Cash for Clunkers Coming Soon to Your Kitchen and Laundry Room

*Stare out Window*

*Shake head*

*Stare at Wall*

*Shake head more*

I have this surreal feeling around me. We had not thought of this one last week as we brainstormed ideas on how we can steal more from future generations... [Aug 13: Reader Proposals for New Stimulus Plans]

I suppose it's time to get long General Electric (GE) and Whirpool (WHR) - Americans are about to be handed more of their great grandchildren's money so they can shop for products for the kitchen and laundry room. Look, if we had even a whimper of a surplus - or even had a dream of one day dropping our deficit, I could at least live with this. But we're bankrupt and just piling on more debt as if money is going out of style.

Via Wall Street Journal

• Appliance manufacturers are counting on a "cash for clunkers"-type rebate program to revive slumping sales of refrigerators, washing machines and dishwashers.
• Beginning late this fall, federal rebates will be available for purchasers of high-efficiency household appliances, furnaces and air-conditioning systems. Congress authorized $300 million for the program earlier this year as part of the federal economic-stimulus bill.
• After seeing the recent surge in new-car orders attributed to the federally funded clunkers program, appliance industry executives are hoping to lure consumers back into appliance store showrooms with rebates that are expected to reach $200 on some types of appliances.
• "It's a good way for the consumer to get back into the marketplace," said J.B. Hoyt, director of governmental relations for Whirlpool Corp. (WHR), the world's largest producer of household appliances by revenue. "Clearly, anything that boosts business is good for us."

Clearly. By adding to the U.S. debt so that certain corporations can do well... it's certainly a win-win.

• Whirlpool has been pushing for such a program for years.

I am sure if you talk to Whirpool executives they are all for free market capitalism. With exceptions of course.

General Electric? They don't even pretend that the U.S. has anything to do with capitalism. I can at least respect them for being honest unlike the rest of these cats who fight off any regulation because its not "free market" but are happy to accept gifts from the "not so invisible hand". Direct quote from Jeff Immelt, CEO of GE.

It's never been a free market; it's never gonna be a free market. That's just the way it is. The fact that I'd like GE to work in concert with where government policy is in the U.S. doesn't mean that I'm a traitor or a bad guy, I think it's just being practical that that's gotta happen.

Anyhow buy stocks hand over fist, your great grandchildren are subsidizing corporate America. Literally.

Comments

[basehitz:]

As a heads up to SA readers, earlier this morning I sent SA an email of a suspected virus infiltration of SA’s website. Last night I read comments posted from other readers who have been having similar problems. At least one acknowledged they took the bait presumably planted by the virus and infected their machine.

Subject: Suspected virus on SA website

A pattern of virus threats has developed in recent weeks that only happens on SA. My system is Vista OS with Norton security. All SW is regularly updated and system scanned for viruses.

The presumed virus attack begins with a screen pop-up type display alerting that my system IS infected and that I should activate some program that presumes to be anti-virus scanning SW. As you are aware, Windows requests user permission before the program is allowed to run. I have read about this type of threat hackers use and didn’t take the bait. But it is persistent and has tried many times over the recent weeks.

My practice each time is to shutdown all internet operations and unplug the internet connection. Then I have Norton quick scan the system, update SW, and rescan. Then I check Windows Defender. Often, it is found disabled when this happens. So I reactivate and scan. Several times since this has happened I do a complete system scan both with Norton and Windows Defender. If any risk is detected, it has always been determined by Norton as “low risk” and “resolved”. As far as I can tell, my system is OK.

Yesterday I read several other posters comment about similar problems. That confirmed my suspicion that this only happened when accessing SA’s website. My perception is that this event occurs when accessing SA articles both directly off your home page as well as thru emails from you. It is not limited to one author. So it appears this threat may have spread through your system.

Naturally, I have curtailed my use of your website. I trust you will get this resolved or I am sure you will lose many readers. That would be unfortunate, because you provide a worthwhile service to fill the void of the agenda-driven financial media.

Note, as I accessed your website this morning, the moment I hit “Contact Us” I got another attack. My curtailment of your service will become more so as a result. Please email me for updates on the status/resolution of this issue. Thanks.

Aug 21 06:38 AM

[basehitz:]

I guess they’ll need a new punchline for “Cash for other clunkers 2”. . . or is that 3? (How many house rebates have we had . . so far?)

It seems this govt is willing to spend anything to get this economy going. When I think of spending personally, it is using available cash. But since collectively we’re in debt up to our eyeballs, we’ll just borrow more. . . presumably from the Chinese principally.

