Microsoft vs. Apple - Which Is Worth More?

Close your eyes and answer this question - which company is worth more, Apple (AAPL) or Microsoft (MSFT)?

I suspect most of us would say Microsoft without any hesitation. This is also correct but probably by a much smaller margin than you'd expect. MSFT's market cap is 219 BUSD vs AAPL 153 BUSD.

There are a lot of great things to be said about both companies. I'll try to sum it up below from my perspective:

MSFT
One or two superior products with very deep market penetration and competitive 'moats' in Windows and MS Office and a number of other products with varying successes, from Xbox to Bing, with the latter not being any match to the competition.

Risk and opportunities
Especially for Windows I don't see any risks on the horizon and the opportunities are mainly in markets like India and China where the number of people working behind a PC and in a company that is so big that they can't use pirate versions has a long way to grow. On top of this is their usage of Windows at home. I don't have any strong feelings for the future of MSFT's other products other than they are a more ordinary player with a strong 'parent'. It is however tempting to think that some of that money they keep channeling into things like Bing will eventually be more successful than they currently are.

AAPL
Who doesn't love the iPod, iPhone, iMac, MacBook? They seem to have it all. They are functional, the most elegant and by far the hippest. With the iPhone they seem to have made the bridge between a full-blown laptop and a mobile phone - and it even works well.

Opportunities and risks
There are obviously a lot of people who don't yet have an iWhatever who will buy one in the future and this may drive revenue in the short to medium run. Is there room for a product between the iPhone and the MacBook? I don't think so. What will be the next thing that is going to excite me? That I can operate it by talking to it? That it can read hand writing? A better camera? Remotely control my fridge? Be a credit card? I'm not a techie but I just don't really feel too many of us have the need for any of this. I frankly rarely use all the current functionalities to begin with.

Meanwhile the people at RIM (RIMM), Nokia (NOK), Samsung (SSDIF.PK) and Motorola (MOT) are not sleeping and will try their best to catch up. Furthermore, if I'm right with the above guess that the speed of progress in the number of functionalities in future iPhone like devices will decline, then they will catch up even faster. Anyway remember how cool the Nokia 8110 phone that 'Neo' used in 'the Matrix' was or how you just needed a BlackBerry? Being the incumbent normally isn't something that lasts when it comes to consumer electronics/phones.

A second aspect of the competitors catching up is one of competition on price with its obvious consequences.

Financial comparison
If we take a look at the numbers they come out like this (taken from Yahoo Finance):

	MSFT	AAPL	Ratio
Market cap/BUSD	219	153	1.44
Equity	40	21	1.88
Annual result	14.6	5.2	2.81
Revenue	58	32.5	1.79
Result/revenue	25%	16%	1.57
P/E	15	29.3	0.51
Dividend yield	1.8%	0%	n/a

AAPL has a P/E that is twice as high. What does it take to get there? Well MSFT sells 80% more, has 57% higher result on its per USD sales but is only worth 44% more. Another way to say it - its results are almost 3 times higher but it is only worth 44% more.

While both companies have a lot of good things going for them I find that when comparing them MSFT comes out cheap and AAPL expensive though they operate in the same or similar fields. While MSFT is priced as if they may not be able to uphold their current levels of profitability AAPL is priced as if they can increase it significantly and then keep it there. I think both are wrong. I think MSFT can increase theirs moderately without much effort while AAPL will have to soon fight tooth and nail to keep and increase theirs while being at the mercy of consumers' changing wishes.

On top of this I'd like to remind you that anyone that has tried to switch from Windows to Mac will agree that this is a whole lot harder than switching from an iPhone to another phone.

Maybe I should also mention that MSFT pays a dividend of a little less than 2% a year and has further spent 9 BUSD a year in the last two years (being the lowest in the last 4) which combined is equivalent to a 6% dividend yield a year vs AAPL's 0%.

Conclusion
Buy MSFT and sell AAPL short. Do it for a moderate amount as AAPL is on a strong trend upwards and you want to be able to hold the position until you have achieved a satisfactory return. I'd aim for 25% or alternatively until you feel the hype over AAPL has faded.

