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  • I would like to thank Daylight Saving (no S!) Time for this Victory.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:23 AM Reply Like
  • me, too!
    10 Mar 2013, 09:28 AM Reply Like
  • Only wish I didn't have a weekend of comments to go through.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:29 AM Reply Like
  • You guys are really fast, but I'll settle for third.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:35 AM Reply Like
  • Four: I am here with AXPW.-Carlos
    10 Mar 2013, 09:52 AM Reply Like
  • If the NS-999 is seen rolled out on Monday, do you think the stock will spike up then fall again (like the ePower announcement), start a steady rise or remain as it is until the refinancing is behind us?
    10 Mar 2013, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • Roll out is just the start ... it needs to stay out at the least longer than the original. It will be interesting to see what PRs comes out of NS, and how long it takes to get them. NS-999 rolling really won't be "news" to us, and I'm not sure NS will publicize it or even allow Axion to trumpet it anytime soon, so I don't see a lot of new investors coming "on board" anytime soon.


    I think our best bet for gradual stock improvement will be the earnings call and the quarterly report. Seeing a continued sales ramp would help a lot, in that all the NDAs may prevent details, but we may be able to gauge a continued ramp in interest.


    I think the biggest move would come from


    1) one of our import sleuths identifying fleet sized testing quantities to BMW and/or Asia, or


    2) someone well known in the truck APU market issuing a PR lauding us that will be seen my many investors that haven't heard of Axion, or


    3) a strategic alliance with someone big and unexpected, like Schneider Electric (who ZBB seems to have found) that gets "big boy" sales team in most any door and with easier project financing. Dynapower might be another possibility ... they're claiming to be a lot bigger than I realized:


    "Dynapower is the market leader in Grid Tied Power Electronics for Energy Storage applications providing more than 50% of the installed power in the US market. In 2013 Dynapower will continue to add to its international installed base of energy storage inverters servicing a variety of customers from utilities to renewable energy integrators and private commercial customers."



    They've also been bought in the last year, presumably by a larger more well funded organization, that certainly not in the Big Boy Public Company league.


    Another possibility: EaglePicher as I mentioned in the previous APC. That would be helpful, but not a major stock mover, though EP is part of a fair sized conglomerate that may be better known in the "right circles" than many of us realize.


    I'm still hopeful for East Penn, but I don't see that happening till we get news for at least one of BMW, the Asian car firm, or NSC. I think we'll get a sale to NSC this year for ONE OTR unit, but that real world testing will try our patience once again.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:47 AM Reply Like
  • Morning everyone!!


    I have a question:


    Who will come first: APU or NS999 with PbC?


    Have a nice day-Carlos
    10 Mar 2013, 10:35 AM Reply Like
  • Carlos, NS999 has the highest probability IMO. They are working on it.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:45 AM Reply Like
  • Agree highest probability of SEEING NS-999 first. But as in my just now published comment above, I think the APU announcement will have a bigger impact on stock price in say the next 5 months.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:50 AM Reply Like
  • I'm pretty sure that APUs are already being tested under NDAs. We should hear word in the next CC, although Tom probably won't be able to give much detail on testing partners and expected timing.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:57 AM Reply Like
  • Morning Mr. John!!


    Excuse me, that means: NDAs


    10 Mar 2013, 11:00 AM Reply Like
  • Carlos, NDA's are "non disclosure agreements". In the industry this means that there is a contract signed by both parties limiting the information that can be shared in the public domain. In the case of automotive it is generally agreed that no information would be shared. They do this in an attempt to shield their future product plans to gain market advantage.
    10 Mar 2013, 11:20 AM Reply Like
  • Non-disclosure agreements. Every time Axion begins a development project the OEM insists on an NDA that limits Axion's ability to speak publicly about the work that's being done and the results that are being achieved. They're a monumental pain because it limits Axion's ability to make press releases and engage in other PR activity, but they've been part of the small company landscape for as long as I've been a lawyer.
    10 Mar 2013, 11:22 AM Reply Like
  • Carlos, Probably more than you wish to know but here is the Wiki page on NDA's.

    10 Mar 2013, 11:28 AM Reply Like
  • So in your opinion the only thing we can do is sit idle and wait until all testing is done and Axion has the clear signal to make PR?
    10 Mar 2013, 12:28 PM Reply Like
  • Amoura, All we can do is use various tools to snoop around to assess how things are going directionally. Any formal status updates are controlled by the agreements that have been signed between NSC and Axion. Failure to bide by these formal agreements can cause issues.
    10 Mar 2013, 01:07 PM Reply Like
  • II
    I think you need to be careful with his her name
    It's Amouna not Amoura


    Urban Dictionary: amoura
    A beautiful and sensuous girl. Exotic, mysterious, and raven haired with cherry red lips.


    Baby Names
    The meaning of the name Amoura is Love


    The origin of the name Amoura is American


    Notes: From the French word "Amour" which means love


    So unless you're trying to tell us something....... ;-)
    10 Mar 2013, 10:12 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco:


    Thanks and have a nice week-Carlos.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:47 AM Reply Like
  • You as well Carlos.


    It's nice here today. 51 degrees F (10.5 degrees C).
    10 Mar 2013, 01:09 PM Reply Like
  • Nicer here - 72º F with an expected high of 79º
    10 Mar 2013, 01:13 PM Reply Like
  • I just knew someone was going to "rub it in".


    Well, I bet you can't point out your more moderate temperature while having a snowball fight! ;)
    10 Mar 2013, 01:25 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco.


    Today I was here:


    Is a nice pleace, near from my city. Armenia, Quindio.


    10 Mar 2013, 04:54 PM Reply Like
  • It's gorgeous country Carlos.
    10 Mar 2013, 04:55 PM Reply Like
  • Ahhhh Carlos, Very nice! I'm sure you are relaxed and in a better state of mind after a nice walk there!


    But alas, No snow balls! :)


    Enjoy the rest of your weekend.
    10 Mar 2013, 04:59 PM Reply Like
  • The palm is called "Palma de Cera":



    The wax palm grows up to 50 meters (160 ft) (rarely to 60 meters (200 ft)) tall in good growing conditions and is not only the tallest palm but the tallest monocot in the world.
    10 Mar 2013, 06:41 PM Reply Like
  • Small things that make big differences.


    Thanks to both of you for the answer.-Carlos
    10 Mar 2013, 11:32 AM Reply Like
  • Followers = Concentrators. 216.
    10 Mar 2013, 12:03 PM Reply Like
  • Well, if the "religious wars" continue unabated here there'll be one less.


    10 Mar 2013, 12:25 PM Reply Like
  • What was that old saw about the camel getting his nose in the tent?
    10 Mar 2013, 12:30 PM Reply Like
  • I'd not heard it.


    The Camel's Nose In The Tent.

    HTL, I'm hoping that it'll blow over. I know I am guilty of adding my share of distractions and bias so I'm sure not going to point around. Hate to lose any of the talent that contributes here.
    10 Mar 2013, 01:20 PM Reply Like
  • FWIW, my AVG says this link is a threat.
    10 Mar 2013, 01:29 PM Reply Like
  • User 46, Thanks for the caution.
    10 Mar 2013, 02:11 PM Reply Like
  • From a truck innovation article iinde posted on the last Concentrator:


    "...Ryder and Penske Truck Leasing. They own 40% of the trucks in the United States."


    Wow, I had no idea those two were that big. I just figured the whole industry was fragmented. Just think if ePower were to get either one of those guys eventually...the whole industry would be forced to keep pace.


    I don't know who Vani introduced them to, but I can dream big if I want to...

    10 Mar 2013, 12:32 PM Reply Like
  • Mr. I, I was wondering if anyone besides myself had their lower jaw hit their chest on that data point. Talk about purchasing power and industry control. Watch what these guys are doing and you'll get a sense on what many of the other players will be forced to do to keep up.
    10 Mar 2013, 01:13 PM Reply Like
  • GE Races Caterpillar on LNG Trains to Curb Buffett Cost

    10 Mar 2013, 01:03 PM Reply Like
  • >iindelco ... I wonder if the BNSF will use the same units they tested dual fuel & LNG with back in 2002-4 when the price of NG was just about the same as it is today. What has changed ... except the need to sell something?
    10 Mar 2013, 01:13 PM Reply Like
  • Iindelco: I suspect DRichs's, IIRC, comments about NG (although I think it was CNG) might apply. LNG plants generraly take multiple years and multiple billions(?) to build from scratch. I don't know what infra-structure is required to get it where it can be disbursed for consumption, but I suspect the pipelines couldn't be effectively used because of the temperature of the liquid and lack of insulation.


    That suggests either co-located plants (likely impractical in most cases?), truck (quantities too small) or rail tankers.


    By the time all costs are in, may not benefit that much.


    Moreover, it's not going to be that much cheaper when the plants already permitted, with dozens more seeking permitting ATM, start producing as the customers are overseas where NG is priced in a relationship to oil, which is predominately Brent crude. SO the price here will "migrate" towards what the exporters can get.


    IMO, this push is a capitulation to the popular mantra of the day without considering what's going on already and the likely outcomes a bit down the road. Even allowing for increased output by the E&P companies as prices rise, they'll be less likely to make the mistake again of significant oversupply that will again depress prices.


    I *believe* NSC has the most likely sustainable and cost effective path forward with the effort to capture and use the kinetic energy of the rolling stock.


    Profit-wise, for an equivalent amount of capex, track miles, ton-miles, ... NSC will end up eating BNSF's lunch if BNSF commits to this path in a big way.


    10 Mar 2013, 01:18 PM Reply Like
  • DRich, I know you're are far more well read in this area than I. I do have to wonder if the primary issues are economic, safety or technological. I can't imagine the technology of the locomotive turning the NG into mechanical force is insurmountable. The rest I can't speak to.


    I did read the report about the poor job that was done as a trial on a yard loco in Long Beach. Most of what I saw there was resolvable IMO.
    10 Mar 2013, 01:57 PM Reply Like
  • HTL, Understand your points.


    Do you know if Congress has approved LNG for export yet. Some of this can be posturing to impact that decision. If you start looking at 10-15 year time frame where this makes sense economically you sure would like assurances that you're not going to spend tens of millions of dollars to develop this just to have your less expensive fuel source revert to world pricing.


    I agree with your thoughts on NSC and the further electrification of the locomotive consist. If the batteries will hold up carrying a bigger storage unit in the right terrain will pay off. Might not make sense for all the rail lines though.
    10 Mar 2013, 02:04 PM Reply Like
  • Iindelco: Sabine Pass import terminal has already been approved for conversion to allow export, - might be others, I've not been tracking closely since my last published article years ago.


    Since we don't have anything I would call a comprehensive energy policy, I don't see anything stopping the lobbyists from getting approvals pushed through so the majors, which have now decided to enter the market, can achieve their goals.


    Assuming it goes the way most things do, we'll take our most valuable resource(s) and sell them in the name of profits, balance of payments considerations, etc.


    It won't matter how much benefit could be obtained if we carefully husbanded this resource. On-shoring of jobs is reputed to be benefit already being seen due to low NG prices and there's others anticipated that would be WOT here.


