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  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » If you managed to get here, I congratulate you for your intrepid ability to overcome all obstacles placed before you.

     

    Let's hope AXPW has the same ability.
    26 Jan, 07:30 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    Your link on Stocktalks works - assuming people are following you.

     

    Does this count as first? :(
    26 Jan, 07:35 PM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2302) | Send Message
     
    Looks like SA must have signed up for Obamacare.

     

    Got a wee website infection, laddie? Take two URL's and call me in the morning.
    26 Jan, 08:31 PM Reply Like
  • Occam's_Razor
    , contributor
    Comments (1553) | Send Message
     
    For anyone who missed it from the last concentrator... back by popular demand: Here is the link to my Hitler spoof on Axion Power:

     

    http://bit.ly/1mDwGHZ
    26 Jan, 09:37 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2127) | Send Message
     
    A chuckle that will last all day.
    Thanks.
    27 Jan, 08:30 AM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Ranma: You're number one in my book!

     

    Uh, well except you posted very useful information where those who don't follow your stock talks might not see it.

     

    Would you accept a downgrade to # 2? ;-))
    26 Jan, 07:41 PM Reply Like
  • greentongue
    , contributor
    Comments (880) | Send Message
     
    Welp, they say ..
    Showing up is not all of life - but it counts for a lot.

     

    -Hillary Clinton
    26 Jan, 07:41 PM Reply Like
  • mds5375
    , contributor
    Comments (159) | Send Message
     
    Worked fo me
    26 Jan, 07:41 PM Reply Like
  • greentongue
    , contributor
    Comments (880) | Send Message
     
    Ready for the latest installment of ePower's ...
    "Tales From the Road"

     

    "Charging Down the Highway"

     

    "Battery Boosted Big Rig"
    27 Jan, 08:39 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Since the Axionistas seem to be pretty hungry for ePower news I've posted some excerpts and pictures from Jay Bowman's bi-monthly letter to stockholders.

     

    http://seekingalpha.co...
    27 Jan, 10:04 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >JP ... Thank-you.
    27 Jan, 10:15 AM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    Thanks for the update. Much appreciated.

     

    I returned yesterday from a quick trip to Ohio, I understand how the weather is hampering the road testing as it was bitter cold and the road conditions poor. My flight was delayed for about one hour as they de-iced the plane, I am happy to be back in Florida!
    27 Jan, 10:24 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    Mucho Gracias John!

     

    HardToLove
    27 Jan, 11:44 AM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1777) | Send Message
     
    Well, I made it here thanks to WayneinOregon's link.

     

    John, thanks for the update on the ePower trucks.
    27 Jan, 11:13 AM Reply Like
  • obieephyhm
    , contributor
    Comments (1593) | Send Message
     
    i'm blaming everything on the 'polar vortex' from now on . . .
    27 Jan, 11:29 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    I can't help but feel this is "do or die" week. Either those significant sales have to come in the next week (two at most) or the price will fall below 0.09 next week and we'll have to endure another price failure and whatever consequences. Even just one or two power cubes will do the trick, at least for the short term.
    27 Jan, 11:41 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >nogoodslacker ... Chill! Don't expect anything to happen before March. October to January is planning time in the corporate world. Full of planning meetings and meetings about meetings. There is no economic activity going on out there in the world right now as everyone worries about where Demand will come from.
    27 Jan, 11:52 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    DRich, if that's true then we are in trouble. I'm just hoping for the already promised significant sales that should already have been planned for last summer when the promise was made.
    27 Jan, 12:39 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (723) | Send Message
     
    ngs, I have listened to every press conference, read every press release, and attended the last stockholder meeting listening very carefully. At no time have I ever heard the word "promise" come from the lips of management.

     

    Would you please provide a link to your repeated reports of said promise?

     

    Thanks.
    27 Jan, 12:54 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    Also, please correct if I'm wrong, the "won't be six months" was not in the summer, but in the CC in Nov.?

     

    HardToLove
    27 Jan, 01:00 PM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    HTL,

     

    "But yes, we are confident going forward that we do have and will have those orders and it won’t be six months out."

     

    This was TG's response to my questioning on the November 15th conference call.

     

    RBrun357
    27 Jan, 01:17 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    Thanks RBrun: my memories only partially broken then! :-))

     

    HardToLove
    27 Jan, 01:22 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >H.T.Love ... It was in the summer (CC or other) where we first heard about "significant" sales that could be discussed at the November CC. We did get a sale and the "won't be six months" assurance and I can't say what, if anything, was significant. I do know it was not a promise because promises in business are made with paper & ink. I wait to see if Axion has made that quick trip down to Office Depot to obtain such things ... just in case ... and can remember how they are used.
    27 Jan, 01:32 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    Ah! Thanks DRich - two different events. Remembered one, forgot the other.

     

    HardToLove
    27 Jan, 01:36 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    VW> I agree generally but technically I think TG on the August (?) call said he never before "promised" sales and then went on to "predict" sales by the Nov quarterly report. So he didn't promise, but the word 'promise' I believe left his lips. A niggling point yes I know. :)
    27 Jan, 01:53 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    Valleywood, please give it a rest with the semantics lesson. Call it a prediction, call it a prognositcation, call it a forecast, call it whatever you want. He clearly went out on a limb at the CC with a "prediction" of sigificant sales by the next CC; he then reiterated that prediction at the annual meeting. Then, suddenly at the CC it becomes "not six months." This is just the latest in a long string of raising expectations and not coming through.

     

    Clearly my interpretation of that as a promise falls within the definition of the word, especially #3 below.

     

    Promise. n. noun
    1.A declaration assuring that one will or will not do something; a vow.
    2. Something promised.
    3. Indication of something favorable to come; expectation.
    27 Jan, 02:04 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    Since we all have so much time on our hands to devote to "niggling points" :-)

     

    Here's TG's actual words:

     

    "I never promised orders on a timetable basis before. But, I will predict that we will have significant orders to talk about on our next earning call."

     

    Here's a link to the Aug. 15th, 2013 CC transcript:

     

    http://seekingalpha.co...
    27 Jan, 02:34 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    ngs> I invest for a living based on fundamentals. I do no technical analysis nor try to time or predict the markets. If I were managing money for investors and they were constantly nagging me about the timing of future capital gains, I would be forced to answer their questions. But in truth I could only guess at timing. I could not know when the securities would become overpriced in the markets and therefore I would sell and trigger the gains.

     

    My true performance would actually lie in how shrewd I was at investing their capital -- planting seeds and growing trees.
    The actual fruit harvest is years away and not something Axion should be judged on when just leaving the "development" stage.

     

    Yes timing of sales with no cash in the bank is absolutely critical, but it's sort of like nagging a farmer during a drought about when he thinks it will rain. It's out of Axion's control and they are doing their best I believe.

     

    I think with sales uncertain, any CEO is going to respond optimistically and perhaps exaggerate a bit. What CEO would respond and say "No, we are working on lots of RFP's and testing situations but I don't think any of them will come through for a couple years." I suggest we take predictions with a grain of salt. As Buffett has wisely said, sometimes you can figure out what will happen but almost never when.
    27 Jan, 02:57 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    RA, good on you for basing your investmenst on fundamentals. I agree that is the only way to go. The biggest fundamental in this case is that we are about a week or two away from getting PIPED again if sales don't materalize.

     

    If 'the actual fruit harvest is years away" as you suggest, then you can expect us farmers won't own more than a percent or two of the land by the time harvest comes around. In the meantime all the seedcorn is getting eaten by crows and we'll soon need to go into town to beg the banker for a loan to get seed for another year. Better rain soon is all I am saying.
    27 Jan, 03:07 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    ngs> The past (cost basis) is irrelevant for today's decision to buy, sell or hold (barring tax reasons). If you view today as 100% of the company spread over 215 million shares or so, a couple more pretty bad financings could mean about a 2 year lifeline and worst case I think 1 billion shares added.

     

    Share count would depend on market price. So if market price shoots up - not farfetched - we could get 2 years of cash for maybe 300 million more shares. Best case? Maybe as little as 200 million for 2 years.

     

    So I figure a most hopeful case if more 2 rounds are in fact needed would be ~50% dilution and worst case (1bn) would mean 83% dilution. Yikes, yes, but it's worst case roughly. I simply don't see any chance of your 1%, or 99% dilution. Even in my worst case if the market cap rose to a reasonable $120 million you'd be made whole on a share purchase made today.

     

    Yes there's plenty of risk but risk/reward picture is very lopsided to the upside. I think a PLUG type pps runup will come one day and I want to be in when that happens.
    27 Jan, 04:27 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    Ideally a few sales push the runway to early 2015, where a combination of good news and lack of PIPErs allow a comfortable new raise above 50 cents. "For production."
    27 Jan, 05:53 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (723) | Send Message
     
    RBrun 357,

     

    I also recall that remark as you quoted. I did not hear him use the word "promise" and evidently neither did you.

     

    Words mean things and it seems destructive to me to misquote or mis-remember something so serious as the word "promise".
    27 Jan, 05:59 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (723) | Send Message
     
    I will give semantics a rest when the language no longer has meaning to the rest of the world. The compulsion is powerful in the word "promise". It is merely predictive as he clearly said "predict".

     

    If I predict that I will be there to help you when you need my help it is just that. A prediction.

     

    If I promise that I will be there you can rest assured I will move heaven and hell to be at your side.
    27 Jan, 06:04 PM Reply Like
  • raleigh731
    , contributor
    Comments (292) | Send Message
     
    HTL,

     

    You are correct. He made that statement in Nov CC. That's why I stated before we are two months into the "not 6 months" comment. I am also anxious for news, as it could come any time, but he stillgiven himself 4 months pad to come up with sales. I believe there are sales in the funnel yet to come, through. They could be additional powercubes or Hyperlink orders. I still feel that NSC could come through with additional information on 999, or additional battery orders for the OTR engine. Still could get an announcement from a battery OEM for BMW. Anxiously waiting! It would be nice and re-assuring to see sales come closer and closer together, which would be a REAL signal!
    27 Jan, 06:23 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Raleigh, Why would anyone allow a free ride on the prior anticipated sales statement when they are clearly tied given the topic is the same?
    27 Jan, 06:43 PM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    Valley,

     

    Did I step on your toes?? Evidently I have mis represented my position! I do not remember emphasizing the word "promise" or "practice"! But when a CEO presents his opinion expressed as a "prediction" I do attach my expectations to it. When they "promise" something and then not deliver I am even more disappointed!
    27 Jan, 07:35 PM Reply Like
  • raleigh731
    , contributor
    Comments (292) | Send Message
     
    ii,

     

    I'm just saying that TG made a statement that sales "would not be 6 months", which leaves almost 4 months until that "deadline". I do think he sees developments that we don't. And, there are statements on this board that are accusing TG of being dishonest because sales haven't materialized from that November statement date and now. Until the 15th of May comes with no sales, he is not being untruthful. I am an unrepentant optimist, unfortunately for me, but I still believe we will see some movement before May per TG's statement. Good luck to you and all Axionistas!
    27 Jan, 10:05 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Thanks Raleigh. I find it hard for myself to just ignore the prior timetable he relayed to us concerning hoped for sales which did not materialize and then start with a clean slate with the same zeal waiting for him to be right THIS TIME. I'm sure things will come, I just don't think he has a clear enough perspective to be using the words he uses when he delivers his guesses. His record doesn't make him look good based on the repetitive differentials IMO.

