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Protective Life Corporation (NYSE:PL)

Q4 2013 Earnings Conference Call

February 12, 2014 10:00 AM ET

Executives

Eva Robertson – VP, IR

John Johns – Chairman, President and CEO

Richard Bielen – Vice Chairman and CFO

Carl Thigpen – EVP and Chief Investment Officer

Analysts

Sarah DeWitt – Barclays

Christopher Giovanni – Goldman Sachs

Sean Dargan – Macquarie Capital

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Dan Bergman – UBS

Operator

Good day, ladies and gentlemen and welcome to the Quarter Four 2013 Protective Life Corporation’s Earnings Conference Call. My name is Patrick, and I’ll be your coordinator for today.

At this time all participants are in listen-only mode. Later we will facilitate a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions). As a reminder this conference is being recorded for replay purposes.

I would now like to turn the conference over to Ms. Eva Robertson, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please proceed.

Eva Robertson

Thank you, operator. Good morning everyone and welcome to Protective Life Corporation’s 2013 fourth quarter and full year earnings call.

Our call today is hosted by John Johns, Protective’s Chairman, President and CEO; as well as Rich Bielen, our Vice Chairman and CFO. Here with us in the room we also have Carl Thigpen, our Chief Investment Officer; Mike Temple, our Chief Risk Officer; and Steve Walker, our Chief Accounting Officer.

Yesterday we released our earnings press release and the supplemental financial information, and both of these documents are posted on our website at protective.com. In addition to that information we’re using a slide presentation with our discussion this morning. That deck is also being webcast from a link in the Investor Relations section that is available for download there.

Finally today’s discussion includes forward-looking statements which express expectations of future events and/or results. Actual events and results may differ materially from these expectations. You can refer to our press release and the risks and uncertainties as well as Risk Factor section of the company’s most recent report on Form 10-K and subsequent 10-Qs for more information about factors that may affect future results. Our discussion also includes non-GAAP financial information and reconciliation to the GAAP measures can be found in the supplemental financial information on our website.

At this time I would turn the call over to John Johns.

John Johns

Eva, thank you very much and thanks to everyone on the call for joining us today. We are very pleased to report a very good fourth quarter and a very good year in 2013.

In the quarter operating earnings were up 46% to $1.43 per share. Net income for the quarter up 79% to $1.47 per share. We also are pleased for the year we reported both record operating earnings as well as net income. Operating earnings at $4.26 per share or about $345 million; net income at $4.86 per share. That translates into about $393 million.

As per our plan we did see nice improvement in ROE during the year. We finished with average ROE at 11.3%. Our estimated risk based capital ratio at the end of the year again which was much better than we had anticipated and forecast turned out to be in a range of what we estimated, again we are clear about that we haven’t totally closed that book but this is our best estimate now that the RBC ratio at the end of the year would be in the range of 440% to 450%. That compares to our estimate of something around 400%.

I am also delighted that we were able to close the Mutual New York acquisition transaction at the beginning of the quarter. The acquisition as Rich will give you more details on just a moment, it actually turned out better in the fourth quarter than we had anticipated. We are well on our way to successful assimilation of the acquisition. We made good progress in the fourth quarter and we feel very good about where we are with respect to that acquisition.

I am now going to turn the microphone over to Rich and let Rich kind of walk you through the details of the quarter and the year, thank you.

Richard Bielen

Thank you, Johnnie and good morning everyone.

Turning to slide four, operating income was $1.43 for the quarter and $4.26 for calendar year 2013. We did have significant realized gains during the year for the quarter was $0.04 but for the year it was $0.60 of realized gains, resulting in net income available of $1.47 for the fourth quarter and $4.86 for calendar year 2013. With respect to the net income it was $119 million in the fourth quarter and 394 million for calendar year 2013.

Moving to slide five is a reconciliation of the net realized gains and losses. During the quarter we had $0.18 of gains on selling securities. That’s somewhat elevated due to the rebalancing that we needed to do as a result of the MONY acquisition on our Modco which relates to the Chase transaction that was positive $ 0.02. We had a modest level of impairments of $0.04 that’s all attributable to our non-agency mortgage backs. We continue to review the performance of those on a quarterly basis and make any adjustments as necessary.

