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Trade stocks by day, and at night am writing a historical epic about the ancient Mayan civilization. "Maya: Spirits Of The Jaguar" is a sweeping saga set in the ancient and magical Mayan landscape where a wronged family struggles against prophecy, power, treachery and forbidden love,... More
  • Axion Power Concentrator 59: Beginning Feb. 1, 2012, Axion Power Shelf Offering Part Two  254 comments
    Feb 1, 2012 4:29 PM

    Due to popular demand, the desk clerk decided take this chance to start another Axion Power Concentrator in the same day. That's a record, fine folks! As far I as know, no "running blog" on Seeking Alpha has ever needed two in one day.

    Also noted in moving around Seeking Alpha yesterday and today, is that moving around seems to be happening faster. Congratulations to Seeking Alpha and their new web host in allowing members better mobility throughout the website.

    Axion Power Announces Registered Direct Common Stock Offering of up to $10.0 million

    NEW CASTLE, Pa., Feb. 1 , 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- Axion Power International, Inc. (OTC Bulletin Board: AXPW) ("Axion" or "the Company"), the developer of advanced lead­carbon PbC® batteries and energy storage systems, today announced that it has entered into definitive agreements to sell an aggregate of not more than 28,571,429 shares of common stock, par value $0.0001 per share (the "Shares"), at a price per share of $0.35 for gross proceeds up to $10 million, before deducting placement agents' fees and estimated offering expenses. The share price for this transaction was pre-determined by calculating a 10% discount to market using the Company's volume weighted average price for the trailing 40 day period (VWAP).

    (Logo: http://photos.prnewswire.com/prnh/20100119/AXIONLOGO)

    The Shares are being offered directly by Axion pursuant to an effective shelf registration statement previously filed with, and declared effective by, the Securities and Exchange Commission on July 14, 2011. The Company anticipates that the net proceeds from the offering will be used for working capital, capital expenditures and general corporate purposes. The closing of this offering is expected to occur on or about February 3, 2012, subject to the satisfaction of customary closing conditions.

    Philadelphia Brokerage Corporation and Emerging Growth Equities, Ltd served as co-placement agents for the offering. When available, copies of the prospectus supplement and the accompanying base prospectus relating to the offering may be obtained from the Securities and Exchange Commission website at http://www.sec.gov.

    This press release does not and shall not constitute an offer to sell, or the solicitation of an offer to buy, any of the securities, nor shall there be any sale of securities in any state or jurisdiction in which such offer, solicitation or sale would be unlawful prior to registration under the securities laws of any state or jurisdiction.

    About Axion Power International, Inc.

    Axion has developed and patented a next generation energy storage device that won the prestigious Frost & Sullivan Technology Award for North America in the field of lead-acid batteries. According to Frost & Sullivan, Axion's new PbC batteries have "the potential to revitalize the lead-acid battery industry by breathing new life into an established technology that is not well suited to the requirements of important new applications like hybrid electric vehicles and renewable power."

    Axion Power International, Inc. is the industry leader in the field of lead-acid-carbon energy storage technologies. Axion believes this new battery technology is the only class of advanced battery that can be assembled on existing lead-acid battery production lines throughout the world utilizing Axion's proprietary carbon electrodes. Axion's future goal, after filling their plant's lead-carbon battery production capacity, is to become the leading supplier of carbon electrode assemblies for the global lead-acid battery industry.

    For more information, visit www.axionpower.com

    Forward-looking Statements

    Certain statements in this Press Release are "forward-looking statements" within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements are based on our current expectations and beliefs and are subject to a number of risk factors and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from those described in the forward-looking statements. Such risks and uncertainties include the risk for the Company to complete its development work, as well as the risks inherent in commercializing a new product (including technology risks, market risks, financial risks and implementation risks, and other risks and uncertainties affecting the Company), as well as other risks that have been included in filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, all of which are available at sec.gov. We disclaim any intention or obligation to revise any forward-looking statements, including, without limitation, financial estimates, whether as a result of new information, future events, or otherwise.

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Comments (254)
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  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Last comment in the previous Concentrator fro FocalPoint Analytics:

     

    When thinking about ramp-up, I started to wonder about shelf life for these batteries. Do they have a substantial shelf-life (time in storage with no activity)? Are they building inventory? Or are they just building electrodes which I assume would have a very long shelf life
    1 Feb 2012, 04:31 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » FPA: The battery shelf life, so I learned last June, is about six months. However, I learned this when I was touring the flooded battery plant, not the PbC facility. I do expect both to be about the same shelf life.
    1 Feb 2012, 04:33 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    Maya, IIRC, the absence of the lead negative electrode and the reduced acidity made the shelf much longer since there was no deterioration of the negative electrode. Going from memory, so I could be wrooooong!

     

    HardToLove
    1 Feb 2012, 05:20 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » HTL: I'm going by memory as well. What I saw was completely assembled lead acid batteries. Hence my above caution about which plant I was in when I asked that question.
    1 Feb 2012, 05:35 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » HTL: I checked my notes. I definitely asked that question in the flooded LA plant. Being 6.5 months ago, the memory blends. But I asked the question and I believe (again, to the best of my memory) that the question(s) posed was/were both about shelf life and inventory turnover.

