What's an American Car These Days?

We've heard a lot lately about the “Buy American” provisions being debated in the economic stimulus bill, and that made me think about how increasingly difficult, and increasingly meaningless, it is to even determine what "Buy American" really means in an increasingly globalized world economy. Consider automobiles - how do you tell the difference any more between "American cars" and "foreign cars."

1. Here's a list of 8 "American-made" vehicles produced by American UAW workers, in American factories, but for foreign-based car companies. If you purchased one of these vehicles, would that count as "buying American"?

American-made UAW vehicles:

• Mazda 6
• Mitsubishi (MITEY.PK) Eclipse
• Mitsubishi Galant
• Toyota (TM) Corolla
• Isuzu i-Series Truck
• Mazda B-series Truck
• Mitsubishi Raider Truck
• Toyota Tacoma Truck

2. What about these nine Canadian-made vehicles, produced by UAW brothers and sisters at factories in Canada, for the U.S.-based Detroit Three. They can't qualify as "American-Made" can they?:

Canadian-made UAW vehicles:

• Buick Lacrosse
• Chevrolet Impala
• Chrysler 300
• Dodge Challenger
• Dodge Charger
• Ford (F) Crown Victoria
• Lincoln Town Car
• Mercury Grand Marquis
• Pontiac Grand Prix

3. What about the Chevy Aveo, which is built by Korean automaker Daewoo for Detroit-based General Motors (GM)? Or the Chrysler PT Cruiser, built in Mexico?

4. What about the 2008 Honda (HMC) Pilot and Honda Civics, built in the U.S. with higher domestic content (70%) than the 2008 Dodge Ram (68%) and the Michigan-built Ford Mustang (65%).

5. What about the Toyota Tundra, Toyota Sienna and Honda Odyssey, which rank #5, #6 and #7 for the "Top American-Made Cars" in 2008 by Cars.com?

Comments

[Detfan:]

American cars are what they always have been. A car purchased thru GM, Ford or Chysler. Nothing has changed. Profits still go to the home country when you buy from anyone else. People who are buying imports continue to weaken the manufacturing complex in this country. Plus, because you can now choose a GM, Ford, or Chysler car, and have it be equal or superior to the import, you can buy American with confidence these days. Why doesn't our government force Japan to open their market (3rd largest in the world) to U.S. cars? Free trade is only free if its equal.

Feb 09 06:58 AM

[Tony C:]

Detfan, that "Det" doesn't stand for Detroit by any chance, does it? It sure sounds that way.
If you actually believe that the cars from Detroit are what they always have been, then you must not work in the industry. The imported content in Detroit's cars has been raising steadily for decades now, and as written, many of them have a lower domestic content than do import branded cars. And since the former big 3 no longer make profits, you can't argue that it's all about where the profits go. There are none!
GM recently announced its "Centers for Excellence," being the GM facilities around the world that will develop its future vehicles. These involve the high paying, highly technical engineering skills that we should seek to keep in the US. While GM's trucks will continue to be developed here, NONE of its future car platforms will be designed or developed in the USA.
Ford's plan for the future? Move production of European developed cars to North America. We retain some assembly line work, but again the skilled jobs will be in Europe.
Chrysler's future? Sell itself to the Italians.

Feb 09 08:44 AM

[ex GM emp:]

I'm scratchin' my head here. We've got trillions in trade deficits on borrowed money. How in the hell are we going to lose if we cut off the rest of the world completely. Seems to me they're gonna be the ones who take the pipe. This article is typical PHD academia. Every answer to every problem is in the pages of a book.

Feb 09 09:40 AM

[ex GM emp:]

I'm scratchin' my head here. We've got trillions in trade deficits on borrowed money. How in the hell are we going to lose if we cut off the rest of the world completely. Seems to me they're gonna be the ones who take the pipe. This article is typical PHD academia. Every answer to every problem is in the pages of a book.

Feb 09 09:40 AM

[DownOnMyLuck:]

Most of these companies trade on international stock markets, so profits and wealth creation (or destruction) go to shareholders worldwide. Half of the dividends that I recieve are from foreign companies.


On Feb 09 06:58 AM Detfan wrote:

> American cars are what they always have been. A car purchased thru
> GM, Ford or Chysler. Nothing has changed. Profits still go to the
> home country when you buy from anyone else. People who are buying
> imports continue to weaken the manufacturing complex in this country.
> Plus, because you can now choose a GM, Ford, or Chysler car, and
> have it be equal or superior to the import, you can buy American
> with confidence these days. Why doesn't our government force Japan
> to open their market (3rd largest in the world) to U.S. cars? Free
> trade is only free if its equal.

Feb 09 11:15 AM

[Miken:]

Write about something you know about. There is not a single UAW worker in those Canadian plants, they're CAW (Canadian Auto Workers) which have no affiliation with the UAW for about 39 years now.

If you want to really annoy a Canadian worker, just say he belongs to the UAW.