    10 Mar 2013, 02:14 PM Reply Like
  • Thanks HTL, I share your thoughts of concern. I also thing it will end up being used to support immediate concentrated profits vs macroscopic advantage. No real energy policy so why not.
    10 Mar 2013, 02:41 PM Reply Like
  • >iindelco ... There is no doubt LNG/NG technology can be turned into mechanical energy for the rails. The big issues are: (all quotes are from linked)


    1) Logistics - these locos need to be refueled more often. They require more specialized equipment & personnel. Fire codes restrict storage/fueling location, operation procedures & transit routes.


    2) Fueling - About 72 gal per day of diesel equivalent is lost from boil-off. It is cheaper to fuel per gallon than diesel because of the bulk pricing it only delivers 65% of the power per gallon thus using more gallons.


    " ... support of natural gas-fueled locomotives will require significant investments in new fueling infrastructure that are duplicative to established diesel based infrastructure. These infrastructure investments and their associated operating costs must be accounted for."


    3) Pollutants - Even as NG burns cleaner, it doesn't explode cleanly.


    " ... When the same emissions data are compared to emission results from modern locomotive engines certified to EPA Tier 2 locomotive standards, there is no NOx benefit from the ECI kit.


    All other criteria pollutant emissions are increased including particulate emissions which are four to five times higher (see Figure 14). Furthermore, the large methane emissions with gas fueling cause an increase in greenhouse gases, compared to operation with diesel fuel on the same locomotive. In addition, there is also a decrease in efficiency when the converted locomotive is switched from diesel fuel to natural gas. Although no data are available on toxic air contaminant emissions from a locomotive using the ECI kit, data on bus engines without exhaust after-treatment indicate that a locomotive using the ECI kit will likely have higher emissions of these species, especially formaldehyde "


    The pollutants being referred to are
    Acetaldehyde 2.7 mg/mi (Low Emission Diesel) 24 mg/mi (CNG Engine)
    Acrolein 0.45 mg/mi (LED) 4.9 mg/mi (CNG)
    Benzene Not Detected (LED) 4.3 mg/mi (CNG)
    1,3-Butadiene 1.3 mg/mi (LED 4.5 mg/mi (CNG)
    Formaldehyde 5.2 mg/mi (LED) 500 mg/mi (CNG)


    I guess we should thank God the CO2 is lower.



    These same findings were verified by BNSF testing as recently as 2009 & 2011.


    I am a fan of using NG for fuel but color me skeptical for use as a widespread general use transportation fuel. It could make sense where oil fuels are at or above $7-00 - $8.00 per gallon and an understanding of the air pollution that come with it. Yet there is evidence that smaller engines can be made to run much cleaner in nearly all categories ... but I don't pay that much attention to autos and the jury is still out on trucks/buses depending on engine size. I can tell you there is a lot of hype to sift through and with time technology might prove it possible and I'll change my skeptical opinion.
    10 Mar 2013, 03:04 PM Reply Like
  • HTL and all: Who is supposed to develop and promulgate this wonderful "comprehensive energy policy"? The DOE? A Brand New federal agency? An "impartial" group of experts picked by pols?


    How do "they" enforce the "policy"? I assume with fedgov laws that not so gently persuade those with investment money and ideas to go in directions decided by a committee! How has that worked out in the past? Remember the fedgov laws about "new" and "old" natural gas in the late 70s and 80s?


    Are you guys serious? Why would a shale oil/gas energy policy be anything more then another boondoggle that benefits favored businesses who donate money to the "right causes"?


    I sincerely hope that Congress stays deadlocked on anything resembling "comprehensive energy policy". For the good of the USA and those who understand WTF they are doing! Spare me from all government diddling with anything as important as "energy policy".
    10 Mar 2013, 03:14 PM Reply Like
  • >iindelco ... Allow me to just add an aside that as a fuel, Compressed Natural Gas can make good sense if properly applied. LNG not so much. That said if a person were to understand the limitations of NG/LNG as transportation fuel as well as where the "Real" markets are to be found there is a lot of money to be made trading in these stocks over the next 5 years. Bubble economics.
    10 Mar 2013, 03:35 PM Reply Like
  • The birth of another Hype Cycle is upon us.


    I guess we now have an answer to John German's immortal question about the next Technology du Jour

    10 Mar 2013, 03:46 PM Reply Like
  • >JP ... My vote for the correct answer is " ... the world is being run by smart and cynical ideologues" because there is no shortage of folks willing to believe whatever hype is put in front of them, though it might take some repeating to get cooperation.
    10 Mar 2013, 04:19 PM Reply Like
  • I tend to agree with your assessment DR, but I really want to believe that I'm not alone in trying to have principles and live by them, regardless of whether they're popular.
    10 Mar 2013, 04:24 PM Reply Like
  • DRich, Thanks for the education concerning LNG/CNG.


    So lower CO2. GREAT. We should run with it. Big <snark>. Ughh
    10 Mar 2013, 04:26 PM Reply Like
  • SHB: My comments about "policy" make an assumption that there is indeed some "intelligence" inside the beltway that is not corrupt ... yet. And that someday the true "work of the people" will arise from the ashes. Very naive I know.


    Government has in the past done some good things and it's not unthinkable that might happen again in the future. 'Course I'll be long gone when it happens.


    But one thing is for certain - business will not, of it's own volition, do anything for the benefit of other than it's bottom-line, currently anyway. Since that's the purpose of business, I'm not suggesting that should change, but that another organization should.


    10 Mar 2013, 06:09 PM Reply Like
  • But one thing is for certain - business will not, of it's own volition, do anything for the benefit of other than it's bottom-line, currently anyway
    HTL, you got right ! and I bet you in the next 10 years that Nat Gas is priced based on global pricing.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:41 PM Reply Like
  • Turning NG into LNG and then shipping it across the ocean is awful costly. So even if the global price is $10 or $15, the domestic price will be far lower because of avoided compression and transportation costs.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:50 PM Reply Like
  • >JP ... Quite correct transmission line pressure NG will be delivered to industrial customers at about $1.50 to $2.00 above wellhead (presently $3.35 mcf). Then add in the cost of re-compressing, if required and most of the time it is. Then remember that unit of NG is only 75% equivalent to diesel so you'd best have a highly efficient engine to breakeven. I just feel there is something wrong thinking NG is best used running engines than to heat homes, make electricity, chemicals, plastics, fertilizer, etc.


    Kinda driving myself a little nutty wondering where I've got this NG/LNG as economically cheap transport fuel supposition so wrong. Is it the same metric when NG is $6.00 mcf?
    10 Mar 2013, 11:10 PM Reply Like
  • I could maybe see LNG ships with natgas-fired saturated steam plants for propulsion (using some of the organic payload gas as fuel, including the evap) as perhaps one way to bring transocean shipping costs down..
    10 Mar 2013, 11:22 PM Reply Like
  • John: Depending on who/when you read, IIRC, the historical energy equivalent cost of NG to oil was used and ran somewhere around 6:1, 8:1, ... I would expect pricing to migrate (the same word I used earlier) towards that over time. As you mention, I don't think it would hit it, for the reasons you mention. But I do believe it's the production side that will help the migration - the E & P folks won't make the same mistake twice? And there's always "consolidation" going on too.


    11 Mar 2013, 06:55 AM Reply Like
  • DRich: I think it's the energy independence Boone Pickens has been touting as the reason to switch transport to NG. He makes a strong case for it, in terms of not sending money to potential enemies, among others.


    I believe he is invested in the sector, so there might be a bias. Nevertheless, he offers some useful considerations that might justify the use of the "less green" NG.


    11 Mar 2013, 07:02 AM Reply Like
  • In my limited and ancient experience, the producer's price is always based on distribution hub price reduced by the costs of compression, transportation and shrinkage between the field and the hub. The longer the supply chain is, the less the producer gets.
    11 Mar 2013, 07:08 AM Reply Like
  • For my friends –


    It's a great investment of 3-1/2 minutes
    10 Mar 2013, 01:19 PM Reply Like
  • Muchas Gracias-Carlos
    10 Mar 2013, 06:23 PM Reply Like
  • It's way late in the day, but my newest article was just published. This one is very information dense and will take some time to read and understand. I would not save it for something to read on the run.

    10 Mar 2013, 07:43 PM Reply Like
  • ha! Sometimes a watched kettle *does* boil! ;)


    Uh, on first perusal... good thing I packed a lunch! many thanks John..
    10 Mar 2013, 07:45 PM Reply Like
  • It is worth understanding, so take your time and enjoy.
    10 Mar 2013, 07:57 PM Reply Like
  • Great!
    10 Mar 2013, 07:59 PM Reply Like
  • I'm wondering if anyone else has gotten a PM (Private Message)
    That possibly suggested that they might be being attacked, pushed around, dissed etc. It would likely be subtle.
    (Probably it would be from a relatively new person.)


    I did a bit back and I am wondering if someone is trying to foment discord, on the board?
    10 Mar 2013, 08:44 PM Reply Like
  • >froggey77 ... Long ago, pre-Concentrator, I got a PM from person that thought I answered their post in a disrespectful way. I went back and re-read the comment and figured they were a psychopath, a troll or both. The name has change a few times but it would be familiar to most. I think (but I'm not a good judge of my own behavior) the only person I blew up on was Mayascribe.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:28 PM Reply Like
  • Froggey77: If they're suggesting something behind-the-curtain, possibly via PMs, I would be suspicious. From what I've seen here, most of the folks would be open and honest about things and wouldn't engage in such back-room behavior.


    But I'm maybe too trusting.


    10 Mar 2013, 09:37 PM Reply Like
  • Nothing here. But thanks for the warning.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:38 PM Reply Like
  • DR
    This was more of an I want, you and him to fight. But I'm behind you buddy. (and could be sending the same message to the other guy)


    It happened about a month ago.
    I got a post I considered as possibly inciting me to respond in a more harsh manner than I normally would. As it wasn't overt I couldn't be sure and I haven't named anyone in case that was not the intent.
    Maybe it's nothing, If no one else has been approached it's not happening.


    However since then things have been more rancorous than usual in the last few weeks.
    As silence, would be the friend, of some one trying to do this.
    I decided to ask.
    10 Mar 2013, 09:54 PM Reply Like
  • >froggy77 ... Harsh response is fine with me as long as it's factual, informative & referenced and doesn't wander too far afield. There is ample OT & closely related idiocy out there, particularly in the article comments stream, to warrant an intellectually abrasive retort and doesn't need get personal. But mostly it's a waste of your time. A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still and then there are the one's that make money being intransigent.
    10 Mar 2013, 10:16 PM Reply Like
  • Here's a nice companion to JP's new article from Bjorn Lomborg in the WSJ:


    "The electric car might be great in a couple of decades but as a way to tackle global warming now it does virtually nothing. The real challenge is to get green energy that is cheaper than fossil fuels. That requires heavy investment in green research and development. Spending instead on subsidizing electric cars is putting the cart before the horse, and an inconvenient and expensive cart at that."
    10 Mar 2013, 10:56 PM Reply Like
  • Good find Renzo, and you're right, together the two articles are a "must read". For ISTM the BIG DREAM that has captured the imaginations of so many believers (and this includes many good hearted people) is this:


    (and it is VERY seductive and powerful, appearing to be *such* a no-brainer)


    Electric cars + solar power = freedom from oil + no CO2


    Yet therein lies several *major* fallacies.
    10 Mar 2013, 11:33 PM Reply Like
  • As a nice example of the mentality I was attempting to address, I offer as Exhibit A this verbatim quote comment by vile sockpuppet (named vjayjbob or something) on John's latest article:


    "Wow you finally admitted you work for the oil and gas industry.


