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  • User550230
    , contributor
    Comments (30) | Send Message
     
    Has it been noted yet, the hotel hosting railroad day in Washington, D.C. is located at 999 9th street
    10 Mar, 08:43 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    Excellent catch.
    11 Mar, 09:37 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    9 is my lucky number too. Today around 9am I sold out my small positions of ZBB and PLUG and actually made a few bucks after years of holding on with a snorkel. Maybe AXPW will turn out OK come September.
    11 Mar, 03:47 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    Dory a dory, don't spit on the floor.

     

    Use the cuspidory what do you think it's for.
    10 Mar, 08:44 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    VDub, running that thru the De-Folksy Translator, and what do we get? Just for fun, run that thru the Rap Converter and lay down some freestyle on us. 8^P
    10 Mar, 09:33 PM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    VW,

     

    Whar kin I git one a them fer my Star Wars Vee-hickle?

     

    http://bit.ly/PlZBqW
    10 Mar, 09:57 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    Mr. I,

     

    No kidding that was a line that my aunt wrote for a musical she did in high school. circa: 1933? She won awards for her musical which actually went off Broadway. It was transcribed to a well known opera, so well known in fact that I can't remember the bleeping thing.

     

    I'll keep crawling over the thing over the next few days and it'll come back to me. When you hear the title, you'll instantly know how her music was in sync.

     

    She used to sing that to me when I was a tiny baby. By the time I reached age ten I was ready to kill her.

     

    :>)
    11 Mar, 09:08 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    SM, my Good Friend !

     

    No problemo. Go to 7-11 and git yesseff a Big Gulp.
    Fillerup with Monster grape, Drink t'all down, an' thay're y'go !

     

    free tip: Gitcha a red towl t'mach yer vee-hickle juss in kays y' slobber sloppy.
    11 Mar, 09:15 AM Reply Like
  • froggey77
    , contributor
    Comments (2768) | Send Message
     
    SMaturin

     

    I often download the concentrators so I can read them hours or a day or two later. When I rou into a link I click it and it gives me a problem loading page but the next time I have acess I have to figure out what I am supposed to be looking for in the link.

     

    So this morning I was trying to figure out exactly what I was doing on the BMW site looking for a
    >>>>>&g... CUSPIDOR for.

     

    :-)
    11 Mar, 08:35 PM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    I was looking for one with the propeller logo.

     

    But VW solved my problem in his inimitable provincial way.
    12 Mar, 08:58 AM Reply Like
  • RBrun357
    , contributor
    Comments (781) | Send Message
     
    ;-).

     

    Is that really so? 999 9th street?
    10 Mar, 08:55 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    "Is that really so? 999 9th street? "

     

    http://bit.ly/O6G5NZ

     

    "2014 Railroad Day on Capitol Hill
    Renaissance Washington
    March 13, 2014
    Washington, DC"

     

    http://bit.ly/1kcDrla

     

    "Renaissance Washington, DC Downtown Hotel
    999 Ninth Street NW Washington District Of Columbia 20001 USA "
    10 Mar, 09:14 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    too funny

     

    we'll know when we've finally arrived in AXPW bubbleland when something like that moves the stk 20%
    10 Mar, 09:30 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    Well at least something there will have 999 on it. :(
    11 Mar, 09:08 AM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    Is there a lot of dust sitting on the roof of that hotel?
    11 Mar, 09:38 AM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    I hope we have an Axionista at the unveiling to eyeball it and give us a first hand account of the potential 999 sighting at 999 on 9th ave...
    12 Mar, 09:51 AM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Uh, APH, I think (hope) you meant to label this concentrator 313? I mean we all loved 312, but it was kind of a bruiser, ya know?
    10 Mar, 09:04 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9584) | Send Message
     
    48th: With the comments flying in faster than blow did in the movie "The Falcon And The Snowman," maybe every Concentrator should have a Part One, and then a Part Two. ;-)

     

    80,000 comments coming in a big hurry. I only wish the AXPW chart mirrored the Comments chart.
    10 Mar, 10:01 PM Reply Like
  • maplecorner
    , contributor
    Comments (23) | Send Message
     
    I bookmarked it # 312b
    10 Mar, 10:21 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Maya, maybe we should start giving each one a code release name, kind of like Intel did with rivers in Oregon. I'm thinking maybe we should call the next one, the real #313, Crimea...
    10 Mar, 10:25 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    New rule. Everyone must buy 1000 shares of AXPW for every comment they make...
    11 Mar, 09:39 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2382) | Send Message
     
    "The code names of OpenWrt branches are named after alcoholic beverages, usually including their recipes in the SSH login screen as well, cf. White Russian, Kamikaze, Backfire, Attitude Adjustment, Barrier Breaker.

     

    The bleeding edge development trunk was confusingly also called Kamikaze until February 2011 but with r25514 it was renamed as "Attitude Adjustment" and is now being constantly renamed to the next stable name."

     

    http://bit.ly/1lS4OUH
    11 Mar, 10:10 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    At least the Followers number keeps leading the Concentrator number. Up to 345 now.
    10 Mar, 10:10 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    Hey, the title of this concentrator # 312 should be # 313 ... and the date says March 11th 2014 which doesn't exist yet. It's only the 10th.

     

    I want my money back!
    10 Mar, 10:33 PM Reply Like
  • isthisonebetter
    , contributor
    Comments (228) | Send Message
     
    RA,

     

    I'm sure you will be refunded in full ;)
    10 Mar, 10:39 PM Reply Like
  • User462699
    , contributor
    Comments (101) | Send Message
     
    RA, it exists on the west side of the international dateline.
    10 Mar, 11:17 PM Reply Like
  • User 393748
    , contributor
    Comments (216) | Send Message
     
    481086 & iindelco -->>

     

    There are more details on Exide's testing regime for their Advanced Graphite Additive material. I will have to wait for a chance to put some more of it together in a readable fashion and suitable for posting.

     

    The two test protocols that they did use were 1) the microhybrid dynamic charge acceptance test (mDCAT),
    and 2) a test known as EUCAR. If anyone can locate the details on these, then some more of the puzzle can be solved.

     

    JCI does have interest in carbon additives, because they worked on a paper outlining a quicker method for testing various carbon additive types. Such testing would involve using smaller sized test electrodes to help speed up the research process.
    11 Mar, 01:18 AM Reply Like
  • User 393748
    , contributor
    Comments (216) | Send Message
     
    Regarding the Kia Soul with the prospective next gen hybrid system, it does seem that if Kia is serious about offering this system with it having legitimate long term performance, then the Axion PbC or ALCC (asymmetric lead-carbon capacitor) will have to be their best choice, if it is to be equipped with any kind of "lead-carbon" battery.

     

    If, on the other hand, they plan to sell this next-gen Soul with it having below par performance, then any one of the current F-LAB or AGM batteries with an additive or paste will do.

     

    As is seen from Exide's Advanced Graphite additive patent application, the DCA numbers obtainable from any current lead-acid/AGM battery will not be enough to properly run this hybrid system in a manner acceptable to the consumer.

     

    Over the last 18 or so years, Kia has worked hard to gain market share in the auto market. In 2012, Kia sold 102,267, Kia Souls. They average some 6,500 Souls sales per month. (That's alot of souls to sell.) It is their third best selling vehicle, after the Optima and the Sorento. There has to be more than one person at Kia's headquartes that would be worried about working so hard to gain market share in a very competitive industry, only to put it at risk by offering a Kia Soul with a new generation hybrid option with noticebly sub-par performance.
    11 Mar, 01:20 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Not to mention the recent hit they took with the MPG class action lawsuits and 400M settlement.
    11 Mar, 02:05 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    39, I have to at least mention that at least here in the States we have been selling our souls at a much faster clip than 7,000/month. And for a lot less money than Kia.
    11 Mar, 09:21 AM Reply Like
  • User 393748
    , contributor
    Comments (216) | Send Message
     
    Regarding the use of carbon additives, its history has been to use carbon additives as primarily a means of extending the cycle life of their lead-acid battery offerings. If battery companies find that DCA and discharge current are improved, then they will take that and not complain.

     

    The development of carbon additives is hampered by the fact that not much is known about how the carbon operates to help lead-acid battery performance in the way that it does. As to why the DCA tapers off in a relatively short number of cycles, all that we have are a number of theories as to the causes. Another key aspect in the research of carbon additives for batteries is the problem in replicating experimental test results. That is to say, that different research groups are doing the same experiments and are obtaining different results. The replication of any research groups' test results by other research teams using the same methodology is a fundamental ingredient in the progression of scientific knowledge.

     

    The lack of a better understanding of the operation of carbon additives will mean that progress in this field can be expected to take place at a slower pace. It may be at a faster pace than that of current lithium-ion research, but not by a huge amount.
    11 Mar, 01:21 AM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (828) | Send Message
     
    "The lack of a better understanding of the operation of carbon additives will mean that progress in this field can be expected to take place at a slower pace."
    ---
    383> Would you have any kind of guesstimate on how much rigorous testing Kia may have done with their lead carbon battery, particularly in comparison to the years BMW and NS has done with the PbC? --- I've also considered that since Kia is only unveiling a "concept car", perhaps they haven't yet made a final decision on their lead carbon battery of choice. --- Thanks for your informative posts.
    11 Mar, 01:45 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    JP (and/or anybody else),

     

    With all the new discussion about the UltraBattery again I figured this is a good link to repost, can you again remind us why Axion had to drop out of this study (top of page 57)?

     

    http://1.usa.gov/ZWUGM4

     

    Why was the DOE pushing this if East Penn doesn't want to move forward into automotive? They must want someone to take this mantle for Lead-Carbon to keep this industry competitive going forward in the hybrid based world.
    11 Mar, 04:21 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    Sorry; didn't mean to double post those "again"s; makes the above post come across "trolly" =)

     

    But I am curious about the Ultra and DOE hookup back then.
    11 Mar, 07:51 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    I have no idea what Axion was planning to provide for the study or what its reasons for not moving forward might have been.

     

    With respect to East Penn I'd bet dollars to donuts that it's contractually obligated to carry a share of the Ultrabattery HEV testing programs that were initiated by CSIRO, the ALABC and Furukawa before East Penn got its license.

     

    CSIRO's first Ultrabattery license was granted to Furukawa which made batteries for a modified Honda Insight that was tested in 2007 by the ALABC.

     

    http://bit.ly/1luaZv3

     

    East Penn didn't get its first Ultrabattery sub-license from Furukawa until September 2008 when it negotiated a deal for automotive applications in North America.

     

    http://bit.ly/1dk34eh

     

    Since 2008 East Penn's rights have been expanded, although the precise scope of those rights isn't entirely clear to me. When I spoke with Dr. Lam at the ELBC in 2012, he told me CSIRO was still seeking additional partners.

     

    Whenever a research organization like CSIRO enters into a commercialization contract, the new partners are expected to bear the cost of ongoing commercial demonstration projects.

     

    When I spoke with East Penn's chairwoman at the ELBC, she made it perfectly clear that their primary focus on the Ultrabattery was huge 500 ah, 2-volt cells for stationary applications, but even in that sector they were taking it slow because they didn't want to run the risk of a big failure like Xtreme Power had in Hawaii.
    11 Mar, 08:33 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Any reason the chairwoman would want to hide the ball from a prolific blogger on the subject?
    11 Mar, 08:41 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    She might want to hide the ball, but I've known Sally since 2009 and have a very good feel for where she's coming from. She's the chairman of one of the largest and most successful family owned businesses in the world and her views of the opportunities and risks in the battery industry are very close to mine. On the rare occasions when our conversations have drifted toward areas she didn't want to discuss, she said so. I don't believe deception and duplicity fit well with her character.
    11 Mar, 09:09 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    Thx for ur boots on the ground intel, JP. We here have no other way to get that info.