I read recently living conditions for many in China that I would describe as living in squalor. And the compensation of many of it’s workers as well below poverty levels. Yet we expect them to buy massive quantities of our debt so we can buy new stuff with their money. This just isn’t right.

But as stock traders, we can either bitch or else find something to play. We know that China has been focused on buying commodities. . . I assume with our money as a hedge against what seems inevitable. This makes sense. So yesterday I opened a new position in GAZ since NG < $3. I avoided UNG cause of all the structural problems there. I hope they straighten that out so I can play both. Be aware that GAZ is an ETN not an ETF. Some are uncomfortable with that.

I will continue to explore other commodities and their producers.

Aug 21 07:01 AM

[babajay:]

Had the same problem also... I had to go into my temp files, find the offending program and delete it. It took me several tries to get rid of it as it crashed explorer every time I tried to delete it. Malicious lil thug...!


On Aug 21 06:38 AM basehitz wrote:

> As a heads up to SA readers, earlier this morning I sent SA an email
> of a suspected virus infiltration of SA’s website. Last night I read
> comments posted from other readers who have been having similar problems.
> At least one acknowledged they took the bait presumably planted by
> the virus and infected their machine.
>
> Subject: Suspected virus on SA website
>
> A pattern of virus threats has developed in recent weeks that only
> happens on SA. My system is Vista OS with Norton security. All SW
> is regularly updated and system scanned for viruses.
>
> The presumed virus attack begins with a screen pop-up type display
> alerting that my system IS infected and that I should activate some
> program that presumes to be anti-virus scanning SW. As you are aware,
> Windows requests user permission before the program is allowed to
> run. I have read about this type of threat hackers use and didn’t
> take the bait. But it is persistent and has tried many times over
> the recent weeks.
>
> My practice each time is to shutdown all internet operations and
> unplug the internet connection. Then I have Norton quick scan the
> system, update SW, and rescan. Then I check Windows Defender. Often,
> it is found disabled when this happens. So I reactivate and scan.
> Several times since this has happened I do a complete system scan
> both with Norton and Windows Defender. If any risk is detected, it
> has always been determined by Norton as “low risk” and “resolved”.
> As far as I can tell, my system is OK.
>
> Yesterday I read several other posters comment about similar problems.
> That confirmed my suspicion that this only happened when accessing
> SA’s website. My perception is that this event occurs when accessing
> SA articles both directly off your home page as well as thru emails
> from you. It is not limited to one author. So it appears this threat
> may have spread through your system.
>
> Naturally, I have curtailed my use of your website. I trust you will
> get this resolved or I am sure you will lose many readers. That would
> be unfortunate, because you provide a worthwhile service to fill
> the void of the agenda-driven financial media.
>
> Note, as I accessed your website this morning, the moment I hit “Contact
> Us” I got another attack. My curtailment of your service will become
> more so as a result. Please email me for updates on the status/resolution
> of this issue. Thanks.

Aug 21 07:47 AM

[TeresaE:]

I too had this happen. Contacted SA, then Firefox fixed it for me.

I quit using Internet Explorer last winter when IE decided to broadcast my usernames and passwords. That was MicroSoft's last chance to screw me.

I find no need to go through your increased security. No virus to be found, just someone hijacking SAs urls and redirecting them.

Since Firefox updated I have not had one problem.


On Aug 21 06:38 AM basehitz wrote:

> As a heads up to SA readers, earlier this morning I sent SA an email
> of a suspected virus infiltration of SA’s website. Last night I read
> comments posted from other readers who have been having similar problems.
> At least one acknowledged they took the bait presumably planted by
> the virus and infected their machine.
>
> Subject: Suspected virus on SA website
>
> A pattern of virus threats has developed in recent weeks that only
> happens on SA. My system is Vista OS with Norton security. All SW
> is regularly updated and system scanned for viruses.
>
> The presumed virus attack begins with a screen pop-up type display
> alerting that my system IS infected and that I should activate some
> program that presumes to be anti-virus scanning SW. As you are aware,
> Windows requests user permission before the program is allowed to
> run. I have read about this type of threat hackers use and didn’t
> take the bait. But it is persistent and has tried many times over
> the recent weeks.
>
> My practice each time is to shutdown all internet operations and
> unplug the internet connection. Then I have Norton quick scan the
> system, update SW, and rescan. Then I check Windows Defender. Often,
> it is found disabled when this happens. So I reactivate and scan.
> Several times since this has happened I do a complete system scan
> both with Norton and Windows Defender. If any risk is detected, it
> has always been determined by Norton as “low risk” and “resolved”.
> As far as I can tell, my system is OK.
>
> Yesterday I read several other posters comment about similar problems.
> That confirmed my suspicion that this only happened when accessing
> SA’s website. My perception is that this event occurs when accessing
> SA articles both directly off your home page as well as thru emails
> from you. It is not limited to one author. So it appears this threat
> may have spread through your system.
>
> Naturally, I have curtailed my use of your website. I trust you will
> get this resolved or I am sure you will lose many readers. That would
> be unfortunate, because you provide a worthwhile service to fill
> the void of the agenda-driven financial media.
>
> Note, as I accessed your website this morning, the moment I hit “Contact
> Us” I got another attack. My curtailment of your service will become
> more so as a result. Please email me for updates on the status/resolution
> of this issue. Thanks.

