Forget Herbalife. ViSalus is maybe a more impressive legal pyramid scheme and its majority-owner...

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bgold1955 Comments (948)
 
This Herbalife thing is an example of stock manipulation at it's worst and right smack in front of investors. Why does one have a 4 hour presentation to blast a business model, company has been around a long time, while he is short? One reason, to make money. As an investor, you have the right to be or not to be a shareholder. My preference is there should be regulations that prevent such manipulation. If the business model is a fraudulent one, regulators should be involved to resolve the situation. Not a hedge fund dude.

Full disclosure - never have been and never will be a shareholder of Herbalife.
13 Jan, 11:28 AM Reply Like

losbronces Comments (387)
 
I have no problem with someone making this type of presentation. It adds to the discussion of the merits of the company. Libel laws protect against outright fabrications.

The performance of regulators in terms of catching frauds has not been very good over the entire history of the SEC. Many big frauds have been perpetrated for a long time. And when frauds are caught, its too late for the investors. So if someone wants to point out potential issues, more power to them. Even if they profit from those actions.

People forget that Enron received praise from Alan Greenspan when he was still Fed Chairman as a model of the "new economy." Detractors were villified until the thing came undone.
13 Jan, 01:05 PM Reply Like

deercreekvols Comments (2933)
 
At what point does something like this become manipulation?

Does it take Goldman Sachs tabbing Nokia as a "sell" while buying over 60M shares since Q2 to be considered manipulation? They have made hundreds of millions on that buy. Anyone who believed their "sell" rating missed out on the NOK jump. Is this ethical? Is it legal? Why is it legal?

Where is the line that can not be crossed? The SEC refuses to draw a line in the sand.
13 Jan, 01:48 PM Reply Like

bgold1955 Comments (948)
 
As an investor, today you have as much corporate data to analyze as ever. If you don't like the data, don't buy the stock. If you don't analyze, your fault. Don't need a hedge fund dude doing what he did in this situation.

As far a regulators, past failures should enhance future processes. Failure is no excuse not to improve.
13 Jan, 01:48 PM Reply Like

bgold1955 Comments (948)
 
Based on the dude's reputation and popularity amongst the big boys, he was able to create a monetary advantage for his position at the expense of existing shareholders. That, my friend, is manipulation and should be investigated. It's time to begin to even the bar a bit.

Do you think you or I could have done the same with the same results?
13 Jan, 02:01 PM Reply Like

1980XLS-2.0 Comments (526)
 
Regulators did not take down Enron.

It required shortsellers.

Just as many people in the investment community knew full well Madoff was a scam, the "regulators," looked the other way.

How many regulators were fired, fined, imprisoned, or stripped of their severance or pensions?

Anybody that takes the competence and accountability of Gov't officials for granted, will lose.

Govwenment takes care of itself, nobody else.


Ever try to get a tenured, union, public school teacher fired?

And even if you could, get their pension and deny severance and/or unemployment benefits?
13 Jan, 03:33 PM Reply Like

mike8599 Comments (559)
 
Ackman should be punished for this - particularly if he was shorting, and company has been legit for 32 years.

If you are an investor in Herbalife or any thing else, Ackman gets to act like god over your investments. He needs to do what every other finance firm does and lower your rating.
13 Jan, 04:51 PM Reply Like