     

    Please understand that my opinion would be far different if TG would at least address the gap between his prior thoughts and the subsequent respective outcomes. But he never does so and continues to go on using the same tactics. There are some instances where he has addressed this when asked but it's just doesn't deliver the same level of confidence to an investor as if he at least broached the topic himself. Not for me anyway.

     

    Please understand that I do not think he is dishonest. I do however suspect he is using this as a tactic to gain time in supporting the stock price and I think his days are long over in using this tool. I cannot place any confidence level at all in his guidance for events to occur in a time frame he is willing to share, His track record is like a broken record. Groundhog day.

     

    BTW, It's not good thinking about the fact that I think he has this characteristic and it's well recognized knowing we will need funds soon enough.
    27 Jan, 11:38 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    In its recent report to the Senate, the DOE said that "the storage component still constitutes only 30% to 40% of the total system cost."

     

    Think about the Bysolar sale for a minute. It was $320,000 for batteries, racks, wiring and minor electronics. If the DOE estimate is right, the end-user is paying $800,000 to $1 million for an integrated storage system and probably spending another $2 to $3 million for the related solar installation. It's a big complex project with many moving pieces and the batteries are not the be all and end all.

     

    We've all seen or created GAANT charts for big projects and know that events can't occur out of order because they're a small part of a larger whole.

     

    As near as I can tell the Bysolar project is a privately funded commercial installation that needed the batteries at a specific point on the GAANT chart. The best view TG had of when the batteries would be required was somebody else's work product.
    28 Jan, 06:48 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Fair enough. So how about saying something in the first follow up get together like," Well we got the xyz sale which consists of yada yada yada. This represents ab % of my prior sales forecast and of the remaining targeted sales all but one remain active. Then maybe expand on the remainder if at all possible and end with any added opportunities. See, a level of understanding on what was expected, what we got and a little gap analysis. This with a final dose of what's next. Now the audience has a clue about what's going on. IMO that works a whole lot better than just a press release that doesn't tie the sale to the prior targets and leaves the audience high and dry on gaps and added opportunities. As a matter of fact the way it's handled with the late meeting starts and rigid end times it's pretty insulting. He'd have to use a well known finger to do much better. JMO.
    28 Jan, 08:06 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I'm pretty obsessive about being five minutes early for everything, but I know that the host of every party has to be concerned with guests who insist on showing up fashionably late. With that kind of dynamic somebody always figures he's getting the finger because the party started late or because the party started without him. I'm just glad it's a choice I don't have to make.

     

    I don't envy TG's position of looking at somebody else's GAANT Charts and trying to estimate the timing of his revenue. It would be great if the customers would let TG talk about their projects and explain when he thought the batteries would be needed, but for systems that aren't funded by the government the customer's security concerns frequently outweigh Axion's desire to talk.

     

    In the last CC Tom said orders were on their way and "it wouldn't be six months." I'm betting that he had a stack of other people's GAANT Charts sitting on the table for projects that were already underway because nothing less would support the statement. At the end of the day the only thing that matters is the customer's rules. If I have to choose between an angry customer and a cranky stockholder the customer wins every time.
    28 Jan, 08:21 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    All well and fine but the customer sensitivity issue you have covered more than once in the past. Nobody is asking for TG to share, nor did I ask for, customer detail. It's not required one bit to deliver the level of detail I laid out. Generic works just fine.

     

    I'm sure you know the correct answer for the appropriate time to start a business meeting. There is no next best. If he feels he wants to delay for some reason he can start on time and ask to wait a period. Or he can start late and apologies for being late.
    28 Jan, 09:11 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    "He'd have to use a well known finger to do much better." If that statement wasn't a pity, it would be funny.
    28 Jan, 09:25 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I won't defend the late start on the conference calls because it bugs me too. But I know there are always choices and they can be very difficult. I can't say whether the start time decisions are good or bad without access to facts I don't possess.

     

    Putting on my customer hat for a minute; exactly what do you think TG's reasonable expectations should be about delivery dates for the eight battery packs that I plan to buy for my demonstration fleet?

     

    I know what ePower plans to do and I've communicated those plans to Axion. So far I'm thrilled with my progress and dismayed with my pace. I'll bet you a nickel Tom feels the same way.

     

    In a prior life Tom was an elevator contractor who knew he had a sale about the time somebody started digging the foundation for a new building. He also knew the contractor had a series of intermediate steps to complete before the elevators could be installed. Knowing what will happen is easy. Knowing when it will happen is a bitch.
    28 Jan, 09:28 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5083) | Send Message
     
    Do you own ePower now? Every sentence has "I" and "my company"

     

    it's so funny it was so unheard of, and now is the savior of the world since the great AXPW prophet arrived.
    28 Jan, 09:50 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    Yes, words have meaning and I even provided the definition for you, which clearly applies to my intended use of the word. The fact that you have your own special meaning matters not to me. I am sure you are a great person and all that, but I have decided not to engage you further on this board. I can get hopeful cheerleading from any number of sources.
    28 Jan, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >JP ... My impression is (and not to be too harsh here) is that Mr. Granville doesn't have signed P.O's, contracts or other solid documents in hand. I have nothing more than a feeling that the immediate future is based on good sales meetings, RFI's, RFQ's and such. He can point to ePower's purchase even as he can't say when you want it and it wouldn't be out of bounds if we didn't know who the buyer was. There is paper between the two. This is not the case for any other piece of business. There is no mention of forward looking quantity, inventory build or ramp plans.

     

    I just don't know how business is and my hope is that it is going better than Market activity we tend to focus on. The known is not indicative of the unknown but leads one to believe the unknown is worrisome.
    28 Jan, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    It may very well be 4 more months. My whole original point, which seems to be lost in a semantics lesson, is that this stock will be toast if it does take 4 more months to get news of any significant sale. News needs to come in the next week or two or we will suffer the consequenses of another price failure.
    28 Jan, 09:59 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I don't own ePower, but I have a big enough interest to make me smile. I also have executive responsibilities for ePower and clearly understand the steps a customer has to go though before it's in a position to schedule a delivery date for batteries..

     

    My fondest hope is that we will be a significant factor in Axion's success. Calling ePower a savior is unwarranted at this point because we have far too many intermediate goals that we have to accomplish first.

     

    I understand you derive great pleasure from making things seem worse than they are, but please save the insults for somebody who cares about your opinion.
    28 Jan, 09:59 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5083) | Send Message
     
    Of course, if you can pull off a big enough IPO with ePower then u can buy AXPW and put it out of it's misery ... and of course appoint TG as CEO again :)
    28 Jan, 10:06 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    John -

     

    I really don't think anyone derives great pleasure in making things seem worse than they are. (Maybe Omy, but it seems s/he is currently correct to have questioned everything).

     

    I think people are just sick of putting lipstick on a pig - and right now, well the stock price speaks for itself.
    28 Jan, 10:08 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    The whole GAANT chart excuse, if true, worries me even more because it implies only one customer in the pipeline and the whole "significant sale" is just a one-off event. If on the other hand it is truly "significant sales" (plural) as stated and reiterated by TG, it doesn't seem likely that everyone's GAANT chart could be running behind schedule.

     

    Frankly, I'm surprised the lawyers aren't all over this one. A lot of people, including me, bought more stock after he reiterated his prediction. I'm starting to wonder if I got suckered into a pump and dump scheme here.
    28 Jan, 10:08 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5083) | Send Message
     
    "I'm starting to wonder if I got suckered into a pump and dump scheme here."

     

    There is a place for the PbC, however IMO it is much more of a "niche" mkt.

     

    With that said, for years TG and his mentor have told a great story and painted a picture of hope and "coming soon" to get shareholders to keep buying stock.....meantime we see where it is and how much as actually materialized. I was suckered into it too...
    28 Jan, 10:15 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Every potential Axion customer has its own GAANT Chart. That's just the way things work when you manufacture a key component for somebody else's integrated systems. You wait until they're ready to accept delivery your product even if your sale is a fait accompli.

     

    Tom has GAANT Charts for BMW, NS, ePower and heaven knows who else. Each of those GAANT Charts is contingent on the schedule somebody else hopes to maintain. When an executive in TG's position is looking at a stack of GAANT charts it's pretty easy to say in mid-November that delivery dates for some of the projects are less than six months off.

     

    The suggestion that there's only one GAANT Chart on the table is more appropriate to the Yahoo! Message Boards; but that's true of a lot of the commentary I've been reading in recent weeks.
    28 Jan, 10:18 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    John - the rampant negative speculation is fueled by the radio silence from New Castle in the face of a terrible financing that has decimated the share price and projections that have not been met.

     

    - NS who does not seem to move forward.
    - BMW who has not publicly commented in years.
    - Vague references to 6 or 7 automakers that are testing, but no details.
    - Trucking companies that may or not be testing (besides ePower)
    - The Asian automaker who was about to use BMW's data and then apparently fell off the map, with their trucking company doing some testing.
    - Could go on, but the point is that much of criticism is warrented - hence the terrible share price.
    28 Jan, 10:26 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    John, I know you don't condone the late start times for the meetings. He should know better and since it's repetitive it's intentional for some reason we don't know about or there is no reason just little respect for the audience. Not good for man with tin cup nor investors dependent on him. I'll bet he didn't come in late time and again for the BMW meetings he needed to attend.

     

    Your question on ePower is easy and I can use it as an example for the other unknowns. Let's ignore the fact Axion has an order and that ePower has given Axion a level of control over info. sharing about the ePower program that far exceeds any other potential customers we know of. ePower is unknown Q co. and wants autonomy.

     

    So, knowing what you have shared, Axion might say during this coming quarters cc," Well we had expected some added sales anouncements from Q co. which were part or my prior cc sales numbers however due to the unusual weather we have had in areas of the US that have impacted their development progress these deliveries have slipped beyond my original target timing. Nothing has changed with the companies plans so I expect these sales should be added to the future sales opportunities we will be discussing after I conclude review of my last sales forecast."

     

    See, customer is not at risk. We are given a level of detail that explains the deviation from the original plans and we know the relationship is still intact. That's fair and nobody has been hurt.

     

    It's not hard. You just have to be sensitive to the fact that investors need something more than mushrooms.
    28 Jan, 10:27 AM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    I forget when the exact date was but it seems to me that the predictions of 300% YOY revenue increase started quite some time ago and the successful follow through on the prodictions has been very poor. Not to say that tomorrow the significant orders won't appear but the predictions have been long in tooth!!
    28 Jan, 10:28 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Stefan> The member of our cohort who knows NS best is convinced their program is moving forward under deep cover and the results have impressed the hell out of his former employer. Ignore me if you want, but pay attention to what Valleywood has to say.

     

    Getting a design win in automotive is a lot like having sex with a gorilla. Once you get started you're not done till the gorilla says you're done or kills you. I'm really tired of the process, but I've seen nothing to suggest that we've been killed and neither have you.

     

    We don't know who Axion is working with in trucking, but I know that ePower couldn't get a phone call or e-mail returned until Axion appeared on the scene and as soon as Axion made a request we had our truck on the Cummins test track with about 20 Cummins engineers in attendance. ePower did not have the stroke to make the meeting happen. Axion did.

     

    We're all really pissed off with the behavior of the PIPE investors over the last few months. Unfortunately that anger is coming out sideways and generating attacks on our managers and customers. I find the continual harping about the actions of potential customers nauseating.