The derivatives related to the VA contract was negative $0.03 that is solely attributable to the non-performance risk related to tightening credit spreads. On our mortgage portfolio we saw a $0.02 reserve for the quarter that we added. And then there is one new item that we are adding this quarter and it relates to the MONY close block and other. Any gains that we recognized with respect to that block goes to the policy holders on MONY.

During the quarter there were approximately $0.07 of those gains. As a result what we are doing is putting up a reserve because that will be paid out to those policy holders over time through the dividend mechanism. So the $0.07 is included in the $0.18 net realized gain on securities but then we are adjusting for the dividend payments that we will be needing to make in the future. And that results in the net $0.04 for the quarter.

Moving to slide six, book value excluding AOCI ended the year at $40.99 versus $36.84 of the year ago, that’s up 11%. Net unrealized gain before tax and DAC ended the year at a healthy $1.1 billion, although down from $3.1 billion at year-end 2012 as a result of the higher interest rates during the year.

Moving now to slide seven. On a divisional basis, first, the Life Marketing operation had $32.7 million of pretax operating income. That’s the highest level of operating income for that division in two years. It benefited from some favorable mortality on our traditional business. That helped us to the tune of about $7 million. That traditional mortality was 89% of expected or the plan we presented, I know a number of you had questions about how that reflects on previous times, if we had gone back and looked at our original pricing for that block mortality during the quarter would have been approximately 77% of our original pricing mortality.

We did see some impact of some lower spreads a little bit less than investment income and there are just some little one-time items that ramped through income to reduce the income by about $5.8 million versus plan. There is a little bit of seasonality in there that we saw.

On the sales front, we saw sales consistent with our plan at about $30 million and see inventory of a similar level here in the first quarter as we move forward with the expectation we will see sales move up in the second half of the year.

Now moving to the annuity line on slide eight. We had record earnings of $53.5 million. That was supported by the good stock market and bond market that we’ve seen. So it resulted in strong VA fee income. As a result of that better fee income we did have some favorable retrospective unlocking of $5.3 million in the quarter. You can see our account balance is up 16% from the fourth quarter of 2012 moving from $17.5 billion to $20.3 billion at the end of 2013.

We did see some unfavorable SPIA mortality of approximately $2.2 million versus planned. On sales front you see total sales of $469 million. As we had indicated we wanted our sales to come in a range of about $2.5 billion, and as a result of the management of that we’ve gotten to that level. Our VA sales did decline to approximately $210 million for the quarter but you can see very strong activity on the fixed side, with fixed sales moving up to $259 million and we’re benefiting from the launch of our fixed indexed annuity that we launched in the second quarter of 2013 and continued to see strong momentum throughout the calendar year.

Moving now to slide nine, in the acquisition segment. Pretax operating earnings for acquisitions was $60.8 million. The MONY impact was above our projection. It came in at $25.2 million. There is approximately $1.5 million of positive expense variance that we think is timing. We had originally estimated we’ll be spending some of that money on the transition in the fourth quarter we think that will move into the first half of 2014.

Also the other positive item that came about is Carl and the investment team were able to rebalance the portfolio very quickly by having repositioned some assets prior to the close in September and then very actively being able to reposition the portfolio during the month of October. Our original plan expected that, that was going to take us the entire fourth quarter and that contributed to the other positive variance there.

In our other blocks, we saw United Investors and Liberty very much on our plan and overall, we saw a favorable mortality of $4.3 million offset by little seasonality in our legacy blocks.

Moving now to slide 10, the stable value products division, we continue to see very strong spreads arranged for the quarter were $21 million. It includes participating income of $2.6 million and also the benefit of market value adjustment on the surrendered contract during the quarter. The total spread was 329 basis points, the adjusted spread was 277 basis points and we expect that spread to stay at a similar level during the first quarter of 2014 and then decline later on the in the year. As you can see our account balance was very steady between $2.5 billion and $2.6 billion and we expect that to end the first quarter at a similar level.

Moving now to the asset protection division, on slide 11. Earnings came in at $6.5 million and we’re seeing the favorable impact of some lower expenses where we made some cost reductions earlier in the year. Earnings were very much in-line with expectations. Sales for the quarter were $109 million versus $105 million a year ago, up 4%.

