Seeking Alpha
About this author:
Submit
an article to

In a move that isn't likely to get much attention due to the current row over the banking industry bailout, Congress approved $25 billion worth of low cost loans for the auto industry today:

(From the FT):

The House of Representatives on Wednesday approved a $25bn package of low-cost loans to help hard-pressed carmakers and their suppliers finance plant modernisation at a time of restricted access to public capital ­markets.

The automotive loans are separate from the proposed $700bn bail-out for the banking sector, which is still being debated in Congress. The House approved the measure 370-58, setting the stage for Senate approval within days.

The industry’s case has been helped by the fact that Michigan and Ohio, the two states most dependent on the car industry, are key swing states in the November 4 presidential election.

Executives of General Motors (GM), Ford Motor (F) and Chrysler and their suppliers have lobbied heavily for the loans. Both presidential ­candidates, John McCain and Barack Obama, have expressed support…

...The loans were originally authorised in an energy bill passed last December to finance the retooling of plants for more fuel-efficient vehicles, especially hybrid and electric cars. But they have become a crucial prop for Detroit carmakers.

The continuing resolution provides funding for $7.5bn, which is the estimated subsidy on the loans – in other words, the cost to the government of providing them at well below market rates.

The loans will not take effect until the energy department has written detailed regulations dealing with, among other issues, which investments will qualify and conditions for repayment. Congress has directed the department to begin writing the regulations quickly and will provide any extra staff required to do so. One lobbyist said he hoped the regulations would be completed by early 2009.

All carmakers and suppliers with operations in the US are theoretically eligible. However, the energy bill restricts benefits to plants that have been in operation for at least 20 years, thereby excluding most foreign carmakers.

A Toyota (TM) spokesman said his company was agnostic on whether it derived any benefits. It has kept a low profile in the debate on the loans.

At some point we, as a nation, are going to have to abandon the idea that we are a free market capitalist society, and just admit that we are a "convenience economy." We are socialist when it's convenient, and blow the free-market horn when that's convenient as well. Or perhaps we have a free market economy when it works, but the government is always ready to step in and help Corporate America clean up its mistakes.

Mind you, I'm not disputing the sheer economic value of the domestic auto industry or the need for them to retool, I would just rather any help from the government come with some sort of penalty, higher cost or a more tangible benefit to taxpayers at large. For instance, if the auto industry has to borrow money from the government to operate, than they should be required to provide low cost auto loans to low income people, or provide job training, employment, etc, to same. Additionally a % of their future profits should be kicked back to the taxpayer as well.

For me, it's not so much the value of any benefit I receive personally if/when the government has to bailout or help a particular company, it's the overall principle of the thing. It's a lot easier to support bailouts (and trust the politicians making the decisions) when they treat the taxpayer with respect and outline the direct benefits we'll receive, as opposed to saying: "do it for the economy."

You can read more here.

Sources:

The Financial Times: "House clears $25bn for carmakers" -- Bernard Simon, September 25, 2008.

Disclosure: at the time of publishing the author didn't own a position in any of the companies mentioned in this article; the ideas expressed are solely the opinions of the author and shouldn't be viewed as financial or investment advice.