Disclosure: I am long MSFT and short AAPL.

Comments

[mrtaxx:]

You forgot to mention the China market which in itself makes your article worthless. Msft is in China and Apple is just getting into it. Why are people willing to pay a premium for Apple products? Because people love Apple products over Msft products (example the Zune) & at last check people do not like Msft products. You should not write articles anymore. How can you leave out China? PE's say a lot about products but you also failed to mention cash flow, one of the current metrics of valuing a stock, however if I was to buy I would buy Apple.

I do not own either stock nor do I own any Apple products.

Sep 08 03:53 AM

[Hansen:]

The idea that there are Chinese companies so big they can't use pirated Windows is utter nonsense. The bigger companies would have to spend considerably more money on Windows, which is exactly the reason they are more likely to use a pirated version.

Windows can be bought on any street corner for about ~$1.50. Or you can by a pirated copy in a nicer package for $5.00. Why spend $3.50 for a nice box. The software is what you want.

Universities, high schools, corporations, companies, internet cafes, with as few as 50 and as many as a few hundred computers, are all running pirated software. I'd be extremely surprised if even 5% of Windows running in China are non pirated.

Intellectual property is a barely understoood concept in China. The few who do understand the concept are interested in protecting only Chinese interests.

"What's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." That's the only concept of intellectual property people in China have.

Bill is still getting F*ed by the Chinese, dry and without protection.

Sep 08 03:57 AM

[Sealobo:]

Microsoft hasn't really come up with anything NEW in recent years that actually making significant contribution to its revenue base.

Now look at Apple.

It's all about track record; MSFT has nothing much to do with innovation in recent years, and they aren't even good at copying anymore (haha). Vista has been an epic failure, and look at what they're doing with this Bing thing and the RROD Xbox360; for once they have a good thing going but it breaks all the freakin' time!

Sep 08 04:06 AM

[SingHash:]

It is absurd to think that the business model MSFT will survive in developing-world economies. The harder MSFT clenches its fist around the pirates, the more business they will lose. Neither company offers a reasonable value proposition when an OS costs more than the average monthly wage. Would YOU pay a few thousand dollars for an OS and then a few more months' worth of salary for a frickin' Office suite? If you had to pay a proportional amount of your income for either manufacturer's products, then you'd be singing with the penguins faster than than you can say "WGA".

MSFT's response has been to offer a lobotomized version of Windows that only runs a few (three?) apps at a time, at a price of about US$30. That STILL doesn't represent any kind of rational value when the competition costs nothing at all. Don't talk about TCO, either: when your population numbers a billion people who are earning a few bucks a day, you will not find a dearth of support. The equation will only get more dire as hardware costs decrease and the "Microsoft Tax" rises.

AAPL's prospects in these markets are only marginally better: they're obviously "bling", and will likely maintain a proportional market share -- albeit against a Chrome / Linux / Windows triumvirate rather than the Windows behemoth of the developed world.

One of the key bits missing from Bruun's analysis is the unwinding of MSFT's network effect. It's already happening, and will only accelerate: people no longer need to buy Windows / Office to maintain usability with everybody else. Alternative formats (or near-compatible implementations) are emerging. Does anybody seriously think that MSFT can compete WITHOUT its monopoly?

Bruun is likely to lose money on both sides of his long/short.

Disclosure: long AAPL (up 1600%), long MSFT (down 20%)

Sep 08 05:29 AM

[Roger Knights:]

Apple's GAAP-based P/E is unrealistically high, as many astute commenters have pointed out. Your continuing use of it, rather than free cash flow, marks your article as out of touch.

"the opportunities are mainly in markets like India and China"

Yes, but the biggest opportunity is for Apple. If it made a deal with a local box assembler in the BRIC countries (for domestic sales only) to bundle in its OS (and protected it from piracy with an internal hardware key and other trickery) it could reap huge rewards for relatively little overhead.