    Its time to get out of the way and make room for new technologies such as solar, wind, non gmo and yes electric cars.


    Oil and gas are killing our world, and now I see you are part of the problem.


    Try making an end to end comparison for oil and coal. Also include the huge military budget required to keep oil at our low low prices and the cost of human death and suffering. I doubt you will. You are pure evil."


    A great many people are so seized by this appealing paradigm of a future of uber-clean solar-powered electric cars that are going to save our world from oil. It's become a very powerful and still entrenched notion, one that's very easy (and nice) to believe, and one that drove a lot of policy and mal-investment (govt, institution, business, and individual) in recent years. Very familiar to everyone here. And I think it's going to die hard. John has been a voice of sanity crying in the wilderness, and has long been at it. But even though more seem to be starting to listen, clearly his work is far from done...
    11 Mar 2013, 05:55 AM Reply Like
  • I have decided to stop reading these concentrators because I find the political trolls who frequent this board more annoying than I am willing to endure.


    I've been coming here for information about energy storage technologies, applications, and markets, not to argue about politics. But if did want to discuss politics, I certainly would not choose individuals as proud of their ignorance as the individuals who make political statements here are to debate.


    I can't take responsibility for educating people who know basically nothing about the subjects they choose to vent about, so good-byte, folks. I hope you read some books about the issues that seem to interest you.


    Good luck with your investments in Axion.
    10 Mar 2013, 11:38 PM Reply Like
  • Well, that's a shame bill. Diversity of thought is a good thing. I think it's an inevitable part of human nature to want to champion one's own views. We all want to, and it's just something to be managed. Yours will be missed though...
    10 Mar 2013, 11:49 PM Reply Like
  • billa,
    Not sure what political trolls you refer to. We have people from all the political spectrums here. Most of the time the political talk is about how it affects investment, tho sometimes it does go a little OT and restraint is usually respectfully requested.
    11 Mar 2013, 12:29 AM Reply Like
  • Ignorance is often in the eye of the beholder.
    11 Mar 2013, 01:28 AM Reply Like
  • Sorry to see you go Billa. -- Take care.
    11 Mar 2013, 02:31 AM Reply Like
  • I will miss your reasoned comments. I ignore anything I am not interested in reading. Wonderful invention the scroll wheel. Take a break and come back sometime later.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:33 AM Reply Like
  • Oh great teacher, please don't burden yourself with the responsibility of educating us by shining your brilliance into our dimly lit room.


    You must take after your friend Lierre Keith whose book you linked to and who writes this about her previous Vegan message board friends, "That was my last visit to the vegan message boards. I realized then that people so deeply ignorant of the nature of life, with its mineral cycle and carbon trade, its balance points around an ancient circle of producers, consumers, and degraders, weren’t going to be able to guide me or, indeed, make any useful decisions about sustainable human culture." -- quite an arrogant statement itself.


    The vegan/green people Keith describes who "are so deeply ignorant of the nature of life" and "unable to make any useful decisions about sustainable human culture" are of the exact same fabric being described by the term "greenie" albeit in a much more friendly way here. I thank goodness our friends on this blog took a higher road using the term "greenie" than going the route Keith did, since your magnanimous tolerance just boiled over at the use of such a generic term and you couldn't help but to describe them with "arrogant confidence in one's ignorance that makes a person with too high an opinion of himself come across like a simple-minded fool."


    If you feel the need to post that you are leaving because you just can no longer withstand the "simple-minded fools" in the political rancoring of which you participated in every time, don't, you are not that important. And if anyone here desperately needs to eat from the apple of your omniscience they will PM you.
    11 Mar 2013, 08:16 AM Reply Like
  • Billa-


    I'm sorry to see you go...many of your comments have been informative.


    11 Mar 2013, 11:20 AM Reply Like
  • "America's power grid is like an old car.
    It gets the job done, even if its performance is slipping. But the repair bills go up every year and experts say only a major overhaul will reverse its decline."
    11 Mar 2013, 11:45 AM Reply Like
  • Billa,


    Did someone hijack your account? Seems no reason to leave just because a diverse group has diverse viewpoints.


    Hopefully the real Billa will come back to us as I always enjoyed his take on events.
    11 Mar 2013, 03:06 PM Reply Like
  • Billa, Sorry to read of your departure. I will surely miss your thoughts here. I wish you'd change your mind but respect whatever choice you make. Best of luck to you! :)
    11 Mar 2013, 05:33 PM Reply Like
  • Billa,
    You can at least remain a lurker ;) There are certainly a lot of pejorative expressions that make their way into the concentrators, but part of accessing the internet in 2013 is learning how to filter out uninformed comments (esp. on news articles!).
    11 Mar 2013, 05:48 PM Reply Like
  • Billa,
    Illegitimi non carborundum
    11 Mar 2013, 08:32 PM Reply Like
  • Excellent SA article, technically proficient, makes good sense, but unfortunately for Axion, totally irrelevant !


    Truth is that the Automotive OEM's do not want a battery (from anyone) that lasts 5-10+ years , and performs exteremely well.


    As told to me yesterday by a very good friend of mine in Boston, who owns a Chrysler, Ford, 2 Toyota and one Lexus dealerships, the main income producer for them is when customers bring their vehicles in for service (for whatever reason) so the manufacturers do not want to provide a battery as proficient as I believe the PBc may be.
    Frustrating and annoying?-without doubt,but it is what it is, and BMW has had the Axion batteries for well over 3 years (and we know they work) and still they don't feel that they either need or want them in their product line up, NADA!


    This will not change until regulations are clarified, confirmed, and written into legalese, otherwise, same old same old.


    Talking about same old same old, as I have opined from day one, Granville and Danton and most of the Axion board should either be deep sixed , or like most commission sales personnell, income should be linked to results !


    If Granville was linked to results he would be making $7,500 yr and not the ridiculously astronomical $750,000 he thinks (and only him) he's worth !!
    11 Mar 2013, 01:31 AM Reply Like
  • I thought TG's salary was around $250K. -- Most of the rest of your post strikes me as a lot of emotional speculation and diatribe that doesn't really make a lot of sense.
    11 Mar 2013, 02:25 AM Reply Like
  • Johnny,
    It just isn't worth my time responding when obviously there is a reading comprehension issue.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:43 AM Reply Like
  • First of all, an apology to all the Axionistas. I’d like to share some thoughts on the Valence Bankruptcy hoping some of the knowledgeable posters here can step in and answer some question / underline the weak points of this thinking. It is related to the sector, and as such I hope you may also consider it a description of a potential scenario (climate/ landscape) where Axion is operating. Under this scenario both A123 and Valence could end up as part of bigger competitors.
    I’m mainly the messenger, as I’ve stolen the approach from another investor.
    When Valence filed for bankruptcy, it looked like Berg, its major shareholder and owner of more than 90% of the company’s debt, was going to use bk to wipe out shareholders (including himself) and take full control of the company. A request for an equity committee was denied. The company expected to re-emerge by year’s end (2012).
    Then A123 filed.
    JCI acted as the stalking horse in a 363 sale of that company, but ended up losing against Wanxian. The price doubled to roughly $250 million. Hot bidding war. JCI wasn’t happy about the result and tried to block the deal even after losing it. Unsuccessfully.
    Back to Valence.
    The company hasn’t re-emerged yet – the opposite. It filed in court to hire two investment banks looking for equity financing. May be it was something due after A123 showed there may be more value than expected for good IP in the sector. However, it is interesting the investment banks will get only half commission if a deal is closed with JCI and a few other companies (that might have already expressed interest in the company?).
    Speculation time. May be Valence (Berg) has now realized that post bk Valence will have a different kind of competitor, giant Wanxiang rather than a relatively small and probably still financially weak A123. A tougher competitor for scale, financial and production capacity, etc. etc. May be in the long term a plan B can be now more rewarding both for the company (its management) and its major lender/shareholder: a sale to a big guy, who can take also advantage (in part) of its large NOLs. Berg would just get as much money as possible back (first as creditor and lastly as shareholder), depending on how many people you can get to bid and what price comes out.
    Questions: am I correct thinking JCI is pretty weak on IP in the lithium battery sector? A buy out of Valence would strengthen its patent portfolio. May be A123 and Valence had no interest (financial capacity) to start a legal fight with a big guy, but Wanxiang owning A123 may set a completely different scenario. It’s also about building a decent defense in case things get tough.
    Here are the names of companies included in the “reduced commission” list for the investment banks: Berg, JCI, SAIF, Enertech Capital, Via Motors. I’d appreciate any comment on the last 3 companies (strengths, financial capabilities, etc).
    Could Valence be worth over $120 million in a bidding war? The NOLs are impressive, but could only be used in part. (Section 382 limitation - Following a “more than 50%” ownership change, corporations ability to deduct pre-ownership change NOL’s is limited. If an ownership change occurs in a bankruptcy case, the calculation of the annual limitation is based on the value of the corporation immediately after the ownership change. Since this calculation is usually after significant debt relief, the equity value is higher, more NOLs).
    Axion related: if I got it right the long time horizon is not competing with the big guys, but becoming a partner to them. Safer, and pretty smart as a strategy. However, here comes the reference to "sources that are in alignment with our business objectives" for the next financing round. Just wondering if any of the previous big names could be interested in getting additional IP in the sector (even outside of lithium, and through a partnership and not necessarily a buyout ) at a time it seems on fashion to do so (the hotter demand for IP is, the easier it may be for Axion). And given the fact the Axion is only looking for a financing, and not on sale, how this deal could be structured.
    11 Mar 2013, 02:51 AM Reply Like
  • Paolo, there is no way to answer your question on financing. You have to be prepared for another stock issue to the same people of last year, then if it is a partner or long term holder "more aligned" with AXPW interests, then it's a plus.


    As to the other tech, and A123.....I have long said that A123 deal was cheap even at $250 M. I think when JCI unveiled the 2 battery system in a BMW it was obvious how they wanted to fill that tech hole in their portfolio.


    China has to work fast on this pollution issue. A123 was the only game in town. It was cheap and IMO they make it work.


    As to Johnny Rambo's post & yours, the only way we get mass adoption in auto's is for the gov't to rewrite rules...force AGM out of SS cars and PbC or the JCI solution above is the only game in town.
    or as Maya says "class action lawsuits".