     

    I also like when u mentioned that EP only has one manufacturing facility in the whole world, in PA. Seems to me that precludes them from economically supplying UBs to, say, Europe or no-Japan/Thailand Asia, at least for auto.

     

    I suppose in theory they could just ship negative electrodes like a promising company we all know.
    11 Mar, 09:24 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    It's only one facility but it's a biggie – The World's Largest and Most Modern Battery Manufacturing Facility with over 2 million sq. feet under roof on a 490+ acre plant site.

     

    http://bit.ly/1g4INd0
    11 Mar, 09:32 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    I assume a world-wide supplier would need to set up manufacturing facilities regionally? Doesn't JCI and Exide do that?

     

    Just in time manufacturing, lower shipping costs for that relatively low-cost heavy product, etc.
    11 Mar, 10:00 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    "Since 2008 East Penn's rights have been expanded, although the precise scope of those rights isn't entirely clear to me. When I spoke with Dr. Lam at the ELBC in 2012, he told me CSIRO was still seeking additional partners."

     

    John, Do I take the later part of this statement to mean that the UB license agreements are not exclusive to the current licensees in their respective markets?
    11 Mar, 10:11 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    AFAIK the existing licenses are exclusive for specified territories, but there are (were?) parts of the world that aren't (weren't?) covered by license agreements. Whenever you have a technology like the Ultrabattery that was developed by a government agency and then made available through licenses, the only way to get a clear picture is with copies of the relevant contracts, a map and highlighters for different licensees and application classes.
    11 Mar, 10:19 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    Thanks John.

     

    Doesn't this, for the autos, make the UB equally unpalatable with the PbC when it comes to leverage for the provider? This meaning the autos like commodities that can be gotten from numerous sources like carbon added to the NAM. Or at least from a couple sources to manage risk.
    11 Mar, 10:24 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Within a particular territory, there's typically only one licensee which means users in that territory will have a sole source issue.
    11 Mar, 10:27 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    oooh, they hate that with a passion.

     

    But the leverage piece can somewhat be managed with long term agreements and the supply piece can be managed with the same given language to purchase from another source for that region under certain conditions. Also screams for having more than one solution tested and scaled. The last provision being the best me thinks!
    11 Mar, 10:34 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    At the bottom of page 56 there is mention of an "ALABC high carbon battery". Did that ever go into development and how does it compare to the PbC? It seems like the ALABC did want a PbC type solution.

     

    http://1.usa.gov/ZWUGM4
    11 Mar, 03:00 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Zooka -

     

    Interesting presentation. I think I remember reading it some time back:

     

    page 61

     

    A set of 44, 6-V, 10-Ah modules was manufactured at Exide and shipped to ECOtality. Twenty-eight
    of these were connected in series and operated under SHCHEVP duty (as shown in Figure 61). (Note that these modules were selected from the rest based on capacity and open-circuit voltage).
    The voltage of the 12-V blocks (every two single Exide modules) within the pack was monitored
    during cycling. It can be seen in Figure 62 that the units were in balance at the commencement of duty.

     

    Unfortunately, two modules failed after the completion of 6,100 simulated miles. These were removed,
    the remaining modules recharged, and another two new, fully charged modules added. Cycling was
    recommenced, but another four modules failed after a total of 8,900 miles. These were then replaced, but
    the pack failed again after a total of 12,500 miles, at which stage it was retired from service. The voltage
    of the 12-V blocks from the pack at the end of cycling is shown in Figure 61. It can be seen that 7 of the
    12 blocks had low voltages, which suggests that at least seven, 6-V modules were faulty. The capacity of
    the failed modules was about 3.2 Ahr.

     

    In summary, the results to date suggest that both the ALABC high-carbon North Star Battery Company and Exide technologies require further development before they are ready for use in HEVs. However, inconsistencies in cell manufacture may have contributed toward the reliability issues encountered in this study.
    11 Mar, 03:09 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Axion got a pair of contracts from the ALABC in 2009 ($380,000) to do some collaborative research support further research into two key areas: (1) the lead sulfate corrosion that tends to accumulate on non PbC lead-acid anodes, shortening the useful life of batteries in most cases; and (2) the use of non-corroding PbC(TM) batteries in HEVs (hybrid electric vehicles)

     

    http://bit.ly/Ic5EL2

     

    ISTR that some of the work focused on carbon paste additives.
    11 Mar, 03:11 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    TG commented in February 2009:

     

    "that our PbC and lead-carbon technologies are the keys to making electric vehicles affordable, dependable and safe. Clearly we have the attention of the world's leading battery companies, and that is rewarding in and of itself. It takes on added significance when you consider that our long range business plan calls for us to eventually sell our proprietary negative electrodes to these same lead-acid battery companies.

     

    This next step will occur as we begin to max out our own battery production capabilities."

     

    Doh! I guess TG has been making grandiose statements for awhile. Granted, I think he had just bagged the Exide deal.
    11 Mar, 03:21 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    The Exide relationship was announced about 45 days AFTER the ALABC grant, so there's no question Tom knew the deal was pending and the news would be important.

     

    In proper context, the words were far from empty posturing.
    11 Mar, 03:31 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Would love to be able to link comments in his recent interview concerning preparing for top-line growth to something substantive such as could be inferred from TG making this statement and then 45 days later bagging Exide.

     

    Is it really possible to stand up 4 times in 5 months predicting significant top-line results, but only have one 320K sale to show for it? I don't think so. So for all my sarcasm, I really believe he has to be working on something.

     

    However, the old adage fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me ... is starting to rear its head.
    11 Mar, 03:38 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    SM: Yep. Fool me once, shame on you - Fool me twice, shame on me - and the third time, and thereafter, its a trade...
    11 Mar, 04:56 PM Reply Like
  • dlmca
    , contributor
    Comments (334) | Send Message
     
    JP

     

    Stockholm Syndrome - good point

     

    We all need to think as "investors" who want to see what has been patiently nurtured become "an overnight success"

     

    That will take sales and/or announcements of significance

     

    I was disappointed to read yesterday of several Axionistas flipping shares as fast as they could make a dollar. This is not investing and as JP has pointed out frustrates the potential returns for all.

     

    We need to think of $1 share price as well as $2, $5 and $10 and beyond. That is where the real fun will be had
    11 Mar, 07:20 AM Reply Like
  • Nicu Mihalache
    , contributor
    Comments (1020) | Send Message
     
    "I was disappointed to read yesterday of several Axionistas flipping shares as fast as they could make a dollar. This is not investing and as JP has pointed out frustrates the potential returns for all."

     

    Welcome in the arena [of adult life]. Playing hard ball with the dogs on Wall Street (extended by the inter-tubes nowadays) is a bloody sport.

     

    As hard a life some axionistas had for several years, there is no way you can blame them for covering some losses. As for myself, I did not have such hard time with AXPW [but surely with other stocks / options] and I do not give more than a rat's *** about what others think about my investing / trading style / choices.
    11 Mar, 08:12 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    dlm> One can both trade and invest in a stock simultaneously. And my trading doesn't frustrate anybody's return.

     

    I bought a small trading block last week, creating demand that slightly bid up the price (or kept selling pressure from cratering it). I attempted to sell said block, which would have slightly depressed the price (or kept it from rising as much). When you net the two trades though my demand cancels out my supply. So there is no appreciable net effect on price for a round trip trade.
    11 Mar, 08:15 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Stockholders will always trade and that's a good thing because the kind of stockholders we see trading today don't have the kind of brute mass that depresses the market price.

     

    Over the last four years we've had a succession of big investors who bought shares directly from the company and redistributed those shares into the public market. In the most common scenario, one or a few huge holders made a decision to sell their entire position at a given price level. Once that kind of decision is made, the price can't move until (a) the seller changes his strategy, or (b) the seller runs out of shares to sell.

     

    Where the sellers we've suffered from had millions of shares they wanted to sell, street holders who flip trading blocks have thousands or tens of thousands of shares and every possible seller has a different target price that he selected in the privacy of his room.

     

    Unless we see a mass exodus where all of the sellers miraculously choose the same exit price, normal trading for normal reasons is a good thing, not a bad thing. Now that the supply-demand dynamic has reached a transition point, my nagging worry is "What there aren't enough sellers to support a stable and liquid market?" Given a choice between a long grind up at the rate of a penny a day and leaps of five or ten cents per day, I'd really prefer the long grind because outsiders view a slow progression as more credible and sustainable. If things move too far too fast, folks start thinking bubble and that's never good.
    11 Mar, 08:55 AM Reply Like
  • greentongue
    , contributor
    Comments (731) | Send Message
     
    "How do you feel about Cincinnati around the end of this month? I'll show you something significant in Predator Green." - JP

     

    Not sure about anyone else but I wish I could be there.
    (Actually in the region as a youth so it would have been practical back then.)
    11 Mar, 08:37 AM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    "How do you feel about Cincinnati around the end of this month? I'll show you something significant in Predator Green."

     

    Is Cincinnati in addition to or in lieu of

     

    Mid-America Trucking Show
    Kentucky Fair and Exposition Center
    Louisville, KY

     

    3/27/2014 - 3/29/2014
    11 Mar, 09:53 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    It would be a shame to have a big trucking party in Louisville and not show up with a tractor or two. It may be a stretch to finish the interior of the day cab before the show, but the sleeper will be there strutting its stuff. It was too late to book floorspace for the show itself, but we'll find the people we really want to meet with.
    11 Mar, 10:02 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    PLUG, FCEL, ZBB and CPST are all up big in premkt again.

     

    Hot hot hot.
    11 Mar, 08:41 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    ZBB back to where it was when I started writing on it. Can't believe it.
    11 Mar, 09:40 AM Reply Like
  • D Lane
    , contributor
    Comments (1212) | Send Message
     
    I hear you Stefan. And I've missed out on all of it.

     

    At least with CPST and UQM I've been participating.
    11 Mar, 09:46 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2382) | Send Message
     
    And absolutely no news ??##$$!!
    11 Mar, 09:51 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    Reheating/hot sector. Things can improve in a heartbeat. Ur out, u lose.
    11 Mar, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2382) | Send Message
     
    Man, those guys must be churning out a new stock offering as fast as they can!

     

    Otherwise, if they don't get taken over, I fear a lot of small fry are going to get crushed, and it won't take 6 months to do it.
    11 Mar, 10:03 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    Stefan, ZBB's only up 75% today, lol.

     

    Stunning turnaround in price. Hope u got a lot of that.
    11 Mar, 10:19 AM Reply Like
  • D Lane
    , contributor
    Comments (1212) | Send Message
     
    re: no news
    I don't understand either. Some China mania via the battery on a truck in China story? JV in China.
    11 Mar, 10:26 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Supply and demand imbalances and the resulting Stockholm Syndrome are far more common than you'd imagine. Every time a small company sells stock it creates an overhang that has to be digested before the stock can perform. The problem is compounded when long-suffering stockholders begin to think "maybe the market is right and we don't deserve a better price." When the imbalance resolves itself the kind of runs we're seeing throughout the sector seem to occur for no apparent reason. ZBB is a great example of the phenomenon, but its behavior is not at all unusual.
    11 Mar, 10:33 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    Benefits of being on the Nasdaq and the resulting HFT and day traders that pass through the sector.

     

    Back in my old trading days I could get 5x (up to 10x margin) on Nasdaq stocks. But "Other OTC" had to be all cash.