One comment I will now make and usually we never talk about weather but what we’re seeing is, as a result of the storms that we’re seeing primarily in the Southeast and in the Midwest, we’ve seen a number of closures and some reduction in sales in the auto segment. We’ve also seen some disruption to our own operations including our Birmingham campus where we had to close down for a couple of days as a result of the storms. So although we don’t see any major financial impact we do see that sales here in the first quarter may exhibit some seasonality at lower level as a result of the disruptions to operations and just the general economy.

Moving on to slide 12 other fourth quarter highlights. We were able to repurchase a number of our notes in the market place at a discount. That resulted in a gain of $16.7 million and we also trued up our tax rate and so the fourth quarter tax rate was 31.5% which improved operating EPS by $0.05 during the quarter. We continue to see very good performance on our investment side, especially on our mortgage loans, our delinquent and foreclosed loans are only 0.2% of the portfolio.

One other item I will just make with respect to expenses, a number of you mentioned that there were some elevated expenses in corporate and other, during the fourth quarter we trued up all of our expense accruals for the year. Also we actually had a number of donations from our charitable foundation during the quarter the total of those were approximately $5 million which accounted for the alleviated expense.

And with that, I am going to turn it back over to Johnny for some closing comments.

John Johns

Great. Thank you, Rich. I’ll wrap it up here briefly. Thank you everyone that follows the company closely now, it’s a part of our basic business model is to start every year with a business plan, a base plan and then we have some other iterations around the plan but we focus very keenly every year on doing our best to achieve that plan and when our results were better or worse than the plan we make every effort to be transparent about that and on our quarterly calls to reconcile to differences.

But turning back to the plan we established for 2013, we essentially not only delivered on it but we exceeded it, we had double digit earnings growth as we mentioned operating EPS up 13%. We had ROE improvement. We’re particularly pleased that if you go back to 2010 we’ve improved the company’s ROE from 9.2% to 11.3% in 2013. We’re delighted to have been given the mandate with respect to the MONY acquisition. It closed on time and as mentioned earlier we’re well on our way to successful assimilation of that business. We were somewhat surprised ourselves by how strong our capital generation was during the year again we finished the year with total adjusted capital of $3.2 billion to $3.3 billion we estimate. Again the retail businesses we think are performing very much in line with plan and very well, so overall, we’re very pleased with all of that.

As we look ahead to 2014, we continue to expect another strong year. Our best estimate in terms of what our company can do is consistent with the plan, the base plan that we presented at the investor’s conference which you would recall was called for $4.70. I will remind you that’s not earnings guidance that is just our plan, that is just our internal look, what we think we’re capable of doing if we execute effectively and the assumptions we make in putting the plan together or come together.

I know one thing on your mind is probably what do we think the run rate was in the quarter? We think the run rate was somewhere at a range of $1.15 to $1.20 and we think that’s very consistent with the base plan. Remember the base plan doesn’t include any acquisitions and it doesn’t include the effects of any capital management activity that might occur during the year.

But again if we achieve the plan once again, we’ll achieve double digit growth in EPS, we’ll continue to push the ROE up we’ll continue to generate a lot of statutory capital and we’ll have good earnings growth in our retail lines as well.

So with that, I’d like to just stop right there and open up the call to questions and so fire away at us.

Question-and-Answer Session

Operator

(Operators Instructions). And our first question comes from the line of Sarah DeWitt with Barclays. Please proceed.

Sarah DeWitt – Barclays

Hi. Good morning.

John Johns

Good morning Sarah.

Sarah DeWitt – Barclays

If I look at the run rate EPS for the quarter of $1.15 to $1.20 that you mentioned and I annualize that and assume that you’re probably going to grow core earnings next year as well. It seems like you’re well on track to exceed your $4.75 plan. Any reason why that wouldn’t be the case?

Richard Bielen

Sarah, we’re just cautious about how we look through the year we do know we’ll have a fair amount of transition expense on MONY especially in the first half of the year. This was our first quarter in reviewing all of those earnings and so we’d like to get a track record behind each acquisition to make sure we can monitor that. So I think as Johnny indicated we are very comfortable with the plan that we’ve presented. We see the run rate in this $1.15 to $1.20 and then we’ll see how progress goes during calendar year 2014.

John Johns

Yeah and Sarah with respect to our in-force business we have a very detailed quantitative model we plug assumptions into it and it kicks out what the business earns and there are a lot of variables around that you can’t really forecast of any precision unlocking due to interest rates, equity markets, expenses can vary you can have legal settlements and things of that sort. So there is a good bit of variability in all that.