    The next 15 months will tell the story on AXPW.
    11 Mar 2013, 06:02 AM Reply Like
  • re: nat gas comments above, IMO nat gas will never be the preferred energy source for transportation. It is like AXPW, it has niches where it works extremely well and is already being implemented in these areas quickly. (ports, busses, etc)


    I also do not think the USA energy independence because of NG & fracking will ever make us energy independent. the overproduction/surplus of NG has helped utilities and manufacturing here in the USA stay competitive.


    Final ... if we ever allow exports (which I think we will) then NG doubles fast and triples putting it to at least $10 instead of the $3 ish we see now. Gasoline probably still climbs in price until usage declines faster than the peak oil supply theory and refinery production issues.
    $4 gas prices has made some tech more competitive and $6-8 in the USA like overseas will make more tech price competitive. IMO, it is coming...question is just how fast?
    11 Mar 2013, 06:13 AM Reply Like
  • re: PbC & AXPW
    Because the PbC in not necessarily a good "energy storage" battery, it will be difficult to compete with other "grid storage" & 'solar" storage tech. It's strengths and weaknesses are well know here, There is probably a niche for the load levelling and "cleaning up" dirty power to the grid but that's probably a limited mkt...and the only negatives I am focusing on here is the competition from GE's marketing arm for grid & rail, especially in the build it in and combining it into their new products almost forcing the adoption. I was also surprised at the number of discharges they claim...not sure just how true that is at this point, it could be like AGM in for a short time at 100% then drops off fast.
    When you look at what JCI just showed on their 2 battery system with lead acid/lithium combo, it's too high now...will be interesting to see just how cheap they can get it down to in 2 years. IMO, auto makers got by with the AGM failure because of the great depression. They didn't need to have to spend an extra $400-1000 on car costs the past few years...however that is changing now & I expect more in the next 2-4 years for the variety of reasons already discussed here. This is a positive for AXPW.


    POSITIVES: IMO, the ePower deal is very very valuable to AXPW. Not so much in immediate sales, but what AXPW will learn over the next 1-2 years.
    When TG hired Vani, we all expected sales to follow soon. Even tho we were disappointed, TG kept saying how pleased he was with him....I think TG knew just how tuff and how long it takes to break into these mkts. and was more patient with much lower expectations than we on this APC had. Vani did open doors that were closed to TG. So my point is, now if we have success with the ePower system, Vani can show his stuff, the real success is probably 2 years away, but we should see some progress in the next 12 months as the test data and tweaking results begin to trickle in.
    These batteries at work on the road is just huge. I am sure there will be some potholes and delays to be tweaked, but now they can prove that PbC has a place. This places extreme pressure on competition. It may just force the partnership we need.


    The only other piece we need fast is that 999 to come out blazing and work. Then we have two proven uses, no longer forcing years & years of testing in a lab. Everyone here for a long time knows I have wanted to see it in the field. This is two apps where the PbC either lives or dies, and it's based on real use success or failure.


    as a footnote, I still like what ZBB is doing. I sorta wish they could hook up with AXPW.
    11 Mar 2013, 06:45 AM Reply Like
  • Hyundai would be a great partner:


    6:45 AM Passenger car sales in China rose 20% to 2.84M units in January and February with both Ford (F) and Hyundai (HYMLF.PK) showing strong gains. For the year, forecasts for total vehicle sales top 20M units as urbanization and rising incomes continue to stoke demand. Comment! [Consumer, Global & FX]
    11 Mar 2013, 06:46 AM Reply Like
  • Altoona's facebook site shows a steam engine on a "treadmill." It was NSC's way of running all kinds of tests without going anywhere. This is what I believe is taking place with the NS 999. It is the only explanation that makes sense for NSC to take delivery of the batteries in December and not have it out of the shop by now. Hopefully they have already run hundreds of hours of tests with the NS 999 running on its own treadmill.
    11 Mar 2013, 07:42 AM Reply Like
  • I don't know, jveal. I had thought the 'testing' of the PbC was over. I had thought this NS999 was to actually be used in the yard.


    However, perhaps they're taking time to gather initial metrics on the batteries with the intention of performing a review at regular (6 month?) intervals.


    But if they're just getting an initial data set then it shouldn't take much time.


    Or perhaps they're tweaking the BMS and using this treadmill for that purpose?


    11 Mar 2013, 12:29 PM Reply Like
  • Given that the treadmill is long gone, I asked the following on Facebook:


    Q: Is there anything comparable today? shows a Diesel Test Shed and an Emissions Testing Shop. How are they different, and in very simple terms, how do they do emission testing?


    A: The "test shed" would be the modern day equivalent of the Altoona Test Plant. Inside the test shed, up to six engines can be hooked up to load grids to test their performance in each throttle position while putting a simulated load on the engine. The wheels and traction motors remain stationary during the test. I have not seen the emissions shop in action, but I suspect what they do there is similar but there they must attach sensors to the exhaust stack.
    11 Mar 2013, 03:54 PM Reply Like
  • WT, thanks for following up on the idea.
    11 Mar 2013, 04:07 PM Reply Like
  • Thx, wtb. Between your contact and AltoonaWorks, we get at least some updates and info between PRs.
    11 Mar 2013, 04:34 PM Reply Like
  • jveal and all: It seems to me that the biggest problem NSC had with AGM batteries was with the high current charge and discharge from regenerative braking and hard acceleration.


    The acceleration load can be duplicated using a "treadmill" type friction brake tester, but the regen braking test would require that the treadmill SUPPLY high torque to the 999 to simulate the inertia supplied energy charging the batteries during braking.


    It could be done, but the cost would be significant if the dynamometer/treadmill wasn't originally designed with an electric motor/generator to supply and sink torque.


    Just something to consider.
    12 Mar 2013, 01:22 AM Reply Like
  • At this stage, I'd guess what they're doing is more tweaking than testing...
    12 Mar 2013, 01:36 AM Reply Like
  • SHB: OTOH, a couple of gensets could pump current into the batteries, simulating the anticipated amperage from regenerative breaking ... only partially of course. But in all honesty, I'm pretty sure that's not what's in question by this stage in the process.


    I think if there is testing going on it's likely system-integration testing and tweaking. The old "Let's see if this Rube Goldberg contraption really works now".


    Maximizing confidence levels, at this stage, that they've got it right has probably been mandated from on high.


    12 Mar 2013, 08:01 AM Reply Like
  • I wonder whether they've figured out a way to simulate/test in particular the switcher environment of frequent and repeated "collisions" on the (newly redesigned?) frames combined with the actual batteries. If you don't want a public "failure" of the next NS-999, it would seem to me that that's the biggest remaining potential problem that they would prefer to address in private if they can.


    I will pose this to my contact, but I'm not sure whether they will have anything definitive in way of an answer.
    12 Mar 2013, 09:23 AM Reply Like
  • Wtb: Perchance the experience with the "Green Goat" has already solved those problems?


    12 Mar 2013, 09:42 AM Reply Like
  • I would hope that they tested the PbC batteries to some level for mechanical shock in the appropriate axis and designed this into either the NS999 chassis or the racks. Which ever is more efficient. I'm guessing that designing it into the chassis would be the right way to go. Just add in some accelerometers to confirm and take a peak under the hood at appropriate intervals to make sure the field trial is going as expected.


    We could hope this was done with the prior NS999 program but given the battery bin design I'm wondering what they did in the way of intelligent design on the predecessor.


    Maybe we'll get a sighting of them banging the thing around in the yard without a hood soon?
    12 Mar 2013, 09:59 AM Reply Like
  • Reply to the above query, plus one I added about jobs at Altoona:


    "I don't think there's any way to test 'collisions' except in real life.


    The only place they could test it where we couldn't get much of a look is at the shop, but I would not consider that real-world, accurate testing as they only deal with engines there....not cars. Engines are normally handled with more care than your average freight car.


    I don't think there is anyone at the shop furloughed at this time, but there are a dozen or more conductors furloughed. There is a hiring freeze as well for both."
    12 Mar 2013, 11:03 AM Reply Like
  • wtb ... interesting labor info there. Shop deals with engines ... No furloughs, no new hires ...


    Decline in 2012 coal transport volume prompted NSC to return/retire some locomotives.


    NSC is closing its Roanoke switching yard.


    BELocos have electric motors, but no "engine".


    Maybe NSC is using NS999 rebuild as a training platform to build electrical equipment skills within its onboard diesel mechanic staff.
    12 Mar 2013, 11:16 AM Reply Like
  • LT,
    " the only way we get mass adoption in auto's is for the gov't to rewrite rules...force AGM out of SS cars and PbC or the JCI solution above is the only game in town."


    This is what you stated above. It has been reflected in many posts. I am pretty sure I disagree.
    The premise of your statement is that the PbC should be adopted for S/S because it is a better product. It is a better product. But its premium price really is reflected in those S/S cars that have regenerative braking. This type of auto will be the higher end "Mild Hybrid" autos.
    Very few of these autos are being produced now. If I was a manufacturer, I sure wouldn't pin my future hopes on an untested battery, not made in bulk, until I was dead sure of the result.


    By definition, a true Axionista is one that can jump to the worse conclusions from a complete lack of information :-). You might be correct, LT. But I am not convinced yet.
    11 Mar 2013, 07:54 AM Reply Like
  • John posted long go that it would be the regulators that force adoption of the PbC by automotive, but only when the technology was available at relevant scale.


    As I mentioned a short while ago, I think we have a chicken and egg problem. How it will resolve is hard to say. I suspect that something unexpected, possibly a side-effect of other niche successes(?), may be the "event" that dissolves the conundrum in Axion's favor. Without this, or something else I've not imagined, I think the odds go against a favorable resolution.


    Having said that, odds can often be overcome with "sweat equity", the capacity for which Axion has certainly demonstrated, and good planning.


    It is this capacity that I habitually favor because it matches my personal behavior.


    11 Mar 2013, 08:35 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist...your statement "If I was a manufacturer, I sure wouldn't pin my future hopes on an untested battery, not made in bulk,"


    The key is "not made in bulk" IMO, ( i didn't mention it earlier) is that the PbC is not included in some tests and it's data isnt' published because it isn't made in bulk or available in quantity.


    As to AGM price vs. AXPW price, the real fact is that AGM only works a few months at best. If at all. So if the gov't rewrites how they calculate mileage...then AGM is out. Period.


    One of the points I wanted to make is that auto makers are going to pay more for a system that works. I think that was also part of JCI unveiling their 2 battery system so early and now opening up and exposing the holes in their portfolio of batteries and saying that AGM just does not work. We all read more and more on this every day.


    TG has bet the company on this too. Without auto, we don't go far.
    11 Mar 2013, 08:42 AM Reply Like
  • Auto is my least favored opportunity for Axion. Rail is a company maker and the same is true for either of the truck applications. Given a choice between a customer that doesn't want to pay up for top performance and several that will pay top dollar, the high value customers win.
    11 Mar 2013, 08:55 AM Reply Like
  • JP ... what a change. No one here has touted BMW and what they have spent on PbC testing than you. Not to mention the "other asian" auto maker.
    11 Mar 2013, 08:58 AM Reply Like
  • It's not a change. BMW and the other automakers have invested millions in the PbC and they're not done yet.