"Is there room for a product between the iPhone and the MacBook? I don't think so. What will be the next thing that is going to excite me? That I can operate it by talking to it? That it can read hand writing? A better camera? Remotely control my fridge? Be a credit card? I'm not a techie but I just don't really feel too many of us have the need for any of this."

Steve Jobs isn't a techie either, but he sees the need for it. Just as he saw the need for the iPhone, when both the techies and non-techies didn't. He's a stand-in for what the consumer wants, but doesn't yet know that he wants. The Apple forums have contained potential feature lists that are real grabbers. I forget most of the items on them, but a couple that would attract the average consumer are game-playing ability and TV/movie/video ability, including video phone calls. Also ebook-reader capability. (The iPhone is already supported by Amazon for Kindle books.) By the time Jobs gets done saying "one more thing" about its features the audience will have vaporized and gone to heaven.

"anyone that has tried to switch from Windows to Mac will agree that this is a whole lot harder than switching from an iPhone to another phone. "

True--this has been a case--and not the only case--where Apple has dropped the ball. But Parallels has now come out with a fantastic migration product that will make this task easy. (And Apple stores will help with the migration, if you bring in your old computer.)

"Being the incumbent normally isn't something that lasts when it comes to consumer electronics/phones."

That was what analysts were saying a year ago: Just wait for the competition--RIM's Storm, Google's Android, Palm's Pre, Nokia's whatever. Well, they've come and pretty much fizzled (although Android's new release will give it a fighting chance). Apple is actually lengthening its lead over its competition; it is defining a new normal. Its OS is the core of the iPhone's advantage, and it is unmatchable. This makes the situation different from prior generations of smartphones, which were just "consumer electronics"—i.e., gadgets. The iPhone is really a computer, not a gadget. Apple has the only truly "smart" phone, because of its OS. Also, the iPhone runs iPod music that owners have purchased. They'd have to abandon it (or upgrade all of it to a portable format at significant expense) if they were to move to another phone. Also, it's possible that the forthcoming iTablet will have a dock for the iPhone. If so, and if it's a big success, it will strengthen the iPhone's competitive position.

"Maybe I should also mention that MSFT pays a dividend of a little less than 2% a year and has further spent 9 BUSD a year in the last two years (being the lowest in the last 4) which combined is equivalent to a 6% dividend yield a year vs AAPL's 0%."

Apple missed a great opportunity to use its unnecessarily huge cash hoard to buy back some of its stock when it was under $100 earlier this year, which would have given stockholders a greater share of the company and reduced the amount of Apple's eventual dividend payouts. Apple's board doesn't represent its shareholders' interests--or, if it does, it's too buddy-buddy with management to stand up to it. Apple has lots of flaws.

"Buy MSFT and sell AAPL short. Do it for a moderate amount as AAPL is on a strong trend upwards and you want to be able to hold the position until you have achieved a satisfactory return. I'd aim for 25% or alternatively until you feel the hype over AAPL has faded."

You'd have said the same thing six months ago, wouldn't you? I can imagine the similarly superficial line you'd have taken: Sell Apple because it's a luxury product in a recessionary time. But that move would have worked out poorly--MSFT has lagged, while AAPL has surged.

Your use of the term "hype over Apple" reveals you to be one of the many superficial scoffers who are baffled by Apple's success and unable to attribute it to anything but a flashy interface, status appeal, and "hype" (slick ads, vocal fanboys, etc.). But Apple is basically successful because its OS is built on rock, and because of the “feel” that goes into its product-design. Windows is built on a swamp.

"hold the position until you have achieved a satisfactory return"

Or lost your shirt. Apple is a $500 stock.

I've bookmarked this article and will revisit it in a year to rub it in further.

Sep 08 05:34 AM

[Think:]

Wow...you need to do a little more research. Do you realize that if you account for the iphone sales that have ALREADY been sold, but not yet recognized under GAAP, you would have a P/E ratio about equal to MSFT? And do you really think that MSFT has nearly as high of a growth potential as AAPL?

Apple has roughly 10% market share in computers, yet if you look at the market share of college students (the people who will influence future purchases) that number is much higher, suggesting that the computer segment alone has much growth potential.