Aug 21 08:55 AM

[TeresaE:]

In Michigan, which is facing California style budget problems for the THIRD time this century, and even considering the money they stole from stimulus to paper over holes in the "budget", the state in conjunction with the thieving utilities, served notice a couple months ago about their own Cash for Clunking Appliances.

We have NO money in this state. We stole from stimulus funds, mowed down a bunch of weeds on the government dime, over the past 5 years raised fees, taxes, sales taxes and shortened the time before the government can tax sale your property. Yet magically, sending more of my money to state thug unions and China is going to make it all better.

Our utilities have raised rates FIVE times in less than four years. So, we pay more in sales tax (yes 6% sales tax) to the thieving state on the higher bills.

And then they are taking that money to turn around and gift it to primarily foreign-made appliances allegedly to save "energy."

I look around this wasteland and think, wtf?

Everyday it appears that this nightmare just isn't going to stop. We are just going to continue down this path to our ultimate destruction.

Just maybe the Aztecs were correct and the world, as we know it, will end in December 2012.

With all the decisions currrently being made, I just can't see how our system can survive much beyond that.

And I hope I have that long to prepare for our upcoming new reality.

Aug 21 09:03 AM

[buoy:]

Hmmm...our stimulus is starting to resemble China's.

Aug 21 09:35 AM

[WPSPIKER:]

I too have been seeing the little (BLOCKED) popup on my firefox shows that it has been stopping threats and or addon pop up windows every time I visit here. I'm not even using the latest FireFox and it works beter than MS...

now to the news.
dont just think WHL (woorlpool,) & GE (General Electric) think of the companies that sell them parts, Preferably ones who also sell parts to automakers & Furnace manufactures. I'm long HON (honeywell) & JCI (Johnsen Controls) who both are major suppliers to many many of these manufactures who are end item beneficiaries. Not to mention that these people also make after market parts used to upkeep existing items. An additional play maybe Eclipse for some of there factory updated heating equipment.

Mark

Aug 21 09:48 AM

[john s. gordon:]

the virus message described by basehitz has been popping up on my mac screen at least once a day for the last couple weeks.
since it won't let me do a warm restart i just kill the power & start over.
big waste of time.
> jack

Aug 21 10:10 AM

[TraderMark:]

Michigan tried to import prisoners from California. Looks like the bid was too low, California is now looking at lower cost states to export their prisoners.

I am serious - that is not a headline from The Onion. Talk about a wacky world. Granted neither state can really pay for the prisoners but thats where your federal printing press comes in.


On Aug 21 09:03 AM TeresaE wrote:

> In Michigan, which is facing California style budget problems for
> the THIRD time this century, and even considering the money they
> stole from stimulus to paper over holes in the "budget", the state
> in conjunction with the thieving utilities, served notice a couple
> months ago about their own Cash for Clunking Appliances.
>
> We have NO money in this state. We stole from stimulus funds, mowed
> down a bunch of weeds on the government dime, over the past 5 years
> raised fees, taxes, sales taxes and shortened the time before the
> government can tax sale your property. Yet magically, sending more
> of my money to state thug unions and China is going to make it all
> better.
>
> Our utilities have raised rates FIVE times in less than four years.
> So, we pay more in sales tax (yes 6% sales tax) to the thieving state
> on the higher bills.
>
> And then they are taking that money to turn around and gift it to
> primarily foreign-made appliances allegedly to save "energy."
>
> I look around this wasteland and think, wtf?
>
> Everyday it appears that this nightmare just isn't going to stop.
> We are just going to continue down this path to our ultimate destruction.
>
>
> Just maybe the Aztecs were correct and the world, as we know it,
> will end in December 2012.
>
> With all the decisions currrently being made, I just can't see how
> our system can survive much beyond that.
>
> And I hope I have that long to prepare for our upcoming new reality.