     

    RBrun357> The 300% revenue increase prediction happened a couple years ago in a year-end conference call. At his earliest opportunity Tom publicly admitted he had mis-spoken and apologized for the transitory attack of foot in mouth disease. The only reason you keep hearing that stupid number is that some people don't know how to accept an apology - EVER. I had an ex-wife like that.
    28 Jan, 11:07 AM Reply Like
  • User462699
    , contributor
    Comments (112) | Send Message
     
    Want me to go for the Marshals Sheriff? The mob's gettin' ugly.
    28 Jan, 11:16 AM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    " ... the way it's handled with the late meeting starts and rigid end times it's pretty insulting."

     

    Thanks for your comments this morning Iindelco. A couple of words that have come to mind for me in addition to "insulting" is "condescending" and "disdainful".
    28 Jan, 11:31 AM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    "The 300% revenue increase prediction happened a couple years ago in a year-end conference call. At his earliest opportunity Tom publicly admitted he had mis-spoken and apologized for the transitory attack of foot in mouth disease."

     

    FWIW, that 300% revenue increase "prediction" was a MAJOR catalyst for some major stock purchases of mine, and for my continued optimism even after that revenue didn't materialize. I was not aware TG admitted to "mis-speaking", and for a long time gave TG a lot of “slack” and continued to believe those revenues were right around the corner. I even believed it was possible the delay in securing financing last year was because revenue was so close, and TG was negotiating from a position of strength. My optimism was fueled further after TG awarded himself and other top management 3-year contract extensions and generous bonuses to boot. Not knowing management as I do now, I assumed those were merit-based developments.

     

    I held my position after the PIPE deal because even though TG didn't mention "300%" at the May 2013 CC call, he continued to say many positive things, which indicated many good things were right around the corner... as he did again in August... as he did again in September... as he did again in November.... I often don't know what to make of it all, but I do know that it has cost me and a lot of other Axionista a LOT of money for taking TG at his word. --- I feel I could be a little more forgiving if he would take to heart many of the well articulated points that Iindelco has laid out this morning. I would interpret many of Iindelco’s comments as pleading for TG to talk to us in a mature and respectful manner. My own belief is that TG starts CC meetings late because he really doesn’t want to be there, and really doesn’t want to talk to us. If he did, he would be PREPARED to tell us things that he has to realize are important for us to know, WITHOUT breaking any kind of NDA or other confidentiality agreements.
    28 Jan, 12:12 PM Reply Like
  • growsmart
    , contributor
    Comments (172) | Send Message
     
    Give it a rest!
    28 Jan, 12:41 PM Reply Like
  • growsmart
    , contributor
    Comments (172) | Send Message
     
    Get over it. Many of the comments now are repetitive whines. This used to be an interesting and useful discussion where all we had to worry about was some yucky trolls. Now the regular contributors are the problem. The comments are so negative that if I didn't know better 1) as a stockholder I would dump my shares, and 2) as a customer I would look for a better company and better people to do business with.
    I am not going to dump my shares and I hope customers will not be put off by what they read here.
    28 Jan, 12:50 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Wayne IO, That is exactly my expectation of how I expect a person in TG's position to act and for whatever reason I sense gaps. Gaps that are not welcome. He has failed miserably to show leadership in this area. I hope it doesn't extend to his employees and our potential customers.
    28 Jan, 12:51 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I interpreted the employment contracts quite differently from you. From my perspective they were merely a clear sign that a financing transaction was close because professional investors don't put money into a company without knowing they've got the management team locked in place for the next couple years. While some might consider 10% of base salary a nice bonus, in executive employment agreements the word generous doesn't begin apply until you get to 50% or 100% of base.

     

    I think Tom has a very clear view of WHAT is going to happen but a much murkier view of WHEN it is going to happen. He can look at somebody else's GAANT Chart and circle dates on his calendar, but the actual timing is not something he can control, or for that matter even influence. From everything I've heard on the conference calls the WHAT has only gotten more impressive with the passage of time. Unfortunately many shareholders only want to know "Are we there yet Dad?," and that's the one question Tom can't answer. Suffice it to say I'mm damned glad I don't have his job because I certainly don't believe I could do a better job.
    28 Jan, 12:52 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3450) | Send Message
     
    Obviously, more angst being aired today. Never a joyous process. But FWIW I think John has weighed in with very valid responses. This bit confused me a little however: "professional investors don't put money into a company without knowing they've got the management team locked in place for the next couple years." As I think we know all too well now, in the end we were consummated with *financiers*, not real investors. The only way I can square it is to assume the contracts/bonuses (which I don't object to btw) were written in context of the strategic investor that was in play and not the PIPErs... Would I have that right?
    28 Jan, 01:16 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    >>Unfortunately many shareholders only want to know "Are we there yet Dad?," <<

     

    Since I am probably one of the ones you are referring to, let me adjust your whiney kid metaphor to be more fitting. Instead of a whiney kid in the back saying "are we there yet Dad?" I feel more like a panicked passenger when drunken dad is speeding toward a curve in the road and what I am really saying is, "will we get there alive, Dad?"
    28 Jan, 01:42 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    "Give it a rest!"

     

    Growsmart, I can relate to some of your frustrations; it sometimes gets to be a bit much for me as well. But I do believe it’s important to discuss thoroughly, and even sometimes redundantly, important factors that affect investment decisions. And with a microcap company, I think it’s especially important to consider the performance of top management.

     

    I try not to get too personal with some of my frustrations, and yes, even angers, because I don’t believe it’s good in a spiritual sense to hold onto undue negativity toward another person, whether in management, politics, etc. But I wish there had been more candid discussions on this board at the time I was making some important investment decisions. Perhaps I would have better understood that in some important ways, Axion management has feet of clay, and would have made investment decisions accordingly.

     

    I don’t know if you believe my posts have been overly critical or whiney, but I’ve tried to keep them measured and as accurate as possible. Despite some of the frustrations I’ve written about management, I added shares last week and again this morning, based on what I feel is a pragmatic optimism. But at least I now feel I’m making decisions with a better understanding of risks I wasn’t aware of in the past. And I’m thankful for “most” of the venting on this board that has given me this better understanding.
    28 Jan, 02:27 PM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    "RBrun357> The 300% revenue increase prediction happened a couple years ago in a year-end conference call. At his earliest opportunity Tom publicly admitted he had mis-spoken and apologized for the transitory attack of foot in mouth disease. The only reason you keep hearing that stupid number is that some people don't know how to accept an apology - EVER. I had an ex-wife like that."

     

    Thank you for that, I understand the ex-wife statement as I have a few buddies that tell similar stories! Fortunately for me my first and only wife has held onto me for over 30 years so I cannot directly relate!

     

    As for the apology stuff, it doesn't work well for me when I loose my money based on statements that I allow myself to accept as truthful. Therefore, I will probably never accept my own apology to myself for allowing myself to get into this position. Again, with all of this so called negativity and frustration being voiced the past few days I am becoming more optimistic that the next chapter must be getting near. It is always darker before the dawn or something like that! ;-))

     

    I continue to be a loyal Axionista even with the dark clouds overhead as I have continued to purchase additional shares at these very depressed levels and lower my overall cost per share. I continue to believe that Axion is still worth the gamble and I truly am anxious for the day when the good news is flowing once again and the attitude on these boards are refocused, hopeful as well as joyful. But until then I truly believe that this board is also the place for nervous and frustrated shareholders and fellow Axionistas to voice there opinions both positive and negative regarding how the company is performing and communicating. It is my opinion that the CEO is responsible for communicating with the shareholder base in order to provide truthful and accurate data. If he does not perform this function well he then may be responsible for creating an environment of unhappy and frustrated shareholders that utilize modern day blog technology to share their opinions.

     

    As I tell my parents who are in their 80's and have questions and complaints regarding their current predicaments, "it is what it is"!

     

    RBrun357
    28 Jan, 02:55 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    >JP

     

    From what I can glean from NGS's comment history, he got in at 0.30 in Sep, 2012, and doubled down at 0.275 in March, 2013. At that time he said he was "way overweight" the stock. He then got housed by the PIPE deal. He added a few shares on the way down but ultimately is in for $20,000 near 0.25 which probably represents a significant portion of his savings. I understand his frustration as I also bought shares at 0.40 and 0.25. I predict NGS would sell if it ever got above 0.30. I would probably also sell the shares I bought at 0.40 and 0.25 if it reached those levels. The difference is that I have a massive position at 0.12, and am trying to get my taxes in order for 2013 early so I can back up the truck for another big chunk at 0.09. One day we're going to wake up and share price will be 0.30 (up 300% on the day). Those of us who had the opportunity to buy shares here will be breaking out the champagne. Those who are gun-shy because of the late arrival of significant sales will simply be relieved.
    28 Jan, 03:22 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9984) | Send Message
     
    A long, long time ago, TG had stated (I'm paraphrasing) that a top five Asian OEM was looking at the PbC. I believe this was in conjunction with BMW. Then TG sort of went mute about the both the Asian OEM and BMW. I believe back then TG knew that BMW and Toyota had joined up in efforts to make a lithium-air battery.

     

    This news was announced last January, and then another press release came out this past December, and can be read in the provided link below.

     

    In the vague-ness of info coming out of New Castle, it's always hard to connect the dots. But when last year in January, I discovered that BMW and Toyota were teaming up, I figured back then Axion was on the outs.

     

    (I do realize the difference between a pure EV and a hybrid, but it looks like both Toyota and BMW have turned away from the PbC for their s/s vehicles. How can one surmise differently, when TG won't even talk about BMW, unless prodded to do so?)

     

    Being that "Axion" is a hypothetical sub-atomic particle of low mass and energy that is postulated to exist, I guess I should have done a better job in postulating that any involvement from BMW and Toyota with Axion, was indeed an idea, a hope, a dream, that now holds little mass and energy.

     

    http://bit.ly/1gnxoM5
    28 Jan, 03:29 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    Wait wait wait! Let's recall the facts here:

     

    In last years Q1 report, after the lithium air announcement, Axion said they began working with a supplier of a major automaker, which TG said later was BMW.

     

    In following CCs TG stated they have bi-weekly meetings with BMW.

     

    It's far too soon to call the program dead.
    28 Jan, 03:52 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Lithium-air is a fascinating technology, but nobody expects it to be available in commercial form for at least a decade because nobody's been able to build a cell that works. If the technology is ever developed commercially, it will be used for electric drive, not engine starting.

     

    Toyota and BMW will spend scads of money developing mission critical technologies that are essential to their core business of making and selling cars. They're not likely to get into the subcomponent business.
    28 Jan, 03:54 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    Patrick. You are pretty close on my holdings. I added more at 0.124 so my basis is now about .22. It bugs me that the stock I sold for the last buy has doubled in price since then. FML, as the kids say. I had a big limit order for 0.10 but I pulled that when the significant sales failed to materialize before the last CC. I have felt hoodwinked ever since, as you can probably tell. One thing you got wrong, however, is I am not likely to sell if it get's above 0.30 because that will probably mean we pulled out of this nose dive and a visible revenue stream has been achieved. I might even start buying again on the way up. I'm flattered that you took the time to peruse my entire posting history--nice to know I am stalk-worthy.
    28 Jan, 03:59 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9984) | Send Message
     
    I wrote, "...little mass and energy." Not that the program is dead.

     

    There's a lot of information out there about which way Toyota and BMW are going, battery-wise. And we all know behemoth JCI is going toward a 48V + 12V configuration. It appears that Axion is more or less done improving the PbC, because they no longer have R&D expense indicated on their 10Q.