Further, Apple may have an edge in smart phones, but smart phones do not yet make up a huge portion of cell phone purchases. Therefore, as smart phones gain in popularity, iphone sales grow regardless of whether they keep the same market share within the smart phone segment.

Lastly, the introduction of the iPhone in China alone would be well worth a premium multiple for Apple. The iPhone is already a big hit in China and it hasn't even been legally available there.

But, I guess your disclosure at the end explains it all: you went short when Apple had already taken a beating and now you're trying to convince others to sell. Please stop spreading your complete BS analysis if you are not going to include a real full disclosure of at least mentioning iphone sales in China (whether you agree with the impact or not) and the deferral of iphone revenue which causes the large P/E multiple.

Sep 08 06:19 AM

[Timeline St...:]

Few questions:

1. Free cash flow? Which company excels in this category?

2. You mention that Microsoft has spent $9 billion per year, in the past 2 years, for R&D. I add to that point that Apple has spent about $1 billion. Unless Microsoft receives some kind of a beneficial financial treatment (ie tax incentives for allocating overhead toward R&D), it appears that Microsoft receives a poor ROI relative to Apple in this category, if revenue growth is a classified as the return. Please comment.

3. Apple has miniscule but rapidly growing shares in both computer and mobile device operating systems. Furthermore, Apple also has miniscule, but again rapidly growing, penetration in Japan, China, and European countries. Counter this with Microsoft, which has a 90%+ market share in computer OS, which is overall growing slowly, and a quickly fading position in mobile OS, which is overall growing quickly. That would seem to be opportunity for Apple and risk for Microsoft. Discuss.

4. Debt. Please compare. Note that Microsoft has gone from zero in 2008 to nearly $6 billion now. While the amount is relatively insignificant, the trend is concerning.

5. Please compare their retail strategies, noting that about 1 of every 8 dollars revenue for Apple comes via the Apple Stores, while Microsoft is only beginning a retail effort. Please characterize what value Microsoft, which is 95% software-oriented, will obtain from retail.

6. How did the year over year results of these companies compare during the downturn?

Sep 08 06:44 AM

[Roger Knights:]

I'm guessing that Seeking Alpha posts punching-bag articles like this for the sake of the walloping they'll get.

Sep 08 06:57 AM

[Tom B:]

The author falls into two common errors 1) That nonsense about Neo in "the matrix", and RIMM closing on the iPhone: the author believes Apple is doing well because it is "trendy". Anyone who USES Apple products understands that Apple's business is about making products that WORK WELL. Trendy gets old after, say, you and all your friends have iPods; superior functionality has lasting appeal. 2) The author believes that a company with 95% market share based on two really primitive, out-moded franchises (Windows and Office) can sustain its position forever. This is not unlike the mindset the GM execs must have maintained through the 80's and 90's.

Sep 08 07:59 AM

[User 131476:]

You are entitled to you opinion on the value of the two companies. However, when you state that "it is a lot harder to switch from Windows to Mac" you provide no evidence to back this claim. Instead, you are trying to drive down AAPL to profit from your short position. Stick to analysis of the value of the two companies - something that can be compared on an objective basis. We don't need your bias with regard to operating systems or user stupidity.

Sep 08 08:48 AM

[top_tier:]

Most analysts have caught on that Apple should be valued on a FCF basis using non GAAP accounting because of the huge amount of earnings deferred over a 2 year period, consequently the PE you post is rubbish. You need to be enlightened to this fact too.

Sep 08 09:04 AM

[jonk...:]

people have been using your same arguments about MSFT being cheap for the LAST TEN FREAKING YEARS..... going on another 10 years, yet you seem to think you are the first one to notice how badly MSFT does????

did you think you were the first one that noticed that MSFT is cheap? hey here is a thought, maybe there is a good reason, like Microsoft the company hasn't come up with anything people want to buy enough to make a profit in like oh say.... TEN FREAKING YEARS.....

hey, maybe that is the reason... or you could look at that 3 times amount you came up with, and actually look at a balance sheet and tell us where that 3 times went to? it certainly didn't end up in a shareholder's pocket or worth? what 3 times are you talking about? the imaginary numbers MSFT reports to the market? were you really fooled by the fake numbers that MSFT reports in earnings numbers?

i'll tell you this as fact, you are not the first person fooled by false numbers reported as earnings...

why not look and see where it went in the balance sheet, why not actually provide something useful and show us how MSFT has ripped the shareholder a new one for the last FREAKING TEN YEARS.....

did you think the market some how didn't notice MSFT? are you really that out of touch with what is going on? that the market didn't figure this out?