     

    Sadly, I don't think we can see 10M share type days around here unless it is real Institutional money moving in as an investor.
    11 Mar, 01:58 PM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2382) | Send Message
     
    Remember when the "oil rig application" was one of our "shiny objects" to look at?

     

    Will there be a new one at this conference call?

     

    ======================...

     

    Saft Delivers High-Power Li-Ion Battery System to ECO-H Technologies

     

    http://bit.ly/1lRZwby

     

    "The ECO-H System is a patent-pending Hybrid Power Management System for the oil and gas industry developed by ECO-H Technologies and distributed by Tesco Corporation. Through its ability to provide power and store energy using Saft Li-ion batteries, the system allows for immediate on-demand power and the levelling of power usage peaks for rigs. Additionally, the system is equipped with a power management control system to regulate gensets and optimize efficiency. The ECO-H System offers both financial and environmental benefits to the oil and gas sector through the reduction of fuel consumption, fuel emissions and operating expenses."

     

    ======================...

     

    Sound familiar?

     

    Perhaps they consulted with Boeing on the "battery containment system" ... can you imagine a Lithium fire on an Oil Rig?

     

    Wonder how many insurance agents or agencies specialize in oil rig insurance?

     

    ======================...

     

    Sorry to you "long timers" for the bad Rosewater flashbacks :-)
    11 Mar, 09:43 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2382) | Send Message
     
    "Li-ion technology was selected for the application due to its high cycling capabilities and long life cycle not offered by traditional chemistries. The advanced battery system provides a lightweight, high-energy density that eases onsite placement of the product and reduces transportation costs."

     

    Are oil rigs as "anal" about weight as most car manufacturers?

     

    Penny UNwise and "Pound "foolish?
    http://bit.ly/1lS2M6Z

     

    Wonder how much more volume is required for the PbC solution?
    11 Mar, 10:01 AM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1766) | Send Message
     
    WTB,
    It will be interesting to see where they are using them. If they are going over to the Middle East, as Rosewater had tried to market the PowerCube for oil rig use, then I would be interested to see what kind of cooling system is needed to keep the Li-ion batteries from degrading in the heat.
    11 Mar, 10:02 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4421) | Send Message
     
    >wtblanchard ... Power requirements on a rig yo-yo more than Air Conditioning demand in a small town in summer. I hear barges aren't all that expensive and can even carry an extension cord.
    11 Mar, 10:08 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    Have spent the past 48 hours researching JC. JC is the national leader, has deep pockets, is known for R&D, and wears a blue badge. Exide is for now no longer a threat, and the Justice Department would never allow JCI to pick it up. Enersys is nifty, but not yet ready to threaten. It's also clear that batteries are not a strong leg JCI stands upon.

     

    They've really been strong in carbon testing, but nowhere can I find a significant corporate effort into manufacturing one of their own. Lotsa looking, but no actual jumping over the bar. What I've done is hardly comprehensive, but it makes me feel justified in wondering, "Why?"

     

    If you'll allow me to roll play, I'll be Chair of JCI. I have a nice commanding position for domestic auto batteries with some international capability. Development is such a pain in the neck, and loaded with blind alleys. The carbon field is loaded with outfits trying all kinds of interesting things. Why not wait and let the smoke clear? Then see if I can buy the winner. Or even better yet, if I know I can take my manufacturing facilities as they already exist, add a plug-in part that requires minimum change to my procedures, and have the gold standard in PSOC why wouldn't I do that?

     

    If I can be TG for a moment, and consider JCI might be interested in my carbon electrode, maybe I can ink a deal profitable for us both. Then add EP since we seem to get on nicely and BINGO, I have two suppliers. Add one more in Japan and there you have Asia. That gives me North America & Asia and if Europe comes round so much the better. Autos are covered domestically & ROW by industry leaders who are good at that kind of thing whilst I stick to what I do best.

     

    Meanwhile I can concentrate on my first-love targets in cubes, boutique applications like ePower, and rail development. The challenge from that road map is to keep on keepin' on until markets unfold. That's my current theory and I cling to it. Meanwhile I'll trust the professionals in whom I have invested to go ahead and do what they do.

     

    Warning: In the above conjecture I have assumed the Chairs of the three domestic companies are not stupid and know more about the industry than I. And further, as SWMBO has clearly pointed out my conjectures have not always resulted in financial bliss. I have to go deal with building the birdhouse I promised my granddaughter. She's tough.

     

    Otherwise, let the egg throwing begin ! :>)
    11 Mar, 09:57 AM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1766) | Send Message
     
    VW,
    While I would like nothing better than to see JCI making PbCs on their AGM lines, I don't see it happening. JCI has on multiple occasions gone out of their way to ignore the PbC. They have already come out with "their" solution for the 48V market and it is a small starter battery with a Li-ion battery in the same case. These are both technologies they already have in house and have developed for themselves. The only way I see JCI making PbC batteries is if Axion goes BK and they can buy the patents. Otherwise, they seem to be a company that believes that if they didn't invent the solution it doesn't work or isn't as good as their solution. IMHO
    11 Mar, 11:41 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    JCI HQ is just down the road from me and a source of local pride. Blue badge or blue chip stock, sure that's the reputation. I don't know much about them really.

     

    But I do understand that bigger is not better. My vote for the best clean energy outfit in existence to my knowledge would be ePower. Pure vision and drive. You can bet that Jay's team is a close knit group that would be happy going to the bar together after work. That's because every day they dangle from ropes on the face of Mt Rushmore drilling holes and setting charges. They are truly carving out a new face of clean energy and I can feel the excitement from 500 miles away.

     

    Not so for engineers or pen pushers in most big outfits. Typically there is resentment between upper echelons and rank and file. Due to size they have to govern by impersonal and excessive memos, which gets incredibly tiresome after years. If there is something cutting edge going on, the weight of stifling bureaucracy takes much of the fun out of it.

     

    Short of it is that I believe inertia keeps the big boys in most cases from being true innovators. In fact they resist it. In the 1960's automakers fought hard against seat belts as required equipment. Hard to believe that now! "Too costly", they said, as if loss of life was less costly.

     

    So those at the top of the heap tend to fear dramatic change, thus they don't embrace it. After all, dramatic change could mean losing their position.
    11 Mar, 12:01 PM Reply Like
  • steve.r
    , contributor
    Comments (14) | Send Message
     
    I keep circling back to this. If lead-carbon gains traction, who has the ability to supply them. Also, if there's any chance of it happening, why isn't JCI (the industry leader) claiming more involvement in progress other than a seemingly casual interest.
    12 Mar, 10:12 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1401) | Send Message
     
    Low volume today. The hot money must already be done.
    11 Mar, 10:10 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    Low volume today (midday now) but stable between .173-.187. I think that bodes well for support and another runup at some point. Maybe some of the hot money will grab profits in PLUG etc fearing a collapse in those high fliers and plow the proceeds into AXPW. That would be nice.

     

    I noticed in the seeking alpha daily email digests I receive that lately articles on PLUG are being featured and among the most commented on SA. Amazing attention for a small cap company that finally got a nice forklift contract (which doesn't sound that sexy). Smells like a bubble though.
    11 Mar, 12:12 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    "Low volume today. The hot money must already be done. "

     

    Why buy AXPW when nearly every other "Green Tech" equity in sight (PLUG, FCEL, ZBB, UQM, APGI) is rapidly accelerating out of the station?

     

    AXPW needs to sell some freakin' PbCs to move the stock price.
    11 Mar, 10:32 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    I understand the prevailing belief that Axion must do something spectacular before the price can move, but I think you'd be hard pressed to identify spectacular accomplishments in any of the companies you just listed. They're all making positive forward looking statements, but the reported accomplishments haven't been terribly impressive.
    11 Mar, 10:38 AM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1401) | Send Message
     
    I meant that the flippers are already done, which means that AXPW price can grind up from here. I think hot money will come back once they see that price has stabilized and profit takers out. It could happen this week.
    11 Mar, 10:45 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    D-inv, not to cast any asparagus at your question, but I can offer one reason why to buy Axion.

     

    Inasmuch as you say the others have already gone to the moon one could suppose it will take those companies awhile to catch up with that price. Axion has hardly moved the needle so it has a lot of room to run. I for one would prefer I was as clever as some of the Axionista traders who have clipped fast profits. But I'm not that bright.

     

    At the moment I see 400K shares traded. Seems to me JP is correct ( and yes, I was wrong) that the plumbers are out of shares to sell, or surely they would be dumping at these numbers at outrageous profits.

     

    We're now in consolidation mode with either foam being removed (one view) or fear being comforted (the other view) and the price is seeking its level. I'm nibbling so I guess I think it will begin a long creep up.

     

    FWIW, I have already gotten my money out of those others you mentioned and I'm playing with house chips. So apparently I believe in their story but think they're over done.

     

    When we start selling bleeping batteries, I think we'll run nicer pass patterns than those other guys. :>)
    11 Mar, 12:36 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    Who said anything about needing "something spectacular"? Spectacular would be wonderful, but hardly necessary to support a rising share price. one "commercial" sale per year (2012 NS999, 2013 300kW solar project) for Axion is not cutting it. No home runs needed, just a few base hits and walks to put points on the scoreboard. Even news of 50 - 100 sales to buyers of MultiLink's EB1s power supply unit would help greatly. Or news of a ePower truck sale or two. Steady PbC revenue growth from a broadening economic sector base would do the trick for Axion as well as for APGI.

     

    APGI has repeat sales in truck dual fuel kits as well as in stationary applications. It will very likely turn cash flow positive this year if it has not done so already. This morning it announced sale of 10 more dual fuel retrofit kits by one of its distributors in the mid-west, one that became a distributor early last year. In January APGI announced a repeat order for $700k of its products from a distributor operating in Cal., Nev. and Canada. Share price gain YTD > 70% on concrete, verifiable performance with more gain to follow soon if selection by a major trucking news source as one of the top 20 trucking innovations of 2014 is any indication.
    11 Mar, 01:25 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    VW ... never bought any fuel cell equities myself but have held all of the others at one time or other and presently long in APGI, CPST (which was not mentioned earlier). I presently have far more invested in AXPW than in APGI, CPST but new money is going to those equities before buying anymore AXPW. I am investing for my five grandchildren at this point and confronted with a problem every parent/grandparent would probably prefer over many alternatives -- all of them are healthy with quick minds and strong memories posing challenging educational decisions and tasks for parents/grandparents.

     

    I first acquired AXPW when expecting the first grandchild (the oldest turned 6 in December) and todate have negative returns to show for it. Returns on APGI & CPST are positive todate with greater future returns highly prospective. Other candidates with strong likelyhood of above average short-term returns are under consideration. Without strong progress toward commercialization by Axion in the next few months, the bulk of my AXPW holdings will be liquidated for redeployment. A lower risk path toward contributing to grandchildren's education will be pursued. Probability of much earlier need for educational funds than typical college freshman age is high. (That six year old kindergartener is bilingual in English & Spanish, reading at 5th grade level and is math competent through 3rd grade.)
    11 Mar, 02:58 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (4605) | Send Message
     
    D-inv congrats on your grandson's achievements and progress at such a young age.
    11 Mar, 03:56 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    Thanks, LT. The granddaughter's educational development is a nice problem to have in many ways and intimidating in others.
    11 Mar, 05:30 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    Norfolk Southern in Washington DC.

     

    Southern Railway owned the property on the east boundary of of Federal Triangle in 1932. The property was condemned under WPA projects.