So this is kind of our down the middle best estimate of what the company will produce if those assumptions turn out to be true, we will be delighted to exceed the plan if that happens. And we’ll try to exceed the plan but that’s where we think we should be in terms of the plan for the year.

Sarah DeWitt – Barclays

Okay great, thanks. And then could you also give us an update on your excess capital position given the RBC came in stronger and your thoughts on when you could potentially resume share buybacks?

John Johns

I will start off with the capital position we believe at the end of the year we probably wind up at about 410 a little north of 410 we’re seeing roughly a number of about 440 we’re saying it’s a combination of really two things, one, the good performance that we had is resulting in better statutory income for the company. We think that contributed probably close to 20 RBC points as we trued up everything for year end.

And then the other item that occurred that some of you have mentioned in other reports is that the me factor came in. As you know, we’ve always had a pretty conservative portfolio on the commercial mortgage side with shorter amortizations that benefited us the quality of that portfolio and we think that may have contributed about 10 RBC points for the quarter.

Richard Bielen

Yeah and Sarah in terms of our intentions with respect to the use of the capital, our intention remained we think it would be healthy for us overtime to return about 50% of our after tax operating earnings to share owners in the form dividends and share repurchase. At the same time in the current environment and given the level of activity that we’re seeing we still have a slight bias to use excess capital more for acquisitions if those opportunities present themselves.

So as we look into 2014 what we intend to do is, scan the horizon pretty careful to see what’s out there in the way of acquisitions and we’ve mentioned for capital rebuilds, we get the MONY transaction fully assimilated by the end of the third quarter. We should be in business again this year to be looking actively at acquisitions. On the other hand, we start to feel that year is passing us by and we need to get out there and do some capital management we will be doing that. So really nothing has changed from our stated position on that from over the last several years.

John Johns

And Sarah one final thing the 440 level that would put us approximately $300 million above a 400% RBC.

Sarah DeWitt – Barclays

Great. Thanks for the answers.

John Johns

Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Chris Giovanni with Goldman Sachs. Please proceed. Your line is open.

Christopher Giovanni – Goldman Sachs

Good morning. Thanks so much. I guess, one follow-up to that, the excess capital of about $300 million or so above 400% RBC. In the past you’ve talked about kind of a desire to do some bigger deals, just given the amount of time and resources you put into both small and large deals. So how should we be thinking about potential size of another transaction if you were to look at something in the latter half of this year or early next year?

John Johns

Rich is pointing at me – I can say, we stretched our own expectations a bit when we announced the MONY deal. It was more $1 billion capital devoted to that transaction, I think we’ve proven to ourselves that we can handle deals of larger size. I think the wild card there is what’s available, what’s out there and then what is our capacity to do a deal. But I think we’re pretty confident in this model. We demonstrated on that transaction which is to devote most of our excess capital to a deal, maintain a 400% or better RBC and then watch the capital we generate very quickly as they tend to do on our deals as you know.

So we are ready to swing for the fans within those parameters if the right opportunity pops up. But we have to have the opportunity in order to take the swing, so that’s where we are.

Christopher Giovanni – Goldman Sachs

Okay. And then in terms of I guess the pace and mix of annuity sales, you mentioned continue momentum with the new fixed indexed annuity product. So I am curious where do you think your expectations in sales can go to there? And then on the VA side do you think we’re kind of at a stable run rate around couple of hundred million?

Richard Bielen

No, I don’t think so. I think we’re very excited and optimistic about our opportunity to grow the fixed indexed product sales. We like the product very much, we like the risk return characteristics, it’s a solid product.

As you know Chris we worked pretty hard during 2013 to bring our run rate on VA sales down and truthfully we may have over shot a little bit on that. I think right now I think we’ll just take a guesstimate as to first quarter where our total annuity sales are 80% to 90% if you combined both product lines of our target and which is roughly $2.5 billion of annuity sales for the year.

So want to achieve that goal and I think we have some opportunity to ramp our VA sales a bit and get that more in line with where we want to be on an annual basis.