     

    Yet nothing coming from BMW or Toyota about Axion. Only Axion talks about mysterious every other week calls with BMW, and that a second source battery maker is being pursued. That was months and months ago. Yes, these things take time, but I'm seeing new battery technology being implemented all over the auto OEM space, and yet not one whit about the PbC. And yet BMW and Toyota are either independently or mutually announcing future models coming with battery technology quite different than the PbC.

     

    I deeply wish I could be more optimistic, but right now all I see is a mirage, an apparition of hope stuck in a quagmire of vagueness.

     

    I can only go on what information I have, and what I have is less than appealing investing-wise for the automotive sector when it comes to Axion Power.
    28 Jan, 04:16 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    According to a recent report from Navigant 48-volt systems will become important in the 2020s, but they'll be irrelevant for the next seven to ten years. – http://bit.ly/1mA4GrI

     

    There is an entire second generation of micro hybrids coming during that time period. Nobody in the industry thinks AGM will be adequate for Gen2 micro-hybrids and the other pretenders are exactly that. I'm all in favor of a long term investment horizon but I don't ignore the short term implications as they become painfully obvious.

     

    If you want to understand this battery join me on my next trip to Cincinnati and see for yourself what it can do in another "impossible" application.
    28 Jan, 04:42 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    >NGS
    Gleaning information is my area of expertise: it's one of too few useful skills I've learned as a result of being a Ph.D. student, which is a phase of my life that is, thankfully, coming to a close in 6-9 months. If you know anyone considering a Ph.D., strongly discourage them. Took me all of 15 minutes to get that info. I did it because I don't believe in Gremlins and wanted to prove you're just really fed-up with the return on your investment.
    28 Jan, 05:17 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Patrick, You could have asked. Most already know.
    28 Jan, 05:22 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9984) | Send Message
     
    JP: Thanks for the invite! That might be doable come spring, as not only would I love to visit ePower, but I also have a newly betrothed nephew living in Cincy. In another life, the Ramada Inn in Florence, KY, used to be a customer of mine, so I know the territory well.

     

    However, it may be true that JCIs 48V + 12V won't roll out until after 2020, which incidentally is a couple of years behind JCI's 5+5+5 plan (of which targets 2017/2018), there are other chemistries rolling out sooner, as in the new flexible silicon battery being developed by Japan's Seksui Chemical Company, which states they are going into mass production in the automotive sector by 2015, with a $290 cost per kilowatt-hour, and will be able to deliver as much as 600 kilometers per charge. No range anxiety there! Expected 2015 revenues? 20 billion yen in 2015.

     

    How come we can't get this kind of info out of New Castle?

     

    http://bit.ly/1fui2Rg
    28 Jan, 05:24 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2893) | Send Message
     
    That's a great idea JP. I would think that Maya's take, as it always was a must read in early Axionista days, would carry a lot of water around these parts.

     

    I especially want to hear from someone who is no longer skewed by having skin in the game. I'm sure Maya is busy but that could be a fun excursion and likely worth the effort and expense.
    28 Jan, 05:31 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2893) | Send Message
     
    I'd be amazed if Seksui can get to 200M dollars in a year or two. Seems optimistic on the kilowatt cost reduction too. But then again maybe I'm skewed from watching paint dry for 4+ years.

     

    But point taken, sometimes you have to beat your own drum a bit.
    28 Jan, 05:39 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    John -

     

    Any idea how long Maxwell/Continental and Peugot tested their system before announcing a design win?
    28 Jan, 06:00 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Maya> By the time spring rolls around I hope to have hard data in hand from a series of real world demonstration tests with fleet operators. So while we can schedule for later, it won't exactly be a sneak peak.

     

    Stefan> I've heard reports that Maxwell, Continental and Peugeot devoted several years to testing and ensuring supply chain reliability. Of the two phases, the supply chain was the most critical issue because an OEM can't design a component into a mainline product without absolute certainty that they can order hundreds of thousands of units per year and receive deliveries on time every time. Having a billion dollar assembly plant shut down because the batteries haven't arrived yet is a monster problem.
    28 Jan, 06:13 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2893) | Send Message
     
    PY,

     

    I know it's all relative, but NGS (based on your calculations) is still a digit or two behind the losses some Axionistas have taken. Maybe there is some perverse comfort in that. Alas, hope burns near eternal.
    28 Jan, 06:21 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3450) | Send Message
     
    Maya, I hope you can/will go. Such an experience, and the resulting reportage derived *straight from the direct customer experience* could do much to assuage yet the latest round of Mirage-atosis the Axionista brotherhood has been suffering.
    We've journeyed long. Many times, we've been sure we spy the oasis just on the horizon.... and then we get there and just more sand.. It becomes easy to start thinking the whole thing might be one big lie. We've been fooled so many times now we just want to kill something. The frustrations build and accumulate on each other until it starts to seem, unimaginable though it is, that the only plausible answer is that the whole thing has just been a fairy tale. That the PbC is not what we think it is, and that it and Axion are never going to amount to a hill of beans in this world...
    But ePower *directly* refutes this. Their hands-on experience with the battery, right now, today, in flesh made steel, refutes many many doubts and confirms the essential story. In their application PbC is simply doing what other batteries can't. For real. Just like we've believed all along. That's why ePower is so truly golden. Absolutely priceless at this stage. It is tiny yes, and garners little attention, but it *is* our provenance. Their positive experience with the battery is invaluable and can restore to us, with great justification, the confidence that, however overlong, the Axion/PbC journey *is* in fact going to conclude the way we always knew it would, with the PbC becoming a successful part of the battery landscape and vital to some niches. To me, John's word will always be good enough, but the fact is, he's just one man and one voice, so adding another set of trusted eyes on ePower's revelatory experiences and another trusted voice to the reportage thereof will only add value. If I only lived closer, (and could afford a nurse for my mom) I would lobby for an invitation myself. But if indeed Maya or anyone else of similar stature could go along with and see for themselves, be the "en loco" eyes and ears of the Axionistas, as it were, and report back, it would be a beautiful, beautiful thing...
    28 Jan, 06:49 PM Reply Like
  • thotdoc
    , contributor
    Comments (1732) | Send Message
     
    Hi 46-

     

    I think you are right; it is getting ugly.

     

    I just hope something constructive comes out of it.
    28 Jan, 08:37 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    Maya -
    That information should have likely been contained within the Axion SBIR grant application that was rejected last year and that was redacted by Axion.
    28 Jan, 08:49 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9984) | Send Message
     
    Stefan: What info? Lots of "swirl" going on today, and I would like to be on point, if possible.

     

    48 & zoooka: JP's invite is...inviting. Am I allowed to name-call my carpenter here? Well, I'm waiting on him to finish off some work, so I can get a painter in here, and then I want to "geriatrify" the master bathroom for my later years, which are coming faster than I'd like!
    28 Jan, 09:55 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    Maya - you asked - "How come we can't get this kind of info out of New Castle?"

     

    Information similar to what you referenced in the Seksui Chemical Company link and probably a lot more specific to Axion's commercialization plan is available in the Axion grant application which was redacted.
    28 Jan, 10:23 PM Reply Like
  • greentongue
    , contributor
    Comments (880) | Send Message
     
    Wouldn't it be interesting to know who exactly did the redacting?
    29 Jan, 07:22 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    48, I think maybe my main point got missed. I don't doubt is is a great battery and it will eventually catch on in several applications and Axion will likely become profitable eventually. The problem is (and this is my entire point) that "eventually" is at least several quarters away and we are knocking on the door of another price failure right now. The consequences of another price failure would either be accelerated rate of shares issued to PIPErs (hence more rapid dilution), or at worst, a full blown liquidity crisis if the PIPErs demand the cash plus 25% option. All the product praising is not going to help. The only remedy is a clear and credible communication of a revenue ramp some time in the next week or two. For now, I will shut up about it, which I am sure will make everyone happy (unless I am compelled to counter some irrational happy speak about what a slam dunk this stock is).
    29 Jan, 09:21 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Eventually is only one announcement away because all the market is looking for is a path to sustainable revenue, rather than a history of sustained revenue. If any of Axion's big dogs decide to do something important, the path could clear instantaneously. Heck, even ePower could provide that path if the fuel economy tests we plan to run next week are as strong as we hope they'll be.

     

    This month Axion announced amendments that reduced the monthly installments to $625 K for March and April, and to $375 K for May and June, assuming there were no additional early debt conversions after the 10-Q was filed on November 7th.

     

    The measuring period for the March installment is already over and the pre-installment shares will be issued by Friday. The next measuring period will start on February 5th and end on February 26th. Unless there's a price failure during that 15-day period it won't matter. If there's a price failure during that period, all the PIPErs could demand is a single $625K payment with a penalty.

     

    Over the last several months the PIPErs have pounded over ten million new shares a month into the market. This week their supply will be replenished with a significantly smaller number of new shares.

     

    The sky is not falling. There are challenges but the failure to overcome them within some arbitrary timeframe is not the doomsday scenario you posit.
    29 Jan, 09:49 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    NGS: "unless I am compelled to counter some irrational happy speak about what a slam dunk this stock is".

     

    Option 3: don't get into the business of trying to convince anyone. Present, allow them to consider, maybe respond to new considerations and otherwise let them draw their conclusions without taking (er, me donating) my time and energy with repetition that is unlikely to change their minds anyway.

     

    Has a side-effect of letting me hear better, although the few remaining brain cells may make that a wasted benefit.

     

    MHO,
    HardToLove
    29 Jan, 09:56 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    HTL. Fair enough. When someone pisses on my leg and tries to tell me it's raining, it is hard to resist the urge to offer a countering view, lest the rest of the world should come to think rain is supposed to smell like piss. We will know in a week or two if my concerns were warranted. For now I'm done trying to explain the situation to anyone.
    29 Jan, 10:01 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    ngs> John's rebuttal I find a lot more convincing than your argument.

     

    However, let me try another tack here. You suggest that shareholder prosperity hinges on a binary event to occur or not occur very soon -- sales announcements.

     

    Supposing that is true, what is the ultimate upside vs downside to buying at 10 cents? Worst case for any stock is always a 100% loss. But what is the upside? 1000%? More? If you think the technology has a future I would say 1000% would be the minimum, meaning sooner or later the shares would only have to hit $1.10.

     

    Now supposing it's a binary gamble that is 50/50, and someone is willing to take that chance, then AXPW really IS a slam dunk buy. That's because it would be like laying your money on red in roulette, but with a payoff of 10 to 1. I'll take that bet.

     

    In truth, I don't think a 100% loss is any more than a remote possibility and that the chance of black (some loss) is closer to 25% than 50% so the opportunity is even better.
    29 Jan, 11:10 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    RA, I was going to explain something, but I remembered my promise to button my lip for a couple of weeks. You pays your money and you takes your chances.
    29 Jan, 11:41 AM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    " ... reduced the monthly installments to $625 K for March and April, and to $375 K for May and June ... The measuring period for the March installment is already over ..."

