Comments on Siddharth Dalal's articles RSS Syndication from SeekingAlpha.com http://seekingalpha.com/author/siddharth-dalal/articles http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-274279 274279 Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:56:54 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-274276 274276 Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:50:35 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-274275 274275 Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:49:13 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-273203 273203 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 22:32:06 -0400 triad.bizjournals.com/...
]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-273071 273071 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 17:49:47 -0400 this 700B baillout and this C/WB deal is all about pmaking foreign investors whole after Wall St sold them all this garbage SIV's

we are being soldout by our govt so that the USA continues to get the 2b/day that we need to fund our deficits

it is econmic extortion being laid on the American taxpayer]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272815 272815 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 13:15:56 -0400
If you subtract $42B (citi's loan loss estimate*) from WB 6/30 equity of $75B, you get $33B. Then subtract preferred stocks ($2.3 + 3.5 + 4.025 = $9.825) and you're left with $23.175, which is about $10.85 per share.

WB shareholders could try to hold out for $10 - 11 via a rescue plan or take $7 in the stock of a company with very capable management. Fortunately, we don't have to decide right away.

*According to Siddarth Dalal's initial post, $42B = 14% of $300B mortgage loan portfolio and 35% of $120B option arm portfolio. IMHO, these are probably pretty good estimates of what WB could expect in the way of discounts in a rescue plan.]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272774 272774 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 12:41:24 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272721 272721 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 12:06:59 -0400
Creditors can force companies into bankruptcy. It's called an involuntary petition for bankruptcy.

]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272562 272562 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 10:10:39 -0400
Know your audience. The folks who don't know these basic concepts aren't generally posting on a specialized blog - you can see from the level of discourse that you're dealing with an informed audience.

And you're incorrect that each individual person had a say so in this situation. The acquisition was a management decision. When those loans started going bad and tanking he value of the CMOs, the employees did their best to cover mounting losses, but ultimately couldn't do enough to keep up with internal losses and unprecedented external influences. The real world does not work like academic theory - would that it were that simple.

"That deal is done for if you pull up the actual transcripts. Or else they wouldn't have made it public, including hte citigroup acquisition transcripts". Clearly the deal was far from done, it didn't even have legal documentation behind it yet.

I don't want to inflame, so I'll go elsewhere. Enjoy.]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272495 272495 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 09:10:21 -0400 www.parchayi.com/2008/.../

It should soon be on seekingaplha too]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272492 272492 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 09:09:30 -0400 www.parchayi.com/2008/.../

and it will hopefully soon be up on seekingalpha too]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272485 272485 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 09:04:50 -0400
Well. The joke is on all of us. I knew WB management was up to something because of the way investor relations was stonewalling about the Citi deal.

The Wells Fargo deal is much better for WB shareholders and you should take it. The fair value of WB is probably $9 and you'll be getting $7. The main difference is that WB shareholders will get paid rather than FDIC.

Saint Warren must have gotten a guarantee from Congress that the bailout bill will pass. WFC can sell Wachovia's toxic crap to the taxpayers and WFC (and Warren) get. an instant profit of $4 Billion.

And Warren probably gets more face time on CNBC with Becky Quick. PS Do you guys think he's nailing her?

]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272467 272467 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 08:46:16 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272448 272448 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 08:28:10 -0400 CITI DEAL IS OFF!! Wells fargo intends to buy wachovia at a value of about $7 per share. Stock is pre-trading @ $6.70.
Now how about that! :-) Finally we come closer to the "real" value of WB stocks...Thus folks--hold on to your WB stocks...]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272392 272392 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:12:57 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272391 272391 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:10:06 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272349 272349 Fri, 03 Oct 2008 01:48:36 -0400
Of course, WB's institutional shareholders will approve the deal - It's unlikely that Citi would have agreed to it unless they had assurance that WB's institutional shareholders were on board.

However, I don't think the Wachovia leftovers will remain independent. Steele will probably sell them to Morgan Stanley so that he can become the next CEO of MS. The common stockholders will probably get one share of MS for 10 shares of WB. This would dilute MS' common stock float by 20%, but the dilution can be handled by reducing the dividend. The only obstacle to this merger would the huge amount of outstanding WB preferred stock.

The current shareholders are basically screwed - the only recourse is a class action lawsuit. Which I would gladly join - except I sold the last of my shares when the board fired Thompson without naming a replacement. ]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272301 272301 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 23:48:15 -0400
When will this transaction be consummated?
We expect this transaction to close before year-end, subject to approval from Wachovia shareholders and the appropriate regulatory agencies. It has been approved by directors of both companies.]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272298 272298 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 23:44:38 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272268 272268 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 22:36:17 -0400 Wachovia is not and never was bankrupt. If the deal goes through they still have Wachovia Securities, Evergreen Investments and Wachovia Insurance Services; all much more worth than just $1 per share. If the deal does not go through I am convinced they can get out of this situation without a bailout.
So where was the difference in BOA taking over Merrill Lynch, which otherwise would have likely gone bankrupt, from Citi to take over Wachovia? The only difference I see is that BOA paid a fair price with Merrill Lynch stocks still trading fairly well after the anouncement. Why did Citi get away with such a cheap price for Wachovia stocks causing the huge drop in WB value? Guess time will tell...]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272245 272245 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:43:28 -0400 seekingalpha.com/artic... you don't have a vote if your a shareholder...the board met...the ceo's met done deal...they just don't account for it...until 2009 1st quarter on the accounting books...prankit and steele colloaborated on how well the deal is. ..]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272236 272236 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:07:42 -0400 I think we just need more information to determine what to do, I am inclined to vote NO and to also encourage all to vote the same way. I am also inclined to look at the Class Action Suit that is being discussed in Coral Gables Florida before I make my decision.
I think the Feds stepped in too soon and forced this deal and that Wachovia can and will survive and that Citi was not the right suitor.
Shame on Buffet for discourging Wells from doing the deal.]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272233 272233 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:00:27 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/97835-the-lowdown-on-citi-wachovia?source=feed#comment-272230 272230 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:54:12 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272223 272223 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:36:34 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272220 272220 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:35:19 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272215 272215 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:23:26 -0400
You say of executives: Those are usually people who have worked for 20 years or so and are supposed to monitor and make adjustments.

In reality those were the people who moved in the upper echelons of a powerful industry, lead by a man who was one of Bush's rangers. But the right checks and balances were not in place - on the board or in executive management - to counter his hubris (sound familiar?) and as a result he made the acquisition that may have eventually sunk a great bank. May have - now that it's been hijacked, we'll never know if they would have made it or not.

I'm voting my shares down. Won't make a difference, but I'll feel a little better.]]> http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272209 272209 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:08:11 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272205 272205 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:02:43 -0400 http://seekingalpha.com/article/98321-robbing-peter-to-pay-paul-more-on-wachovia-citi?source=feed#comment-272203 272203 Thu, 02 Oct 2008 19:58:46 -0400