fairness to SIRI, they could be thinking along these lines...as the Proxy item of reverse holds an expiration of Dec 09. This way, a special vote does not have to be taken. But my take is, it's going to take them a few Q's anyway to become more solid and continue to prove themselves as a combined company. If everything goes as planned according to their own projections, they could easily be in great shape a year from now and request the same vote for reverse at that 09 annual meeting next December. Until then, there's definitely plenty of hard work to be done and projections to meet. Concentrate on that execution and the SP will follow no problem. IMHO...
the exact language. In any case delisting is not a factor in the RS issue. If they say it and use it to get RS split votes, it is false
and misleading statements in order to restructure thru illegal
misrepresentation. Someone should confront Mel and the other exec.'s
and ask are they specifically saying publically to shareholders and the
investment community that a RS is necessary now to avoid delisting
in the current time period. Also, we need a direct answer from them,
if they get a reverse split, are they planning new share issues in order to use that money to pay down debt knowing everyone who suffered
a RS lost the value of their shares with no chance to recoup that lost money. AS shareholders we have to exert our rights in order to protect
our investments. The stronger we are as united shareholders the more power we have to get answers now before it's to late.
On Jan 16, 2009 the delisting requirement will end. With Sirius not having received a delisting notice, it was not formally in a compliance period. Compliance periods, as I have read and understand, are those 180 automatic compliance periods once notified, after 30 day noncompliance, and extension 180 day periods when granted. For Companies not in a compliance period the clock starts over starting on Jan. 19, 2009 (Monday) for 30 days, then a notice and 180 day compliance period begins, ending around Sept 19, 2009. The additional 180 days also means that Sirius would move from the Global Market to the Capital Market for this additional period. The link below is of the rule change as proposed.
www.nasdaq.com/about/S...
Holdon,
Based on this info, an emergency meeting would have to take place to give the company authorization for a RS to be included in a plan submitted to Nasdaq, requesting an additional 180 day extension. The company cannot submit it if its not authorized.
In a perfect world where Mel was trusted or shareholders had confidence, the company saving money by not having a Emergency Meeting, proxy mailing, and vote, would be prudent. In that case the RS would be a tool already granted and if not needed would expire on Dec 31, 2009.
you wrote:
>>The current Nasdaq rules from 10/17 suspend until Jan. 16 any
delisting time period starting point. Any Corp. in the delisting time
period would get 60 days after Jan. 16 and then a second 180
days after that<<
I looked on the Nasdaq document and couldn't find any 60 day change to the normal initial 30 day period of non-compliance. I could have missed it. Did this change? Otherwise, it's still the old rule of 30 days under 1.00 starts the 180 day clock.
And I did find the clarification of when SIRI's clock would start. If a company was in compliance before the temporary rule change (as SIRI was...barely), the new 30 day "below 1.00" clock starts fresh on Jan 19. So your looking at 7 months (July 19) plus appeal time (October) before any delisting would take place...
www.cchwallstreet.com/...
People need to vote based on information on the ground and their comfort level with authorizing an unnecessary authority for an action, if abused, would harm them as shareholders. For me, if Mel and crew do not do something to build that confidence within the next couple weeks, I will be sitting on the sidelines anyways.
notes on another case with a 60 day rule. Didn't have the actual rule in
front of me. Stand corrected. Thanks for the good research.
cos1000..
finally a little more decisive move today on higher volume...albeit down. Maybe this helps move closer to a significant capitulation mode...
Market-wise, we have now had a rotten September, October and now 1/2 of November. Somewhere in here soon, there has to be a turn for a sustained period. Way too much consistent downward pressure. just can't last much longer... IMHO...
cos1000...
I hear ya but I'm willing to provide a little time. As you, I am bothered by the lack of mention of a salient "reality" to the company. He should have at least mentioned it (the rule change) happened. But I want to let him prove something to all. After the dilution in July, I can't believe they would be so "arsinine" as to think they are going to dilute again just 5 months later...even as their stock is down this far. As you said earlier, it just makes no sense. He said "in short order" without skipping a beat so I gotta let him prove it. Further, as I said to Relmor, if they want shareholders to approve more shares/reverse, they must get this SP up. No shareholder in their right mind will say yes to something like that while down here. ESP...Institutions and Funds. No way. If they would, they'd be a total moron. That's why I think the SP has to head higher before the meeting...because they want those tools. This will give many of us options. IMHO
Our time frame is probably close to the same. I am looking for an announcement by the 1st week of Dec on financing. Its going to take some kind of news to move this stock price. I think the low volume, even today 32M is low, is a sign of news waiting to happen. Its like getting everyone on the plane ready to go, and now we're waiting for a weather delay. I'm giving management the benefit of the doubt, right now, but something has to be delivered before the annual meeting IMO.
To change topics, I am also concerned that we are not seeing very well executed marketing plans..... silence to the general public while marketing to existing customers. Seems like their letting this holiday season pass them by. I am also completely taken aback by the silence from the company in general after this merge. Cost cutting is great but their is a retail market that needs to be addressed. They have a great new portable product in the XMP3 and no one even knows about it.
All right I'm done and tomorrows another day....... have a good one.
i thought siri needed the yes vote to get the extension., in the case they don't , i'll vote no on both !
killer, feed the dog!!!
HOW LOW YOU THINK GS SHARE'S ARE GOING ?
ANOTHER BAD DAY FOR THE GANGSTER MR WIENKES
PLUS .....SHOOTING HIS MOUTH IN TO THE OZONE A FEW DAY BEFORE
SIRI REPORTS , THE MAN HAS AN AGENDA ,
OFF THE SUBJECT
MARK CUBAN INSIDE TRADING
WHERE THE HELL IS WALL STREET POLICE WHEN STOCK'S LIKE SIRI
BEING MANIPULATED
THE WHOLE FINANCIAL SECTOR BEEN MANIPULATED
I AGREE WITH SENATOR MCCAIN
SOME ONE NEEDS TO POLICE THIS CASINO , FIRE ALL THESE
MORAN'S
Dino