    Your assertion "without auto we don't go far," however, is absurd.


    The other markets have every bit as much profit potential with far less irritation.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:38 AM Reply Like
  • JP..What's absurd is your constant attack on anyone who has a different view. Without auto, how long before NSC builds out 50 loco's / year? or how long before ePower sells 1000 truck kits? How much money will AXPW have to invest to increase production capacity for these two mkts. ? What terms will they get on financing a line buildout or upgrade?


    It's not worth my time to discuss anything with you anymore.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:56 AM Reply Like
  • The only question is when does that happen? When I think that NSC has been working on its NS-999 since 2009 and has only settled for one locomotive last year, it is very slow progress imho. Also, I was thinking about Energy HUB system sales to RW, but that too doesn't seem to be taking off so far, but again I hope RW are working hard to market the solution. One can only hope that things start to move a little faster.


    One question to definitely ask at the next CC is their expectations about sales for this year.
    11 Mar 2013, 12:29 PM Reply Like
  • LT> 50 locomotives a year or 1,000 ePower tractors are within Axion's existing production capacity with a three-sift electrode operation, although I'd prefer 25 of one and 500 of the other because its a more likely intermediate step. I'm not sure what the source of your hostility is, but it's not helpful to others.
    11 Mar 2013, 01:14 PM Reply Like
  • I'm thinking words like "tout" and "absurd" might have had better alternatives. Sometime words come across harsher on the Internet than was their intent. Anyhow, good points by all.
    11 Mar 2013, 04:04 PM Reply Like
  • Interesting that the internal process of the APC is becoming more toxic.
    11 Mar 2013, 11:25 AM Reply Like
  • Thotdoc: I was thinking it's a normal effect of increased participation by some combined with lack of progress - seems to bring out the less-civil side of things.


    Normal behavior?


    11 Mar 2013, 11:31 AM Reply Like
  • I'm no psychologist but it seems fairly normal.


    Some people are normal, everyday folks but with a bit of hotter temper.


    Other people are more sensitive than the average.


    Also, there is something about posting online and in email that prompts a person to write in an inflammatory manner.


    It is what it is and just requires more patience at trying times.


    It's unfortunate but I'm personally not put off the APC or concerned that it's deteriorating into a cesspool of hatred.


    11 Mar 2013, 01:07 PM Reply Like
  • Seems that the testiness has to do with the timing of Axion stock. Obviously when the market hits a new high and Axion doesn't then everyone blames the product. Its not the battery. Its not the batteries future that is off. Its the stockholders wishing that the time has come when obviously the time has not yet come.


    No one would like a skyrocket stock price more than me. But the time has not yet come.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:27 PM Reply Like
  • Thotdoc
    Actually it's happened before.
    After a bit it calmed down.
    I didn't read the first 100 + concentrators. This could have happened multiple times.
    Thinking about it; the time before this might have been due to TG making a statement about sales that were overstated.
    (I can't remember the timing well enough to be sure.) and the NSC batteries being ordered but not delivered for months.


    In this case I think it was partially due to our thinking ePower was going to be a breeze and announced last Dec. While it is happening quickly (Compared to everything else) It's not quick enough and we expected NSC to have 999 on the rails by now.
    Ordered last April? delivery waited until Dec finally maybe Mar. before getting the batteries in? and we don't actually know they are in or going in soon.


    Not to mention we have been in the depths of winter. Less sun and a bit stir crazy. All have an effect.
    11 Mar 2013, 07:30 PM Reply Like
  • It was just a process comment.
    11 Mar 2013, 10:16 PM Reply Like
  • Thotdoc, Might be opportunity for an online Axionista clinic?


    So far my "Bang Head Here" sign on the wall has sufficed though! 8oP
    11 Mar 2013, 10:26 PM Reply Like
  • "So far my 'Bang Head Here' sign on the wall has sufficed though!"


    Starting to get a bit of a headache though.
    11 Mar 2013, 11:48 PM Reply Like
  • Testiness appears to always increase in the lead-up to the earnings release.


    So many hopes but so little hard news.
    11 Mar 2013, 11:41 AM Reply Like
  • Albert: "Testiness appears to always increase"


    Can't help myself :-(( "and Testicleness appears to always decrease".




    Reminded my of a *very* old Linkletter "Kid's Say the Darndest Thing". What animal would you like to be? Got the usual lion, tiger, ... One wanted to be an octopus. Art says "Why?". The kid says so I could grab people with my testicles. "Don't you mean tentacles?" says Art. "No, testicles - my daddy told me so".


    11 Mar 2013, 12:13 PM Reply Like
  • "The commercial vehicle industry is moving ahead with cleaner vehicles, and with operators making money out of them, said John Boesel, president and CEO of Calstart.


    That’s indeed so, added Doyle Sumrall, senior director of business development with NTEA, the Work Truck Show organizer. More emphasis is being given now to using analysis, tools and models to understand the paybacks on clean vehicles, and to show the benefits that flow to the bottom line."


    Green Truck Summit & Work Truck Show


    There is a lot about the cost savings of CNG trucks and a bit about hybrids. Of course, there is no mention of ePower.
    11 Mar 2013, 12:59 PM Reply Like
  • We hope that the ePower trucks will speak loudly for themselves and a "show" will be unnecessary. I have found things that sell themselves, have happier owners long term.
    Pushing the ePower system as a nation wide solution will end badly. They are excellent for specific terrain, of which the country has large amounts of. They are not so great for other terrain types. Stories from people trying to run them in the wrong locations would stain the reputation (and bad news can be spread quickly.)
    11 Mar 2013, 01:54 PM Reply Like
  • You'll certainly get no disagreement from ePower on that point.
    11 Mar 2013, 02:11 PM Reply Like
  • >No Body in Particular ... I went to the Axion website in search of the "White Papers", to refer a friend to, that used to be easy to find. I clicked every Tab and didn't see them. OK, maybe I'm just getting too old to find things anymore or are they just not there?
    11 Mar 2013, 02:17 PM Reply Like
  • You must be getting old Drich ;-) Click the "Investors" tab and go down mid-way and you will see "Charge Acceptance Solution White Paper" under Key Documents. I think that is what you are looking for.
    11 Mar 2013, 04:11 PM Reply Like
  • >jakurtz ... Duh !!
    11 Mar 2013, 05:18 PM Reply Like
  • Thanks Mr. Investor. :) Am I guessing right?
    11 Mar 2013, 04:03 PM Reply Like
  • :^P
    11 Mar 2013, 04:08 PM Reply Like
  • huh?
    11 Mar 2013, 04:31 PM Reply Like
  • >MrHolty. Check out four comments from yesterday starting here:



    I love it!
    11 Mar 2013, 04:37 PM Reply Like
  • Thanks for the reply. Otherwise I would have spent a hour laying in bed looking at the ceiling and then pulling up the instablog and choosing the 5th letter for every fourth comment to find the cryptic message.
    11 Mar 2013, 06:15 PM Reply Like
  • You should use your Official Axionista Decoder Ring. Of course, if you didn't get one, that's just someone on the staff being mean...
    12 Mar 2013, 09:47 AM Reply Like
  • ARPA-E Top Prize Goes to Nuclear Start-Up
    Richard Martin — March 8, 2013



    which references



    which has a lot more details.


    "Transatomic’s plan is to build a prototype reactor in 5 years, commercialize the technology in 15 years, and have reactors come online by around 2030. The company doesn’t plan to build and operate nuclear power plants, but to license its reactor technology."


    So we're the only ones that have to be patient :-)
    11 Mar 2013, 04:28 PM Reply Like
  • That's the same technology that has been mentioned here a couple times - Thorium Flouride, IIRC, MSRs. Links to videos posted too. I'm glad to see DOE/ARPA-E getting on board with this late-80s/early 90s ONR-proven technology.


    11 Mar 2013, 04:42 PM Reply Like
  • HTL: The MSR concept was proven out in the 60 thru 70s. It also was shown that it could be used to "breed" U233 from Thorium (Th232?) at greater than a 1:1 ratio. That is, it could make more fissile U233 then it "burned".


    The Oak Ridge group pushed the concept as a fuel maker to the AEC (uranium was believed to be scarce at the time), but the military wanted plutonium to make bombs. So the fast (neutron) U238 -> P239 breeder got the funding. After a lot of work and money, that didn't work out well for the industry. And Plutonium became a dirty work to the anti-nukes.


    With the loss of the MSR breeder concept, interest in the MSR faded. After all, the power generation industry had already scaled up the Navy BWR to enormous (some say ridiculous) size and the cost of Uranium was falling. Who needs a breeder?


    So now we have no breeder and no ultra-safe MSR that needs no expensive fuel rods. Just the fuel as metal pellets when needed.


    But it is still an excellent concept and produces high temperatures suitable for cheaper and less complex Brayton gas turbine energy extraction.
    12 Mar 2013, 01:50 AM Reply Like
  • So why didn't other countries pick up and run with the MSR and thorium fuel cycle? I mean you'd think France would have been *all* over that. Instead they nuclearize virtually their entire nation by building almost 60 light water plants?
    12 Mar 2013, 02:04 AM Reply Like
  • wtb: I read the second article and I must say that Richard Martin doesn't seem to understand what a breeder is and how it works.


    For instance, the MSR can not be fueled by Thorium. Thorium 232 is a fertile material, meaning it can be converted by neutron absorption into U-233, a fissile material. The U-233 can then undergo fission.


    If properly designed, The MSR CAN convert Thorium into U233 (it is complicated and not a "one step" process). But the reactor must be started with a full load of U-233, U-235 or Pu-239. After it has run for a while the original "fuel" can be slowly removed until the reactor is running only on fuel it made itself. Takes years. No free lunch.
    12 Mar 2013, 02:18 AM Reply Like



    "BROOKVILLE Liberty Modern Streetcars will utilize an innovative battery energy storage system (ESS) to power the car’s four traction motors when off-wire. Approximately one mile of the 1.6-mile track will require ESS power, allowing the LRV to cross the city’s Houston Street Viaduct over the Trinity River without the use of catenary."


    BTW, Brookville was involved in the NS-999 ...
    11 Mar 2013, 04:41 PM Reply Like
  • >wtblanchard ... What's old is new again. It has been gone for nearly 80 years but another streetcar line returns.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:22 PM Reply Like
  • WTB, Thanks. That will get you thinking of possibilities.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:22 PM Reply Like
  • DRich: now that GM and others aren't big enough to buy them all out, maybe they'll stick this time, unlike in the early part of the last century.


