Seeking Alpha
  • Seppo Sahrakorpi
    $NOK Indian tax man now going after both Nokia Group, and Nokia India, for the total of 2.5B EUR http://bit.ly/1kmlKNN
    12/7/13
    Reply (48)
    • Timothy Bryan: Idiots....
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: Pretty much coming up with numbers as they go...
      12/7/13
    • Timothy Bryan: yep
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: It is good to remember that at least some of these claims are based on retroactive legislation: http://seekingalpha.com/c/84gtt
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: And that random numbers in this case is nothing new. Numbers at billion dollar plus scale were quoted already in January.
      12/7/13
    • La Rue: Next week will be very interesting !
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: See e.g. here: http://seekingalpha.com/c/8kjof
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: @LaR Interesting in the sense that when this story initially emerged in January, the SP took 10-15% hit...Of course the market...
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: ...cap is 2-3x that now, so the hit should be smaller in percentage terms. And Nokia is stronger company, so even this...
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: ...ridiculous roll the dice number does not spell anywhere near BK for Nokia.
      12/7/13
    • La Rue: Isn't Nokia India separate from Nokia ? Just declare BK, close the plant and move on and let India sell the plant for scrap metal.
      12/7/13
    • Timothy Bryan: Yes this will cost them only the factory in the deal, which will be sold for scrap. The stupidity of the Indian authorities is unequaled..
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: I agree. India has no leverage here. They will lose employment and long term revenue generation from this. If India wants to stay in . . .
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: The stone age, this is a good start. Unbelievable.
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: Hopefully it will just get tossed out in all courts except India.
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: La Rue, Next week it will be 5 Billion, with 'penalties' of course. January it will be 10B.
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: Or whatever the cash number is that Nokia will have after the deal.
      12/7/13
    • Doug Dallam: I thought the D&S deal absolved Nokia of any problems like this, deferring to Microsoft?
      12/7/13
    • alphaRAJU: I think Elop should make Microsoft pay this ASAP.
      12/7/13
    • Timothy Bryan: My understanding is India nokia is completely separate from the rest, so this only stays there with no effect elsewhere.
      12/7/13
    • Timothy Bryan: Shut the plant down and give it back to these idiots...
      12/7/13
    • mepa84: If Indians do not get the money they dream for they will ban Nokia phones. India is an important market for Lumia and MSFT changes the deal
      12/7/13
    • mepa84: By this speed that the Indians set arbitrary numbers and penalties soon they will ask for the deal money
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: They are already implying that they will next assess the capital gains taxes they will want from the D&S deal :)
      12/7/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: It is difficult for me to see how India could legally go after / ban MSFT Lumia phones in India. There are several degrees of separation.
      12/7/13
    • im626: India is the next big market for NSN and even other divisions. It's critical to resolve this issue for Nokia's long term viability.
      12/8/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: @im626 That is a good point, basically how isolated Nokia Group and NSN are from Nokia India. Can India go after those too?
      12/8/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: And even if they legally could not do that, there will be reputation etc issues, how Nokia is perceived in India...
      12/8/13
    • Seppo Sahrakorpi: Some additional thoughts and links here (link to a SA comment thread): http://seekingalpha.com/c/fxoil
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: @Seppo, The Indian people are hardworking and value quality. They suffer immeasurably under a corrupt, discrete and money hungry...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...government. The people will stand up for high quality jobs that could easily vanish while choosing NOKIA's innovations/quality imo.
      12/8/13
    • mepa84: The message from Indian government to the corporates is: come here open a factory and we will put a tax demand on all of your cash to BK you
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: Agreed mepa. Please bring your hundreds-of-millions to build a factory affording the best technology/conditions of the time, pay our...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...talented workers more than prevailing wages, invest in efforts to help our poorest citizens, pay the Indian government as...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...agreed and just be happy to be here. This attitude (petulance) is far too pervasive today. IMO India has more to lose today than...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...a month ago. Given these shenanigans NOKIA has little to lose and a lot to gain.
      12/8/13
    • mepa84: shocked to hear Nokia has offered some money to Indians. This is accepting the guilt and sending the message that the bate is in the net
      12/8/13
    • mepa84: Now, ITA is playing the game they are skilled in to maximize the ransoms. Indians might make $1BN but it takes decades to reinstate image
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: I'd guess the damage to India's reputation as a 'business friendly manufacturing' nation is already done. India is facing tremendous...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...internal struggles while international companies seek out high quality/value locations to invest. Even if the ND courts drop the...
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: ...fee/fine to zero, I'd guess they'll begin to lose big business at a most impressive pace.
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: BAD BAD business/tax/manufacturing decision imo.
      12/8/13
    • sidiji: India aims to curb business tax disputes with safe harbour rules http://on.ft.com/1bqvqoG
      12/8/13
    • colorado.: @sidji, Unfortunately the Indian people see little from settlements/taxes. There will be zero tax disputes when others follow NOKIA out!
      12/8/13
    • toraji: Royal Dutch shell has the same problems. http://bit.ly/IL7IsY . Not a good place for multinationals I would say
      12/8/13
    • toraji: Microsoft stays out of the "mess" http://bit.ly/1kqZ1jT
      12/8/13
    • JMstocks75: Be prepared to buy this dip
      12/10/13
    • Photony: What a bunch of idiots those Indian tax officers are. Seems that Nokia will have to BK the Chennai factory. Feel bad for the employees.
      12/10/13