     

    The condemned property was the last to be destroyed and built upon with the Apex Building. During the intervening years however WWI veterans marched on Washington to protest inadequate conditions for veterans. They occupied Anacostia with a camp ground and marched in assembly to the east end of the Federal Triangle. On July 28, 1932 upon orders from Herbert Hoover, Douglas McArthur and George Patton attacked the protesters on Southern Railway condemned property with 1,200 infantry, 1,200 cavalry, and six battle tanks. Patton led a cavalry charge with sabres drawn (!) and routed the veterans with vomit grenades. One veteran was killed. The "Bonus Army" of veterans retreated to Anacostia (43,000 of them) and at 10:14 pm that same day McArthur attacked again and burned their camp to the ground.

     

    Southern Railway built a replacement building at 1500 K Street in 1928. It was my favorite office building of all time and it still stands.

     

    Presumably, today's NSC visit will be more pleasant and yield us kewel news.
    11 Mar, 11:12 AM Reply Like
  • dlmca
    , contributor
    Comments (334) | Send Message
     
    Valley

     

    JC thoughts...Reasoned thoughts. Thank you

     

    Glad I hit a nerve or two elsewhere. Respect it is a free market.

     

    Seems to me - given the risks - one should not be in AXPW if you are not thinking long term. Think like an entrepreneur building a company one brick at a time with a destination of significance in mind

     

    Respect everyone's right to do as they please
    11 Mar, 11:50 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    "Dark matter, he said, could consist of axions..."

     

    Anything that gives us more exposure is good, lol.

     

    http://bit.ly/1i95PEO
    11 Mar, 11:52 AM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    Hmmm..

     

    Are you sure we want to be associated with WIMPS?

     

    "Dark matter is widely thought to be a kind of massive elementary particle that interacts weakly with ordinary matter. Physicists refer to these particles as WIMPS, for weakly interacting massive particles, and think they originated from the Big Bang. WIMPs are thought to be streaming constantly through the solar system and Earth."
    11 Mar, 12:27 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    We're not: " Dark matter, he said, could consist of axions, WIMPs or sterile neutrinos"

     

    We're axion. They're WIMPS. Or sterile. Or exides.

     

    At the moment, though, we're all dark. Passing right thru stuff w/out being noticed. Eventually they'll all see we're the Big Factor though.
    11 Mar, 01:00 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    I'd be happy with a quarter of the mass in the global battery industry.
    11 Mar, 03:16 PM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    With your moons orbiting an asteroid metaphor, we might well become MACHO's.

     

    http://bit.ly/1i3OhJz
    11 Mar, 03:52 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    I's certainly rather be a MACHO than a WIMP.
    11 Mar, 03:59 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    AES batteries to replace dirty peak power plants

     

    http://bit.ly/1lSr296
    11 Mar, 12:00 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    "The company's "Advancion" system can supply power for as long as four hours at about $1,000 a kilowatt. That's close to the $1,350 a kilowatt from a recently built gas peaker plant, he told Bloomberg."

     

    Unless I'm mistaken, that works out to an installed system cost of $4,000 per kWh.
    11 Mar, 12:06 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    And we can't get any traction.

     

    "I got a rock!" :(
    11 Mar, 12:18 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (828) | Send Message
     
    [AES] has begun selling systems in many markets: the region served by PJM Interconnection (largest in U.S.), Hawaii, California, the U.K. and Philippines.
    11 Mar, 01:05 PM Reply Like
  • shaggydude4hire
    , contributor
    Comments (19) | Send Message
     
    Shouldn't you take it the other way to $250/kwh
    11 Mar, 01:05 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    ($4,000/kw)/4 hrs = $1,000/kwh? Just guessing.
    11 Mar, 02:21 PM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    Begging everyone's forgiveness since I've almost assuredly posted this already, but . . . .

     

    I hate to be a sexist pig, but this is one great chick !

     

    http://bit.ly/1h1g6SF
    11 Mar, 12:11 PM Reply Like
  • Stilldazed
    , contributor
    Comments (2093) | Send Message
     
    Hi VW,
    I have kept that site open in a tab since the first time you posted it. What a great, interesting and relaxing feast for the eyes.
    11 Mar, 12:55 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Mitsubishi hasn't gotten the TPS report on lead carbon batteries yet:

     

    Mild hybrid Concept AR (Active Runabout). The front-wheel drive Concept AR is powered by a lightweight mild hybrid Belt-driven Starter and Generator system (BSG). A 100 kW 1.1-liter 3-cylinder direct-injection turbocharged MIVEC gasoline engine mated to a 10 kW, 48 V BSG torque circuit with a 48V, 0.25 kWh lithium-ion battery.

     

    http://bit.ly/1lSuIYq
    11 Mar, 12:18 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Schaeffer hasn't gotten the TPS report either ...

     

    http://bit.ly/1i9kHTE
    11 Mar, 12:47 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Interesting push for 48V systems until it started talking about inductive charging

     

    http://bit.ly/1iwsDwh
    11 Mar, 01:49 PM Reply Like
  • Al Marshall
    , contributor
    Comments (495) | Send Message
     
    Stefan: Good articles. Interesting that Schaeffer claims a 48v battery can support a 12kW electric motor which they say is sufficient for low speed electric drive only.

     

    The fact that there are multiple projects underway across the industry built around 48v batteries is a good sign. Mayascribe was right to emphasis it last year (I thought at the time he was premature)
    11 Mar, 06:38 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    " A 100 kW 1.1-liter 3-cylinder direct-injection turbocharged MIVEC gasoline engine mated to a 10 kW, 48 V BSG torque circuit with a 48V, 0.25 kWh lithium-ion battery."

     

    :-) Which appears positioned directly above the gas tank.

     

    No thanks.
    12 Mar, 02:09 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    They are working that battery hard.

     

    10 KW / 48V = ~200 amps
    250 watt-hours / 10,000 watts = 0.025 hours or 1.5 minutes.

     

    Which equates to a 40C discharge rate at full romp. (assuming they really bias the BSG that hard)

     

    Really sounds like Lithium-Polymer territory. Model airplane batteries. Prized and priced for really high power and energy density. But far from the safest knives in the drawer. And even the most high-performance, fast-charge Li-Pos can only take maybe like 4C charging max, which is supposed to only be with constant monitoring. And habitually charging that fast shortens the life of the battery.

     

    http://bit.ly/1glfcQV

     

    For a mainstream example. So the equivalent of about two and a half of these babies. 600 bucks worth just for cells. Note the disparity of the max discharge and charge currents:

     

    250A or 50C out; 5A or 1C in.

     

    Obviously, what they would put into a car would have to be a more highly engineered, safety-tested solution than these, toy airplane batteries, but still, kinda scary.
    12 Mar, 02:51 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    The Axionista movie clip of the day has to be:

     

    http://bit.ly/1i9h4wK

     

    The next nominee will be:

     

    http://bit.ly/1lSxb5b
    11 Mar, 12:29 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    Was that JR or OMY rising out of the hole covered with the "Axion nickle" in the first movie? Didn't know that the yellow brick road had a troll service tunnel! Gotta change those "nickles" to lead. ;-D
    11 Mar, 12:43 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2124) | Send Message
     
    For those waiting to buy AXPW on the way up, I suggest you look at the short term price ZBB chart. I have held for a long time. I can't guess where I would have bought back in. Was it after the first jump. The second. After todays 10,000,000 share volume and 60% rise?

     

    I'm thrilled for all the Axion bottom feeders that bought at the bottom. Just have no idea when it will explode up and when to buy on the way up.
    11 Mar, 01:07 PM Reply Like
  • kevin lemm
    , contributor
    Comments (87) | Send Message
     
    As I was contemplating when to sell some of my shares of Axion I remembered what I read recently in an interview with Warren Buffett (posted below).

     

    http://on-msn.com/1i9z8XG

     

    The quote from the interview that struck home the most,

     

    “You just have to have some conviction that either a given company, or a group of companies ... are likely to make more money five or 10 or 20 years from now than they're earning now. And that is not a difficult decision to come to."

     

    Led me to the realization that at 20 cents per share, Axion’s potential for growth should be purchased, not sold.
    11 Mar, 01:53 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    kevin> You're right and I'm Buffett's #1 fan, but to temper that, when he was younger and playing with nimbler amounts of money he wasn't really a buy and hold guy. He traded quite a bit, but always on fundamentals after he read Graham.
    11 Mar, 02:46 PM Reply Like
  • kevin lemm
    , contributor
    Comments (87) | Send Message
     
    thanks Mr. Moheban I'll keep that in mind, but I think with the E-Power partnership, the future is still significantly brighter than the sub-20 cents we're currently at.
    11 Mar, 03:02 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    I know many ex-Axionistas but only a few who have got back in. Very hard to do emotionally and most will only tip toe back even if they left with a thump.
    11 Mar, 03:10 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    Absolutely Kevin agreed. But as AXPW sank for months last year I'm sure glad I traded a smallish chunk of my holding repeatedly and kept lowering my cost basis thus. Nothing wrong with doing it on the way up too. Not frequently but when hunch fever runs particularly high.

     

    A share sold at .20 for example can buy 1.33 shares at .15, ignoring gains tax. Interpolate the 33% more shares when the price is $5 and you've really got something.
    11 Mar, 04:13 PM Reply Like
  • Amouna
    , contributor
    Comments (1455) | Send Message
     
    kevin,

     

    I had this rationale when I bought back in 2011. In 2014, it is becoming increasingly hard for me to see much upside in Axion the way it is currently run.

     

    Much of its technical prowess can be credited to the men in the factory, but I have some doubts about the man at the top. Some people see him as a saviour and a visionary with strong negotiation skills, whereas I am much more skeptical on this front. Again this is just me...
    11 Mar, 06:34 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9584) | Send Message
     
    PLUG just raised $22.4M for $5.74 a share.

     

    http://yhoo.it/1iwnwwl

     

    One analyst stated that PLUG is fairly valued at 50 cents.
    11 Mar, 01:27 PM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1766) | Send Message
     
    Maya,
    We know anybody who has $22 million sitting around to invest in Axion? That would be enough to fund to company for 2-3 years and get over the worry, by some potential customers, that they will be closing their doors in the future.

     

    "The shares were sold at a price to the public of $5.74 per share for gross proceeds of approximately $22.4 million. The shares were placed with a single investor."
    11 Mar, 02:34 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (828) | Send Message
     
    Plug's pps meltdown today from $11.72 to (currently) $6.80 apparently came in response to the $5.74/share financing. Reminds me of Axion's pps meltdown in Feb. 2012 from .60+ after the .35 per share financing was announced.

     

    ZBB dropping today from a high of $4.75 to (currently) ~$3.00 is a quite a drop as well. What's with all the volatility? Are the high frequency traders targeting these "hot" green stocks and creating massive movements? FCEL is down sharply as well.

     

    What might this portend for Axion at some point?
    11 Mar, 02:42 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4421) | Send Message
     
    >WayneinOregon ... Nothing like a round of financing to discover the difference between fair value and faith ... or fluff ... whichever.
    11 Mar, 02:46 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    Wayne, PLUG's plunge, although it's still above the recent offering price, was probably because of this:

     

    http://bit.ly/1fpIPAJ
    11 Mar, 02:50 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9584) | Send Message
     
    Lab: That single investor probably made millions on his $22M.

     

    PLUG coming unplugged reminds me of the blue lights media hoopla that Molycorp and Lynas sustained.
    11 Mar, 03:12 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    I don't look at MCP very often so I was shocked the last time I saw its price. Maybe I could use them as a Tesla analog?
    11 Mar, 04:26 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    HTL, likely knows better but it has been said that "high frequency" trading makes up the majority of all listed stock volume. The computers react to price mechanisms in picoseconds.
    11 Mar, 04:26 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (9584) | Send Message
     
    Well...China acts as a cartel in the REE space. But the automotive dealership associations here in the US are acting as a blockade to Tesla.

