Trina Solar: As Debts Come Due, $14 Billion In Off-Balance Sheet Liabilities [View article]
what is disclosed by the company is a fact. How is presented is not. Gene, you are right. Article has a lot text and may impress people due to sheer volume of data. Trina may have issues but their are other in nature than its debt.
Trina Solar: As Debts Come Due, $14 Billion In Off-Balance Sheet Liabilities [View article]
$14.5B in contractual agreements for purchase of equipment and raw material, 90% of it with GCL. Contracts are negotiable, and they have been negotiated down to price per kg. As year goes buy pricing will change and so the obligation amount. Short term borrowing is recycled monthly, this amount went down from Q2 to Q3, bonds are up but that is 88M, worth around 60M now. Seem like someone got caught with their short last week, and now the damage control. Impressed amount of work on putting so much irrelevant information together to get the stock down. Congratulations
JA Solar Responds To EU Threat, But It Cannot Win [View article]
Tom, there is more to this game that you would like to give the credit to. If the solar was not worth the attention, you wouldn't have American politicians and EU protectionists scrambling with the levies to stop the Chinese. 90% of Wal-Mart goods are made in China, that company is called a success story because it is able to acquire products from the same place those modules are made. Certainly this is not about American manufacturing either. You know why because there is not such a thing. First Solar manufactures in Malaysia. SunPower in Philippines. German SolarWorld has 200MW cell factory in Ohio, and there are 27GW of projects in approval stages in the US. Who do you think will supply the module? Not the US manufacturers. Further ASPs are at the level that favorite argument of the critics, the cost, is no longer under consideration. JA and Trina are actually hardly losing any financial resources at this point. I do not have a time to discuss this in detail, I need to wait for LDK release to publish our traditional burden of debt review and explore some few missed points by many. BTW Stalin has been very good at those plans. Those plans had built Soviet Union to a powerful organism that was able to defeat Nazis and when it came to divide Europe squeezed Churchill in Yalta to give up his allies with half a Europe. Most disgraceful act in history of BE. Until late 80s what had Stalin started kept the same Soviet Union as a powerhouse. Chinese actually have a lot more success and capability in delivering on their plans. They have a second largest economy in the world with growth at quadruples of any Western country. This century will belong to China and India, it is simply facts. Lastly for the Doubting Thomas using "dude" in the name, check the page 7 of this pp, 40GW confirmed after we reported on SPVI. http://bit.ly/OiwaOJ
Q-Cells Sale Sells Solar Growth Short [View article]
I can see that SolarOne will use cells from Q-Cells to sell into the US and use facilities in Germany to produce on that market, but SolarOne is minority owned by Hanwha, and there is no integration of organizations but cooperation in value chain coming from this relationship.
I am sorry but this the last post of mine on this topic. REC published the results of cost 1.12 per watt including Opex. Yingli's costs are $0.94. Have you read the article? How do you put up 750MW of capacity? It costs money that is cash account going down to capex. REC closed all the shops down and sold the equipment by taking a write down, they added a cash from those sales, it is a simple business trick. Depreciation is part of costs, if you did not have depreciation you would not have hi costs, but you would not be able amortize your equipment off. One suggestion, you admit you do not read budgets very well. I agree. Instead of questioning anything I post, do a homework on this, read some F-20s, study accounting principles. I do not mind discussing my articles but you cannot just create own rules and bash my writing on basis of wrong assumptions. By the way all cost includes deprecation, amortization , part of GAAP.
I have purposely asked the question about FS. Revenue for FS is based on system revenue. The gross margin is not based on modules sales, they are the system costs' margins against the revenue BOS and cost BOS. Unfortunately your calculation is faulty. Look at my article on Yingli, internally they have 11.5% margin on all-in costs, but gross margin is at 7.9%, there you can clearly understand what is involved. The difference between accounting in US versus in Europe is why it is confusing to compare REC and the Chinese, but it is not impossible. Check this presentation: http://bit.ly/Kbds95 page 11, module costs is 90 cents Euro, clearly company identifies SG&A plus R&D worth of 10 cents Euro. The total cost for Yingli was $0.57 processing and $0.26 poly. Both together at $0.83. REC costs is .90-.10=0.80 euro, which is $0.99 today’s prices? So REC module is .16 per watt more expensive. YGE sold 534 modules their Opex is 60M, divided by 534MW it is around .11 cents, ok so added together it is .94, you have REC at 0.90 euro it is 1.12. REC produces each watt at .18 greater cost than Yingli or 20% more cost. thanks
EysteinH, I am not sure what is your pursuit? If you looking at the cost of manufacture, gross margin is the format. Term" all-in- cost" refer to conversion of poly (including its cost) to a watt of the module, not what components there are as spent divided by the produced watt output. I think you are confusing both, the concept of "all-in costs" with company's dynamic of expenses against that volume of sales in watts. You can use all kind of formats and claim better or worse costs, by creating new standards, but how did you determine First Solar sales of megawatts, the volume of it and then the ASP?