Sep 08 09:09 AM

[roger that:]

Microsoft is in no way comparable to the GM of the 80s and 90s. Microsoft is doing its best to innovate. In fact, it has taken up almost every innovation that has come along recently. It is offering almost all the innovations Apple has come up with. It is offering many innovations Google has come up with. And it is offering most of the innovations in gaming that Sony has come up with. Microsoft is no slouch at innovations. And I doubt it will suffer the fate of GM. For one thing, it is not in the grip of big unions, as GM was.

Sep 08 09:48 AM

[FreeRange:]

The author needs to find a day job. What nonsense. Sudo analytical babble.

Sep 08 09:56 AM

[FreeRange:]

Excuse me Roger, but you just described how Microsoft doesn't know how to innovate, but knows how to copy. Duhhhh! And you throw in some nonsense about unions. Roger, you don't really belong here, sorry.


On Sep 08 09:48 AM roger that wrote:

> Microsoft is in no way comparable to the GM of the 80s and 90s. Microsoft
> is doing its best to innovate. In fact, it has taken up almost every
> innovation that has come along recently. It is offering almost all
> the innovations Apple has come up with. It is offering many innovations
> Google has come up with. And it is offering most of the innovations
> in gaming that Sony has come up with. Microsoft is no slouch at innovations.
> And I doubt it will suffer the fate of GM. For one thing, it is not
> in the grip of big unions, as GM was.

Sep 08 09:59 AM

[FreeRange:]

you are exactly right - folks, it is easy!!!!!! to switch from windows to mac, especially when you look at what you have to do to switch from Windows xp to Windows 7 - what a friking joke! Also, if you take your brand spanking new marvelous Mac to the apple store along with your PC, they'll do it for FREE!!!!!!!!!! What a concept! Or you could go to the Windows store -oops, con't do that.


On Sep 08 08:48 AM User 131476 wrote:

> You are entitled to you opinion on the value of the two companies.
> However, when you state that "it is a lot harder to switch from Windows
> to Mac" you provide no evidence to back this claim. Instead, you
> are trying to drive down AAPL to profit from your short position.
> Stick to analysis of the value of the two companies - something that
> can be compared on an objective basis. We don't need your bias with
> regard to operating systems or user stupidity.

Sep 08 10:04 AM

[GSlusher:]

This is supposed to be a discussion about stocks, right? Do you (the author) "believe in" a "free market"? (I really don't, but that's not the question.) Let's see what the so-called "free market" has said about the two companies.

MSFT:
Last close: $23.86
1 year ago: $26.12
2 years ago: $29.49

Thus, MSFT's price dropped 8.7% in the last year and 19% in two years.

AAPL:
Last close: $170.31
1 year ago: $157.92
2 years ago: $137.20

So, AAPL's price went UP 7.8% in the last year and UP 24% in two years. I'm not an economist (my MIT degrees are all in mechanical engineering), nor an MBA, CPA, CFA, PQR, STU, or anything else, much less an "analyst." However, if one believes in "the market," it would seem that selfsame "market" is saying (and not subtly!) that MSFT is on the way down.

Sep 08 10:09 AM

[Josh B Thom...:]

If Apple products are superior than why such a low price on their latest operating system? Clearly the premium price cannot be sustained due to alternative products are very similiar. Apple's new pricing strategy reflects the commoditization of Apple's offerings.

Sep 08 10:31 AM

[Tom B:]

I will explain. If Apple is pricing more as a commodity, this is a GOOD thing 1) because the market is expanding 2) because more consumers will be able to "switch" to Mac, particularly in a tight, recessionary economy, like we see now. Their pricing strategies seem rational and effective, based on last quarter's results.