Print this article with comments
Comments
18
Comments 1 - 18 out of 18
You are viewing the latest 20 comments
  •  
    Another, perhaps obvious point to be made is that the loan with its attendant regulations is very likely to "steer" the auto industry in whatever direction Congress wishes to serve political rather than economic purposes. The toxic influence will not be confined to loan in question. Nothing justifies this loan.
    2008 Sep 26 08:55 AM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Disgusting. This is rewarding bad behavior and mismanagement with a taxpayer funded bailout.
    2008 Sep 26 09:29 AM | Link | Reply
  •  
    It isn't a bailout, it is a loan garuntee, the same way the government did for my college loans.
    2008 Sep 26 02:12 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Well, GM and Ford is dirt cheap.. forget politics,, just buy them stocks!! It is once in your lifetime buy! Look, GM and Ford is not exaclty mega stocks because the outstanding shares in float is way below the market average... GE, Intel, Microsoft and others have 20 times or more as many shares ... They are profitable but the earnings take forever to rise year after year. Often it takes one more billion dollars in profit to boost earnings by a dime a share... For GM, if GM makes one more billion dollars in profit, its earning will be $2 a share.. two billion $4, three billion $6... While Microsoft need to increase earnings by $10 billion just to increase earning by a dollar, $20 billin just $2 and so on... The multiple for GM is so great and Ford to an less extent because Ford has three times more shares yet very low by comparison. that is why Ford is stuck at $5 a share. Those two automobile stocks are very interesting stocks... It doesnt take much profits to propell them ten times higher in stockprice. even higher if GM and Ford start taking market share back from Toyotas Hondas and Nissans. GM and Ford can do that.. You can really wait until GM fall a bit more, but chances is so great that you will mss the opportunity to grab shares at lower prices than today. You can buy some at stop limit prices lower than now.. They will know about you and wont give to you, anyway... it is computer programmings. Traders will keep eyes out for guys like yourselves..Theywill trade them higher than you want to buy to keep you out of reach..GM is at $9 and Ford at $5, my god!! Very cheap!
    2008 Sep 26 03:33 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    If you think GM and Ford will go belly up, fine, they will stop building small cars especially because it is low profits.. Then what will happen then?? We will have an acute shortage of small cars and the prices of small cars will zoom to $30,000 even for lowly Corollas or Fits or Yaris... Hybrids will fetch upwards of $50,000 or so.. Tokyo will be making a mint of profits while you fret about the reliabilty of GM and Ford but end up losing your shirt buying a new car from Toyota, Honda and Nissan... America will be sinking deeper than hell!! Nothing is static... Most of you still think you can keep buying Japanese cars while GM and Ford will still sit on hands building small cars no body wants. If you think Toyota, Honda and NIssan will hold the line on small car prices after GM and Ford go bankrupt.. You are kidding yourself... Your talk about inferior GM and Ford cars is CHEAP!!! You will pay more for your "superior judgement" on quality of cars!!! Sure They will grow production of small cars to meet our demand but it will take a decade or more to replace GM and Ford lost production.
    2008 Sep 26 03:38 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Our economy will be hurt more from GM and Ford bankruptcy than we thought ..We thought that there will be plenty of Corollas, Fits,Yaris, Prius, Civics, Accords around with GM and Ford gone. NO, Wrong!! Carbuyers from GM and Ford will compete with you for the limited supplies of small cars built by Toyotas, Hondas, Nissans. Many of you wil be bumped into used car markets... Used car prices will go up!!! Vicous cycles !!! America will explode!!
    2008 Sep 26 03:40 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    If you contnue not buying GM and Ford, then our government will probably have to ante up another $25 billion in loans... another one, another one until our government is convinced that GM and Ford is gone for good!! Our government cannot tell you to go buy GM and Ford cars... Our government can only hope that you have economic commonsense to stop and think and finally realize that it is pointless to buy Toyota, Honda, and Nissan simply because they are better built by a veneer like comparisoin.. Very little difference in quality for all the trouble our government will have to go through... Consumers , you think it over... yes, I am trying to scare the shit out of you! I had tried everything else already... Here your shit go!@
    2008 Sep 26 03:44 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    I have a crazy fantasy that many of you would have gone to buy GM and Ford once I give up and sell GM and Ford just out of sheer cowardice!! No, I willNOT SELL GM AND FORD STOCK !!! YOU UNDERSTAND!@@@ I WILL JUST WATCH YOU PAY MORE FOR COROLLAS, CIVICS, PRIUSES, YARIS, FITS, ETC ONCE GM AND FORD IS BANKRUPTED AND I LOST MY MONEY IN STOCK... I WILL LOSE LESS THAN YOU WILL PAY MORE FOR YOUR NEXT CAR FROM TOKYO!! YOU WILL NEVER WIN!!
    2008 Sep 26 03:47 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    HAPPY MOTORING, AMERICAN JAPANESE DRIVERS!!
    2008 Sep 26 03:48 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    the debacle of GM and Ford is a big reason for the many foreclosed properties!! The ripples is so strong that it might add over $100 or $200 billion to the price of the bailout of $700 billion envisoined by the government.. It is just because you feel smart reading Consumer Reports about car comparisoins... Really, all it takes is a kick of the tires!!! YOu have NO COMMONSENSE!! I am not trying to save workers, I am also trying to save everything around us.. You are nothign but American agiile ratfinks!!
    2008 Sep 26 03:52 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    AGILE ASSED RATFINKS!!
    2008 Sep 26 03:52 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Another example of how the Seeking Alpha contibutors know absolutely nothing about the Auto industry they love to complain about. These loans were tied to a 40% INCREASE in Corporate Average Fuel Economy which requires Auto companies to SELL a combination of cars that average 35 MPG. They can make all of the small cars they want, although domestics and imports are counted seperately so Chevy's Aveo doesn't help the Impalla, but if customers want to buy larger vehicles because gas becomes cheap again, the Auto companies have to pay the government a huge penalty. The $25B loan package does even come close to offsetting the $35B cost the government estimates the Auto companies will pay to achieve the new government regulations.

    CAFE is far more socialistic than any government loan package will ever be. It penalizes Auto companies for selling a vehicle mix the government doesn't like but consumers actually prefer. It is also the root cause of the truck/SUV fad because the CAFE requirements for these vehicles were much lower than cars so Auto companies could make the big trucks/suvs customers wanted without paying a CAFE penalty.

    The loans also come with huge requirements. They will be given out on a plant by plant basis and each plant must be at least 20 years old (Honda, Toyota, and Nissan plants are elligable) and the loan must be used for tooling for a new vehicle that gets 25% better mpg than the previous vehicle the plant produced.

    If the government treated the banks and wall street like they treat the Auto companies they would have raised the capitalization rates 20 or 30% when the credit crisis hit instead of pumping cash into the system, opening the discount window, and eventualy offering to buy all of the bad debt. That is the definition of a bailout, not the loans to the Auto companies.
    2008 Sep 26 04:13 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Alright you Detroit apologists, let me ask you this.