Christopher Giovanni – Goldman Sachs

Okay. And the last one just around the investment portfolio, you saw a bit of a shift towards the BBB credit quality but also a big decrease in the retail sector of the mortgage loan portfolio, I am wondering if this is really just on-boarding of MONY’s assets or it was Carl and team kind of a bit more active around repositioning the portfolio?

Carl Thigpen

Yeah, this is Carl, we did get a different portfolio mix of mortgage loans from the MONY portfolio where we’re traditionally heavily weighted towards the retail sector. That portfolio was much broad and had a lot more office products and warehouse products that we typically originate ourselves.

Christopher Giovanni – Goldman Sachs

Okay. Thanks so much.

John Johns

Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Sean Dargan with Macquarie. Please proceed.

Sean Dargan – Macquarie Capital

Thanks. I was just wondering, I guess our performance relative to plan, the contribution from MONY to acquisition what was that related to do you think and aside from the expenses in the first half of 2014, where do you think there might be opportunity to do better than plan with the MONY business?

Richard Bielen

Sean we’re not going to try and get ahead of ourselves since we’ve only seen one quarter of performance. When we have looked at the quarter in aggregate we’ve seen some pluses and minuses and we’re confident around the pricing model that we have that we can perform on that.

This was really the benefit here in the fourth quarter of good execution where we had some timing estimate of the rebalancing that was needed for that portfolio and we were able to do that a lot faster than we originally thought, which gave us this positive but we still want to see the performance of the block overtime and make sure that we see consistency quarter-by-quarter now that’s under our management.

John Johns

I will just add a little more point to that too, I think to be totally clear we did see a bit of bump up in interest rates above what we had modeled into our acquisition analysis. So we got a benefit from that but on the other hand we saw expenses were elevated a bit too. But net-net it doesn’t appear that their trajectory is a little better than perhaps we had anticipated and we reasonably priced the deal.

Sean Dargan – Macquarie Capital

Got it. Thanks and in stable value products just even adjusting for the NPA and prepayments the adjusted operating spreads have hung in better than I would have expected is this a reflection of a repositioning of the portfolio I mean should we expect these to come in at all?

John Johns

Sean, it really wasn’t on the portfolio side it’s really on the credited weight side that we’ve been able to reap and affect roll new contracts at lower rates than we had in our model overtime. And so it’s really coming from the lower credited interest more or so than the better yields on the asset side. We do see in the second half of this year those lower rate contracts that we rolled a few years ago coming to maturity. We expect that they will have to be rolled at a higher rate which is why we expect spreads to start to decline later in the year but we do look at the first quarter and expect our spreads to stay at a similar level for at least the first quarter of 2014.

Sean Dargan – Macquarie Capital

Okay. Thank you.

John Johns

Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of John Nadel with Sterne, Agee. Please proceed.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Hey good morning everybody. Just two quick questions for you I think most has been covered already Rich can you just remind us what percentage expected versus planned mortality is baked into your outlook? I think if I recall it’s 90% but then maybe just remind us of the sensitivity of what each percent better or worse means in terms of earnings?

Richard Bielen

Okay. So we try to back on, I think on our third quarter call, we’ve tried to move away from original pricing and this ratio only because what we’ve seen is, the number is moving through time as our level of expected claims goes up and we’ve been retaining more business. But if you look at the fourth quarter we had what I will say, our new plan or our new expected. We came in at 89% of that. That was $7 million. So I think you can run that math.

You are correct that when we made the recalibration from original pricing to our plan that, that recalibration was roughly 90% of what we had originally priced for which was why in my prior comments I said, if we went back to look at that old model we would have been at about 77% of pricing and as round numbers go that would have meant $14 million better than we originally priced for a number of years ago. But we’re trying to move away from that because that numbers move in as the business mix changes and really moved to where are we measuring versus the plan we lay out for you.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Got it okay, that’s very helpful. And just to clarify those numbers when you gave us some of the adjustments in the segments that favorable mortality of seven, couple of other items that you mentioned in your opening remarks is that all pre or post-tax?

Richard Bielen

That’s all pretax.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Got it, that’s helpful. And then can you give us a sense I think you laid out when you gave us the 2014 plan what your expectations were on spreads, I am talking about stable value here and why they were declined, can you just sort of cover that? Can you just give us a sense for the spread on, for instance the in-force book versus the spread on new business that you’re writing today? I noticed I think you wrote about $97 million in 4Q, can you maybe just give us a sense for what the gap is between the spread on new business versus the in-force?