     

    Today, the New Jersey Automotive Dealership Association voted to oust Tesla from selling vehicles in their state. That's now 3 states that can't sell Tesla cars (TX and AZ).

     

    11 Mar, 04:36 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    I'm no fan of Tesla, but seems like more artificial interference just to protect an established order. A lot like the taxi business versus the upstart car services. Part of the healthy dynamism of capitalism is supposed to be creative destruction. Failure is just as necessary to the system as success. And if the dealership model can't compete and survive without gov't interference then something's wrong with it and it should evolve...
    11 Mar, 04:48 PM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1766) | Send Message
     
    48,
    You have to remember that the dealerships pay a lot of sales and property taxes to the cities/states they are in. If you allow internet sales of $100,000 automobiles the states are worried they aren't going to get their cut.
    11 Mar, 05:46 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    And that's too bad. But the cookie crumbles. You have to let it.
    11 Mar, 05:49 PM Reply Like
  • rgholbrook
    , contributor
    Comments (116) | Send Message
     
    Granted the trust level associated with a car salesman barely beats that of congress,

     

    http://bit.ly/1ixf8wy

     

    But, car dealerships, especially franchises, do provide boots on the ground services in towns across America. They also bring confidence to the market for the consumer. On the other hand,what local shop are you taking the Roadster or Model S to when things go wrong on your road trip? Agree it would nice if an unintended benefit of Tesla is that it forces the dealerships and associations to "up their game".
    11 Mar, 05:50 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    rgh, I totally agree that dealerships bring some value. Value that would be missed without them. But let Tesla buyers/owners find that out on their own. They buy a car directly from the mfgr, knowing full well there is no dealership nearby, well, when it comes time for service or customer support they will feel the consequences of their decision. They will probably squawk about it. Prospective Tesla customers will take notice. They may decide not to buy. Tesla loses sales. Tesla then has to decide whether or not to create dealerships. Let the process unfold naturally that way.
    11 Mar, 06:21 PM Reply Like
  • Rick Krementz
    , contributor
    Comments (2164) | Send Message
     
    LabTech, a car sold by Tesla in NJ still has sales tax collected by NJ, just like a dealership. A Tesla car bought in any state, then brought to NJ, has sales tax in order to be registered.

     

    There are Tesla "offices" in NJ that pay rent and employees. The other car dealers in NJ are strictly scummy, anti-competitive hypocrites.

     

    I lived in NJ for a while, and only printable thing I can say about buying a car there is "unpleasant".
    11 Mar, 06:51 PM Reply Like
  • froggey77
    , contributor
    Comments (2768) | Send Message
     
    Dealerships were forced on the automakers years ago by the govt.
    A lot of people were stuck with cars and no place to get them fixed; when the company went out of business.
    Tesla's approval of shops to fix their cars seems like a viable option when it's near you.....but personally I wouldn't have a car that needed to be taken states away to get fixed. I think they need thousands more of approved sites.
    However the Tesla owners have been rich and willing to deal with a car that sits in their driveway for a month and more on occasion. If their target audience had been people with only one car, it would have been DOA.

     

    BTW
    While I've seen them at shows, I noticed my first MS on the road today. (Well OK in a parking lot.) It was raining and my first thought was it was a Ford Focus. (I'm not really a car guy.) Anyway I noticed the T on the front and realized what it was. We passed and I got a quick look at it.
    I'm not impressed.
    11 Mar, 10:10 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    John -

     

    Wasn't it Alan Cooper that told you that he wanted to test the PbC for the LC Superhybrid? Could these guys have been pushing PbCs?

     

    http://bit.ly/17aiykc

     

    Too bad it gave, what we believe is an inferior product, a very public platform.
    11 Mar, 02:14 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Sure hard not to see it as some form of wasted opportunity...

     

    But as in all things, I guess time will tell.
    I mean if Axion had been involved this whole time with the project it surely would have brought some increased visibility, press, and PR. But maybe having this 48v platform/market mature all on its own is nearly as good. Maybe it will all eventually come Axion's way anyway. PbC is not a drop-in replacement, but any way you slice it, it's still going to offer some compelling advantages that these 48v systems should be able to leverage and exploit as they expand. Maybe it's a case that carbon-paste and UB establish and nurture the category, without much input of limited Axion resources, but nevertheless benefits eventually redound to Axion when those platforms start inevitably looking for a better battery down the road.

     

    Still, sure seems like it would be nice to have Axion's name splashed all over it now though...
    11 Mar, 03:11 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    If the UltraBattery starts showing up in the next generation 48V hybrids I'm not sure that would be good news for Axion.

     

    We have long been told that Axion will be the OEM's logical choice when they realize they have to pay up. If we find that they will pay up but not for the PbC that suggests some flaw in Axion's business model.

     

    The whole Ultra and Kia thing is intriguing; I suspect by next year we will have answers
    11 Mar, 04:31 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    " Maybe it's a case that carbon-paste and UB establish and nurture the category, without much input of limited Axion resources, but nevertheless benefits eventually redound to Axion when those platforms start inevitably looking for a better battery down the road."

     

    Jeez 48, I hope this road isn't the same for rail, automotive and grid storage. Gonna be another "highway of tears".
    -
    Ten to fifteen inches of snow on the way. I'd gladly give it to the Cali. folks! Need a moisture transporter to beam it there.
    11 Mar, 04:51 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Stefan> Alan Cooper told me the ALABC wanted to USE the PbC in the LC SuperHybrid. There was no question of testing its suitability. He was miffed that Axion said no, but frankly I can't blame Axion for deciding that it didn't want to spend limited resources for footnote coverage in a promotional campaign that touts the wonders of an electric supercharger and a BSG.

     

    While I didn't ask Mr. Cooper whether the Ultrabattery was considered as an option for the LC SuperHybrid, I know it wasn't used and there are only two possible explanations. First, I think there's a good chance that the Ultrabattery is not well suited to a micr-hybrid drivetrain. Second I think there's a good chance that East Penn wasn't interested in being a footnote in somebody else's PR campaign either.

     

    The tone of many recent comments is approaching resignation to the assumption that the Ultrabattery is KIA's battery of choice for the 48-volt system. The assumption is absurd. East Penn and Furukawa are not active participants in the automotive OEM markets. East Penn only has one facility that can make the Ultrabattery and they're focused on utility grade cells that offer solid profit margins.

     

    I have yet to see an article or a presentation that suggests an automaker, any automaker, is engaged in validation testing of the Ultrabattery. While validation testing might not make the mainstream press, it would certainly show up in the progress presentations these East Penn makes for industry conferences and the DOE.

     

    I'm happy to assume that KIA will take the low road and try carbon paste additives first, but I just don't see the Ultrabattery as a contender for this particular niche.
    11 Mar, 05:15 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Intriguing as heck. What would be most useful is to be able to see some kind of direct UB vs PbC technical shootout..

     

    But absent that, what we're pretty sure of is that UB cannot equal PbC when it comes to charge acceptance. And without adequate charge acceptance a hybrid system cannot capture all of the energy that is otherwise wasted in braking and descending hills. ePower's failed experience with AGM is highly instructive WRT to that. The power generated can overwhelm the (non-PbC) battery and then the energy is just wasted as heat/wear in the brakes. Dumb. It's leaving something on the table. It's settling for a drivetrain that fails to be all it can be.

     

    Basically, and Dr. Buiel made this point several times, the PbC is almost the only battery that accepts energy at the same rate that it delivers it. No other LA chemistry does. LA is great at cranking out amps. But try to put those back in and it's a snail's pace. Fine for some applications. Not so much with hybrids.

     

    Consider the Kia drivetrain. Say the electric Supercharger and BSG both consume 5KW each at full tilt off the line. Both the UB and PbC (in 4x12V strings) can probably deliver the 200A 10KW burst to make both happen over the course of several seconds during a hard acceleration event like freeway on-ramping or passing or stoplight getaways. But only the PbC can be replenished, and thus recover, at the same rate, either from the engine generator once the car's up to desired speed or from a decel event shortly following as in stoplight-to-stoplight driving. In such situations, the UB would fall further and further behind. It takes four times as long to be replenished as it does to be depleted. And if such replenishment is from a hard braking event or steep descent that exceeds the UB's max uptake rate, then all the energy that might have been captured by the battery won't be, instead it will go to heating up and wearing out the brakes. And who wants that?

     

    Anyway, I gotta think that if PbC in reality *can* do the job better, if there are extra gains to be had by using it, then somebody *is* eventually going to use it in order to get that competitive advantage. Provided of course the cost isn't so high that it's not worth the candle...
    11 Mar, 05:19 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    JP,

     

    I agree with your logic and I doubt KIA would want a sole source provider in the US.

     

    However, why did the ALABC even come up with an UltraBattery hybrid concept car if the licensees have no interest in pursuing automotive markets?

     

    I get it with their LC SuperHybrid concept - as it "attempts" to promote AGM batteries with past additives, something all manufacturers can replicate.

     

    But why the Ultrabattery hybrid? It is not technology that is available to the rest of the battery manufacturer's (much like the PbC) so how does it help ALABC's cause.
    11 Mar, 05:30 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    CSIRO and the ALABC have cooperated for years. The first Ultrabattery HEV conversion was track tested in 2007 using batteries made by Furukawa, the first Ultrabattery licensee. East Penn didn't arrive on the scene before the track test results were released and CSIRO and the ALABC were in full PR mod. So from East Penn's perspective the HEV conversion program was something it inherited as part and parcel of the Ultrabattery license.

     

    If you look at the vast bulk of Ultrabattery presentation materials it's clear that their only real focus is stationary and automotive gets mention as an after-thought.
    11 Mar, 05:45 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (3886) | Send Message
     
    "East Penn only has one facility that can make the Ultrabattery and they're focused on utility grade cells that offer solid profit margins. "

     

    Which says any auto OEM in N.A., Europe, Korea, S.A. that chooses UB is accepting a sole source supplier shipping heavy product from Pa, or EP is willing to sublicense manufacture to battery manufacturers outside Pa or build/acquire new manufacturing facilities elesewhere. Shipping fully assembled UBs overseas from Pa would endow PbC with a further competitive advantage beyond the technical advantage of lower product weight.

     

    Axion's business model OTOH anticipates shipping a light weight, low physical volume product for use in battery assemblies elsewhere.
    11 Mar, 05:58 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1401) | Send Message
     
    What would stop ALABC from just buying a few PbCs and developing with it for their LC SuperHybrid?
    11 Mar, 06:02 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    PbC electrode assemblies are light, but they take up the same volume as lead-based negative electrodes that typically represent half of the working case volume.

     

    While international shipping of electrode assemblies is theoretically possible, I have to believe an automaker in Europe or Asia will insist on local electrode fabrication near their battery manufacturer instead of relying on a 5,000 mile supply chain.
    11 Mar, 06:03 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    I'm not saying the photo is conclusive. I am saying it's highly suggestive.

     

    There are two main questions:

     

    1) Are the batteries in the show photo UltraBatteries?

     

    and

     

    2) What does the presence of any particular battery in the show photo mean?

     

    As to the first question, I've recently looked through hundreds of bing images and google images search photos for 12V battery, automotive battery etc etc, trying to find a battery with a similar case design to what is featured on the ultrabattery.com website and what is in the Kia show photo. I looked at a lot of 12V car battery pictures, but I couldn't really find any that looked like the one in the show photo/UB photo. Maybe other folks doing their own image searches can find some where I didn't.