"2. What about these nine Canadian-made vehicles, produced by UAW brothers and sisters at factories in Canada, for the U.S.-based Detroit Three. They can't qualify as "American-Made" can they?:

Canadian-made UAW vehicles:

* Buick Lacrosse
* Chevrolet Impala
* Chrysler 300
* Dodge Challenger
* Dodge Charger
* Ford (F) Crown Victoria
* Lincoln Town Car
* Mercury Grand Marquis
* Pontiac Grand Prix

Feb 09 12:51 PM

[Moon Kil Woong:]

Look under the hood, if the engine is not an American one then the value add came from somewhere else. Actually, don't bother. If it gets bad gas mileage it's American. If it gets good gas mileage or is battery driven it's not. How sad this is what GM, Chrysler, and the rest have made American craftmanship come to symbolize.

And Miken is right, many of US company cars are being made partially or completely overseas. If you want to bash overseas businesses being competitive bash the US auto companies too. If you want to bad overseas cars then get ready to pay $40,000 for a piece of junk unless you buy a Japanese car built in America (ironically they do it because a US auto worker is cheaper than in Japan).

Feb 09 07:58 PM

[CLH:]

Very good points Perry. Cars made by the little three are made by workers who hate the company because of the union. These workers will be happy when they are all unemployed and can draw permanent welfare.

Feb 09 09:12 PM

[Thadeus III:]

Mr. Perry likes to filter information like many do today so suit their POV or assuage their conscience because of buying a foreign car or product. All one needs to do is to look at what other countries are and have been doing for their businesses, people, and banks, not just now, but for YEARS. . In Japan, China, and especially Germany and other European countries the governments have been subsidizing their car makers for years. Since last Fall, Germany has been giving it's citizens a cash incentive to buy GERMAN made cars such as the now popular Opel Agila. When a $5K incentive is suggested here in the US all people can do is complain about how it's helping those lazy *#@$! auto workers and their companies. Other countries have always been protectionist. Ever since WWII the U.S.A. has been too much the worlds care taker. People here need to get past petty jealousies and prejudice when it comes to the well being of us all. There will never be a time when all of us get the same pay or benefits. Contrary to what many people think or say, a union doesn't "dictate" how a business is run or what engineering or production design choices are made. A union does help workers attain safer work standards, benefits, and compensation based on how well the company is doing, while trying to establish a decent standard of living or well being for workers and their families. Is spite of what others may say, this has helped establish a fairer standard of living for others not working in a unionized company or occupation. No more. Now GM, Ford, etc, want to provide $14-1$16/hr and also have a person fund his/her own 401K and a good deal of their medical insurance. Not even Suze Orman would see how that is possible. In the case of the UAW, losses in benefits and pay have occurred especialIy since 1982. But many are too petty, jealous, or ignorant to research that. Well, I guess we all need to move 10- 20 people into a single household and start living like third world countries.

In addition, I've always told my kids to make the best of what you have, live within your means, but keep your eye open for opportunity to better yourself by making efforts to do so. Not everyone has the same talents or academic abilities, another reason for a union to help provide a worker some measure of dignity no matter what his job position. . If you keep looking at the other guy, making comparisons, and being competitive for money, you will either be unhappy or an arrogant blowhard that no one wants to be around (except others like you).
This country needs to take care of it's own as other countries have for years. Instead of criticizing and and forming narrow minded opinions, we need to see how the rest of the world is handling this financial crisis. And Kman, I applaud you for your moving into the electrical field. Ir does require a lot of sacrifice to travel and move around a lot. I have a friend that did electrical contract work as you are. But he decoded to eventually work for a local contractor for less pay and a weekly paycheck to be with his kids and family. We need to be mindful of other people's circumstances and respect their decisions.

Feb 10 09:34 AM

[reality chk:]

The Canadian made American vehicles are made by Canadian Auto Workers NOT UAW.
Also by leaving some small details out the writer knows that conclusions are left to the interpetations.

Feb 10 11:44 AM

[reality chk:]

Is it American if it is assembled in America with foreign made components?
For every one (1) assembly line worker there are 16 at the powertrain plants, the metal fabricating plants, and the supplier plants.
Is it American if it was assembled in California or Texas,or Alabama if 70% of the components came from Japan, or Korea ?
Is it Canadian if it is assembled in Canada with 70% American components?
I don't like to export Dollars. it comes down to imports / exports. Dollars leaving this country do not return. They are replaced by IOUs and Deficits. The relationships we have with Canada are much more on an equal level than those with Japan , China, and Korea.

Feb 10 11:58 AM

[Tony C:]

<<<Look under the hood, if the engine is not an American one then the value add came from somewhere else. Actually, don't bother. If it gets bad gas mileage it's American. If it gets good gas mileage or is battery driven it's not.
>>>

Far from true. Many of the worst mileage vehicles in the EPA's list are foreign brands. And on a car-for-car basis, Detroit typically beats the Japanese brands in mileage (not to say they are the better car). Japan's pickups all get poorer mileage than do Detroit's.
Since Toyota introduced the Prius to the US market, its CAFE (fleet average mileage) numbers have DECREASED. Why? Because Toyota sold far more guzzling trucks than it did hybrids. It just doesn't publicize those facts.