Low price on 10.6 "Snow Leopard": 1) the new features are mostly "under the hood" hooks for speeding up applications and using less disc space-- NEW, but nothing flashy. 2) Apple wants as many people to upgrade as possible so developers feel more inclined to use said features. Please note: Apple is a HARDWARE company.


On Sep 08 10:31 AM Josh B Thompson wrote:

> If Apple products are superior than why such a low price on their
> latest operating system? Clearly the premium price cannot be sustained
> due to alternative products are very similiar. Apple's new pricing
> strategy reflects the commoditization of Apple's offerings.

Sep 08 11:02 AM

[J. Bruun:]

Oh wow - that was a lot more response than I was hoping for. At times perhaps also more subjective than what I was expecting when I wrote it. I suppose it is not so different from what you see for those who venture to say something positive about Citi or Bank of America.

Here are some answers to some of the points raised in general:

GAAP and past sales revenue recognition
This is a valid point and though I was aware of it when I wrote it I suppose it works both ways. It should also mean that e.g. 2008 numbers contain 2007 sales? With increasing sales this is still supportive though.

MSFT is out of tune with the market
I agree they are in many ways. When I purchased my iMac I also purchased Vista to run on Parallels. I was careless enough to buy it in the wrong language and when contacting MSFT support I was informed that I could upgrade (at twice the price) to some higher version and only then change to English and there was no possibility to return it. A very bitter experience. But MSFT must know they have to change and I expect it is a fixed point on their strategy agenda. After all I hope no one disputes that MSFT just like AAPL has some of the best and brightest people employed. I'm sure they they don't want to stay where IBM once was.

I am trying to manipulate the market to recover losses!
I put the position on on Friday and I am not so optimistic that I think I can affect the share prices of either company with one article. Anyway pull up a chart of the two and you will see there have been plenty of opportunities to benefit from playing the two against each other.

Sentiment
One thing I did gather from all your comments is support for my view that most people have a very very positive and passionate view of AAPL and very few have anything positive to say about MSFT and even fewer dare. This is the main reason I put on this trade. From where we are now it will be easy for MSFT to surprise positively and equally easy for AAPL to disappoint.

Sep 08 11:47 AM

[jack dee:]

WOW,

You really whipped up some hate there!
Just like the linux club , apple fans are filled with bile, they simply dont accept other points of view, and are completely unable to see apple as an investment.
I would guess many apple fans are far too over wieght in this one company.

On Sep 08 11:47 AM J. Bruun wrote:

> Oh wow - that was a lot more response than I was hoping for. At times
> perhaps also more subjective than what I was expecting when I wrote
> it. I suppose it is not so different from what you see for those
> who venture to say something positive about Citi or Bank of America.
>
>
> Here are some answers to some of the points raised in general:<br/>
>
> GAAP and past sales revenue recognition
> This is a valid point and though I was aware of it when I wrote it
> I suppose it works both ways. It should also mean that e.g. 2008
> numbers contain 2007 sales? With increasing sales this is still supportive
> though.
>
> MSFT is out of tune with the market
> I agree they are in many ways. When I purchased my iMac I also purchased
> Vista to run on Parallels. I was careless enough to buy it in the
> wrong language and when contacting MSFT support I was informed that
> I could upgrade (at twice the price) to some higher version and only
> then change to English and there was no possibility to return it.
> A very bitter experience. But MSFT must know they have to change
> and I expect it is a fixed point on their strategy agenda. After
> all I hope no one disputes that MSFT just like AAPL has some of the
> best and brightest people employed. I'm sure they they don't want
> to stay where IBM once was.
>
> I am trying to manipulate the market to recover losses!
> I put the position on on Friday and I am not so optimistic that I
> think I can affect the share prices of either company with one article.
> Anyway pull up a chart of the two and you will see there have been
> plenty of opportunities to benefit from playing the two against each
> other.
>
> Sentiment
> One thing I did gather from all your comments is support for my view
> that most people have a very very positive and passionate view of
> AAPL and very few have anything positive to say about MSFT and even
> fewer dare. This is the main reason I put on this trade. From where
> we are now it will be easy for MSFT to surprise positively and equally
> easy for AAPL to disappoint.

