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Nokia's (NOK) Lumia Windows Phone 8 devices are seeing post-Christmas discounts in the U.S. The...
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Thursday, December 27, 2012, 9:35 AM ETNokia's (NOK) Lumia Windows Phone 8 devices are seeing post-Christmas discounts in the U.S. The flagship Lumia 920 is available for $39 on Amazon with an AT&T contract, while the mid-range Lumia 822 is free with a Verizon contract. And T-Mobile is providing the Lumia 810 for free with a contract. It isn't clear if Nokia is bearing any of the cost. The black Lumia 920 is at #16 on Amazon's phone bestseller list. (China Unicom)
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This news story has 81 comments:
Abandoning the Smartphone business completely makes more sense than joining the Android flock.
I know a lot of people hate anything other than complete allegiance to the Nokia hype as if this were North Korea and Nokia was Kim Jung-Un but my caution on Nokia has helped people while the rah-rah Go Nokia drivel in 2010, 2011 and the first half of 2012 has lost people money so I can't be ashamed of helping people.
Now that Nokia has had a good run based on zero improvements in the profit picture the Nokia fans are telling people NOT to hedge their gains and to just double down.
So I will continue to help people and be proud of that while those who help people lose money in Nokia will continue to be shameless in their hype.
Bronze medal.
Yay!
Was it absurd for Samsung to adopt Android and vacuum up billions in profit that Nokia "intelligently" let slip through their fingers by kneeling down to Microsoft after they set fire to their own OS?
Your persistent comments NOK adopting Android may have been relevant about two years ago but that time has passed. Please desist.
Apple this Apple that, its a fact :P
And anyway, Samsung was one of the pioneers adopting Android, it didn't get in Android 2 years ago, like you suggested.
Again, you're comparing Apples to Lemons. Good luck with that kind of logic.
"I've always been right about Nokia since it was a $6 stock."
The below are noted again and posted again as a reminder. I think you have a lot to learn about fallibility.
Here are some of your gems from prior posts DVL from the time when Nokia was under $2. We have more than doubled our returns and you still claim you have not made a mistake in missing a 135% gain? If you can call it on the way down you should be able to call it on the way up. I had fun reading your posts, but I think you should avoid statements like the one above as you are not an investor. You believe that one should drive forward by monitoring your progress in the rear view mirror.
I will accept the fact that I invested too early in NOK, and as a result have suffered a huge loss until now. However, with your vision I think you will suffer many losses in the future. I am long msft, intc, glw, siri and nok, ko. I have heard what you were against, but never heard what you are for in specific investments.
7/18 posts when NOK was way under @2/share -- "Please point out where good news from Nokia has sent the stock price up for more than a day."
"No reasonable investor would buy and hold a stock with a horrific World Record market share collapse like Nokia."
"Listening to me and other truth-tellers has saved people a LOT of money and heartache. The Nokia pumpers CANNOT say that they have helped anyone." This coming when NOK was 1.70 a share and Apple was over $600/sh. Good investment advice DVL, you have made people a lot of money.
7/20 DVL post "On the point of death. Occurring at or connected with the time that someone dies." You are right, you never said bankrupt and you have always been right as you noted above!!!
7/21 DVL post--- "Isn't the current share price way, way too low for a stock that will be 3 or 4 dollars higher in the next few years?" Very good DVL. The NOK price was around $1.7 or so at that time. No you have never been wrong about Nokia.
Just note that I picked these posts in 3-4 days when the NOK share price was around $1.70. As our investment instructor you would have had us sell Nokia and invest in Apple. Yes, you are really good.
Looking at your posts I could not find a single post that had any redeeming value. Just remember that it is much easier to tear down a building then to build one. Had you become a bull sometime on or shortly after Nokia had the multi year lows then I would listen to what you and your kind have to say, but when you continue with the same exact sentiment as if nothing has changed in the company, the product or the market the past 6 months, then I say you are sadly lacking in your objectivity and analytical capability.
Add something thru this forum to make me think, but dont continually make generalized statements that have no redeeming value to those of us who want to try and get an edge on the future performance of a company by sharing information.
Replying to what I write proves that you care and are a little worried about your "investment" in Nokia.
On what basis would a stock move up another 33% if the company is not even turning a profit.
That is a recipe for a stock price collapse.
Where are the net revenues if the phones are so popular?
Please point out where I lost people money.
When the paid Nokia hype team was touting Nokia @ $5 where were you when people rode this puppy down to $1.76?
Where were your complaints then?
Now if Nokia falls back to $3 or even $2 will you (once again) go back to radio silence only to pop up when momo traders push this unprofitable company back to $4?
All the time people are taking to whine about those of us who haven't fallen for the hype and none of that time is used to point out where Nokia's profits went.
Tell me:
How can Nokia continue to defy gravity with many more quarters of losses to report?
Again...where are the profits to support the stock price?
1. Walmart is raising its prices on the Lumia 920.
http://bit.ly/YkWNYg
2. "The Wallstreet Journal" does not offer any possibility to comment on their articles.