    11 Mar 2013, 05:44 PM Reply Like
  • >H.T.Love ... At its peak in the 1920s, such Dallas inter-urban passenger lines fanned out to Fort Worth, Denton, Dennison, Waco, Corsicana and Terrell. That's about 80 miles North/South and 45 miles East/West. Basically it is what the DART system is trying to rebuild. Also, back then there were about 240 miles of trolley lines (today I believe it is 8) in a city with a urban-suburban radius of approximately 12 miles from city centre. All gone by 1956.
    11 Mar 2013, 06:05 PM Reply Like
  • Loads of street cars and trolley buses in Toronto. Dammed good subway and light rail services too.
    11 Mar 2013, 06:16 PM Reply Like
  • I believe trackless trolleys never fully went away in a handful of North American cities, including Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco and Boston.
    12 Mar 2013, 09:31 AM Reply Like
  • I remember electric buses powered by overhead power lines in San Antonio in the mid-late 50s. Quiet and clean. I suspect the maintenance on the wiring wasn't trivial. The bus mounted mechanism that followed the wires was something to watch in operation!
    12 Mar 2013, 05:29 PM Reply Like
  • In Boston they were called "trackless trolley's".
    12 Mar 2013, 05:45 PM Reply Like
  • There are four trackless trolleybus routes in Boston that still exist. All are run by the Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority (MBTA) in the Harvard Square area, and all are former streetcar lines.
    13 Mar 2013, 09:09 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist, you asked about the potential for storing power using air compressors. Just as Axion re-invented the mature technology of LAB, a new company has re-invented air compression. see link below. Note, if you are in a hurry skip the first four minutes of introduction.



    This dramatically improves the efficiency of air compression and makes it a compelling choice for energy storage for the grid, particularly for renewables. Hope this helps answer your question.
    11 Mar 2013, 05:43 PM Reply Like
  • Rick,
    Thanks for the video. The ideas are always wonderful. The math as to how much the storage tank of cheap power will cost is always the interesting question. But I liked the concept. Hope things go well for the theory.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:17 PM Reply Like
  • The tough part with CAES will always be geology and trying to make airtight caverns that have the porosity and permeability needed for rapid charge and discharge. There's a reason that we only have two operating CAES caverns on the planet and its not a lack of trying.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:31 PM Reply Like
  • John,


    If you watch the video you will see they are not using caverns. The young lady who came up with the idea, and in whom Vinod Khosla invested millions of dollars, entered Princeton at age 17 as a PhD candidate. She got her PhD and had invented the idea and was working with Vinod Khosla by age 22. I think she understands the issues.
    12 Mar 2013, 04:08 PM Reply Like
  • I did watch the video and she says near the end that they want to start with pressure vessels and graduate to caverns.
    12 Mar 2013, 05:06 PM Reply Like
  • JP, I have been working with some people at Lightsail. The initial plans for geographically independent storage is using standard 48" steel gas pipeline, which is rated IIRC to 3000 lbs/in2. Construction of large pipeline is well-known and very cost effective.


    Caverns, as you know, have geographical limitations. They may be important at approaching-TW scale. Lightsail's approach is substantially different the existing two CAES plants. The current CAES plants are still functioning, not particularly profitable, and apparently do not represent a future path. They do consume a lot of natural gas.


    Will Lightsail be successful? My back of the envelope says "probably yes", which is a rare thing in my book. There is still a very long way to go from "probably yes" to "successfully and profitably executed at scale", and the path is far from guaranteed.
    12 Mar 2013, 05:56 PM Reply Like
  • I think Lightsail's approach is promising, I don't start to cringe till folks start talking geological air storage, because I know how tough that is.
    12 Mar 2013, 08:52 PM Reply Like
  • Rick and/or JP---so, would Lightsail's compressed gas solution and the PC be complementary? I'm guessing that the PbC responds faster then LS can/would. If so, then PbC for power and LS for energy.
    12 Mar 2013, 10:59 PM Reply Like
  • I'd be willing to bet that Lightsail's system is pretty fast, but it is more an energy solution than a power solution.
    13 Mar 2013, 09:41 AM Reply Like
  • I agree with JP (LS & PbC)
    13 Mar 2013, 10:01 AM Reply Like
  • Always interesting to look at job openings ...


    13 Mar 2013, 01:26 PM Reply Like
  • (KNDI): Being removed from NASDAQ Golden Dragon China Index effective 3/18.



    11 Mar 2013, 05:52 PM Reply Like
  • I can see KNDI bring taken off.


    I can't say I understand (LDK), LDK solar (JASO), JA solar and a wind co. (MY) getting on the list.
    None of the charts look impressive. (Including KNDI)
    11 Mar 2013, 08:05 PM Reply Like
  • Froggy,
    For those that don't follow KNDI, it is really interesting that they are being taken off the list. Most of these list are predicated on the financial growth and sales. Kndi is at that stage where if you only read the financials you would say," Hey, they make a little money producing go-carts. But if you follow the story, you go, "Hey, they are really ready to produce 100,000 small $8,000 electric cars before you get the $5,000 rebate.


    This in a country where millions of electric motorcycle riders want a small electric car.


    Even though I have a small amount invested in KNDI, I see a really big success story, very soon. But I have said that about AXPW for 4 years. Do yourself a favor. Don't listen to me.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:24 PM Reply Like
  • I'll go you one better. I'll never listen to myself either!
    11 Mar 2013, 09:33 PM Reply Like
  • But I have said that about AXPW for 4 years. Do yourself a favor. Don't listen to me.


    How many times have I said that to myself and others ! ?


    Futurist, there is hope for us yet ! ROFL (Literally)
    11 Mar 2013, 09:34 PM Reply Like
  • >Futurist ... If I only relied on the charts, news & unofficial financial reports coming out of China instead of reading the official financial reports and listening to Bloomberg, CNBC & Cramer, I would think the whole country was in bad shape.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:46 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    I've been watching KNDI myself.
    It's still looking like a falling knife.
    Despite interesting news.


    This was a Quarterly change so next Q they could reverse it.


    Quarterly Changes to the NASDAQ Golden Dragon China Index


    I don't see solar as doing well ATM. Reports a few months ago were factories are closed, or running at reduced volume and possibly selling below costs to stay open. They had a run up with the new year but disappointed in earnings. I don't see them as growth this Q.


    RE in general had a run up (Which I saw no reason for) disappointed and seems likely to go back down, but I admit I haven't been following it that closely.
    12 Mar 2013, 12:48 AM Reply Like
  • China has just recently had one of their once-a-decade government changes. Brand new politboro, new top leadership, and second tier oligarchies moving to take their turn at the top. After this very large domino falls, smaller reactions are seen throughout the nation, and though outsiders like us will never be able to see behind the curtain, now would be a good time to be cautious...
    12 Mar 2013, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • EIG Develops Lithium-ion Battery Cell for Stop-Start/Micro-Hybrid Vehicle Systems


    "Energy Innovation Group Ltd. (EIG) a South Korean manufacturer of large format lithium ion battery cell technology, announced today the development of an LTO cell targeting and enabling applications requiring high charge/ discharge rates, long cycle life, and broad operating temperature range."

    11 Mar 2013, 09:46 PM Reply Like
  • >iindelco ... Yea !! Another miracle device that makes "them economically viable" while never mentioning price or performance.
    11 Mar 2013, 09:51 PM Reply Like
  • DRich, Well there sure are quite a few "me too" articles after JCI indicated development of a hybrid offering for SS. Did someone "release the crackin" the water?
    11 Mar 2013, 10:19 PM Reply Like
  • Now that I have reloaded my clip and I am trend trading again and considering the kind of stock charts I'm looking for (on an overall uptrend for openers of course) I am incredulous that I went all in on AXPW because I thought (bad word: thought) Axion would win the infamous DOE award and then when it didn't let myself stay in the stock until I lost 70% of my capital. Must of been something in the water. Crack?


    I am hoping something good will happen so I can get off the sidelines and take another wack at it. A modest wack! I must say that sitting on the sidelines with AXPW is like that old broker's ad: "Very relaxing"
    11 Mar 2013, 09:51 PM Reply Like
  • >bangwhiz ... Don't be so hard on yourself. You weren't wrong to pound the keyboard looking for sales, sales & (the next most important metric) sales. It was heartening to see the likes of Ed Buiel was of similar mind. Testing & NDA's are nice, even necessary ... but "RELEASE THE KRAKEN"
    11 Mar 2013, 09:58 PM Reply Like
  • I don't know why I never considered sitting on the sidelines before, It cost me a pipsqueak brokerage fee to get out and it will cost me the same brokerage fee to get back in. Peanuts. Will I miss a huge pop? Not yet. I better quit talking! My head is spinning. What's next? Green puke?
    11 Mar 2013, 10:07 PM Reply Like
  • Bang, The "Three not so wise men". Seen em a few times!

    11 Mar 2013, 10:37 PM Reply Like
  • After watching Rickplano's "Solve for X" video about CAS I watched a second Solve for X video about making solar power competitive without subsides and operating 24 hrs per day. Fascinating approach by a super smart guy who's spent $200M bucks of his OWN money on solar energy development.
    11 Mar 2013, 11:11 PM Reply Like
  • Can't remember if this older report from Roland Berger was posted so I'll just post it.


    Lithium-ion batteries - The bubble bursts

    11 Mar 2013, 11:55 PM Reply Like
  • Two articles that mention Axion:


    12 Mar 2013, 08:18 AM Reply Like
  • nice finds jveal
    12 Mar 2013, 08:54 AM Reply Like
  • Jveal: Great to see (AXPW) mentioned in the same breath with tier-1 players even if it's an error, for now, on the auto front due to lack of scale.


    Good finds, both!


    12 Mar 2013, 09:15 AM Reply Like
  • jveal,
    I find it interesting that the article claims:
    "In addition to Johnson Controls, other companies supplying systems are Axion Power, Robert Bosch LLC, Delphi Automotive and Exide Technologies"


    I would put us more in the category of "waiting to supply Start-Stop systems".
    12 Mar 2013, 01:47 PM Reply Like
  • 03/11/2013: EOD stuff partially copied instablog (up later).
    # Trds: 22, MinTrSz: 100, MaxTrSz: 8500, Vol 43325, AvTrSz: 1969
    Min. Pr: 0.3100, Max Pr: 0.3197, VW Avg. Tr. Pr: 0.3161
    # Buys, Shares: 18 27825, VW Avg Buy Pr: 0.3194
    # Sells, Shares: 4 15500, VW Avg Sell Pr: 0.3101
    # Unkn, Shares: 0 0, VW Avg Unk. Pr: 0.0000
    Buy:Sell 1.80:1 (64.2% “buys”), DlyShts 4000 (09.23%), Dly Sht % of 'sells' 25.81%


    Well, the bid/ask action was unusually stable today and there was much less late-day weakness. With the low volume, it was somewhat surprising. If I didn't miss any, the low ask I saw was $0.3193 and the highest was $0.3198. This was both a much smaller range than typical and stayed generally further away from best bid, rather than collapsing towards the median, as is typical when ATDF/TEJS and NITE are on the pitch, as they were today.


    Could this indicate that sellers at this level are again exhausted? Or is it a result of our late-day magician holding the price higher making potential sellers think they can get more and thereby causing lower volume as the sellers are reluctant to give up any fractional pennies because they see “strength”? Don't know. Let's hope not, as a whoosh could result if there are a couple relatively large sellers there and they finally give up on trying to milk the last fractional penny out of what they mean to sell.