     

    JP, special thanks for spelling this out so clearly. I was already breathing easier after Axion responded so swiftly to the <.10 situation, and am breathing even far easier with your above details. --- Thanks.
    29 Jan, 01:56 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3450) | Send Message
     
    ngs, honestly, it wasn't really your comments I was specifically keying off of..but appreciate your clarifications just the same. Agreed, that the destinies of PbC, Axion, and AXPW.OB are three distinct things and could well diverge. But I do think the veracity of the merits of the PbC itself are utterly foundational to the fortunes of the other two. Timing is of course going to determine much. And so far it has only played hell with us... But who knows, after this interminable dry spell, maybe we're due for a break.
    29 Jan, 04:54 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (1047) | Send Message
     
    ngs, JP addressed some of your ongoing concerns last Thursday. Since I thought it was one of the most significant, relevant and timely posts made regarding shareholders' current situation, I thought I would re-post it again for all our benefit.

     

    I personally believe the thin ice we've been skating on for the past few months has gotten a little thicker. Who would have guessed last summer that retail investors would buy up the tens of millions of shares being dumped onto the market by the PIPRs? And now that we're near the end of the process, with the number of shares being dumped going down dramatically, I wouldn't expect retail investors to stop buying at this point. In fact, it would make a lot of sense that their buying would actually increase as the end of cheap shares "may" now be in sight.

     

    I also have concerns about breaking <.09, but I'm also encouraged by how swiftly the <.10 was addressed in January. Yes, could mean more dilution, but that is inconsequential (in my own mind) at this juncture. The real concern for me is when Axiion needs new financing, and I don't believe that will happen for a good many months. --- I myself am taking deeper breaths these days. Some of my high anxiety over the past few months is giving way to some pragmatic optimism. --- Here's John's post from last Thursday:

     

    nogoodslacker> We have no more months of 10 million share selling by the PIPErs. Under the new deal terms the available ammo in the PIPErs arsenal will fall to about 6.25 million shares a month for the next two months and then fall to 3.75 million shares a month for the last two months. Since the available data indicates that the PIPErs are responsible for 80% to 90% of sell side activity, the impact of the reduced reload could be significant. After all, the market is accustomed to having 10 million new shares a month and when you cut the supply side by a third its an important change.
    27 Jan, 12:54 PM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    I truly believe that everything in Axionistaville would change dramatically with the advent of a "significant order" announcement! We could all be watching the formulation of the Perfect Storm, with all of the PIPER shares being absorbed by retail investors I believe the surge in share buying would be extraordinary once the next chapter has started. I can envision 100,000,000 trading volume days once the fear of defeat is replaced with a very steep climb in revenues!

     

    Of course this is still a big gamble as we all know that those illusive "significant orders" have only been proclaimed to exist and have yet to be spotted. Something like the Bigfoot monster that is claimed to be out roaming the wilds that many truly believe to exist!

     

    February 15th will be 3 months into the 6 month window of time expectation that TG stated. Since it won't be 6 months per TG's statement then I believe that if anyone has a desire to absorb cheap shares your time is running out. But then again, based on TG's past performance maybe time is not running out for cheap shares at all. I guess this quandary is the main reason we are at $.095!

     

    RBrun357
    27 Jan, 01:39 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    WiO, you should go back to that thread and finish with my reply to JP's reply. If VWAP goes below 0.09 this week, we will be firmly in the vortex of a death spiral. Right now, though, we are on the edge where we might be able to swim away if those "predicted" significant sales come through.
    27 Jan, 02:09 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    Rbrun> Well said.
    So I have been thinking of what a mistake it has been for any industry adoption these last 5 years to have kept "lead" in the name of the PbC battery. It makes perfect descriptive sense to engineers, but to less enlightened people with purse strings it has had bad connotations.
    In honor of the white knights of proud, early PbC endorsement -- the trucking industry -- I propose the lead-carbon battery be renamed to something that truckers can sink their teeth into, some kind of big-ass, bad-ass, m**f** of a name. Since most large predator names have already been taken by trademarked products (and sports teams), perhaps RBrun has hit on something here: "the Sasquatch".
    "The only battery designed with a footprint in the shape of an actual large foot," could be the marketing angle, "with the case sprouting a mass of matted hairs shorn from coconut husks".

     

    Sorry guys, the sales suspense is killing me these days and I'm getting a little punchy. Please pardon this post! :-P
    27 Jan, 02:21 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    >RA

     

    I made a point about asking about branding at the last CC because I agree with you, it's more important than management realizes. Being part of the current lexicon means that "someone" is talking about you. I'm not sure where this saying comes from but it goes something like

     

    "What happens to a business that doesn't advertise? Nothing at all."
    27 Jan, 03:02 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    Patrick> I recall that cc question about "branding". I don't think TG understood that you meant 'lead' in the name though.

     

    Fortunately as the winter edition of Batteries International magazine highlighted, modified lead acid technologies are now starting to get industry attention, to fill the void left by certain shortcomings of Li-ion. We saw this coming very early and bought AXPW but ironically we're the ones hurting from our foresight!
    27 Jan, 04:13 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    http://seekingalpha.co...

     

    We'll see if this prediction begins panning out, beginning with 3 or 4 PC's to a single customer any day now. Maybe just in time for my birthday tomorrow. (Fingers crossed).
    27 Jan, 01:57 PM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    Patrick,

     

    I truly wish you get a really big birthday present tomorrow!
    27 Jan, 03:11 PM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (198) | Send Message
     
    Everyone relax please. I am sure there will be a big fat order announced after the close tonight.

     

    But seriously, I am interested to know where this confidence that CEO shows comes from. It can only be power cubes I assume. I am pretty sure last CC TG said that BMW was on the back burner? We know NS999 is testing and ePower a while away.

     

    Sometimes I think TG is actually clinically insane. Like that video interview that was posted in early Jan. He is sitting there saying how Axion's challenge is to try to fill all the orders that are coming in. really? Sometimes I think he lives in a different world. It is definitely the miserable AXPW world that I have grown up in.

     

    Now I am just ranting. Yes, I remember a couple of years back CCs where he is congratulating the "team" on reaching a real turning point for the business. I am not calling TG a liar. But I certainly doubt his ability to accurately convey to shareholders the true trading position of the company. I just hope my doubts don't extend as far as accurately conveying the technological importance of their batteries.
    27 Jan, 03:26 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    dance, where did you hear that NS999 is in testing. As far as I have heard it is sitting idle outside the shops at Juniata for some months now.
    27 Jan, 04:12 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    NGS>

     

    NSC made clear during the public announcement that the majority of testing of the batteries was being conducted with a simulator that isn't even attached to the train. The delay in getting the train rolling has to do with things like connectors and wires and bushings from other suppliers having issues or delays.
    27 Jan, 04:36 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Patrick, I have seen zero detail concerning what has caused NSC not to have the revisions to the original NSC 999 platform completed. Only comment I've ever seen was from TG and he said supplier delay IIRC. Everything else AFAIK has been speculation or trying to rationalize what in the heck NSC might be up to.
    27 Jan, 05:07 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1638) | Send Message
     
    dance,

     

    "...He is sitting there saying how Axion's challenge is to try to fill all the orders that are coming in. really? Sometimes I think he lives in a different world"

     

    Ditto my friend. I have come to the same conclusion!
    27 Jan, 05:20 PM Reply Like
  • dlmca
    , contributor
    Comments (359) | Send Message
     
    I am betting pipers get us to $0.08 or lower before TG has to face a CC again in March, 2014.

     

    Undoubtedly there will be more promises of sales leading into March CC - as is TG's style

     

    And perhaps then the pipers will be gone

     

    Lastly, if this scenario unfolds - this then has to be the due date for the Board to really step up to the plate and do what they are there to do
    27 Jan, 03:52 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    "$.08 or lower"

     

    I'm a real doubter. Did you notice that buyers stepped up and bought yet another 1.8 million shares today without the price even hitting 9 cents? Wow, I'm not seeing any buy side fatigue in that fact. My buy limit at .0883 was not hit. I'm kinda disappointed.
    27 Jan, 04:23 PM Reply Like
  • Occam's_Razor
    , contributor
    Comments (1553) | Send Message
     
    @dlmca: if our PIPE friends get us to .08 before the Conference Call in March, then they will promptly renegotiate their current "sweet deal" and make it even "sweeter." Tommy-boy will acquiesce to keep things moving.
    I certainly hope that .09 does NOT get breached, and I'm absolutely "tickled pink" that we didn't break .09c today with over 1.9 million shares traded...that's almost volume of 2 million shares with NO break of .09c...
    .
    If any one of the Big Fish that I alluded to in my satirical youtube video is truly interested in Axion's technology, it wouldn't even be a "rounding error" on their Balance Sheet to become Axion's Strategic Investor going forward (later this year).
    I really don't know what is going on in New Castle, and I certainly don't rely on TG for scoop.
    27 Jan, 04:08 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1638) | Send Message
     
    I would go as far to say that any strategic investor that comes in will first of all replace TG and the legacy team - save maybe for Vani and the new CFO- and start afresh. Axion really needs fresh blood at this junction in it's history!
    27 Jan, 05:23 PM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1041) | Send Message
     
    I simply cannot see the value that Vani has added at this point. Yes, the darkest before the dawn but if he's not selling (and we are not selling) than he's not doing his job.

     

    http://bit.ly/M6ycXJ
    27 Jan, 05:40 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Mr. Holty, One of the things I'm afraid with Vani is that he is big business. He doesn't have an entrepreneurial background. As such his focus would be more in relationships like BMW, NSC and Cummins. Could be he was more than Axion could afford and with the BMW back burner comment this might be even more true. Could also be that he is instrumental in the Cummins relationship but we don't know that.

     

    As for letting him go. Around the last round of premium financing I'm sure Vani along with TG started to feel their well feed back sides twitching with the possibility someone else would be bringing this baby home. That's why they rewarded themselves w/ 3 years contracts. This so that if you and I get zippo they have strapped in their back sides to the remaining assets. He's not going anywhere.
    27 Jan, 06:21 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13542) | Send Message
     
    Correct, iindelco. I agree. The window for changing management closed (crashed to the street far below, really) a year ago.
    As my 1 year old grandson has learned to say when he notices his plate is empty "All gone!"
    28 Jan, 09:25 AM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (198) | Send Message
     
    Quick question if any Brits on the board in the UK. What company are you using to trade OTC in the US. I just checked my commission for my latest AXPW trade a month ago and was pretty nasty. They screwed me on the spread as well I am thinking. I used to use eTrade but they closed their UK office.
    27 Jan, 04:55 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1638) | Send Message
     
    Check interactivebrokers.co.uk
    27 Jan, 05:28 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    Careful IB charges per share (up to 0.5% of total trade).

     

    Look for a flat fee broker, like Schwab.
    27 Jan, 05:56 PM Reply Like
  • newalker
    , contributor
    Comments (150) | Send Message
     
    I use IB usa and the plan I'm on is flat rate. Low cost is one of IB's strengths.
    http://bit.ly/1f4cHRz
    27 Jan, 06:05 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    newalker, doesn't the IB flat rate plan still charge per share? By flat rate, I mean a flat fee per trade. IB is one of the lowest costs unless you are trading penny stocks.
    27 Jan, 06:40 PM Reply Like
  • newalker
    , contributor
    Comments (150) | Send Message
     
    Ranma, I didn't mean to seem to disagree with your caution, which is correct, but in general it would depend on the penny stock value. Here's the info from the link:
    Flat Rate USD0.005 per share
    Minimum Per Order USD 1.00
    Maximum Per Order 0.5% of trade value
    Just wanted to provide the link so dance621 could check to see if IB would be satisfactory for their particular needs. In general I've found IB to be generally the best deal, although I do use other brokers as well.
    27 Jan, 07:29 PM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (198) | Send Message
     
    thanks lads. still a bunch better than my broker at moment.
    28 Jan, 05:09 AM Reply Like
  • siliconhillbilly
    , contributor
    Comments (2214) | Send Message
     
    RE: Auto makers and the PbC.

