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Exit polls in Greece show the 2 pro-bailout parties garnering just 32-36% of the vote, maybe not...

  • Sunday, May 6, 2012, 2:24 PM ET
    Exit polls in Greece show the 2 pro-bailout parties garnering just 32-36% of the vote, maybe not enough to form a majority government. It's a shocking fall for Pasok and New Democracy, which together claimed nearly 80% of the vote in 2009. "The exit polls confirm ... there's no political consensus for the kind of reforms Greece must implement if it wants to remain in the eurozone," says Nicholas Spiro.
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This news story has 40 comments:

  • Not looking good for markets opening on Monday then. More uncertainly and possible contagion for the EU keeps getting back on the horizon.
    6 May 2012, 02:34 PM Reply Like
  • Yep, I was just thinking the same thing.
    6 May 2012, 02:41 PM Reply Like
  • Repeat of last summer. Might be a drop in price of oil which would help but I think the supplying countries have permanently priced in Fed printing press excesses.
    7 May 2012, 08:28 AM Reply Like
  • Just kick it out of the eurozone already. Sigh.
    6 May 2012, 03:11 PM Reply Like
  • And this comes on top of this:

    Sunday, May 6, 2:13 PM Francois Hollande has defeated Nicolas Sarkozy by a comfortable margin in the race for the French Presidency, reports Bloomberg, citing exit polls. It will put the Socialist party in power for the first time in 2 decades. Sarkozy's defeat makes him the 11th EU leader tossed from power since the sovereign debt crisis began.

    Together, these developments will increase uncertainty over the broad direction of European policy, whether Greece will abide by the terms of its latest bailout and the viability of the EMU.
    6 May 2012, 03:11 PM Reply Like
  • Uncertainty just ended.
    It is clear that voters do not want austerity. Only options left are default, euro exit, and money printing.
    6 May 2012, 03:54 PM Reply Like
  • What's interesting is most Greeks want to remain within the euro zone but resent austerity, reform and supervision. Much like children, Greek socialists want to cling to mom and dad (EU and ECB) but resent being told what to do and having their allowances cut. Among socialists, there must be a Freudian analogue between parents and the state.
    6 May 2012, 04:18 PM Reply Like
  • If you were in a lifeboat, but not doing any rowing and just eating the dwindling supplies, would you volunteer to go over the side for the benefit of the others in the boat?
    6 May 2012, 08:28 PM Reply Like
  • Agree but how is that different than America? When confronted the fiscal liberals say the solution is simply to print more. 5000 billion over three years just too austere?
    7 May 2012, 08:32 AM Reply Like
  • Looks like they decided to go Icelandic. Wonder if France will follow.
    6 May 2012, 03:46 PM Reply Like
  • The election results actually make things very clear for the euro zone. Poor countries must leave and print their own money. There is no catalyst to produce unification among people.
    6 May 2012, 04:27 PM Reply Like
  • Hollande is actually a positive as he is a technocrat despite the Socialist Party moniker.

    Greece is a big negative but there is hope. The leading party gets a few days to form a government and if not goes down the line until every party is exhausted and new elections are held.

    The big question is which parties do PASOK and ND ask to join their coalition. How radical do they reach to ensure a government and if they fail do the anti-Euro forces take over?
    6 May 2012, 04:29 PM Reply Like
  • David

    Well said.
    6 May 2012, 06:36 PM Reply Like
  • Arguably matters are not as dire as most of the other commenters on this tread suggest. First, current trends with about 32% of the vote counted give three parties (New Democracy, Syriza and PASOK) together about 50% of the vote and the Green Party enough votes to make this a solid majority if these four Parties can develop a common governing position. See the following two links which, as of a couple of hours after the close of polls on May 5th, show these trends and the basic positions of the Parties in question