Sep 08 12:27 PM

[mollytjm:]

bottom line: Apple continues to garner market share...of everything it does! why? they make great products, they innovate faster than anyone and do it well, they love their customers and ACT like it, they have huge amounts of $$$ and no debt, they have enormous room for expansion... this is a stock that's a great buy and hold investment.

And...it IS easy to switch from windows to a mac...apple will do it for you...free. And there is room for another product, always, if it's done smartly. (by the way, there already is something between the iPhone and the iMac... it's called an iTouch)
long APPL

Sep 08 03:50 PM

[Anthony B:]

If you knew about the non-GAAP P/E multiple being almost a third less than the GAAP multiple why didn't you mention it.

I welcome shorts to AAPL as I hope their valuation doesn't go sky-high...would have to find something else to trade.

Sep 08 04:49 PM

[Daniel Moser:]

I would sure love to see someone much more tech saavy than myself do some analsyis on profit/megabite of product sold. Intuition suggests that AAPL is 10X more effecient than MSFT on that metric but I am not exactly a techy so I my intuition might just be wrong.

Sep 08 05:20 PM

[PBIPhotobug:]

What is an "Annual result"? I looked in the Annual Reports of both companies, as well as in the analyses of several large brokerage firms and in Motley Fool, and can't find this category anywhere...

Sep 08 07:42 PM

[brewer:]

Wow, it never fails to amaze me how confused people are about computers. This is one to bookmark though, it's a textbook case.

>>That it can read hand writing? A better camera? Remotely >>control my fridge? Be a credit card?

I'm sure you were able to predict the success of the iPod and iPhone though, huh? Even the so-called Apple fanboys thought Jobs had lost his mind when introducing the iPod. Don't believe me? Watch the video...

www.youtube.com/watch?...

>>I'm not a techie but I just don't really feel too many of us have >>the need for any of this. I frankly rarely use all the current >>functionalities to begin with.

I suggest writing about and investing in things you understand, and not investing based on your 'feelings' (as you accuse Apple fans of doing.

Finally, the talent exodus at Microsoft happened a long time ago. I'm sure they have some bright people working there, but I can't name any of them, I'll let you try though, if you want to keep your guessing game going. Then again, as I suggested earlier, I think you really should stick to writing about something you know, rather than rambling on and spouting the usual MSFT FUD.

@ Jackdee:

Ever stop to think that Apple fans don't hate fools, that maybe they just hate when people spread stupidity and lies and try to pass it off as if it were fact? Who is the real hater, the one who tries to correct a wrong statement, or those that hate them for doing it?

Sep 08 08:56 PM

[KenC:]

You're long MS and short Apple? Justice is served.

Sep 08 11:14 PM

[Nettligent:]

Apple is far better investment position than Microsoft. More revenue in 2010 and beyond with more products and solutions.
Microsoft: nothing elegant or impressive. Microsoft pushed and forced customers to use its Windows Vista and now customers have to pay for upgrades and using its buggy software.
My Verizon phone has Windows OS in it. I hate it so much but got stuck with 2 years contracts. Stay away from Verizon and Microsoft.
Oracle, SAP, RedHat, etc are much better than. Microsoft is going nowhere...too much hype and marketing.

Sep 09 03:54 AM

[jack dee:]

>>Microsoft: nothing elegant or impressive<<

Second light is pretty cool and far ahead of anything else out there.
I am pretty sure Apple research will buying one to reverse as soon as they can.

And Natal looks like a fun and useful interface, if it delivers all it claims it will win the hearts of millions.

And of course MediaCenter on Win 7 its everything Apple wants to be when it figures out how to do it.

Not elegant? Not Impressive? you fanboys just dont want to see, you are blinded by hate and venom.