Where did you get they do not include wages? It is part of COGS . Opex is not included as by definition it is not related to "making" the product but to "managing" the business and day to day selling costs. This is why Chinese exclude shipping costs of modules, as the do not contribute to "making" the inventory. I suggest read my articles and refer to balance sheets, understand the accounting principles. It will make it easier. If you cannot make a positive gross margin, you are not going to make operating margin positive, mute point.
Do you think that then big guys locked pricing higher than the small guys, who also have ton of long-term contracts? Hanwha has contracts like all of them do, even Jinko has contracts. All of them sat at the table to negotiate at one point, and Yingli or Trina cannot get it down, but Hanwha can? Perhaps it only so much and spot dominates Hanwha's purchases but both Trina and Yingli are growing, meaning they need more not less poly, which gives them better leverage for blended price, buying now. Is it possible that average poly wasn't at $27, someone just said it, their blend is pretty high after all. CSIQ talks about all kinds of cost reductions but their ELPS line of 280MW of cell lines is not fully utilize, but they talk about the conversion as they have at least half of capacity in it. I am not sure who REC sells to at this point.
thanks for the feedback, I am not sure about negative, facts do sound like that sometimes. As Eystein points out all of it is in the article. The concept of internal improvement is very elusive, if cannot be captured in the BS or IS. I am a big fun of solar, but even bigger one of transparency. What does demand speak of? Clearly everyone is losing income so what separates success from less success? thanks
LDK Solar Takes $411.8 Million In Write-Downs In Q4 [View article]
HI Boomers, it is a choice for a very aggressive investor. You bring good points about equity and long-lived assets. If you do not own it, perhaps it is better to stay away.
Trina Solar: As Debts Come Due, $14 Billion In Off-Balance Sheet Liabilities [View article]
Trina Solar: As Debts Come Due, $14 Billion In Off-Balance Sheet Liabilities [View article]
China's November Solar Shipments Add Concerns About Q4 Estimates [View article]
JA Solar Responds To EU Threat, But It Cannot Win [View article]
Further ASPs are at the level that favorite argument of the critics, the cost, is no longer under consideration. JA and Trina are actually hardly losing any financial resources at this point. I do not have a time to discuss this in detail, I need to wait for LDK release to publish our traditional burden of debt review and explore some few missed points by many. BTW Stalin has been very good at those plans. Those plans had built Soviet Union to a powerful organism that was able to defeat Nazis and when it came to divide Europe squeezed Churchill in Yalta to give up his allies with half a Europe. Most disgraceful act in history of BE. Until late 80s what had Stalin started kept the same Soviet Union as a powerhouse. Chinese actually have a lot more success and capability in delivering on their plans. They have a second largest economy in the world with growth at quadruples of any Western country. This century will belong to China and India, it is simply facts.
Lastly for the Doubting Thomas using "dude" in the name, check the page 7 of this pp, 40GW confirmed after we reported on SPVI.
http://bit.ly/OiwaOJ
JA Solar Responds To EU Threat, But It Cannot Win [View article]
Q-Cells Sale Sells Solar Growth Short [View article]
Q-Cells Sale Sells Solar Growth Short [View article]
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
Check this presentation:
http://bit.ly/Kbds95
page 11, module costs is 90 cents Euro, clearly company identifies SG&A plus R&D worth of 10 cents Euro. The total cost for Yingli was $0.57 processing and $0.26 poly. Both together at $0.83.
REC costs is .90-.10=0.80 euro, which is $0.99 today’s prices? So REC module is .16 per watt more expensive. YGE sold 534 modules their Opex is 60M, divided by 534MW it is around .11 cents, ok so added together it is .94, you have REC at 0.90 euro it is 1.12. REC produces each watt at .18 greater cost than Yingli or 20% more cost.
thanks
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
I am not sure what is your pursuit? If you looking at the cost of manufacture, gross margin is the format. Term" all-in- cost" refer to conversion of poly (including its cost) to a watt of the module, not what components there are as spent divided by the produced watt output. I think you are confusing both, the concept of "all-in costs" with company's dynamic of expenses against that volume of sales in watts. You can use all kind of formats and claim better or worse costs, by creating new standards, but how did you determine First Solar sales of megawatts, the volume of it and then the ASP?
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
Hanwha SolarOne Posts Fifth Consecutive Quarter Of Declining Shipments [View article]
thanks
LDK Solar Takes $411.8 Million In Write-Downs In Q4 [View article]
Solar Industry And Burden Of Debt: A Q4 View [View article]