    http://bit.ly/wrBwMj

    http://bit.ly/KttScN

    How in rebuttal to my assertion, it will be argues that Syriza and the Greens oppose the austerity measures at the heart of the bailout agreement between Greece and the Troika (i.e. IMF, ECB and the EU). However,
    (a) with the election of Hollande in France (and other recent developments in the Netherlands, Italy and Spain) it is clear that the Troika will now refocus on the need to develop a solid EU growth strategy to complement and reduce the sharp edges of the current austerity focus of EU fiscal policies,
    (b) the regional State elections within Germany this weekend and next will weaken the neoliberal and conservative voices within German political circles that have insisted that the EU adopt a rigid austerity stance to the exclusion of measures to encourage economic growth in southern Europe at this time,
    (c) Chancellor Merkel, faced with increasing isolation in the light of points (a) and (b) above will now have the ability to convince her Party that it now needs to reach an accommodation with the German Green Party in place of the Free Democrats and to offer greater support to an EU growth strategy.
    At the same time, the common thread amongst the four Greek Parties to which I refer is that they want Greece to remain within the EU and continue to have the Euro as the Greek currency and they all agree that the austerity measures are too harsh but must be ameliorated through negotiation with the Troika rather than unilateral rejection by Greece with the chaos such rejection would entail.

    In short, there is room for development of a positive outcome whereby Greece, the other peripheral EU States and the EU generally will continue with reform of their economies and fiscal management but broaden their focus to avoid undue contraction of national economies an attendant social and political upheaval. The UK will also begin to see merit in following a parallel path.
    6 May 2012, 04:30 PM Reply Like
  • Following up on my earlier reference to German regional State elections, here are results and commentary on today’s election in Schleswig-Holstein.

    http://bit.ly/IOZPlS

    http://bit.ly/IwriUI

    Next weekend will see an election in Germany’s largest State, North Rhineland - Westfalia, and a further blow to the Free Democrats.
    6 May 2012, 04:52 PM Reply Like
  • It is a shame that helicopter Ben can't run in France and Greece.

    He would have a triple mandate but then I think he wants to devalue every countries money ☻
    6 May 2012, 05:12 PM Reply Like
  • Just a poor man getting poorer.
    6 May 2012, 05:12 PM Reply Like
  • In the short term the Greek and French stories may be negative but in the long term it is positive because this is the first step towards abandoning the counterproductive austerity paradigm. Once Europe switches to a more pragmatic, USA-like economic policy, the healing will begin.
    6 May 2012, 05:27 PM Reply Like
  • Actually, the opposite is true. The reason these anti-austerity votes are being received the way they are in the markets is that they dramatically increase the probability that the euro will be grossly devalued and/or that the unsustainable debt burdens these countries have assumed are now certain to result in collapse much sooner than most expected. In Greece we will probably even see repudiation. Austerity was the last hope, and the childish voters of Europe have thrown it away. They will discover that the choice is not between having your cake and eating it too and saving your cake for another day, but between saving your cake for another day and starving to death.
    6 May 2012, 09:30 PM Reply Like
  • Draconian cuts only make things worse. Look at Greece. Austerity has enforced a nefarious cycle which is bordering into social chaos.Austerity is a stupid mindless self-flagellation as well a chest thumping self- aggrandizement.
    6 May 2012, 05:50 PM Reply Like
  • Yes, let's repudiate all debt world-wide and start from scratch:-( Sorry but I don't understand more spending as the solution to overindebtedness. But then, I'm not an academic.
    6 May 2012, 08:51 PM Reply Like
  • Agree with the comments above of The Last Boomer and anonymouse#12.

    Would only add that there is also merit, in moderation, with public finance reform initiated in Greece in conjunction with the bailout agreements between Greece and the Troika. Narrow focused deep austerity, however, answers nothing.
    6 May 2012, 06:25 PM Reply Like
  • Bob, I don't disagree with your post. But the problem is that NONE of the anti-austerity crowd, in any country, have a credible plan for dealing with the sovereign debt monsters.