     

    So for me, given all the other clues and connections, albeit murky they are, it is not quite absurd to conclude that what is in the photo anyway is UltraBattery.

     

    Now, whether that really means anything, that I'm not trying to claim with any confidence. I mean, as discussed, if in fact it is ultrabattery in the photo, it could be a diversion, misinformation, subtle psychological warfare against their intended supplier, all designed to strengthen Kia's hand in upcoming negotiations... None of us can say. It may just be a meaningless stand-in. But If we wanna take it at face value, that, heck sure looks like Ultrabattery, Ultrabattery has been tested in hybrids, ultrabattery is touted here and there as a hybrid solution, there do exist major mfgrs presumably in business to sell ultrabattery etc etc...

     

    Well, if it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, sure it may not be a duck after all, especially if some evidence suggests otherwise... but I don't really think it's fair to say that it's *absurd* to think that maybe, perhaps, it just might really be a duck, you know?

     

    Just saying.
    11 Mar, 06:11 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    For that matter, suppose Kia does decide to go with UB and wants to sell cars in America. What's to stop Kia from making the cars in Korea, then shipping them to the US sans batteries? EP/Deka can ship the batteries to the Kia Dealerships in the US where they can be installed in the cars prior to sale. Might not be practical/desirable for a high-volume model, but for a lower-volume model couldn't that work?

     

    Also, if EP/Deka is in not interested in the automotive market, no way, no how, on at least some level, then whyfore this?:

     

    http://bit.ly/1cOZsBa
    11 Mar, 06:28 PM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1766) | Send Message
     
    John,
    The assumption, in your opinion, might be absurd. But I would argue that someone put forth the image from the Kia presentation, with the LC trademark on top of the battery pack, and what looks to be the form and size of four Ultrabatteries underneath. I find it hard to believe that this was done by accident. So it is my opinion that someone(s) wants us to believe that the system will use the Ultrabattery. Who that was, and why they want us to believe it is very open to speculation. IMHO

     

    "The tone of many recent comments is approaching resignation to the assumption that the Ultrabattery is KIA's battery of choice for the 48-volt system. The assumption is absurd. "
    11 Mar, 07:03 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    LabTech, I'll take one guess as to why they did what they did. And I think it's the same reason BMW went public w/ Axion years ago. The prototype emphasis on lead carbon and the comments in the articles about the weaknesses of lithium ion were a very clear message to an entire industry.

     

    Also wouldn't discount that it's also a message to Axion.

     

    There are, of course, other motivations involved. One of which is giving credit to some of your development partners.

     

    BTW, I am also of the opinion that even if the Ultrabattery was in the prototype other batteries are being tested as well and a final selection is not in place.
    11 Mar, 07:13 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    The ALABC owns the LC logo and trademark that appear in the KIA photo. It is the centerpiece of the ALABC's "Low Cost. Life Changing. Lead Carbon." program to promote lead-acid batteries with carbon paste additives.

     

    http://bit.ly/NHuOEm

     

    The ALABC's work with CSIRO on the Ultrabattery in modified Honda Hybrids has nothing to do with the LC SuperHybrid program.

     

    Neither East Penn nor the Ultrabattery are even mentioned on the ALABC's LC SuperHybrid page or any of the linked materials on that page.
    11 Mar, 07:15 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    The "LC" in the Kia pic maybe is just a courtesy nod to Valeo or CPT technology (or their inspiration). However, like others have said, it's doubtful that all design choices are final at this stage.

     

    Also it seems like most of us agree that it likely won't be the same Exide batteries used in the Volkswagen based Super Hybrid (although this is what battery is used when the "LC" is displayed). The logic jump to assuming it is the Ultra battery seems inconsistent since I don't think we can find a picture with the Honda UltraHybrid depicting an "LC" logo.

     

    In some ways, the "LC" logo might be an AALBC relationship differentiator that means it is not a nod to the UltraBattery at all but rather a nod to it being a plain jane AGM (with additives) that presumably all the AALBC battery partners, like Exide, could replicate.
    11 Mar, 07:42 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    The Logo used in the KIA photograph belongs to the ALABC. It is not owned by Valeo or CPT.

     

    The ALABC has been very careful to distinguish its LC program from its other research activities. I consider its use in the KIA display as fairly strong proof that KIA plans to launch with AGM and carbon paste additives, although the identity of its battery supplier will remain triple secret until they're ready to actually build and sell cars in 2015, most likely for the 2016 model year.
    11 Mar, 07:53 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    Makes sense.

     

    LC logo is kinda of "marking of the territory" attempt for the ALABC and the lead acid industry.

     

    Still confused why KIA allowed it though and that's why I postulated that maybe KIA was inspired, in some way, by the LC Super Hybrid concept/technology.
    11 Mar, 08:10 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    KIA made a big deal of using a lead-carbon battery so it makes sense to me that they'd give a nod to the industry consortium that's promoting the technology.
    11 Mar, 08:24 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Couldn't Kia cherrypick?

     

    Couldn't they say...

     

    "well, ALABC, we really like all the CPT components... the beefy speedstart BSG, the gutsy electric supercharger...and we like all the work you've done. But we don't understand these wimpy carbon paste batteries you chose to use. Not going to cut if for us. We have our customers to answer to, and they're not going to be getting a substandard solution from us. Yes we know it must've made your members happy, but that's not our problem. We want a more robust choice. Oh and look, here's UB backed by an established, highly respected manufacturer. That endured all those HEV tests. That's what we choose. And hey, if you wanna put your logo on it, fine. But bottom line, we're buying what we want." ;)
    11 Mar, 08:38 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    AFAIK the ALABC has no interest in either the Valeo electric supercharger or the Control Power Technologies BSG. It is, however actively engaged in promoting the Ultrabattery and AGM batteries with carbon paste additives.

     

    For all intents and purposes, the Ultrabattery program and the LC SuperHybrid program are fraternal twin daughters of the ALABC.

     

    When a father of twin daughters learns that one has gotten engaged, he does not publish the other one's picture and name in the newspaper.
    11 Mar, 09:27 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Point taken John. As perhaps an explanation that might reconcile the questions somewhat, is it possible that the photo is showing not ultrabatteries, but instead EP/Deka batteries that nevertheless use the same case, but are merely conventional AGM+carbon paste inside? Seems unlikely if EP is not really in the auto game, but it is a thought...
    11 Mar, 09:42 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    On second thought John, now I'm confused.

     

    In an earlier post above you say this:

     

    "Alan Cooper told me the ALABC wanted to USE the PbC in the LC SuperHybrid. There was no question of testing its suitability. He was miffed that Axion said no, but frankly I can't blame Axion for deciding that it didn't want to spend limited resources for footnote coverage in a promotional campaign that touts the wonders of an electric supercharger and a BSG."

     

    Which all but implies that the focus of the LC SuperHybrid is the electric supercharger and the BSG, and that the carbon-paste batteries that ALABC ended up using instead of the PbC (which they would have preferred) take a back seat to those components..

     

    But then, just now, you write:

     

    "AFAIK the ALABC has no interest in either the Valeo electric supercharger or the Control Power Technologies BSG. It is, however actively engaged in promoting the Ultrabattery and AGM batteries with carbon paste additives."

     

    Which seems to indicate that it's really all about the batteries. Which means Axion really *should* have seized that opportunity, because then maybe ALABC would be "actively engaged in promoting" the PbC too! ;)
    11 Mar, 09:59 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    The value of any third party's promotional contribution has to be weighed against that party's disclosed intent and mission. The ALABC's mission is to advance science for the benefit of all its members. It probably would not have gotten behind the Ultrabattery if the technology had been developed by a private company instead of CSIRO. Given Axions desire to keep its IP confidential and the ALABC's desire to share IP freely among all its members, the tensions are very real. Axion has chosen the path to market that diligently protects the IP for its stockholder's benefit. I'm in no position to second guess the wisdom of those decisions.
    11 Mar, 10:17 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    86,

     

    I think it is likely that if Axion had participated it would have ended up similar to how the ALABC currently markets the Ultra Hybrid.

     

    Likely the ALABC would still have had another demonstrator marketing more generic/ accessible batteries to all their members (i.e. AGM) anyhow.
    12 Mar, 12:15 AM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Perhaps. Though it would have gotten the Axion name splashed around a bit I would think. Which might have been of some value, if only to the stock price.

     

    Yet the ironic thing is that the PbC *is* accessible to all their members... if they buy electrodes from Axion... while Ultrabattery is basically exclusive to East Penn.
    12 Mar, 12:24 AM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3297) | Send Message
     
    Imagine the mighty Plumbum nation is at war with the dreaded Lithiumites... a war fought with muskets and black powder. The kind that is prone to damp and makes clouds of smoke after the first volley so that nobody can see straight for the next.

     

    And then, then, one of the Plumbus among us develops a revolutionary new-fangled waterproof, smokeless powder. Higher potency too, so that shots are flatter and more accurate. He tries to get the plumbous armies to use the new powder, but they balk, they laugh and call him an upstart punk, they say his price is too high. They say they'd rather die than buy powder from this arrogant guy and be at his mercy. So they go back to fighting with what they have. Because they know better. But they try to make purer black powder, they try to add iron filings to it to make it work better, but it still stinks...when it's wet everybody misfires, and when it ain't the smoke still burns their eyes and keeps them from seeing their targets well enough to aim properly..

     

    Meanwhile the Lithiumites are developing rifles. With gun cotton. They're expensive and sometimes blow up, but they shoot dang far and dang straight.

     

    And so it was that slowly, stubbornly, did the proud mighty Plumbum nation lose the war...
    12 Mar, 12:53 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    A fine allegory =)
    12 Mar, 02:48 AM Reply Like
  • tomcat818
    , contributor
    Comments (42) | Send Message
     
    PLUG is melting down as I'm writing this... down from intra-day high of 11.72 to 7.65 low.
    11 Mar, 02:16 PM Reply Like
  • Ranma
    , contributor
    Comments (1401) | Send Message
     
    PLUG raised money around 5.74 IIRC.
    11 Mar, 02:33 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    Day Traders will exit as quick as they came in.

     

    http://bit.ly/1i9jJGP
    11 Mar, 03:07 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    PLUG $6.03 at close and $5.85 after hours. Wow! How would you like to have bought at $11.50+ today?
    11 Mar, 05:29 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    At 8 pm on March 6th Plug filed the definitive prospectus for an offering of 3.9 million shares priced at $5.74.

     

    http://1.usa.gov/PekLHz

     

    Since Plug's stock closed at $6.36 on March 6th, the discount to market was quite modest.

     

    I have a hard time understanding why anybody would bid the price up from $6.36 to $11.50 after the filing of the prospectus, but some people are really sloppy when it comes to doing their homework. They have nobody to blame but themselves.
    11 Mar, 05:53 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    John> If you are saying that anybody could expect to subscribe to the offering at $5.74, then to subscribe and simultaneously short the much higher priced stock would be a perfect, riskless arbitrage opportunity. So I guess the question is how sure could the little guy be of getting a seat at the offering table?
    11 Mar, 06:34 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Plug's press release said "The shares were placed with a single investor."

     

    While that investor could have resold the shares at a big profit over the last two days, the resales probably wouldn't involve any short selling.
    11 Mar, 06:49 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    RA, not riskless since a short can be called in (and likely would have) as it got past $10 and then you'd lose your hedge. Not easy to even get shares to short these type of events. But it is possible someone had the cajones to do a quick placement and then sell it for a flip. Or maybe they really wanted in for the long term. Personally, I think it was a dangerous stock as soon as it broke out of the 3's.
    11 Mar, 07:05 PM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    If you shorted at say $8 and it shot to $11 you think it would force a margin call? What if the short was small and collateral in the account ample?