    OTOH, in the situation as we find it, the buyers were willing to move up towards the ask and pay it. The buy:sell recovery from the recent abysmal percentages of 0.859, 0.249, 0.219, 0.276, 0.157 and 0.642 (today) might be suggesting some reduced fear of a price move substantially lower ... if it was accompanied by volume, which it is not. We saw the best bid go as high as $0.3195, briefly while ask was $0.3198, but it quickly moved back to the low $0.31xx area and remained there but for another brief period at $0.3194 during the lunch hour when there were only two trades, the highest being $0.3193 for 8.5K going off while bid/ask was $0.31/$0.3194.


    Again, the situation is (as always) unknown, but it does mean more caution should be included in any TA.


    Having said that, the spread is compressing ATM with lower highs and higher lows. My potential new rising support (~$0.301?) is still in play, we are fairly centered in the Bollinger band and we are “pushing” on a rising 50-day SMA, $0.3213. With no volume it's not much of a push though. We're just below a demonstrated resistance seen 12/3-12/4 and a churn low “support” 2/1-2/11 before we took the exit from our rising trading channel begun in mid-November. If we're lucky, this will extend into a sideways move until intersecting the potential new rising support, whereupon it will find support and start to creep up. But that is tough to forecast with this low volume.


    The oscillators are mixed again, as we would expect with directionless low-volume action. Some flattened, some started weakening (momentum weakened to 1.03) and stochastic continues its slow move towards oversold. None of the others warrant detailing today.


    On my experimental charts, average trade size is below anything I would think even suggests typical retail buying or selling. We are currently moving “at the edges”, which can't be a good thing. Buy:sell is better, but with this volume, sort of meaningless. My original inflection point calculations, which are volume-sensitive, remain disorganized with a negative bias. My newer version, which includes other factors, is moving towards a decidedly neutral stance ATM with longer-term trends up and shorter-term trends flat-to-down. In this configuration, no move or direction of price is suggested.


    Details of “Dly Sht % of 'sells'” and inflection points omitted here.


    12 Mar 2013, 08:25 AM Reply Like
  • Buyers have been coming in at <= 30 cents, and sellers >= 32 cents, And everyone is waiting for the financing, hence the low volume.
    12 Mar 2013, 11:35 AM Reply Like
  • AXPW stock is directionless these days, with little volume. The market is telling Axion that it better come up with some exciting sales news (or prospects), and a clear financing plan, before it buys the success story...


    Damn it's hard to invest in R&D companies :)
    12 Mar 2013, 10:54 AM Reply Like
  • the market isn't saying anything to AXPW, as it isn't aware it exists. welcome to nano.
    12 Mar 2013, 10:59 AM Reply Like
  • This is why its so much easier for them to cut deals with government, or whisper with whales...


    The market is deaf as a post.
    12 Mar 2013, 11:09 AM Reply Like
  • When (if) it becomes a 300 million dollar+ Market Cap company, then the market will wake up. What will take AXPW to reach this size is anyone's guess: NSC, BMW, grid storage, or a combo of all of these...
    12 Mar 2013, 11:48 AM Reply Like
  • Amouna, Best you can do is make darn sure you believe in the management, the technology and the market potential/timing. Increases the odds but no assurances.


    I'm afraid I've been off just a little on the timing. For me this is going to temper the up side. Short of a full blown market melt down I'm OK with it. If the market really melts down are my USD's gonna help me? Things are dropping like a rock in real buying power already. Heck, I'm just glad there's no inflation <snark>!
    12 Mar 2013, 12:00 PM Reply Like
  • My whole position in AXPW was as much a faith in the prowess of PbC technology as it has been in management. I believe the people at the top of AXPW are working on the side of the shareholders, especially when you see what they had to go through from the early beginning (Mega-C, lawsuit, etc...). I also like the humbleness and dedication of the CEO and his character. Again, time will tell whether we have a winner or not, but when you see the stock market rising and the opportunity cost becoming more expensive, one can't help but wonder when our expectations will ever see the day of light.


    Patience, patience patience :)
    12 Mar 2013, 12:09 PM Reply Like
  • I would guess a number of things would be necessary for Axion to reach a $300 M market cap. My own desire is to see a pps of 0 or better. If we could do that, I think we could easily see a double of current market cap to $70 M. I realize big things could come along at any time, but I would be most content with a sustainable 0 pps as a first step.
    12 Mar 2013, 12:38 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna, One other signal of honesty I liked seeing was the way strike prices for the officers options have been set. I like the fact that they haven't been lowering them with the stock price going down. Also new shares issued, like when Vani Dantam came on board, are set in the same area. This signifies leadership that says "We earn it and if it comes in we stand in line together". Rare in greedy America.
    12 Mar 2013, 12:59 PM Reply Like
  • Remember that all proclamations from the government are in code, iid.


    Don't forget to invert the message to arrive at the truth, ie, "no inflation" really means "lots of inflation", etc.


    "Voluntary" payments are really, of course, extortion with a gun buried in your ribs.


    It requires effort, sometimes, to remember to apply the code to what only appears to be simple English.
    12 Mar 2013, 01:34 PM Reply Like
  • woops, meant eps, not pps.
    12 Mar 2013, 01:45 PM Reply Like
  • In my experience the best place for the stock price is a modest loss with rapidly ramping revenue. It gets to be a real grind when meeting earrings expectations becomes a quarterly challenge. Revenue growth is. Lower bar.
    12 Mar 2013, 02:01 PM Reply Like
  • TB, ... the distinguished and honorable senator from....


    Yeah, It's obvious in most cases.
    12 Mar 2013, 03:28 PM Reply Like
  • Somewhere else please.
    12 Mar 2013, 03:40 PM Reply Like
  • Institutional stockbrokers in New York, spend more money in an evening, entertaining a prospective client, than Axion (who?) trades in a day !!
    Sad but true, but hey, keep spending most of our days analyzing a huge 1-2c swing in the market !
    12 Mar 2013, 08:21 PM Reply Like
  • >Amouna ... Rails & trucking could do this all by themselves (2 years). Storage would be nice but no one is very comfortable with this solution enough to implement it at scale. You'll know it's close when demonstrations start using mixed types (min 4 years for utilities - commercial, depends if economic activity ever shows)
    12 Mar 2013, 11:56 AM Reply Like
  • We still have great hopes for Rosewater but with no news I wonder if they closed down for the winter?
    12 Mar 2013, 12:11 PM Reply Like
  • There is no "winter" AlbertinBermuda, they are in Florida :)
    12 Mar 2013, 12:18 PM Reply Like
  • OT: I know a few of you follow Robert Prechter



    "Today at 4:15 p.m. Eastern time, Todd Harrison will hold Minyanville's first live webcast with Robert Prechter, famed technical analyst, founder of the Socionomics Institute and pioneer of this new social science. And you're invited to join in.


    Todd will speak with Bob about what socionomics is, why it's so important, and how the study of social mood is rapidly transforming the decision-making processes of many businesses and industries worldwide.


    This still-developing field was virtually unknown to the public a few years ago. But today socionomics is being introduced in university curriculums and used in enterprises from “big data” research to hedge fund management.


    As Todd readies to share his thoughts on socionomics at the annual Social Mood Conference next month, we wanted to get the conversation started, and let you all listen in.


    Once registered, use the password 'socio' to join. "
    12 Mar 2013, 12:04 PM Reply Like
  • Remember Enbala? Announcement the say day as the PowerCube from PJM and VIridity. Here's a recent GreentechMedia article on them as well as more general comments on Frequency Regulation:


    Biggest Power Users Provide Gigawatts of Smart Grid Flexibility


    Enbala sees gigawatts of untapped grid flexibility out there in the world’s big water pumps, cold storage warehouses and other big power users.


    JEFF ST. JOHN: MARCH 11, 2013

    12 Mar 2013, 01:28 PM Reply Like
  • >wtblanchard ... Yawn. " ... in a program that taps building-side loads ... to help keep grid frequency within safe margins" "... one of three ..." "... chosen by Ontario’s Independent Electricity System Operator (IESO), alongside flywheel and battery-backed storage projects aimed at balancing the province’s growing share of wind and solar power ..." and not a PbC in mention or sight.
    12 Mar 2013, 01:36 PM Reply Like
  • We know that the Powercube is already in place at Viridity Energy which is acting as a demand side frequency regulator for PJM (as a test project of course!)
    12 Mar 2013, 02:00 PM Reply Like
  • >Amouna ... That PowerCube is "in place" at Axion, New Castle, Pa. and is most likely monitored by Viridity today, but who knows. It has been what feels like at least a year since anyone has mentioned it and the last person I remember doing so was Mr. Granville. There has been no mention (unless I'm not remembering) by Viridity since the launch which is not true of their other projects.
    12 Mar 2013, 02:12 PM Reply Like
  • "the Powercube is already in place at Viridity Energy"


    Nope. The PowerCube is installed at Axion's New Castle facilities with power frequency services managed through arrangements with Viridity Energy.
    12 Mar 2013, 02:13 PM Reply Like
  • DRich, I don't recall if they ever fully loaded the PowerCube either. I seem to remember it as being about 20% available but as you suggest we haven't heard anything for some time.


    Not suggesting this is a bad thing it just is what it is.
    12 Mar 2013, 03:20 PM Reply Like
  • Thank you for the clarification, thought for some reason that the PowerCube in place at Axion was for other purposes (like demo for example) and that Viridity had another cube delivered at their site. My mistake
    12 Mar 2013, 04:55 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna: "My mistake".


    No! Veridity's mistake! ;-)) Or one of their customer's mistake.


    12 Mar 2013, 05:10 PM Reply Like
  • :)
    12 Mar 2013, 06:17 PM Reply Like
  • For anyone who is long MXWL, I highly recommend reading the following article right away:
    Maxwell's Misreported Revenue: AR Says There Could be More to Come
    12 Mar 2013, 01:48 PM Reply Like


    Some rank EV-angelism of the first order. One stop shopping for all the best myths... or truths, whichever they turn out to be...
    12 Mar 2013, 05:20 PM Reply Like
  • Fisker says A123 hiding true size of creditor claims

    12 Mar 2013, 09:41 PM Reply Like
  • "Corvus Energy designs and manufactures high power lithium ion ENERGY STORAGE MODULE (Li-ion) energy storage battery solutions in partnership with Dow Kokam"


    A new PDF file on Safety just appeared, complete with a little jab in the Summary:


    Meanwhile, back at the Ranch ...