Me? I dont really like the GOOG , but that does not stop me buying shares and making money. And if apple was priced the way I would like, of course I would buy shares, I dont need to own an ipod to invest nor do I need to like stents to buy JNJ.

Sep 09 04:18 PM

[Tom B:]

You mean "Silverlight"; not "Second Light". For those who don't know: it is a weak knock off of Adobe Flash. And Flash is an annoying web "feature" everybody would be better off without. HTML 5 is a much better approach to rich content.


On Sep 09 04:18 PM jack dee wrote:

> >>Microsoft: nothing elegant or impressive<<
>
> Second light is pretty cool and far ahead of anything else out there.
>
> I am pretty sure Apple research will buying one to reverse as soon
> as they can.
>
> And Natal looks like a fun and useful interface, if it delivers all
> it claims it will win the hearts of millions.
>
> And of course MediaCenter on Win 7 its everything Apple wants to
> be when it figures out how to do it.
>
> Not elegant? Not Impressive? you fanboys just dont want to see,
> you are blinded by hate and venom.
>
>
>
>
> Me? I dont really like the GOOG , but that does not stop me buying
> shares and making money. And if apple was priced the way I would
> like, of course I would buy shares, I dont need to own an ipod to
> invest nor do I need to like stents to buy JNJ.

Sep 09 10:52 PM

[Tom B:]

MSFT is very reactive, as they would say in psychology circles. They had OVER a decade to turn out a useful cell phone. They didn't bother to even try until the iPhone arrived. They could have done an MP3 player years ago. They didn't do the Zune until well into the iPod revolution. They didn't do a browser until Netscape started making noises about replacing the Windows desktop with a web product. IE was actually decent-- possibly MSFT's best product EVER. BUT, after Netscape died they totally forgot browsers exist. Sure they have-- what-- version 7 (?)-- but it's a joke; it's dead last in features, security, and speed, and is only used by people who don't know how to install alternative software under Windows. Last but not least, they had DECADES to whip Windows into shape. What did they do-- added UAC and eye-candy (Vista and Win 7). Windows still isn't UNIX. Apple has been on UNIX since 2000. NeXT, even longer.

Sep 09 11:02 PM

[jack dee:]

Tom B , you could at least try listening to others, instead of assuming , open your mind dude, the world is so much bigger than apple

tinyurl.com/m7y26h



And for those of you who dont know, Tom B pretty much an apple fan who is blinded by Zeal.

On Sep 09 10:52 PM Tom B wrote:

> You mean "Silverlight"; not "Second Light". For those who don't know:
> it is a weak knock off of Adobe Flash. And Flash is an annoying web
> "feature" everybody would be better off without. HTML 5 is a much
> better approach to rich content.

Sep 10 01:39 AM

[Tom B:]

It's called "analysis"; not zeal. But I do have to apologize to you: MSFT has indeed made two almost identically named technologies "Silverlight" and "second light". My mistake, there.


On Sep 10 01:39 AM jack dee wrote:

>
>
> Tom B , you could at least try listening to others, instead of
> assuming , open your mind dude, the world is so much bigger than
> apple
>
> tinyurl.com/m7y26h
>
>
>
> And for those of you who dont know, Tom B pretty much an apple
> fan who is blinded by Zeal.
>
> On Sep 09 10:52 PM Tom B wrote:

Sep 10 11:55 PM

[Senan:]

Just a quickie on the remark that Nokia "...are not sleeping and will try their best to catch up...". In the mobile telecoms space Nokia has no catching up to do over Apple. Nokia's primary business is handsets. In this they hold over 60% of the market. Apple hold less than 1%. Nokia perhaps needs to do something with it's smartphones with regard to downloadable applications etc., but again, this is not their primary concern.

Sep 21 06:08 PM

[JW.USC:]

And for those of you who don't know, jackdee pretty much a Micro$uck fan who is blinded by zeal.

But that much should be obvious to anyone who has read a handful of his FUD-filled comments.


On Sep 10 01:39 AM jack dee wrote:

> And for those of you who dont know, Tom B pretty much an apple
> fan who is blinded by Zeal.

Nov 09 03:53 PM