Aug 21 10:45 AM

[Avoiding Alpha:]

exact same thing happened to me.


On Aug 21 06:38 AM basehitz wrote:

> As a heads up to SA readers, earlier this morning I sent SA an email
> of a suspected virus infiltration of SA’s website. Last night I read
> comments posted from other readers who have been having similar problems.
> At least one acknowledged they took the bait presumably planted by
> the virus and infected their machine.
>
> Subject: Suspected virus on SA website
>
> A pattern of virus threats has developed in recent weeks that only
> happens on SA. My system is Vista OS with Norton security. All SW
> is regularly updated and system scanned for viruses.
>
> The presumed virus attack begins with a screen pop-up type display
> alerting that my system IS infected and that I should activate some
> program that presumes to be anti-virus scanning SW. As you are aware,
> Windows requests user permission before the program is allowed to
> run. I have read about this type of threat hackers use and didn’t
> take the bait. But it is persistent and has tried many times over
> the recent weeks.
>
> My practice each time is to shutdown all internet operations and
> unplug the internet connection. Then I have Norton quick scan the
> system, update SW, and rescan. Then I check Windows Defender. Often,
> it is found disabled when this happens. So I reactivate and scan.
> Several times since this has happened I do a complete system scan
> both with Norton and Windows Defender. If any risk is detected, it
> has always been determined by Norton as “low risk” and “resolved”.
> As far as I can tell, my system is OK.
>
> Yesterday I read several other posters comment about similar problems.
> That confirmed my suspicion that this only happened when accessing
> SA’s website. My perception is that this event occurs when accessing
> SA articles both directly off your home page as well as thru emails
> from you. It is not limited to one author. So it appears this threat
> may have spread through your system.
>
> Naturally, I have curtailed my use of your website. I trust you will
> get this resolved or I am sure you will lose many readers. That would
> be unfortunate, because you provide a worthwhile service to fill
> the void of the agenda-driven financial media.
>
> Note, as I accessed your website this morning, the moment I hit “Contact
> Us” I got another attack. My curtailment of your service will become
> more so as a result. Please email me for updates on the status/resolution
> of this issue. Thanks.

Aug 21 11:23 AM

[mikebrah:]

I too have had the virus announcement on my iMac. I just hit cancel and hit back and have not had any problems.


As for Michigan's 6% sales tax, I am quite jealous. Here in CA we pay 9.75% and it's only looking to go higher in the near future.

The thing that keeps me sane and optimistic is that ultimately the solution is quite QUITE simple. Cut spending, shrink government, increase individual accountability.

It's like weight loss. No matter how fat you get, the solution is the same and you will see results immediately once you change your lifestyle. That is what lets me hold on to the hope that at SOME point, collectively we will have our "aha" moment and decide to change.

Hopefully it will be more peaceful than the last time.

MM

Aug 21 11:30 AM

[TeresaE:]

Mark, why would a bankrupt state (Michigan) be in "negotiations" with another bankrupted state? Talk about throwing good money after bad.

But, that is diverting reality.

The same prison is being looked at to house the COURTS and prisoners from GITMO. There is MASSIVE opposition in the state to this.

I fear this as the reality of the laws such as the Homegrown Terrorism Act comes into play and these "courts" can be flipped to be used on Americans. Scary if you have read the law and can rationally & logically apply reality to it. BTW, though signed by Bush, it was written by the Democrats.

Anyway, our prison guards are the THIRD highest paid in country. We have to find a way to make money, so of course our bid was too high.

As if California could pay any amount to any state. IOUs for all!


On Aug 21 10:45 AM TraderMark wrote:

> Michigan tried to import prisoners from California. Looks like the
> bid was too low, California is now looking at lower cost states to
> export their prisoners.
>
> I am serious - that is not a headline from The Onion. Talk about
> a wacky world. Granted neither state can really pay for the prisoners
> but thats where your federal printing press comes in.

Aug 21 11:46 AM

[TeresaE:]

Do you pay it on gasoline (including federal & state gas excise taxes) and utilities (including federal & state utility taxes AND government run utilities)? In Michigan the government sets utility rates, and those utility rates guarantee the government a set rate of tax. No one sees that this is a massive conflict of interest. But the falling usage rates shows that some are catching on - and leaving.