     

    There isn't an auto maker in existence that will replace a cheaper part with a more expensive one unless FORCED to do it by customer pressure or government regs. They will pay off customers to be quiet and use PR to ignore or deny any problem. They will use political and/or economic pressure to hold off guvmint mandates to change for efficiency reasons.

     

    Writing weasel regulations and having them "update" an existing regulation is a cheap ploy. Except for the payoff to the purchased regulator(s).

     

    Best of all is to convince the pols that the cost of testing to see if it works after a year on the road is too expensive and would hurt the auto industry (jobs and patronage hits in Your district!).

     

    So unless there is some countervailing economics somewhere, the PbC, as the obviously correct solution to the Stop-Start durability problem, is a nonstarter. Auto makers want the price to drop into the high volume AGM range. As I just wrote, they can wait. If Axion fails, there won't be an existing solution available in production quantities and they get an automatic pass. Sigh.

     

    27 Jan, 05:29 PM Reply Like
  • ARGE
    , contributor
    Comments (722) | Send Message
     
    Lets stop buying and pool our money and tell Tom we'll buy the Pipers out at there sweet terms without the sell pressure.
    It's only a LLC away.
    27 Jan, 05:48 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    ARGE, I might not be in for buying out the pipers, but I'd be happy to sign on to a sweet deal like the PIPErs got on the next round of financing.
    28 Jan, 10:18 AM Reply Like
  • ARGE
    , contributor
    Comments (722) | Send Message
     
    Me too, but I was thinking if there was another price failure, or maybe causing one, get the shares before a big announcement happens, and get a 70% discount.
    28 Jan, 06:04 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    Buying out the PIPErs will cost the money they are owed plus a 25% premium. It would be interesting to see how many shares Axion would give us to pony up the cash. You would need like two or three hundred people to put up a few tens of thousands each, though. It would be hard to get something like that together but if the discount was big enough, I would be up for it.
    29 Jan, 09:30 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    The issuance of pre-installment shares for the March payment is a done deal at this point. After giving effect to that stock issuance and the early conversions disclosed in the last Form 10-Q, the total remaining balance owed to the PIPErs is $1,162,500. While I don't see any reasonable chance that a group of Axionistas could negotiate a take-out transaction, the amounts are far smaller in reality than they are in your magnificent magnifying mind.
    29 Jan, 10:03 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >nogoodslacker ... "but if the discount was big enough" (?) Strange sentiment. I thought maybe all this complaining was about the shareprice being far below your estimate of "fair value", but, with that statement, it seems you're just wanting in on the PIPE deal. I'm sorry if you're not in a position to profit from pounding the shares even lower. Buy, sell or hold ... a big enough discount would have the same effect.

     

    My personal opinion is Axion needs either business activity or actual strategic investors that can bid up the shares to what "fair value" might or should be. Sadly, that is not the Axionista mindset. We whine about not being able to be the utlimate bottom feeders.
    29 Jan, 10:16 AM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    I'll make a note of that and talk to you in two weeks.
    29 Jan, 10:27 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4673) | Send Message
     
    >nogoodslacker ... I'm not going to put a time limit on my objections like that.

     

    We could certainly use some of the enthusiasm of the average Tesla shareholder that seems to think a share ought to be worth a quadrillion dollars and is willing to pay-up. We are a group that salivates about buying for a nickel.
    29 Jan, 10:47 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2893) | Send Message
     
    200 to 300 people at 20000 to 30000 grand each would be 4m to 9m dollars. I think that would be near enough for the next raise and way beyond whats left with the current PIPrs.
    29 Jan, 12:41 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    $9M would pay off the PIPE and raise enough cash to avoid needing another PIPE later this year.
    29 Jan, 01:17 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Doing a PIPE is a lot like peeing on an electric fence. Once is enough for any lifetime. I got my experience out of the way in the late-80s and would never recommend the idea to anyone, but you'd be amazed at the stories PIPE investors and their investment bankers tell to get the uninitiated to sign on the dotted line.
    29 Jan, 01:37 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    Not sure how many people would be up for such an investment given the lack of transparency.
    29 Jan, 01:58 PM Reply Like
  • Mathieu Malecot
    , contributor
    Comments (1171) | Send Message
     
    DRich, i share your frustration with the typical Axionista mindset. Competing with each other to buy the same stock at lower and lower prices helps us how exactly? I would remind everyone in the room that nothing new has happened to materially effect the valuation of this penny stock. the PIPERS redoing a deal is neither positive or negative in terms of stock appreciation, but it was a positive for a cash strapped company trying to get to orders before financing.
    29 Jan, 04:34 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    mathieu: "redoing a deal is neither positive or negative in terms of stock appreciation"

     

    If we ignore the traditional pps = some value / # of shares, yes.

     

    HardToLove
    29 Jan, 04:37 PM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (198) | Send Message
     
    ARGE,

     

    Well I wonder why a rights issue has never been suggested. It seems that management fail to see the investor loyalty and dedication to the company. Someone is buying these shares that the PIPEs are dumping. Go back a year and the daily volume was in the 10s of thousands often. Not a lot of shares being sold by people who are holding out for the future. Would I double my holding for the current price to see 16M more cash added to AXPW. Certainly. What would that give? 18 months of cash flow. I see that sort of offering would actually lead to a rise in price.

     

    But what do I know. Not much if truth be told.
    27 Jan, 06:14 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    Dance621: We here have suggested and discussed rights issues, via warrants, in the past.

     

    HardToLove
    28 Jan, 10:43 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1883) | Send Message
     
    The problem with a warrants/rights issue is that to entice people to pony up cash then Axion would have to beat the current market price. But that would have the effect of dropping the market price to about the strike price. What shareholder will buy in the market when they hold rights to buy cheaper? So the market lacks support and thus the price falls to the warrants strike.

     

    If it falls even further though, due to the market seeing the massive dilution coming, then few exercise rights/warrants as you can buy cheaper in the market. Then Axion fails to raise the cash it needs and shareholders are soured by holding warrants not worth much while seeing their legacy stock decline in value.

     

    The above is not certain but still highly likely in an illiquid stock such as AXPW trying to raise its entire market cap in a rights offering. It works a lot better for a company with highly liquid stock and when the market cap is at many times the capital raise amount. Thus the specter of dilution is small.
    29 Jan, 11:31 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    In three decades of practice I've discussed rights offerings with more clients than I could count. So far I've never had a client that was willing to bite the bullet and assume the risks. I have seen successful rights offerings, but they're few and far between.
    29 Jan, 11:49 AM Reply Like
  • Mathieu Malecot
    , contributor
    Comments (1171) | Send Message
     
    if you are thinking of some kind of rights offering do me a favor and buy the stock on the OTC, thanks and love - this guy
    29 Jan, 04:35 PM Reply Like
  • dlmca
    , contributor
    Comments (359) | Send Message
     
    Afraid TG will not entertain a strategic investor unless he gets another 3 year contract and bonus

     

    It becomes more and more obvious that he has, and has had, a strategic dream - and the practical side is he is going to see it through as long as the pay cheques come in

     

    As suggested this is where the Board (who are supposed to represent the shareholders) need to ask the tough questions, set standards, expectations and deadlines seeing that the best strategic plan is executed and not one that someone steadfastly sticks with to the detriment of others 

     

    27 Jan, 06:48 PM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2248) | Send Message
     
    Comment from the cheap seats which are located on the sidelines:

     

    "I never promised orders on a timetable basis before. But, I will predict that we will have significant orders to talk about on our next earning call."

     

    What would you call a TG statement that Axion would have a 300% increase in annual sales (made ages ago, 2010? 2011?) With another 300% increase in sales the following year. While not predicting "orders" isn't that implicit in his statement? Anyone betting on the basis of TG's predictions is truly grasping at smoke based on prior history.
    28 Jan, 02:04 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I would call the 300% statement a bad case of transitory foot in mouth disease that Tom acknowledged as an error and retracted.

     

    I've made any number of mistakes in my life and learned that the only thing I can do is acknowledge the error, try to set things right and clean my side of the street. Mercifully the vast majority of people I encounter are willing to accept an apology and move on instead of dredging up the same complaint again and again and again.

     

    The only exception that springs to mind was an ex-wife who had a terrible drinking problem.

     

    I envy your exemplary life that has never required an apology and never required the forgiveness of others for words spoken in haste.
    28 Jan, 07:10 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5083) | Send Message
     
    Tesla hits it big in China … on social media, at least
    http://on.mktw.net/1gm...
    28 Jan, 05:59 AM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1638) | Send Message
     
    At least, Tesla is good a putting its best foot forward and their Marketing strategy is spectacular. For all the criticism and the negatives on Musk's personality, he has a much better grasp on his company than our management does.
    28 Jan, 06:13 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Musk is selling his product to status conscious consumers and each sale is a discrete event.

     

    Axion is selling the batteries for complex integrated systems that are sub-systems in even larger projects.

     

    Musk is in charge of his GAANT Chart. Tom Granville is not.

     

    Criticizing an executive for looking at somebody else's GAANT Chart and concluding "our part of this project should occur in six months" is inherently unreasonable because the timing estimate always presumes that all prior activities of third parties will be completed on schedule.
    28 Jan, 06:59 AM Reply Like
  • axion-nl
    , contributor
    Comments (180) | Send Message
     
    John, do you have direct access to TG? If so, give him a call and ask for some sales :)
    28 Jan, 08:33 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    I have access to Tom because I'm one of those damned customers that Axionistas are so fond of complaining about. I plan to build a fleet of ten demonstrators, but I have a long list of intermediate goals that I must accomplish before I'll need any more batteries. So far, it has taken me longer to put tick marks beside my intermediate goals than I wanted and the time scale on my GAANT Chart keeps expanding. I'm thrilled with my progress to date but less than thrilled with my pace.
    Axion is not selling a product that's useful in anything other than an integrated system.

     

    As a hybrid truck developer, I won't buy batteries until I need to install them in a new tractor. I need to prove that my Sleeper Cab and Day Cab meet the requirements of my potential customers first. Axion is a critical link in my chain and I won't have a product without them, but there is nothing Axion can do at this point in time to speed the pace of my product development work.
    28 Jan, 08:56 AM Reply Like
  • greentongue
    , contributor
    Comments (880) | Send Message
     
    Now multiply that by "Train Size" and "Cautious" to get NS current state of progress.
    28 Jan, 12:46 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    If SA's instablog starts working again, I'll get my blog updated and post a link.

     

    01/27/2014: EOD stuff partially copied to the concentrator.
    # Trds: 134, MinTrSz: 500, MaxTrSz: 110000, Vol: 1886785, AvTrSz: 14080
    Min. Pr: 0.0907, Max Pr: 0.0970, VW Avg. Tr. Pr: 0.0925
    # Buys, Shares: 44 631838, VW Avg Buy Pr: 0.0939
    # Sells, Shares: 89 1247947, VW Avg Sell Pr: 0.0919
    # Unkn, Shares: 1 7000, VW Avg Unk. Pr: 0.0925
    Buy:Sell 1:1.98 (33.49% "buys"), DlyShts 875619 (46.41%), Dly Sht % of 'sells' 70.16%

     

    Initial FINRA data was missing 17,877 shares of trade volume for AXPW ... Corrected data included no additional short sales ...