3. Why is China Unicom mentioned at the end of this article?
.
I know you are short Nokia, but do please tell me what you are long on and why? You refused to answer my question before. Also, can you tell us what your portfolio looks like and your cost basis per stock so that we can become experts like you and compare our results with Nokia to yours?
One of the folks here provided a link to J. Templeton and his investment advice. I suggest you contemplate what he said "An investor who has all the answers doesn't even understand all the questions." I think Templeton has described you to a tee.
Why dont you go and spend your time to find a good stock for yourself? You just might learn the question if you spend a little more time reading and contemplating, rather than spewing nonsense.
p.s. I am not implying I am rich.
Lost count of the # of times I wanted to Dislike a post, but could not!
every day i see good news for Nokia
they win RIMM lawsuit, apple pays royalties, Nokia siemens gets new contracts, MS pays 1 billion a year to just use MS OS, Lumia sells outs, asha phones are selling better than expected, nokia maps going into car GPS, Nokia closes plants and cuts cost to save millions, 12 billion cash barrell, swiss pension funds invest millions in nokia, short ratio declining, GS buying millions, now they are making a tablet that to compete with ipad....this is the buy of a lifetime!!!
Serious DVL- what else could you expect- i now know 6 eople that use LUMIA 920 and 900, 6 months ago didnt know any..very good start
Please calm down. It is not my fault Nokia lost 18% in 2012. People love Apple and Samsung.
That isn't my fault.
People love Lumia 920 too
http://bit.ly/Rljcap
This is interesting as well, Verizon raised Lumia 822 price and the device now appears on top sellers list. Especially worth noting the text:
"Now, on checking it seems Bestbuy is selling iPhone 5 at $50 discount and Lumia 920 without discount. Also at Amazon, SGS III is going for $59 with a huge discount of $149 over the carrier price"
http://bit.ly/UxdjXa
Also, Amazon China raised Lumia 920T price by 200 Yuan, even though it has been on sale just a couple of weeks
http://bit.ly/YWxb93
WSJ, what are your unbias journalists writing now?
Lack of confidence = a desire for an "ignore" feature.
Confidence = Not caring if there are 10,000 negative comments about a stock you own.
That is why I haven't lost money in Nokia. I am not a cult member. I am an investor.
Nokia is down 18% this year.
Boy, am I glad I've learned how to buy stocks in calendar days other than January 1st. I never understood that strategy of buying stocks on January 1st only... You know the markets are open all year long, right? Why limit yourself to a single day?
I don't care for that, DVL... and neither should you. Forget January 1st, you seem obsessed with that date for some strange reason.
My pre-planned entry at $2.37 a share for NOK is working just fine, even though the stock is down since January 1st. So why bother so much with that? Just because CNN and Reuters like to show Year-To-Date graphs on their shows, it doesn't mean we all have to buy stocks on January 1st and let them ride.
I hope that the Lumia line gains some momentum and gives Nokia some profit boost, but I didn't bet on that single event.
Just like Apple isn't iPhone...Nokia is way more than Lumia 920.
Why the need to focus so much on Nokia Lumia 920 alone?
Nokia has 3 big segments, 2 are profitable... one isn't (and can be killed at any time.) Why not trading accordingly?
I am glad you havent lost money in Nokia. I wish your investments well in 2013.
As for us cult like Nokia investors we will just keep throwing money into the value trap you call Nokia for 2013 :P
just by looking at the number of comments you posted 4187! and without reading any of them...it is clear that you are using this platform to manipulate the stock value so that you can benefit!
The stock is at $4.05 today and it will hit the $6 mark that you indicated in few weeks and not in $5 years!
and how is this bad news for Nokia... so far I had 7 I phones send to me and family over the last few years from AT&T and they where all free! how is that bad business for Apple? of course the phone companies pay for the phones( at a discount because of the high volume purchase) in return for a one year or two year contract.
wake up and do not follow the herd of sheep mentality!
dont be fooled to thinking DVL has that much cred on one website in the entire www that he alone can move anything...
4000 comments on SA does not equal price movement it just means he spends a lot of time commenting here...
Nokia in all of its blazing upward price movement couldn't even match its 2012 high!
So let's not go crazy with talk of $6 per share in a few weeks. :)
The black Lumia 920 is still number 3 seller on Amazon's AT&T list, and the red one is sold out.
Of course it is true that the pricing does not indicate that demand exceeds supply, but it is not necessarily the case that the current discounts indicate that surplus stock of phones is being dumped either.
It looks like you haven't drank the Kool-Aid!
Apple doesn't need to cut prices.
Increased sales = increased prices
Decreasing sales = decreasing prices
There are many reports coming all around the world about the i-Phone being bent by just sitting on it. Kool -Aid you said.
http://bit.ly/Ub7Npv
http://bit.ly/TCPfDG
http://bit.ly/Yl46Pz
why?
you just have to experience it in person,
faster OS
bigger screen
GPS
Yellow color
i wear gloves all winter
Live tiles are exciting
awesome camera
dont need case
THey get royalty fees from the phone companies every time a customer signs a contract with ATT&T or Verizon... it is good business and that is what Apple is doing.
http://bit.ly/V6XF2g
Listed is net salary in dollars.