Feb 10 02:22 PM

[Tony C:]

<<< All one needs to do is to look at what other countries are and have been doing for their businesses, people, and banks, not just now, but for YEARS. . In Japan, China, and especially Germany and other European countries the governments have been subsidizing their car makers for years. Since last Fall, Germany has been giving it's citizens a cash incentive to buy GERMAN made cars such as the now popular Opel Agila.
>>>

And the US government does the same for our auto industry. Try doing some research on USCAR and PNGV. These were government research projects aimed at funneling tax money directly into the Detroit auto makers (Japanese companies need not apply). The goal was to get them to produce high mileage cars. Ford, GM and Chrysler all produced the required concept car, cashed our check, and went back to building SUVs.
Toyota had wanted in, but once shuned by us, they went home and developed their hybrid drive system (which had started as a US concept!).

And I hope you realize that Germans buying an Opel benefits an American corporation, not a German one.

Feb 10 02:29 PM

[33Nick:]

There is almost no such tings as "Buy American" or "Buy French", or buy anything where almost all products have components part made all around the planet. It's a nice way to keep attention away from more important things happening.

Feb 10 04:04 PM

[Thadeus Tho...:]

@ Tony Carlos

" >----- And the US government does the same for our auto industry. Try doing some research on USCAR and PNGV. These were government research projects aimed at funneling tax money directly into the Detroit auto makers (Japanese companies need not apply). The goal was to get them to produce high mileage cars. Ford, GM and Chrysler all produced the required concept car, cashed our check, and went back to building SUVs.
Toyota had wanted in, but once shuned by us, they went home and developed their hybrid drive system (which had started as a US concept!). " >

This is old news. And the Big 3 did produce many hi mpg vehicles. Where do you think Ford Focus and Chevrolet Cobalt XFE came from? And the Japanese jumped on the band wagon , or tried to, with big SUVs and pickup trucks. And yes, it was foolish for GM to sell it's electric vehicle/battery technology to an oil company and then on to Toyota. So isn't that proof that GM wanted clean and green electrics back in the early 90's? And who bought them? They had to do leases and that's what they got for being foresighted.
Also, the kind of protectionist support that goes on in Japan, Europe, and now especially China isn't near what US companies have benefited from. You folks just don't seem to get it. I guess it's ok to support the troops in dubious military ventures ( no disrespect intended and I am a vet), but when it comes to supporting American business and workers stomp on 'em hard. What an attitude.

Feb 10 04:36 PM

[303820:]

For every foreign transplant that opens up in this country one of ours shuts down...For every $1 profit they make they take$.90 back to their home land!

Feb 10 06:09 PM

[Tony C:]

<<<This is old news. And the Big 3 did produce many hi mpg vehicles. Where do you think Ford Focus and Chevrolet Cobalt XFE came from? And the Japanese jumped on the band wagon , or tried to, with big SUVs and pickup trucks. And yes, it was foolish for GM to sell it's electric vehicle/battery technology to an oil company and then on to Toyota. So isn't that proof that GM wanted clean and green electrics back in the early 90's? And who bought them? They had to do leases and that's what they got for being foresighted.
Also, the kind of protectionist support that goes on in Japan, Europe, and now especially China isn't near what US companies have benefited from. You folks just don't seem to get it. I guess it's ok to support the troops in dubious military ventures ( no disrespect intended and I am a vet), but when it comes to supporting American business and workers stomp on 'em hard. What an attitude.>>>t...

Yeah, USCAR and PNGV are old news. Tax dollars were funnelled into Detroit to cover thier costs in developing high mileage cars which were supposed to be then launched to production. Detroit took out money, did the development part, showed the concepts, but never produced the cars. THAT IS THE PROBLEM.
As for protectionism, please tell us who is the largest selling car brand in China? Hint: it's initials are G and M. And which brands are amongst the top five in Europe? Try Ford and GM.
What country slaps a 25% tariff on any imported truck? Try USA.
Now tell me about protectionism.

Feb 11 09:26 AM

[Thadeus Tho...:]

Yeah, at least we had some protection from the cheap, unsafe trucks that Thailand was preparing to dump on the US. Too bad we couldn't get some of that protection on Kia. 10 year warranty? Try and collect on that or even get parts in a reasonable time. Where is our consumer protection there?

Feb 11 11:43 AM

[Tony C:]

<<<Yeah, at least we had some protection from the cheap, unsafe trucks that Thailand was preparing to dump on the US. Too bad we couldn't get some of that protection on Kia. 10 year warranty? Try and collect on that or even get parts in a reasonable time. Where is our consumer protection there?>>>thad...

If you think import tariffs are the way to prevent unsafe product from reaching the consumer, then I'm done with this dialog.

BTW, the Ford Focus and Cobalt XFE did not evolve from any taxpayer funded research. They are simply a slight tweaking (engine tune and gear ratio) of Detroit's existing compact cars. Both of which are badly outdated and overdue for replacement.

Feb 12 09:02 AM

[Cosmo:]

Why the "UAW workers" filter to qualify as "American"? Seems the non-union transplants, Honda being the first, had the business model right from the beginning. I did not know Union and American were synonymous.

Apr 07 11:58 AM