    If our domestic automakers are trying so hard, why don't they -

    1. Import the 40+ mpg cars they build that are selling well in Europe and elsewhere? They don't need $25 billion to do that, just some cargo ships (which I suspect are readily available right now real cheap.)

    2. Start building the NGV's again (they sell them in Canada and other countries) that Boone Pickens is spending $60 million to advertise for them. They'll sell more of them than Volts, and make more money doing it.

    3. Send each dealer who wants one a dual-fueled NGV, and help them set up a CNG refueling depot at their dealership.

    And for Christ's sake, do SOMETHING besides go crying to Washington. In their current state of affairs, the Congress could send them the $700 billion they want to spend on the bank bailout, and it would only STILL only be a matter of time until they ended up in bankruptcy.

    2008 Sep 26 04:50 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    I've been waiting for answers to these questions for a long time, and I suspect I'm not going to get them here. Just like my kids, the only thing you guys know how to do well is call home for more money.
    2008 Sep 26 04:53 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    For the past 15 years the Detroit 3 were making $10K on a loaded truck and $15K on a big SUV. And they sold MILLIONS of them. What ever happened to all THAT money?
    2008 Sep 26 04:55 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Buy the shares at fire sale
    GM =Global Motors
    It's not you daddys gm!
    along with tax incentives to build these plants its a win win
    for the consumer and the unions
    most important for GM

    imho
    2008 Sep 26 05:44 PM | Link | Reply
  •  
    Having worked for GM, I have never seen a company waste more money than them. When they have parties, they cost over $500,000 hiring speakers that cost $100,000 and making everyone stay in a hotel for over $200 a day. That's one party and they have about ten of them a year. Next, they pay people $300,000 a year for a job that they could hire someone for $110,000 a year. They overpay their 22,000 white collar salaried employees all the time and they do half the work of any other company. At 5:00 p.m.., the place is empty. When some big shot from Detroit comes in, they do a massive cleanup of the office and tell everyone to stay at their desks all day and pretend to look busy. Did I mention that GM is almost all white men too that says the word "yes" as often as they breathe? Also, watching and playing video games is an everyday occurrence.
    2008 Sep 28 10:28 AM | Link | Reply
  •  

    Paul- Here are the answers to your questions.

    1. Import the 40+ mpg cars they build that are selling well in Europe and elsewhere? They don't need $25 billion to do that, just some cargo ships (which I suspect are readily available right now real cheap.)

    Answer: If you understand the relationship between the dollar and foreign currency...you now understand that the difference between these two makes a big difference between the profit a company came make when shipping cars over here. Also, you have under estimated the cost it takes to ship these cars over here. If it was so easy, why don't all the foreign car makers do the same thing? Its simple, it cost more than what you think. Its cheaper for the car manufactures to build billion dollar plants in the US then it is to ship these cars here.

    2. Start building the NGV's again (they sell them in Canada and other countries) that Boone Pickens is spending $60 million to advertise for them. They'll sell more of them than Volts, and make more money doing it.

    Answer: Detroit could produce Natural Gas cars if they wanted...in fact there are many of them (mostly trucks) that are on the road today. The reason these truck companies have them, is because they are willing to build (spend billions) these natural gas fill up stations needed to fuel these NGV trucks. The answer here is, if some entrepreneur / govt funding would start putting natural gas pumps readily available at your local BP/Shell etc...then the automotive industry would start pumping these cars out in the masses. After all, this technology isn't new by any means. You cant blame Detroit for not pumping these NGV cars out by the masses when no one will buy them because there is no where to fill your car up with Natural gas. Having one pump every 5,000 miles isnt going to cut it...

    3. Send each dealer who wants one a dual-fueled NGV, and help them set up a CNG refueling depot at their dealership.

    Answer: Who is paying for this CNG fueling station? Once again you have under estimated the cost of this type technology ....you cant expect a struggling auto industry to come up with billions of dollars to transform the way we used the automobile today without providing them funding. How comes people arent saying that your local Exon etc (that are making record profits) should build these at their expense? After all they are in the buisiness of filling your car up...not the auto industry.

    So many people are confused on this auto loan package...This isn't a bailout for the auto industry this 25 billion pkg was approved last year under energy bill that was passed by congress. This legislation wasn't just approved, it was funded. If the govt comes out tomorrow and says that (pick any industry that is struggling now) it is mandating certain mpg requirements a few years from now that will cost these companies billions of dollars...the govt has no choice but to provide loans to make this happen, otherwise the companies simply will not be able to meet these requirements and more jobs will be cut. This wasn't a bailout, it was a promised loan that was part of the agreement between the auto industry and the govt last year to reduce our dependency on foreign oil. Isnt this what we want? Everyone keeps complaining about fuel prices...but these same people dont understand the fundamentals behind getting us there.
    2008 Sep 29 11:13 AM | Link | Reply
Viewing Comments 1-18 out of 18