Average salary in Portugal: €787
Do you really believe this represents the reality of an average Portuguese family!? As far as i know, a net income of €787 per month would feel like a dream to most people here, that I can assure you.
Those statistical averages are always inflated by the few % of people earning (or stealing) millions while others keep the pennies.
But if you have any doubts, why don't you come here and do a little survey!?
Facts are available - search for income: http://bit.ly/Rl2yat
Since you seem to have completely failed to grasp my point, here's a small example:
Population = 100
If 99 people are making $100 a month and a single person earns €50 000 a month... on average, each person earns €599 a month.
Statistical averages are the simplest way to make a lie appear as a truth...
A person from lets say Croatia could move to the UK, but dont expect that person to be making what a average brit would make.
I recently read this article about a greek trying to find work in Sweden. http://buswk.co/UwmVBr.
So while in theory if you do not like what you make in lets say Slovakia and would like to move to holland to make more, in reality you would only be treated as a second class citizen there.
Presumably it is better to have the option than not - what would you propose instead?
Average salary in Portugal: €787
The average worker in Portugal earns a lot less than €787 a month. Please stop confusing the 2 things.
A Nokia 920 is very expensive for most people here and if you don't believe it, book your next holidays to Portugal to check with your own eyes...
Germany having biggest population 80m+ has average salary per person 2800e+.
I do not think you would use Alabama average salary to represent USA average salary either.
And as a last point, while on can say 1000$ phone is expensive, USA pays more than 1800$ per two years:
http://huff.to/W4sXW7
As monopolies are no longer in EU telecom, one can enjoy much cheaper total cost for any phone in most European countries.
I don't doubt that a Nokia 920 is very expensive for most people in Portugal and I wouldn't expect an 'average worker' to buy one. It's a flagship phone, and Nokia make phones at all price levels from €20 to €600+.
However, your first post said: "Meanwhile, if you're in Europe and you really, really want a 920, you must pay €700... which is way more than an average European earns in a month." This was clearly incorrect; QED.
And just because you cannot admit you misinterpreted my initial post, you keep on pushing and pushing, constantly twisting my words... and as a result of your attitude, we are now discussing semantics!?
Jeez, I give up. You're on the verge of trolling and nothing positive will ever come out of such discussion. We're both wasting our time here. Bye.
So you didn't write this? http://seekingalpha.co...
I won't bother explaining again. I know what I meant but you still don't get it.
Sincerely, if you don't want to understand, so be it. It's your own right... but why do you keep insisting!? Are you trying to increase your Troll status or something like that!? I don't see the point.
OK, I get you. When you're proven wrong, you get upset and counter-attack by trolling. While that might be funny on some forums, here it's just... distracting. Well, you can stop now. OK?
Can we please get back to the point being discussed before? I believe it was the 920 pricing and discounts in America.
--------- // ---------
In Europe, the discounts are nowhere near those values. I believe Nokia will have higher profit margins but less sales in Europe.
The discount strategy seems to be the way to get Americans interested in an alternative to Android and iOS. I think they are intentionally lowering the prices to conquer some market. It makes sense in order to gain some momentum.
The prices are not discounted in US, they are subsidised. Total cost of ownership is higher in US than EU.
..Average refers to a number, not a physical person. The correct way of saying what you want to say is: "Most (or the majority of) Europeans earn less than €700 per month"
The hardware and OS have been getting great reviews, and features like wireless charging and a great camera do set it apart.
The knock against Windows Phone is the lack of apps, but for most users, the 80/20 rule applies here.
I mean seriously, iOS and Android outnumber Windows phone in sheer number of apps, but do you really need 10 different versions of things like Flashlight?
Microsoft has really deep pockets, and they will find the 20% of apps that 80% of people use, and if there isn't one there, they will simply hire someone to make it.
You will see this app chasm close pretty fast.
Long Wintel
(In some countries like Portugal, Greece, Spain... €700 is more or less the income of many couples.)
List of Countries in Europe by monthly average wage...
Here's a small example:
Population = 100
If 99 people are making $100 a month and a single person earns €50 000 a month... on average, each person earns €599 a month.
Statistical averages are the easiest tool available for governments to hide the truth.
Damn averages.
I'll be giving my wife the 822 when Verizon gets the 920 or its successor. These phone are the best out there and its a shame more people don't know that.
If they profit from the phone business, perfect.
If not, they should just kill it once and for all.
In either case, NOK is worth more than $4 a share.
I am seriously thinking about getting out of the American market. There is way to much fear mongering, ignorance and manipulation. Learn to think people.
well the Amazon chart is changing on hourly basis, Lumia 920 now at #14, the best AT&T device is #10.
Top spot goes to Verizon SGS3 with price tag of $59.99, which probably means Samsung is in deep trouble because of huge discount, right Seeking Alpha?