    FAA OKs plan for Boeing (which hit a new high today) 787 Dreamliner fix

    12 Mar 2013, 09:55 PM Reply Like
  • I haven't seen anything that seems to address the possible operational issues in the Boeing systems. Sounds as if they are just building a better box. I still think they aren't operating in the proper current and voltage range for these cells, and the swollen cells and high number of battery failures even without fires suggests the same.
    13 Mar 2013, 09:41 PM Reply Like
  • JRP3, You don't know, I don't know and we'll never know. This is at a level where we will never know the real story. This is bad bad stuff and it will be handled for things that have little to do with reality as we know it.
    14 Mar 2013, 12:00 AM Reply Like
  • Sometimes...I'd like to fly off into JRP3's reality, just to see what's it's like. Lithium battery problem here, lithium battery problem there...yet never no how no way has there ever been a lithium battery failure due to lithium battery chemistry.
    14 Mar 2013, 12:27 AM Reply Like
  • Maya, it appears that the logic is akin to: "eggs will never break unless handled improperly", which of course is an error of scope. As in, too narrow. If the product or service is not robust, then there's a higher handling cost.
    14 Mar 2013, 01:09 AM Reply Like
  • Maya, all technology has proper operating parameters. If those parameters are not applied the product will fail prematurely. Since literally billions of lithium ion batteries are used successfully every single day without behaving the way the Boeing pack did the logical conclusion is that Boeing is doing something wrong that no one else is. Unless of course you live in a world where lithium ion is simply pure evil waiting to unleash it's wrath on an unsuspecting public! Quick, run from your cell phones, tablets, and laptops!


    If all they do is build a better box then we will know because they will continue to have cell and battery failures. It's not black magic, these batteries are failing for a specific reason. Just because they have failed to identify that reason doesn't mean it's not there.
    14 Mar 2013, 08:51 AM Reply Like
  • There could be more than one reason that the batteries fail. One question to ask is whether the changes will include enough, diagnostic tools to ever figure the reason(s) out. Would love to be a fly on the wall as BA decides how much and what kind of testing to continue on a parallel path even as they may design a safer "system" in the mean time to get the planes back in the air.


    Key question for our regulators is to look at how much independent oversight and direction is proven. To my way of thinking, depending on BA to ensure your safety have been disproven! Of course some will argue that BA can't afford to muck this up again, but I believe it was "economic' pressures (how times was the 787 delayed?) that got us in this mess to begin with.


    Do they have the in-house expertise they need to understand and solve this problem? If not, what are they doing about it? What lessons have they learned, and will the organization really change?
    14 Mar 2013, 10:06 AM Reply Like
  • JRP3, My intentions were to point out that given the level this has escalated to we will most probably never know what caused the problems. It's obvious there is at least one design issue or one manufacturing issue or perhaps multiples.


    But the fact also remains that lithium ion batteries have inherent risks just like any other battery. There are costs in managing these risks. Could be they are too high or if they are not managed correctly they will be even higher. The risks grow when you're no longer standing over a fire cracker (cell phone) but you're now standing over a hand grenade (large battery pack). There are failures of packs in electronics due to proper and improper usage. We often don't hear about most of these events. When you move up to the hand grenade sized pack you're going to hear about every single event.
    14 Mar 2013, 10:31 AM Reply Like
  • I guess someone at Boeing is paying attention to me ;)


    "Boeing, Thales and GS Yuasa have also decided to narrow the acceptable level of charge for the battery, both by dropping the charging ceiling to reduce the potential energy of the battery and also raising the voltage floor to better protect against effects from deep discharge."



    I'd like to know the cutoff voltages, and if the pack completely disconnects from charging once it's full, but this seems like a major step in the right direction.
    16 Mar 2013, 10:25 AM Reply Like
  • Axion gets a mention;


    "In an otherwise lackluster year for the clean energy/clean tech sector, Clean Edge, Inc., in its Clean Energy Trends 2013 report, cites the trend to microhybrids as one of the more positive and lasting movements in the transportation sector."

    12 Mar 2013, 11:15 PM Reply Like
  • festain: One time...a long time ago, I had a hole in one. It was my second, but in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, my named out miracle shot was reported in the statistical column a mere inch from the likes of Arnold Palmer and Jack Nicklaus' weekly doings. Yeah...those two prolific golfers were a tad more notable. But there was my name, tucked in close. Still hold the clipping, and the encased golf ball, almost reverently.


    Having Axion Power mentioned within the same sentence as Jonhson Controls is really, really cool.


    Thanks festein, for the link.
    13 Mar 2013, 01:26 AM Reply Like
  • In the article, I found this comment:


    Start Stop Guy March 12th, 2013, 9:29 pm


    Thanks for helping to get the word out about this important, underappreciated trend. The next step is to get the word out about what works and what doesn’t. For any start-stop hybrid “flavor” except the lightest one, the most common, least expensive current solution is to use AGM batteries. Unfortunately, there is a big scandal brewing there, as AGM batteries fail in their start-stop function within just a few months. The demands placed on AGM batteries are just too much for them to handle. JCI and Exide and the auto makers know this, as do an increasing number of consumers in Europe. Here in America, the consumer is much more litigous and active, though, so look for a better battery.


    There are two realistic choices for that better battery: 1) lithium-ion, which is high-priced by itself and requires expensive system support (e.g., thermal management and/or equalization circuitry), is at times dangerous, is not economically recyclable, but is somewhat available at scale, and 2) Axion Power’s PbC battery, which is lower cost, needs no thermal management nor equalization circuitry, is very safe and completely economically recyclable, but is not yet available at scale. The only thing wrong with Axion’s PbC is that no one outside of BMW, GM, either Toyota or Hyundai, Norfolk Southern, Freightliner and many other large OEMs has ever heard of them.


    Note that I excluded Maxwell’s supercapcitor and LAB offering, as it only supports the hotel loads encountered during engine-off events for a maximum of 30 seconds. So it’s not a true start-stop solution—the supercapacitor boost just ensures that the system, which uses an inferior battery, will be able to restart your engine.


    Nice mention-Carlos
    13 Mar 2013, 02:31 AM Reply Like
  • Hi Carlos, that comment sounds "suspiciously" like it could have been written by an Axionista. Sounds like from one of our more learned members, so that would definitely exclude me. Anybody going to fess up? :)
    13 Mar 2013, 09:15 AM Reply Like
  • WIO: I had the same thought. Either way, getting he word out has to help ... eventually.


    13 Mar 2013, 10:06 AM Reply Like
  • ;^)


    I am long a still undiscovered stock, so I think it's worthwhile to keep getting the word out. JP is far and away our most active writer, but the rest of us can at least try to have an impact. This was my 3rd or 4th article comment, and probably won't be my last.


    I also sent an email to the Clean Edge editor suggesting that he/they do an expose on the s/s battery early failure looming scandal. But with all due respect to CE, a WSJ or NY Times piece would have a much bigger impact.


    Has anyone called or written the EPA yet? How about a pro-bono environmental lawyer? How about your congressman? Made a one cent buyout offer for XIDE?, lol. Other suggestions and thoughts on the matter (helping Axion thereby helping ourselves) would be helpful.


    Among the tools and methods of increasing the awareness of the AXPW opportunity, this blog is outstanding, but it's not the only way...


    PS---if the daily ending stock price is what is used in the calc for the upcoming financing, it is in my best interest for that number to be as high as possible, right?
    13 Mar 2013, 10:30 AM Reply Like
  • Mr. I, since Elon has his army of cyber-brownshirts patrolling the internet, I don't see why some of us can't do our own public relations.


    As long as we always tell the truth - exaggerations, half-truths and sycophantic praise can only undermine our cause, as I believe it does for Tesla.


    You're an innovator, Mr. I, and I salute you!


    13 Mar 2013, 12:30 PM Reply Like
  • Thx, DM. This blog is great, but Axionistas efforts can go a lot further, IMO. There's a lot of us, some of us seem pretty motivated, and we cover a lot of backgounds, interests and skills.


    There would be no material need to even try improvements if commercial adoption of the PbC was not still going slowly. Maybe we get a game-changing win tomorrow. But until we do, I think we have more power, in more ways, than we think.


    My first-blush cautions are avoiding legal negatives (e.g., collusion where applicable, if at all---it's why I hestitated posting about trying to get the maximum ending price each day. Hard for me to believe I'm the only one to think and do anything about it!), and not stepping on mgmt's toes too hard. Not sure how to do that, as the info flow from them to us is very thin, so we don't know what efforts they are making. But at least regarding lobbying, in any sense of the word, I would guess that Axion's budget and manpower constraints and sensitivities of potential partners say they're doing nothing. That doesn't mean a 3rd party can't make an effort, though.


    I'm still in the brainstorming stage, though, so maybe some of these ideas, or even all of them, are a waste of time. Maybe a focus on finding more investors is the best way to go. Like some of us have probably already done.
    13 Mar 2013, 01:46 PM Reply Like
  • Mr I: Last year I contacted the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, to inform the business editor that something potentially very exciting is abrew in New Castle, but nothing ever came of it.


    When the yard slug rolls out successfully, I plan to make another attempt, or if something else notable occurs.
    13 Mar 2013, 02:01 PM Reply Like
  • Maya---many thanks!


    One area where we hopefully won't have to do much if anything is the ePower truck. I hope and expect to see the press, pictures, articles, PRs, word of mouth, etc. of those trucks and their batteries splashed all over the place. TG even mentioned during the last conf call, "I hope the press is here." Me, too.
    13 Mar 2013, 02:18 PM Reply Like
  • Mr I: Not if, but when Axion works, the story behind Axion, the long journey of struggle, determination and patience, plus the human interest of David vs. Goliath, with David winning, holds the makings for a fantastic feel good story.


    I'm hoping TG extends an invite to me (and others) to attend the Norfolk 999 unveiling, as he did for the PowerCube.
    13 Mar 2013, 02:35 PM Reply Like
  • Maya---are you waiting to write that story, or have you already started? :^)


    Let me know if TG gives you an invite---I'd like to go, too. And maybe I'll stop at ePower on the way.
    13 Mar 2013, 02:49 PM Reply Like
  • Mr I: I think we've all been living the story, or better, saga. It would be a gas to write.


    If TG throws an invite my way, I'll letcha know. Typically, an announcement of the unveiling should occur a day or two before the unveiling, allowing for bigwigs to "ready up" a trip.
    13 Mar 2013, 03:10 PM Reply Like
  • I figured that you already had some "From Russia, With Love" ideas already. Hard to keep an active mind still.


    Didn't know the unveiling head's up lead time was so short. How do they expect Obama to be there, much less the new pope?
    13 Mar 2013, 03:28 PM Reply Like
  • (XIDE) Moody's jumps on the bandwagon, cuts Exide to Caa1, seven steps into junk territory, from B3, outlook remains negative, cites weak operating margins.


    Says they believe liquidity profile weakened by higher-than-anticipated working capital levels expected by end of current fiscal year, March.


    Deteriorating profitability appears to have stabilized, reflecting idling of secondary lead recycling ...


    There's more, but it's DowJones so I can't link it. Full story on ETrade, where I'm logged in.



    13 Mar 2013, 07:27 AM Reply Like
  • Thx HTL. Interesting...would a desperate Exide be better for Axion? My first reaction is yes---hard to be worse than the neglected-at-best, adversarial-at-worst situation currently. Exide: "Hmmm, we need a big hit to get us out of this deepening hole. What can be sold in big volumes at premium margins? Gotta be somethin' that no one else has...and is defendable for years. And actually works, darn it. Maybe we oughta give that guy Granville a call. God, I hate those guys and their PbC. Tried to crush it oughta 'vem, but nnnoooooooo, they just keep breathing. Oh well. Send that new consultant to talk to 'em. I can't bare to do it myself."
    13 Mar 2013, 11:14 AM Reply Like