Richard Bielen

Okay. In order to achieve a low double digit ROE on this business we need a pricing spread of roughly a 100 basis points. So that is kind of going back a number of years ago, a traditional level. The 277 that we saw in the quarter is really the best proxy of what the in-force spread is but we are a little bit longer in duration in this portfolio. So it’s not going to roll off just evenly overtime which is why we expect it to go down later in the year and for everybody’s knowledge at our investor conference we projected a spread for the year of 255 for 2014.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Okay. So if we look out to several years from now, just assume that the in-force the account values are stable from here as we look out several years from now that spread continue to ratchet down toward that 100 maybe a little over 100 basis points given your asset duration is a little bit longer.

Richard Bielen

Well what we showed at the investor conference was a three year projection so the one year plan and two years of model that would have us dropping from 255 to 230 to 190 in 2016. So that gives you an indication of magnitude and direction that we would be going in. In order to get down to a 100 would be a number of years out and obviously there is a lot can happen in terms of interest rates in our asset liability management to work through that.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

Sure. Absolutely, thank you very much. Sorry you won’t be in Florida.

Richard Bielen

It’s a little storm in the Southeast.

John Nadel – Sterne, Agee & Leach, Inc.

I am sure you’re starting to…

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Dan Bergman with UBS. Please proceed.

Dan Bergman – UBS

Hi good morning. I was just curious if you could elaborate on your thoughts around the current M&A and block acquisition landscape, just how you’re seeing things develop particularly given the recent movements in interest rates and also some of the recently announced transactions in our insurance deals we’ve seen? Thanks.

Richard Bielen

Yeah, we remain pretty optimistic and bullish in terms of the outlook for more M&A in our space. Since we announced the MONY deal I think there have been couple of pretty sizeable transactions, the Lincoln Benefit transaction as well as the CNA transaction that was announced I guess late last week or early this week. We think all the forces that have been driving M&A activity in the U.S. in our space sort of continue unabated.

We actually think rising interest rates is supportive of more M&A activity because companies that are holding non-strategic properties or policies would view that as a better time to sale because they will get a better price because higher interest rates will lead to better valuations. So we remain very constructive in terms of our expectations about M&A activity and again we feel particularly good about our position within the space. We think we have a franchise there that as good as any and probably better than most. So we are very upbeat about M&A as we look forward.

Dan Bergman – UBS

Great. Very helpful. And then just switching gears I may have missed it but can you provide the breakdown of the $25 million in MONY pretax earnings between kind of the normalized earnings coming off the block in the transaction or transition expenses that you saw in the quarter?

Richard Bielen

We did not that total transition expenses for the quarter were roughly $7.5 million. That was a little less than the plan that we had of those a little less than $6 million were one-time fees and expenses related to the transaction. So we had about $2 million of transition but we do expect to actually have that in somewhat elevated especially in the first half of 2014 as we affect the transition from AXA to ourselves.

Dan Bergman – UBS

Okay, great. Very helpful. And then just finally just in general I just want to see if you had any thoughts, updated thoughts around how the business integration of MONY is progressing and a little bit further into the acquisition?

Richard Bielen

We believe it’s progressing very well. We’ve moved the employees in Syracuse from the MONY Tower to their own locations just outside of town there is 100 people, a number of the senior management have been on site to visit them. Our cooperation with the AXA team has been very good during this process and so we’re very pleased on that front. Now it’s just a lot of hard work and heavy lifting in order to get systems integrated and plugged into our systems at this point but overall it’s going very well between the two organizations.

John Johns

Yeah, we’re right on plan and this is everyday work for us. We’ve done this so many times we feel very good about our ability to bring this one home. I would say, I will just add more color to it, we have been very delighted about the people, we’ve added to our team up in Syracuse they are a good group and they seem to really enjoy our culture as well and they fit in very well so that’s been an unexpected bonus of the transaction.

Dan Bergman – UBS

That’s great. Thanks so much.

Richard Bielen

Thank you.

Operator

(Operators Instructions).

John Johns

Great. If there are being no further questions, I think this meeting is adjourned. Thank you all very much for joining us and we’re very happy, we could deliver a good quarter and we’re going to work very hard to do more or the same. Thanks.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today’s conference, thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect. Have a great day.

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