    So while austerity -- with its tangible method of pain -- has "proven" to be unproductive, there are NO alternatives that do not realistically involve some other form of massive pain.
    6 May 2012, 06:59 PM Reply Like
  • How about the current US policy? It keeps us above the water. I believe that Obama and Boehner had a deficit reduction plan that was not that bad but the right wing in the Republican party torpedoed it. If we elect more moderate people in Congress on both sides, a viable compromise is quite possible that will address the US sovereign debt and deficit problems.
    6 May 2012, 08:14 PM Reply Like
  • Guys they have not fixed there govt. efficiency problems yet and neither have we.
    6 May 2012, 09:02 PM Reply Like
  • Tricky

    I agree with your critique. Clearly aspects of the austerity program are needed going forward (i.e. sound administrative practices, transparency and accountability for the administration of the State etc.). That said, in the absence of a realistic growth and economic reform agenda, those aspects of the austerity program will be impeded and may fail as the economy implodes.
    6 May 2012, 09:11 PM Reply Like
  • 1) Greeece leaving the euro is the best outcome.

    2) Hollande will most likely move towards subsidizing employment by cutting defense. Look for the French being more like homebodies.
    6 May 2012, 06:27 PM Reply Like
  • David Urban seems to be right. Latest headlines from Reuters and others say there is actually a good chance of a majority government being formed in Greece. Will take some horse-trading, but still possible.

    There is also talk that Hollande may bring Trichet back into the French government, which would be interesting, to say the least.

    Maybe Hollande is just what Europe needs, not the opposite.

    Many other leaders are coming around to the idea of a Eurobond because of Hollande. And his championship of a Tobin Tax is something many veterans of the Gold sector have wanted for years.

    A growth agenda could actually end up strengthening European markets very quickly - since markets are supposed to be six months ahead, not concurrent with what's happening now. It's the US which may have to catch up policy-wise, especially if BOTH the Europeans and the Chinese get their wish for a new crop of international ratings agencies independent of the US and UK. Something else Hollande may quickly push for.

    The one who is under real pressure right this moment is Obama.

    Again, markets reflect what WILL happen about six months from now. The Obama-ites need to push very, very hard against Worldwide Shorts United, who are now - whether because of actual political feelings or pure greed - pumping up the rhetoric for "austerity" in a ploy to boost Dollah! Dollah! Dollah! to levels which will hurt the stock market - which in turn harms consumer confidence and business confidence alike - increase the trade deficit again, harm manufacturing, and maybe tilt us back towards negative growth.

    Being talked into excessive fear of Oil is a bad, bad idea for the Obama-ites, just as it was a bad, bad idea for candidate McCain in 2008.

    Read my lips, Mr. Obama: Very few Americans care about gasoline prices when they go to the polls. We DO care about the stock market, home prices, job availability, and a general sense of hope among the populace.

    If there is any sign Worldwide Shorts United are determined to go overboard, the Obama-ites and Romney-ites alike should get their PPTs to BOOST Oil, BOOST Euro, BOOST Gold, BOOST pretty much everything that normally moves against Emperor Dollah! including the US banks.

    The biggest risk to the world is deflation, not inflation. And May to November is exactly the six-month lag of the Leading Indicators.
    6 May 2012, 06:38 PM Reply Like
  • "The Obama-ites need to push very, very hard against Worldwide Shorts United, who are now - whether because of actual political feelings or pure greed - pumping up the rhetoric for "austerity" in a ploy to boost Dollah! Dollah! Dollah! to levels which will hurt the stock market"..."If there is any sign Worldwide Shorts United are determined to go overboard, the Obama-ites and Romney-ites alike should get their PPTs to BOOST Oil, BOOST Euro, BOOST Gold, BOOST pretty much everything that normally moves against Emperor Dollah! including the US banks"..."The biggest risk to the world is deflation, not inflation"

    You sound like one mighty confused Liberal/Keynesian.
    6 May 2012, 07:16 PM Reply Like
  • Ven -

    You are correct.

    Too many commentators are focusing exclusively upon the percentages that each Party has attained in the current Greek election. With over 90% of the votes counted, New Democracy and PASOK together stand to win 150 of the 300 seats in the Greek Parliament – in other words, they only need the support of a very few from other Parties (the Ecologist Green Party comes to mind) to govern.