Our property taxes also make up for the shortfall. A $200,000 house, with a taxable value of $100,000 pays over $4500 a year in my neighborhood - and I live in the "lowest" taxed city in the state's biggest county.


On Aug 21 11:30 AM mikebrah wrote:

> I too have had the virus announcement on my iMac. I just hit cancel
> and hit back and have not had any problems.
>
>
> As for Michigan's 6% sales tax, I am quite jealous. Here in CA we
> pay 9.75% and it's only looking to go higher in the near future.
>
>
> The thing that keeps me sane and optimistic is that ultimately the
> solution is quite QUITE simple. Cut spending, shrink government,
> increase individual accountability.
>
> It's like weight loss. No matter how fat you get, the solution is
> the same and you will see results immediately once you change your
> lifestyle. That is what lets me hold on to the hope that at SOME
> point, collectively we will have our "aha" moment and decide to change.
>
>
> Hopefully it will be more peaceful than the last time.
>
> MM

Aug 21 11:50 AM

[not so dumb...:]

Sales tax in Chicago, Ill. is 10%, likely the highest in the country. Cook County Hospital ( now called John Stroger Hospital) states that 60% of its patients are undocumented, according to the hospital's CEO David Goldberg, M.D. Do the math!

Aug 21 01:25 PM

[TraderMark:]

Mike, your property taxes are much lower. Which is why CA is always in a state of emergency every 4 years... much more reliant on spending and employment taxes than more stable real estate taxes.

Speaking of, New Jersey excels in high property taxes. Literally have read stories of people who have owned home free of mortgage but had to move from NJ due to increasing prop taxes.

On the plus side those taxes are subsidizing a whole class of public workers and their current and future pensions. Always a winner!

*raise your child to work in government


On Aug 21 11:30 AM mikebrah wrote:

> I too have had the virus announcement on my iMac. I just hit cancel
> and hit back and have not had any problems.
>
>
> As for Michigan's 6% sales tax, I am quite jealous. Here in CA we
> pay 9.75% and it's only looking to go higher in the near future.
>
>
> The thing that keeps me sane and optimistic is that ultimately the
> solution is quite QUITE simple. Cut spending, shrink government,
> increase individual accountability.
>
> It's like weight loss. No matter how fat you get, the solution is
> the same and you will see results immediately once you change your
> lifestyle. That is what lets me hold on to the hope that at SOME
> point, collectively we will have our "aha" moment and decide to change.
>
>
> Hopefully it will be more peaceful than the last time.
>
> MM

Aug 21 02:09 PM

[Howard_T:]

I too have had the "virus" hit twice. In the meantime, Firefox twisted my arm into updating, and I have had no further problem. After the first attack, I had McAfee do a full scan which turned out clean. For reasons stated by others above, I no longer use IE.

More rebates so we can finance more debt? All I can say is, "If you know you are going to drown, at least enjoy the boat ride."

Aug 21 02:44 PM

[j-dub:]

Don't forget about:

"Rebates for rabbit ears"

I have been writing congress for weeks about how Americans need more energy efficient plasma big screens and I am hoping that my ideas are made into reality.
Thanks America!!!!

Aug 21 06:33 PM

[Hot Richard:]

There is no way the state will finance a LONG TERM wealth redistribution to stock holders. That ain't gonna happen (there is no political payoff for them). The point has been made before...the money helicopters are not for you. State run businesses will be sucked of profits long before any accountant figures out what is left for shareholders.

Better than buying stocks because "we're all collectivists now", I say few of the state-run companies will provide serious returns for investors. It just isn't how the game is played (and yes, it IS a game).

I stand with GE on this one. The USSA is not (and hasn't been for a very long time) a capitalist/free market. Screw sleeping well at night. While Congress is shelling out your money you'd be a damn fool not to get in line yourself while cursing and plotting how to end this insanity. Don't hate the playah, hate the game (see how I tied it all together!).

Aug 21 09:24 PM

[Chickenpookie:]

Plasma big screens are energy efficient? How much more than LCD big screens and from where did you obtain your data?

Thanks,


On Aug 21 06:33 PM j-dub wrote:

> Don't forget about:
>
> "Rebates for rabbit ears"
>
> I have been writing congress for weeks about how Americans need more
> energy efficient plasma big screens and I am hoping that my ideas
> are made into reality.
> Thanks America!!!!
>
>

Aug 22 02:23 PM

[Hans111:]

Our swimming pool leaks.
I am waiting for a federal cash injection to replace it with a new one.

Where can I apply?

Aug 24 06:28 PM