     

    I rarely short and when I do it's always a small position. So small that if the price doubles even then it's no sweat. It's not worth it to live like that.
    11 Mar, 07:22 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (2322) | Send Message
     
    Shorting stocks with highly unusual volume and pps action is a different beast altogether. When I used to trade (years back); I could get called in on 25%+ moves because some of those moves can be 250%+ while you're away at work and then wipe out a whole account (and your broker won't like being on the hook). A name like PLUG is the type of short where you'd have to have large collateral and pay a rebate just to get short. With PLUG the way to do it would be options. Normally though, these types of stocks are the "promoted" kind that don't have options and its almost impossible to short them. Take a look at stocks in the legalized marijuana space. A few already have near Billion dollar market caps with almost no sales. Scary part is they were great short ideas at 10-100M market caps also. Typically, wait till the mania unfolds and lets someone else get the first 25-50% off the top as there still is plenty of meat on the bone after that.
    11 Mar, 09:06 PM Reply Like
  • geopark
    , contributor
    Comments (250) | Send Message
     
    Random notes:

     

    Tried to short NPWZ this morning @.0667 and was told that shorting is not allowed for equities under $5. Have never shorted since I didn't understand it or know how.

     

    The ~150% rise in 4 days just seemed just seemed too easy and so I tried. Retreat began @ ~9:50, now down to ~.045 . . would've been fun, no charge for the lesson though.

     

    Any knowledge sharing on shorting would be appreciated.

     

    Congrats to thotdoc (also tonys23) on you FCEL sell call from apc312.7mar04:26pm. Down 9% and falling. Would you mind sharing at ~ what price you might re-buy?

     

    Looking for the thotdoc post found a bunch of stuff I missed with the high volume of late. Thanks WIO for your 'personal health' post, also apc312.

     

    Thanks VW for the eagle nest re-post, I had forgotten it, still very cool.

     

    Thanks JP for the Wizard of Oz music links. will add this:

     

    http://vimeo.com/8578344

     

    Do believe Yip, Mr Arlen and Judy Garland would be quite pleased as well.
    11 Mar, 02:30 PM Reply Like
  • thotdoc
    , contributor
    Comments (1415) | Send Message
     
    No set price, I want to see it settle. The company may be announcing some new large sales from their partnership with NRG; that will make them profitable if the sales are greater than 80MWs
    11 Mar, 11:18 PM Reply Like
  • geopark
    , contributor
    Comments (250) | Send Message
     
    thanks
    12 Mar, 05:41 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (17253) | Send Message
     
    Thursday's stuff - still no power at home.

     

    03/06/2014: EOD stuff partially copied from blog (up now).
    # Trds: 467, MinTrSz: 1, MaxTrSz: 243626, Vol: 5952182, AvTrSz: 12746
    Min. Pr: 0.1330, Max Pr: 0.1510, VW Avg. Tr. Pr: 0.1446
    # Buys, Shares: 276 2658614, VW Avg Buy Pr: 0.1449
    # Sells, Shares: 187 3230568, VW Avg Sell Pr: 0.1445
    # Unkn, Shares: 4 63000, VW Avg Unk. Pr: 0.1384
    Buy:Sell 1:1.22 (44.67% "buys"), DlyShts 1529792 (25.70%), Dly Sht % of 'sells' 47.35%

     

    Take a look at the trading breakdown by time, very detailed today, for what a “lift off” looks like. Note that we had 85K in pre-market trades too.

     

    The average of the lowest 20 VWAPs times 80% today is $0.0764 vs. $0.0764, $0.0764, $0.0764, $0.0766, $0.0767, $0.0768, $0.0768, $0.0769 and $0.0772 on prior days. 80% of today's VWAP is $0.1157 vs. $0.0887, $0.0781, $0.0774, $0.0779, $0.0773, $0.0770, $0.0749, $0.0742 and $0.0752 on prior days. These are potential prices for the next tranche of shares to the PIPErs.

     

    Today's low, high, VWAP, trade volume, and daily short sales moved 33.13%, 13.11%, 30.46%, 41.75% and -10.99% respectively. Price spread today was 13.53% vs. 33.63%, 6.32%, 10.29%, 9.14%, 5.26%, 7.86%, 15.44%, 6.59% and 9.23% on prior days.

     

    On the traditional TA front, we had an excessive spread (BUT MUCH LESS SO THAN YESTERDAY) and a higher low, high and VWAP. The close was above both the prior close and above the open, with again very high volume and volume increasing substantially.

     

    Full stochastic is now well into overbought, ADX related are above neutral and rising, Williams %R is overbought, momentum continued moving smartly: ~0.96, 1.33 and now ~1.65, MFI is rapidly ascending and about to go overbought, and accumulation and distribution continues rising.

     

    RSI is deeper into overbought at 86.64 and still rising. As mentioned though, when moves are very strong things can keep the oscillators in overbought territory for a very long time.

     

    The MACD is well above neutral now and continues to climb, along with the histogram.

     

    Price was bumping blew right through the 200-day SMA, $0.1361 and traded almost exclusively above it on strong and rising volume today, a very bullish signal. The only possible concern is that volume has “spiked”, suggesting a possible trend end is nearing.

     

    The Bollingers are still widely split and being “pushed” by price and might be a concern as a return to mid-point is common. But as mentioned yesterday this doesn't usually happen in just a day or two. Some time usually will pass and the Bollingers will adjust some before a move towards the mid-point begins. So I don't think it's a worry for now.

     

    The larger trades (>= 15K) which was the most balanced I had seen yesterday, lost some of the balance today. The percentage split between buy and sell ...

     

    The usual is in the blog here.
    http://seekingalpha.co...

     

    HardToLove
    11 Mar, 03:12 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    Well, today's trading has showed little if any signs of the PIPErs. ARCA, NITE, ATDF and BTIG weren't pushing to the front of the ask line. NITE has been selling, but only looks retail, such as the 100k block that's got 94k left at 18 cents.

     

    So the PIPEnd theory keeps getting stronger.
    11 Mar, 03:16 PM Reply Like
  • WayneinOregon
    , contributor
    Comments (828) | Send Message
     
    Now that it appears the PIPRs are mostly gone, what could a near-term downside catalyst be? I don't see any obvious ones. The ongoing financing concerns are always there, but it seems unlikely there'll be undue fretting on that front until at least early summer, or later.
    11 Mar, 03:58 PM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    I think the company has been given a window of calm by many investors---a wait and see approach until at least the conf call and possibly a few months thereafter.
    11 Mar, 04:14 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13441) | Send Message
     
    Let's see, how about:

     

    The new NSC "green" loco unveiled at the conference is based on a different battery tech... If this is followed with a cancelation of the 999 initiative...

     

    The Kia reveals their lead carbon battery solution is not PbC, although they did test the PbC before making their choice...

     

    Axion announces a new round of funding sooner than we hope...

     

    TG's current "...not 6 months..." promise times out with no results, "significant" becomes a joke punch line on APCs everywhere...

     

    There are any number of downers which can happen.
    Best to hope they do not.
    11 Mar, 05:04 PM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    Aw, TB....

     

    You be harshing our mellow, mon!

     

    Just when we was getting MACHO, too....
    11 Mar, 06:01 PM Reply Like
  • JohnM121
    , contributor
    Comments (357) | Send Message
     
    Our troll is paid by "Big Oil", who buys out ePower and keeps the patents unimplemented.
    11 Mar, 07:05 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Another interesting energy storage model:

     

    http://bit.ly/1i3QCnP

     

    Hard to compete with no money down.
    11 Mar, 04:09 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    We've known for years about the opportunity here and the tech. is surely available. Will governments ever upgrade for this? Anyway, "for the future".

     

    Audi Says 'Nein' To Waiting At Red Lights

     

    http://huff.to/1fq7C7N

     

    BTW, Only 1 Nein!
    11 Mar, 04:16 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    A little on what Kia is thinkig relative to meeting EU targets on their vehicle line. ote the comment on the electric supercharger target.

     

    Korean brand Kia maps out its strategy to slash range-wide emissions by 2021

     

    " “The configuration here (at Geneva) with the start-stop generator, electrical charger as an option, I would say this is more for D-Segment (mid-size), so Optima level. If you take out the supercharger which is possible, you can also use it in smaller segments. So the technology itself is not fixed to a segment, it is in the end a question of package and costs.”"

     

    This comment is specific to the DCT but it is something to think about as it related to carbon additives to the NAM.

     

    " “What we observed is journalists writing about our competitors, that is part of our job so we have to take care of items which we see on our competitors as negative.” "

     

    http://bit.ly/NYwmJY
    11 Mar, 08:04 PM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    Too many are not paying attention. Step back and look at the forest. GLTA.
    11 Mar, 11:48 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Interesting to go re-read Dr. Buiel's S.A. comment log and the deterioration in his opinion of management from January through July of last year before he completely sold out of his position. Thought process basically being - where are the sales.

     

    Another post that I thought was relevant to the current discussion:

     

    "I would not put any stock in the carbon additive batteries to Ultrabatteries. As one person put it from Ford Research in Aachen Germany, carbon additive batteries or the Ultrabattery do not perform as well as a standard AGM battery.

     

    I've been asked by a few people to put my money where my mouth is on these topics. I am now running a small R&D lab in Tennessee manly for lithium ion and supercapacitor materials development (I've had to go where the money is). I would be happy to have these batteries built (maybe by Axion?) and then test them. The truth needs to come to light here"
    11 Mar, 11:05 PM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    "Axion - please take my advice, move faster!!! Get you lines rolling and get batteries out in the market. There are applications for what you are selling. It is not a fake advanced battery like Xtreme power and it works contrary to the Ultrabattery. Just get it out there..."

     

    "If you go back to 2010, you would find that:

     

    BMW wants us to work with one of their suppliers.
    PowerCubes will be sold this year.
    We are working with an industry giant on the grant to be
    announced this July.
    More ePower trucks will be ordered.
    NS slowdown is not a battery issue.

     

    were all in the works back then except for the ePower truck. However, Axion built and displayed a Volvo truck with a battery powered air conditioning system and also discussed hybrid traction systems for heavy
    transport vehicles."
    11 Mar, 11:33 PM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (163) | Send Message
     
    I am actually feeling more encouraged at the moment.
    1) I enjoyed the high volume price rise on high volume, and as far as I can tell the pullback with on smaller volume.
    2) The increase in share price from the lows of 9c will make it easier to raise capital
    3) Orders have not been announced (starting to stretch TG's deadline) but I can't believe even TG would have announced impending orders without some confidence that they would materialise.
    4) A few weeks ago the axionistas were in a depressed state regarding automotive sales but suddenly they are potentially front and center as major manufacturers start to implement lead carbon technology.
    5) Management put out a few "news reports" regarding the relevance of solar to their powercube, even with financial breakdowns. Powercube was a big sale last year and is nicely placed to be implemented more widely.

     

    By the way, yes ePower is exciting, especially as JP is around to give us updates, but it should not be the focus of our attention because we get continuous news. If we did not have JP (Lord forbid - please drive carefully JP) then ePower would just be another "why aren't they giving us any updates" line of enquiry. ePower shows us the potential delays that all companies will experience when testing this technology. It was a a couple of months ago that JP was saying the truck would be in the hands of hauliers in "misquote-a week or two" and chest beating would take "another misquote-a few weeks". I don't think I am mistaken in saying that not truck company has gotten their hands on an ePower truck yet (might be wrong). These things always take longer than expected. TG should have been less enthusiastic with investors over the last few CCs but BUT! at least we have not had news that companies have dismissed PbC batteries as unsuitable. BMW still testing, NS the same, ePower etc etc. Now that would be bad news.