     

    Today's low, high, VWAP, trade volume, and daily short sales moved 0.22%, 0.00%, -2.34%, 287.58% and 334.57% respectively. Price spread today was 13.00% vs. 4.73%, 44.79%, 14.26%, 31.25%, 5.76%, 8.33%, 6.47%, 11.13% and 1.90% prior days.

     

    Unlike prior days, there weren't trades at the extremes that were one-offs that may have affected the spread. However we did have a very large number of “larger” trades today, including one of 110K. These 30 trades totaled 1,066,708 shares, 56.54% of trade volume. 370K, 34.69%, were buys and 696.7K, 65.31%, were sells. The VWAP of all the larger trades was $0.0928, with the buys' VWAP at $0.0949 and the sells' VWAP at $0.0917.

     

    I Said yesterday the traditional TA stuff may be trying to change my bearishness to a neutral stance. After saying it's a bit early to judge and this was a Friday in a short week I went on to detail what was trying to convince me. I then detailed some items that were contrary to that. I ended with “Still no sign of any bullishness, but I'm hopeful at least for a sideways trading range for a wile. Since hope is not a strategy though, I'll still lean towards price weakness, at best after a sideways trend for a short while”.

     

    I'm apparently leaning the right direction. On top of the reduced VWAP on very much higher volume, all the oscillators I watch, now including full stochastic and ADX, and related, resumed weakening and made small moves lower. The Bollingers have begun diverging, with the upper limit flat and the lower limit falling.

     

    I adjusted my medium-term descending resistance for a better fit to the highs we'd been seeing. The result of that, which seems more realistic, is we no longer have trading ranges “wrapped around” my medium-term descending resistance. With a value now of ~$0.101, we traded completely below the line and have fewer days trading wrapped around the line.

     

    Yesterday I raised the possibility that the volume and sell percentage Thursday suggested the heavy sellers may be out for a while, allowing a consolidation to begin. Friday didn't dispel that possibility. Today did, as far as sellers being out. The sell percentage was very near Thursday's 69.7%. Volume approached that of Thursday, ~2.1MM.

     

    Still no sign of any bullishness, but the possibility of at least a sideways trading range for a while remains.

     

    The average of the lowest 20 VWAPs times 80% today is $0.0792 vs. $0.0797, $0.0801, $0.0805, $0.0806, $0.0808, $0.0815, $0.0817, $0.0823 and $0.0828 on prior days. 80% of today's VWAP is $0.0740 vs. $0.0758, $0.0750, $0.0798, $0.0797, $0.0803, $0.0771, $0.0778, $0.0794 and $0.0827 on prior days. These are potential prices for the next tranche of shares to the PIPErs.

     

    When I saw the early strong “buys” percentage (in the breakdown by time note the fist three periods of ~509K with high buy percentages) I knew the market-makers would have a heyday. Sure enough, the daily short sales came in at 46.41% ...

     

    HardToLove
    28 Jan, 08:47 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    After many attempts, and finally a "work around" (shades of FINRA!), I got the charts and all for yesterday up.

     

    http://seekingalpha.co...

     

    HardToLove
    28 Jan, 04:48 PM Reply Like
  • kevin lemm
    , contributor
    Comments (121) | Send Message
     
    http://bit.ly/1k1lDJj
    The link above is for Smart Grid News
    Smart Grid News is once again looking for votes to determine which companies become one of there 14 finalists in there competition for smart grid companies to watch. go ahead and vote for your favorite company while we wait for real news.
    28 Jan, 10:37 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (723) | Send Message
     
    RBrun357, please check your PM.
    28 Jan, 10:53 AM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (787) | Send Message
     
    Valley,

     

    Back at ya!

     

    Please check your PM.
    28 Jan, 04:06 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (723) | Send Message
     
    kevin, good catch. Thanks to you 'tis done.
    28 Jan, 11:35 AM Reply Like
  • Mac325
    , contributor
    Comments (21) | Send Message
     
    Axion Power made the final 14 on the Smart Grid News - Smart Grid Company to Watch poll.

     

    Voting for the finalist is open until 2/2.

     

    http://bit.ly/1i7LezI
    28 Jan, 12:55 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Actually it made the semi-finals and they plan to pick 14 winners from the 25 companies identified in the new poll.
    28 Jan, 01:05 PM Reply Like
  • JohnM121
    , contributor
    Comments (414) | Send Message
     
    Their description still uses the term "superconductive" instead of super-capacitor. The spell checker on SA makes the same mistake.
    28 Jan, 01:17 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    Now if they could only sell some batteries, everything will be just fine.
    28 Jan, 01:45 PM Reply Like
  • Occam's_Razor
    , contributor
    Comments (1553) | Send Message
     
    It won't let me vote this time (on the new list)... can you only vote once?
    28 Jan, 01:16 PM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1041) | Send Message
     
    I believe so. It tracks by IP address so I'd think so.
    28 Jan, 01:18 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1842) | Send Message
     
    Looks like we've shot our wad...

     

    Don't forget to vote by mobile or work/home computers instead.
    28 Jan, 01:26 PM Reply Like
  • User462699
    , contributor
    Comments (112) | Send Message
     
    I managed to vote again.
    28 Jan, 01:41 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    http://bit.ly/LkGE5Q#

     

    Let's resurrect that Rosewater Hub and get some favorable strategic financing from SPWR in exchange for exclusive rights to PbC in grid-connected applications. They said they are looking for a storage partner. It would be like Tesla and SolarCity only without the conflict of interest.
    28 Jan, 01:38 PM Reply Like
  • metroneanderthal
    , contributor
    Comments (1511) | Send Message
     
    My view is that as TG created expectations amongst shareholders at the last CC, he owes an update now.
    28 Jan, 03:08 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    We will get our update at the next earnings call, which unfortunately doesn't come around till the end of March because that's when the annual report is due.
    28 Jan, 03:42 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    What they can't make on price they'll make up on volume. They are a bigger player in E-Bikes which do very well in China and are still mostly powered by LABS due to price.

     

    Market News - Chaowei Power (00951): '13 profit down significantly

     

    " (Infocast News) Chaowei Power Holdings Limited (00951) warned that its profit for the year ended 31 December 2013 is expected to experience a significant decrease, notwithstanding that it expects a significant year-on-year increase in revenue for the year. The board considers that the expected significant decrease in profit was mainly attributable to the intense competition in the lead-acid motive battery market in the PRC in 2013, which has kept the selling prices of products under pressure."

     

    http://bit.ly/LkZYzD
    28 Jan, 03:10 PM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » A comment by JP has been deleted. I copied the comments that might be deleted and will repost most (all?).

     

    Give it a little time for something comphrensible, hopefully, to emerge.
    28 Jan, 03:47 PM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » >JP ... I've gotta agree on that. Speed has never been a problem but I think that goes for the whole of the battery sector. Speed has only demonstrated itself to lead to spontaneous & self-feeding fires in at least 3 chemistries I can think of right now.
    28 Jan, 02:04 PM Reply Delete Comment Like 6
    WayneinOregon Comments (675)
    28 Jan, 03:49 PM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Well, I managed to lose the rest - inexperience in doing a large number.

     

    Apologies to all.
    28 Jan, 03:54 PM Reply Like
  • nogoodslacker
    , contributor
    Comments (1038) | Send Message
     
    If that was his comment directed to me, I wish you would have left it and my reply. But, I guess we gotta play by your rules. Thanks for all you do.
    28 Jan, 04:21 PM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » NGS: It's lose-lose for APH. If he calls names and isn't deleted, accusations of "protecting" and valuable people leave sometimes.

     

    I'll do better next time as I know the mistake I made that lost what I had copied.
    28 Jan, 04:32 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5083) | Send Message
     
    I wish you would leave them up, because I can use them for reference when every time he discredits someone and labels them as a "troll" and should be on yahoo board,,,,I am going to go back and post his past history and other statements and predictions he has made.

     

    The big boyz have sold out long ago, so there has been a mirage of hopium painted by him and TG and a turn to social media to fund this company. It's up to the public and axionista's to fund AXPW or else it would have been history already. AXPW is struggling to keep from drowning, maybe we get the dream, more than likely not.

     

    Either way, when they were touting BMW, NSC and other "top five's" they knew AXPW was no where near a commercial or viable company. But, they led us to believe differently with statements that inferred great things. That's my beef.

     

    Tough questions and different opinions should be welcomed. It's time this ended.
    28 Jan, 04:39 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Jeeze APH, No paper, pen and short hand skills! ;-p
    28 Jan, 04:41 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1638) | Send Message
     
    LT,

     

    Understand your frustrations, and share some of them myself. Either way, we will be fixed on the destiny of Axion fairly soon. TG either goes as a hero, or not!
    28 Jan, 04:50 PM Reply Like
  • Axion Power Host
    , contributor
    Comments (469) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » The whole point of attempts to moderate without being tyrannical is to avoid personal wars and keep the concentrators a resource for investors.

     

    Yes, emotions are sometimes expressed and may or may not be "productive". But within APH's limited abilities APH *will* do his best to keep the concentrator on point.

     

    For personal wars, SA offers you the ability to make your own blog.
    28 Jan, 05:18 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9984) | Send Message
     
    Great points, Mr. APH. The APCs have always been a space where disparaging name calling is not tolerated.

     

    Thanks, as always, for doing the fantastic job of moderating this blog!
    28 Jan, 05:52 PM Reply Like
  • Mathieu Malecot
    , contributor
    Comments (1171) | Send Message
     
    thanks for your efforts, i appreciate the attempt to remove offending material while maintaining most of a post. you rock APH
    29 Jan, 04:37 PM Reply Like
  • 42itus1
    , contributor
    Comments (228) | Send Message
     
    So, anyone have any speculations as to how JCI intends to reduce the weight of their LA batteries around 25% .

     

    http://bit.ly/MroZtP

     

    This or similar link was posted by iindelco so time ago.
    28 Jan, 05:43 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13542) | Send Message
     
    As JP pointed out at the time, this sounds remarkably like the 24% lighter PbC battery...

     

    A similar approach would not be surprising, given this coincidence.
    28 Jan, 05:57 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (18056) | Send Message
     
    TB: I bet one of the first buyers would be AXPW, to tear it down and see what IP was inside.

     

    HardToLove
    28 Jan, 06:08 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    42itus1, Well JCI has already given you one way that they intend to remove some of the weight. They are going to ask the automakers to go back and reduce the demands on the battery in their requirements. Less energy = less mass. How much does this count for ? Don't know.
    Maybe engineered plastics for the case with more efficient lower mass fibers for strength. Doable for more money which they can cover with reduced lead use. Brass terminals vs lead. No carrying handle? Simpler mounting flange? Shorter life? More efficient starter? Sizing exactly to each vehicle need so more PN's? Better anode and cathode materials.

     

    Lot's of ways but as SiHB indicated they don't like paying more. Maybe they will now?
    28 Jan, 07:05 PM Reply Like
  • 42itus1
    , contributor
    Comments (228) | Send Message
     
    >iindelco, Your points are well taken, but some seem rather counter-intuitive to the lessons I thought I had learned from you. That is; 1) regardless of tier level (size), suppliers don't get to dictate in the automotive sector-- 'reduce your requirements!'!, 2) going forward electric demands in automotive have, and will continue to grow -- battery demands will increase!, 3) the Less energy = less mass formula is not reflective of reducing weight of a battery it is providing a smaller/lessor battery.