    See the following site for the results late on May 6th.

    http://bit.ly/wrBwMj
    6 May 2012, 09:24 PM Reply Like
  • The slow motion Euro train wreck just got a push.
    6 May 2012, 07:25 PM Reply Like
  • Europe's problem is not the austerity programs but the inability to correct structural imbalances.

    Ask yourself if Greece has corrected any of their lax tax collection efforts or other structural imbalances within the economy.

    If we try to change to a growth track without correcting the underlying structural problems watch out for gold. That may be the catalyst for the next leg up.

    The LTRO program has done nothing but allow the banks to get 1% loans and cycle the money right into sovereign debt. The money is not making it into the private sector.
    6 May 2012, 07:32 PM Reply Like
  • David you are so right, where is the house cleaning brigade for these wasteful govts.!
    6 May 2012, 09:13 PM Reply Like
  • Which means the Eurozone must split.
    7 May 2012, 12:11 AM Reply Like
  • Dividend_growth the question is when. I believe they will start going down hill during summer the ECB will face major pressure during the Olympics to keep things from getting worse. Than all bets are off.
    7 May 2012, 02:35 AM Reply Like
  • It's not just the tax collection, David. This crisis has been going on for years and the government has done nothing but implement painful cuts.

    It has made zero progress on privatizing, even though the government's participation in the economy is massive and would need to be drastically reduced in scope even without the current mess.

    One is sometimes tempted to think that only the most unpopular aspects of the reforms have been implemented in a deliberate effort to fuel popular rejection of the reforms, all to protect the "statist quo".
    7 May 2012, 09:51 AM Reply Like
  • Relia,

    I am not confused, and I am a Centrist, not a Liberal.

    Only 30 years ago, Supply-Side theories were equated with Voodoo.

    Pendulums swing. The pendulum worldwide is swinging back to an emphasis on growth at any cost.

    This may continue to be a tough market until after the US election. But too much emphasis on what is best for the very few has now clearly backfired in nearly every country except the US. The US is next, unless the Few do some serious soul-searching.

    One point to remember: We are only a few weeks from the start of the London Olympics. Incredibly dangerous for those Olympics to be held if we're in the midst of pan-European rioting, a la last year's Arab Spring. For that reason alone, the Europeans are going to want to calm and soothe their markets as soon as possible.

    And it would be extremely decent of the DOGs if they finally let the PM stocks lead the market for awhile. The group is at 900-year lows to the underlying metals. Many of these stocks are down 50 percent from their annual highs. If some bones have to be thrown to the Shorts, why can't they be from the carcasses of all those sickening high-fliers which made new highs since January?

    This hasn't just been an unfair market recently. It's been a malicious market - undoubtedly because it has been so thin, enabling the SACs of the world to bully literally at will with no one trying to stop them.
    6 May 2012, 10:38 PM Reply Like
  • Greece is most likely going to exit the EUR. It is way too small to force any changer in the EUR arrangements and the banks have taken most of the losses. The Troika will also have to take losses I assume but that can be postponed. One way Greece can exit the EUR is to allow them to print some local currency for liquidity purposes while keeping the EUR as well. Then they gradually start paying all bills, like pensions and salaries, in the new Drachma. Of course, the new Drachma will be a total disaster but what are the options.
    7 May 2012, 05:21 AM Reply Like
  • Why is global public debt unsustainable? Because the public has had to BUY all the toxic private debt to keep the world from collapsing into civil war.

    Private Debt created our crisis. And Private Debt is still the problem that keeps us from growing.

    http://seekingalpha.co...

    Read and see.
    7 May 2012, 05:52 AM Reply Like
  • Right on Michael. And a huge part of that private debt was speculative leverage or over consumption spending by the citizens and pitiful government oversight that allowed leverage by the banks over 100 to 1.
    7 May 2012, 08:44 AM Reply Like
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