     

    Personally I am paying a lot of attention to the share price these last few weeks cos it is all so damned exciting. But, with the exception of the possibility that the recent buying was on the back on some insider info that we are not privy to, nothing has changed.
    12 Mar, 07:25 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Consider ePower.

     

    We're working on a unique engine dominant series hybrid drivetrain for Class 8 trucks. We've already decided that the PbC is a wondrous battery for our application and we want to buy $20,000 of batteries for each tractor we build, but we can't buy any batteries until we get the rest of our drivetrain working the way we want it to. That has us huddling every day with our engine and generator manufacturers to try and get the control systems working properly. The process is taking longer than we hoped but it is moving in the right direction. When we have our system working properly we'll put tractors into the hands of fleet operators so they can evaluate performance for themselves and make a buying decision.

     

    Axion can and does provide great customer support when we ask for it, but most of the issues we're facing have nothing to do with the batteries and there's nothing Axion can do to help. They'll sell us batteries when we're ready to buy them and not a moment sooner.

     

    If we take our time and do our work properly, we'll have a credible offering for the 400,000 unit per year Class 8 truck rebuild market. If we cut corners or don't properly optimize our system, we could fail, and that would be tragic because we're so close.

     

    If Axion can't make ePower move any faster how much influence do you think it has on its first tier customers?
    12 Mar, 07:40 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    In the two years I've been here, Axion's big picture has continued to be:

     

    1) will the PbC achieve significant commercial acceptance (large orders)?

     

    2) when will that happen?

     

    While 1) still remains to be proven, the real problem has been 2). With tiny, pre-revenue cash flow negative companies like Axion, more time = more shares = lower stk price = lower upside price, all other things being equal. IOW, their battle includes a race against time. The painful chapter w the PIPE just proved that for any still doubting the significance of the time element.

     

    I remain optimistic re 1), and cautiously hopeful re 2).
    12 Mar, 09:04 AM Reply Like
  • D. McHattie
    , contributor
    Comments (1823) | Send Message
     
    We always have the option to double-down. That's the beauty of issuing more shares v debt.

     

    I learned this lesson with KNDI as I bought in at about $5.50 and rode it all the way down to $2. At $2.18 I doubled my investment.

     

    The moral for me is to not commit too much too early with a company transitioning from development stage to production because it may take longer than I think. Keep some powder dry so I can take advantage of delays and the inevitable lower stock price.

     

    I have almost doubled my investment in AXPW at around $.11 and have kept some powder dry in case we're not quite there yet and the price goes lower.

     

    I continue to believe in the technology and the company and I continue to think, fast and wait.

     

    D
    12 Mar, 09:40 AM Reply Like
  • dance621
    , contributor
    Comments (163) | Send Message
     
    JP, I was using ePower as an example of things taking longer than they are supposed to with axion. I do not doubt the potential for the technology and I am as excited as anyone to see the results. It is just that weeks turn into months which turn into years. This is the axion way and this is what we are now starting to see with epower (well the weeks to month bit)

     

    Does ePower have a timescale in place at the moment?
    12 Mar, 10:32 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    We think we're running behind schedule on the sleeper cab and making good time on the day cab, but our opinion and $5 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks. The weather hasn't been cooperative but that's not something we control. Our new engine is working very well but it's not coordinating with the generator as well as we'd like. We're getting great support from our main component suppliers and think the solution is close. With any luck at all we'll have at least one and maybe two tractors in Louisville for the truck show at the end of this month.

     

    I'm really sorry if we're not moving fast enough for the sidewalk superintendents, but if it was easy somebody else would have already done it. One of the first things I learned as a baby lawyer working with R&D companies is that projects take longer and cost more than you ever dreamed possible. Axion is certainly a case in point. At the end of the day the only question that matters is "Are we closer to the goal today than we were a week, a month, a year or a decade ago?" As long as that answer is a big YES then nobody has room to complain.
    12 Mar, 11:01 AM Reply Like
  • Fritz1969
    , contributor
    Comments (37) | Send Message
     
    Why are they not using Axion-Battery?
    http://bit.ly/1cwo4E4
    12 Mar, 03:20 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Space and weight are the big factors. The XL Hybrid system uses a small battery (1.8 kWh) that operates at 250 Volts and fits on a heavy pickup or cargo van chassis.

     

    http://bit.ly/1fTq3Tv

     

    It would take 21 conventional lead-acid batteries to build a 252 Volt string so even if you used small lead-acid batteries (e.g. motorcycle sizes) you're looking at a lot of space and weight.

     

    For this particular drivetrain, which strikes me as sensible and well-concieved, lithium-ion batteries are probably a better choice.
    12 Mar, 07:20 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Last night a friend sent me a press release on Odyne Systems plans to showcase a hybrid work truck at a utility fleet management conference in early June.

     

    http://bit.ly/1fTtEkw

     

    Odyne's 120 unit demonstration project is being funded by a $45.4 million DOE grant (~$380,000 per truck) and targets annual fuel savings of 1,750 gallons per truck.

     

    While we want ePower to prove its value based on the economics of saving 6,000 gallons per tractor-year, we're not ignoring the immense amounts of money that have been given to companies that made a convincing case for less compelling fuel savings.
    12 Mar, 07:58 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    John -

     

    Didn't Odyne and Axion have a relationship at one point? Is Odyne back up and running? Looks like they went lithium with JCI.

     

    http://bit.ly/1fpP7f4

     

    ePower - I like this a lot. Axion has a Volvo truck with a sleep cab that was installed with a battery operated Clima-cab system. I would be more happy if ePower was Kenworth or Freightliner (I see both at supercapcitor conferences a lot) but the technology here is good and not much different than the work Axion did with Odyne before they closed down. My main concern with ePower is they seem a little small and might not be able to consume a lot of PbC batteries as they get started. Please correct me if I am wrong but the pictures I saw seem to suggest they were working with old tractors in a small shop. Again, I do not want to knock this as it is a good application - just want to see more of these are a few larger ones that could really rock the boat.
    12 Mar, 09:24 AM Reply Like
  • D. McHattie
    , contributor
    Comments (1823) | Send Message
     
    Which begs the question, John, are presently at liberty to describe any of your plans to partner with the DOE?

     

    D
    12 Mar, 09:43 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (29444) | Send Message
     
    Stefan> I'm not entirely clear whether Axion did any work with Odyne. It seems that Joe Bartlett, the lawyer that represented the Quercus Trust in connection with its Axion investment, took the CEO job at Odyne while he was an Axion director. Since Gelbaum used Bartlett for most of his projects, the existence of an interlocking control group through Quercus doesn't mean much.

     

    http://bit.ly/1fpTcjB

     

    I can guarantee that you would not be happier with Kenworth or Freightliner because (a) neither of them makes drivetrains and they simply install engines and transmissions from Cummins, Allison and other first tier vendors into the tractors they build, and (b) if they built drivetrains and were working with Axion the entire process would be shrouded in soundproof black canvas for three or four years.

     

    ePower is very small and has limited facilities for turning wrenches. Our current staff couldn't do more than one retrofit a month if everything went smoothly and when you're engaged in system development nothing goes smoothly. When we finish our work and have a product we're willing to sell, we think we'll be able to ramp our throughput capacity quickly.

     

    Our shop in Florence has adequate floorspace to accommodate ten to twelve working retrofit projects without having people stumbling over each other. When we start to staff up our principal need will be good diesel mechanics, rather than engineers. In other words, people are available to do the work.

     

    When a fleet customer orders a tractor rebuild from us, we'll ask the customer to send his tractor and a crew of his mechanics to our facility to learn the process. When the rebuilt tractor is delivered to the customer, it will be delivered with a trained crew with enough knowledge to (a) keep the tractor running properly, and (b) do additional retrofits in the customer's own shop by simply ordering kits from us.

     

    The mathematical progression gets staggering if each service bay in Florence trains 12 crews per year and each of those crews can do 12 retrofits per year.

     

    D McHattie> You only get one chance to make a first impression so we're not talking to anybody until we can show them working tractor that meets our expectations. There's an immense difference between aspiration and accomplishment and we want to rely on the latter.
    12 Mar, 09:53 AM Reply Like
  • Valleywood
    , contributor
    Comments (649) | Send Message
     
    I've Got It.
    I'VE GOT IT !
    Where the bleep is Mr. I ??

     

    Mr. I,

     

    On a hunch this morning I dragged out my operas. I guessed right !

     

    Try the Prelude to "Carmen", by Bizet. At normal tempo, it lasts about two minutes. Exactly halfway through the Prelude, at one minute, the orchestra ends the dance sequence and starts the chorus which is heard all through the opera.

     

    A'dory A'dory
    Don't spit on the floor
    Use the cuspidory
    What do you think it's for ?

     

    The spittle (to coin a phrase) goes on for a full minute.

     

    If you haven't a cuspidor, just go to SMaturin's house, borrow his Star Wars vee-hickle and spit in it whilst you listen to the opera.

     

    Off topic, but when I was in high school I was invited to be a guest of the Met and hear Maria Callas sing in an opera. At that time I despised opera and refused. What a dumb-ass.

     

    Today I own dozens of Callas' recordings including her master classes. If I could bring her back I would gladly pay $25,000 to hear her sing. Yet another deep wound I received in my youth at my own instigation. There are times I make myself furious.

     

    There. I feel better now. Feeling so much better I'm starting to juice up. I think I'll go look for SMaturin's car.
    12 Mar, 10:15 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message
     
    I will refuse. 8^P

     

    http://bit.ly/N6ibl0
    12 Mar, 10:30 AM Reply Like
  • Retired Aviator
    , contributor
    Comments (1446) | Send Message
     
    VW> I'm a complete opera ignoramus but in middle age I've developed a unique fascination with Karen Carpenter's amazing voice. Thank God for youtube footage. http://bit.ly/1fTOlNo

     

    Of course as an adolescent you wouldn't have caught me dead listening to the Carpenters as liking such saccharine love ballads and smooth harmonies would invite bullying in those days. It was all about acting tough with Led Zeppelin and muscle cars. Nothing wrong with them but the peer pressure situation was strange in retrospect.
    12 Mar, 10:59 AM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2103) | Send Message
     
    VW,

     

    It seems your memory was of the Moe, Larry and Curly version of the opera.

     

    http://yhoo.it/N6phpu
    12 Mar, 11:00 AM Reply Like
  • iindelco
    , contributor
    Comments (8761) | Send Message
     
    http://bit.ly/1iAMpew
    -
    " Toreador, oh dont spit on the floor. Please use the cuspidor, that's what it's for."

     

    http://bit.ly/1iAMqzk
    -
    The James T. Callow Folklore Archive

     

    "TOREADOR-EE, DON'T SPIT ON THE FLOOR-EE
    USE THE CUSPIDOR-EE
    THAT'S WHAT IT IS FOR-EE

     

    http://bit.ly/1iAMqPy
    12 Mar, 11:37 AM Reply Like
  • Stefan Moroney
    , contributor
    Comments (2483) | Send Message
     
    Looks like this was the NS surprise:

     

    http://bit.ly/1iAujcK

     

    And meanwhile out of New Castle ... still crickets, go back to sleep.
    12 Mar, 10:16 AM Reply Like
  • Mr Investor
    , contributor
    Comments (2476) | Send Message