     

    I take it that you see the 25% number as coincidental to John Petersen's calculated 24% reduction in weight for the PbC. I was dreaming about the "other" large battery maker (domestic,IIRC) that was interested in incorporating the AXION anode into their battery line--separate from the BMW requirement for a second source.
    28 Jan, 08:54 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Very good 42itus1.

     

    To your first point. This is true. However the automakers are receptive to suggestions and in fact have internal initiatives to meet revised targets as industry requirements change. Sometimes suggestions are acted upon and sometimes not. Like all industries there are focus areas and their are resource constraints.

     

    As we have seen more recently weight is a hot issue in the industry so talking about reducing the weight of the LAB by 25% will get someones attention. During the decades I worked in the industry you couldn't get anyone interested in mass removal unless it was free or you paid them. Pretty much it was a non-issue for most of the main stream automotive platforms.

     

    To the second point. Yes and no. We need to remember that while the total energy turn around in the battery is growing the peak current required for starting the engine is going down as engines get smaller and friction is reduced. There are in effect two different areas to be worked on. The first to make sure that the airpost test can be satisfied for new power plants and the second that the storage systems can provide the far higher energy requirements that need to constantly be cycled through the battery. These two areas have changed significantly in many vehicles vs the mission of the old SLA battery.

     

    To the third point only for the starter requirements. In the case of managing all the other functions things like DCA and efficiency are becoming far more important.

     

    And yes. I consider the PbC mass reduction due to the carbon electrode and the JCI goals a coincidence.
    29 Jan, 08:13 AM Reply Like
  • AlbertinBermuda
    , contributor
    Comments (739) | Send Message
     
    ii

     

    I fail to understand all the fuss when it comes to focusing on reducing the weight of automobile batteries. Trying to cut 10lbs off the total weight probably equates to a substantial savings in fuel for the life of the vehicle. However just look around when you next go to the mall. The numbers of obese people is amazing. Next walk around the carpark and peek inside the cars. Look at the junk many people haul around in their cars. Much of it just sits there for months or longer.

     

    It seems to me that if we were serious about improving mileage the auto companies would be offering the diesel engines that are virtually standard equipment in Europe.
    29 Jan, 09:25 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Ahhh Albert, What you're talking about is the difference between automotive regulation and reality. See it really doesn't matter to the government regulators if people use the correct vehicle or they use whatever vehicle they have wisely. What matters is that the vehicle that you build meets the targets required within its vehicle class. What the people do after that they will work through other channels. That's the game.
    29 Jan, 12:08 PM Reply Like
  • froggey77
    , contributor
    Comments (2770) | Send Message
     
    42itus
    "So, anyone have any speculations as to how JCI intends to reduce the weight of their LA batteries around 25% "

     

    It seems to me I remember something like this from 2 years or so ago.
    At the time (Exide I think) announced a 48v battery that was a hopeful entry into the hybrid race.
    They announced thinner plates as their answer.
    A short look around came up with Odyssey batteries.

     

    "Pure Lead Plates: Constructed from 99.99% pure virgin lead, ODYSSEY battery plates are extremely thin, so more of them can fit into the battery. More lead plates equals more power.

     

    Tin Alloy Coated Brass Terminals: Brass terminals coated with a high quality tin alloy ensure secure, corrosion-free cable connections."
    http://bit.ly/1grQTmG"

     

    They seem to cost about double the price.

     

    Also if you check the description of this video you find:
    " Uploaded on Mar 23, 2011

     

    EnerSys uses a thin plate, pure lead design in their new line of batteries for North America

     

    Jason Zerbe at Enersys explains what thin plate pure lead. The benefits include:

     

    - Thinner the plate, the more energy you can get out of the battery and the faster you can recharge it.
    - Pure lead has corrosion resistance and has a longer life as a result.
    - 30% higher energy density for the size.
    - Longer run times
    - Ideal for fast charge"
    29 Jan, 07:06 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Exide Technologies announces plans for Alliance with Northstar Battery LLC.

     

    " Exide plans to market the NorthStar®-branded AGM product line as an ultra-premium, thin-plate offering – a strategy intended to expand the Company's existing transportation battery portfolio and deliver a number of unique design features specifically targeted to high performance vehicles operating in demanding conditions. Exide believes these batteries would be well-suited for vehicles including emergency responders, commercial fleets and marine vessels, sports and luxury cars, larger SUVs and trucks. "

     

    http://bit.ly/1a2wUrW
    29 Jan, 09:01 PM Reply Like
  • 42itus1
    , contributor
    Comments (228) | Send Message
     
    >froggey77 & iindelco,
    Good input, Thanks. That would put JCI four years behind Exide's offering/tech and three years behind Odyessy's offering/tech.

     

    "- 30% higher energy density for the size."

     

    Unfortunately we don't know if 'size' is referencing volume or weight. Also it is impossible to know the weight reduction ratio from the pure lead to lead alloy plates so the mystery continues.
    29 Jan, 11:11 PM Reply Like
  • AlbertinBermuda
    , contributor
    Comments (739) | Send Message
     
    When it comes to verifying that a target has been met is that a one time event e.g. when the vehicle is brand spanking new?

     

    If that is the case then the failures that apparently all auto manufacturers are experiencing after a couple of months use with stop/start will continue to go undetected.

     

    And thinking on a bit when it comes to mileage testing how is that done? Is there a single tester that drives each and every vehicle or is there a group who of course might vary in weight by a significant amount? ref back to my mall comment.
    30 Jan, 11:53 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Particularly with systems that are sold to regulators as pollution control, the first stage in the process is getting to a point of widespread adoption. The second stage is regular inspections to ensure the systems are functioning properly in the hands of the users.

     

    Right now, micro-hybrids are still in the first stage. As the systems become more common, recurring pollution control inspection protocols will be changed to include stop-start functionality. That'e when all hell's going to break loose.
    30 Jan, 12:03 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    "As the systems become more common, recurring pollution control inspection protocols will be changed to include stop-start functionality. That'e when all hell's going to break loose."

     

    For purposes of Axion and the investors on this investment blog - will that be 5 to 10 years from now?

     

    AGM batteries were around since the late 70s, but only during the last decade really adopted.
    30 Jan, 12:20 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Albert, Original certification is done in a lab to a standard test that includes a fixed drive cycle. This is different in different countries or regions of the world.

     

    As John has indicated devices that are part of the pollution control system are generally warranted for a period of time and must generally be checked at a certain frequency and repaired as per individual state requirements. In NY this is done annually but I know some states do this at different frequencies and I think some do not do it at all.
    30 Jan, 12:27 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    The adoption rate for AGM batteries had more to do with user needs than anything else. Flooded batteries were a perfect fit for automotive until very recently. With the emergence of stop-start in 2008, the wholesale shift to AGM has happened very rapidly. Based on all the evidence I've seen over the last few years AGM is inadequate for Gen1 micro-hybrid and will be grossly inadequate for Gen2 micro-hybrid. While 48-volt systems will likely be adopted for Gen3 micro-hybrid, that's at least a decade away.

     

    My first car with pollution control gear was a '69 Ford with positive crankcase ventilation. As I recall, it was early to mid-70s when the annual safety inspection protocols were changed to include emissions testing. Since we're already five years into the micro-hybrid ramp and automakers seem to be adopting variants of the technology en masse, I'd expect inspection protocols to change within a couple years.

     

    Regulators are funny when it comes to pollution control gear. They usually insist on "best available technology," but pay special attention to the 'available' part. Today AGM is the only advanced lead-acid battery that's available at relevant scale for the auto industry. The PbC is a better technology for the application as proven by years of validation testing with OEMs. The real issue at this point is availability and supply chain reliability. We seem to be making progress on those fronts, but until a deal is signed with somebody much bigger than Axion, availability will be a limiting factor on regulatory flexibility.
    30 Jan, 12:32 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Well they need to become part of the drive cycle first which as we've discussed is not true in the US or last I knew Canada.
    30 Jan, 12:37 PM Reply Like
  • AlbertinBermuda
    , contributor
    Comments (739) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    Not soon enough for me.
    30 Jan, 01:16 PM Reply Like
  • AlbertinBermuda
    , contributor
    Comments (739) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    I "like" your comment but do not like the delay.
    30 Jan, 01:20 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2656) | Send Message
     
    "The real issue at this point is availability and supply chain reliability. We seem to be making progress on those fronts, but until a deal is signed with somebody much bigger than Axion, availability will be a limiting factor on regulatory flexibility."

     

    If that is the case, TG needs to figure out a way to communicate it in a meaningful manner b/c at .09 a share or a $15M market cap the market treats these relationships as dead.
    30 Jan, 01:24 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    The only thing the $.09 stock price indicates is that too many shares were pounded into an illiquid market over the last six months and that selling activity crushed the price beyond all recognition. When the supply-demand dynamic comes back into balance, the $.09 stock price will be nothing but an unpleasant memory.

     

    When I lived in Switzerland I spent a lot of time driving through long tunnels where you could see a circle of light in the distance but never really judge how far it was to the end. When you emerged from the tunnel and went from dim light to full sunlight, the impact was always instantaneous and always shocking. I expect the same phenomenon when Axion emerges from the PIPE for all the same reasons. I hope to have a new Instablog up before the weekend with the results of an analysis that's still a work in process, but really fascinating.
    30 Jan, 01:36 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    >JP "The real issue at this point is availability and supply chain reliability. We seem to be making progress on those fronts, but until a deal is signed with somebody much bigger than Axion, availability will be a limiting factor on regulatory flexibility."

     

    I plan to press TG about this issue in the next CC. First and foremost, what is the limiting factor in striking a deal with a third-party manufacturer? Personally speaking, I am willing to accept razor thin margins in exchange for getting a big fish to adopt the technology. Holding out for better negotiating terms would be incredibly foolish IMHO.
    30 Jan, 02:22 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    Patrick, In automotive I think you will get your wishes relative to margins if they find a path to supporting one or more customers. But it is a path to becoming very relevant. Everyone and I mean everyone will take notice if it happens.
    30 Jan, 02:41 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Negotiations with other battery manufacturers are incredibly complex beasts that have to be pursued very delicately because the first deal you strike locks you into a structure that everybody else will expect as a matter of course. You have to be really careful that you're not giving away the baby with the bath water.
    30 Jan, 02:45 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (9575) | Send Message
     
    I'm hoping that whatever partnerships Axion can get they give up on this silly notion of running their own battery plant. I love it for R&D and the initial learning curve. Beyond maintaining it for advancing the technology for cost reduction or additional performance I hate the idea IF they can land a good partner or more.
    30 Jan, 02:50 PM Reply Like
  • Patrick Young
    , contributor
    Comments (1533) | Send Message
     
    I disagree about setting precedent. It's a reward for the early adopter. Late adopters pay full price. Oh, that's not fair? Well go cry about it and continue trying to hawk your pig-iron. When you're ready to get in on the stainless steel gravy train, come back with your cap in hand.
    30 Jan, 02:58 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30232) | Send Message
     
    Unfortunately a body of law has grown up around patents that basically says you can keep the rights to yourself with impunity, but if you start transferring rights to others there needs to be a level playing field. I'm not well enough versed in the details to quote chapter and verse, but I know enough about the risks that I'd be working closely with patent counsel to ensure that I didn't