     

    Plant Manager, Joe Cole, was giving me the tour, and I most certainly do not want to speak for him with faded memory, but I believe the shelf life is six months, before degradation begins. Which is easily fixable with a quick charge (my guess). Here's some of my notes: "Fill sulfuric acid after order, and one month before delivery." And, "Six month shelf life."

     

    Make of these scribbles what you will. Those scribbles were the last thing I wrote before I moved onto the PbC plant, because the next page in my notes starts off with: "PbC Plant," underlined.

     

    Hoping this helps!
    1 Feb 2012, 06:32 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    Thanks Maya.

     

    HardToLove
    1 Feb 2012, 06:52 PM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    I believe you are correct HTL. I'm 98% sure that fully assembled batteries, sans the electrolyte, should be able to be stored for a very long time w/o detectable degradation.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:20 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    AGM type batteries like the PbC cannot be assembled without electrolyte. An AGM battery uses damp glass mats to hold the electrolyte and they're permanently sealed as the last step in the manufacturing process.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:27 PM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    Interesting! I need to take a trip down there for the tour one of these days.
    5 Feb 2012, 02:21 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    Think stockholders meeting. I'm going to try and make the trip this year.
    5 Feb 2012, 02:25 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    Is the date set yet?
    5 Feb 2012, 02:31 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    I'd expect sometime in June, but I haven't seen anything about a date yet.
    5 Feb 2012, 03:04 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Likely, around June 20, as it was last year.
    6 Feb 2012, 12:29 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » The below link takes you to an Axion Power produced PDF, which explains today's shelf offering in greater detail:

     

    http://bit.ly/x40Wuz
    1 Feb 2012, 04:38 PM Reply Like
  • Mercy Jimenez
    , contributor
    Comments (2682) | Send Message
     
    Don't forget to thumbs up this new Concentrator at the top -- to thank our fearless "desk clerk" for keeping our discussion humming!
    1 Feb 2012, 04:44 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Thanks, Mercy. Curiously, I again couldn't get that request in. Kept receiving an "error" message.

     

    I normally only drive using six cylinders. Today, I needed eight.
    1 Feb 2012, 04:48 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    This is Concentrator comment No. 9,976.

     

    Dollars to donuts the count is over 10,000 before I wake up in the morning.
    1 Feb 2012, 05:13 PM Reply Like
  • pascquale
    , contributor
    Comments (143) | Send Message
     
    G'night John Boy
    1 Feb 2012, 06:44 PM Reply Like
  • Treehill
    , contributor
    Comments (147) | Send Message
     
    I was surprised to read in the filing PDF (page S-5) that there are only 415 stockholders holding the 85M Axion shares. That's it? I would have assumed there were thousands of shareholders.
    1 Feb 2012, 05:34 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (3662) | Send Message
     
    Most of us hold in brokerage accounts and I think that only counts as 1 name of the 415. Ex. Fidelity, E-Trade, etc I don't believe they know us retailers by our legal names unless we notify them of such things.
    1 Feb 2012, 05:47 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    Correct: our shares, if held at a brokerage, are registered in "street name".

     

    HardToLove
    1 Feb 2012, 06:21 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    We got us a new theme song: "She's a clean machine, she kept her motor clean, she's the best damn company that I ....evah seen! But the world kept shakin', my eyes kept achin', ...my mind was racin' but we kept takin it, 'cause you, ...you shook me all year long!"
    1 Feb 2012, 06:21 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    this bit of nonsense was a riff on KT's post. But now his post is gone. deleted? did he say too much? what a day.. ;)
    1 Feb 2012, 06:50 PM Reply Like
  • KirkTierney
    , contributor
    Comments (97) | Send Message
     
    I have an aversion to certain kinds of phone calls. On the other hand, WTF.

     

    General comment on the financing.

     

    o Thank God that's over. For all of those nice business prospects, lacking this funding was a serious underlying risk. It had to be.

     

    o The deal was cooked long ago. Examine an MA40 for three months, and see at what point (as investor in the deal) you would have confidence that you were getting a good deal at an intersection of important announced and unannounced developments. In all of January, the MA40 moved up by only 4 cents.

     

    o It was not entirely Axion's call. Axion did not want the deal to go away -- it could have -- nor to get too close to the end of cash. That would have been begging for big trouble in seeking other financing.

     

    o I believe a page has turned, and the company is now much more stable. I believe the stock price will recover well, but that is not my forte -- just my belief. A bit of good news will help it along.

     

    o Debt is a killer at this stage. Pref shares are a killer at this stage. Insane warrants are a killer at this stage. We got a clean machine with some wiggle room and a better balance sheet.

     

    So now I am rifling my coat pockets. I have waited long enough.

     

    kt
    1 Feb 2012, 07:01 PM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    Thanks for your comment KT.

     

    Here is another perspective as well:
    Yesterday, the market cap closed at about $52.7M, today with the additional shares added in, the market cap closed at ~$53.5M.

     

    For all intents and purposes the company is selling for about the same price today as it did yesterday.

     

    Between now and then they secured financing to get us through announcements with 1. BMW, 2. NS and 3. PowerCube sales.

     

    If anyone's time frame is less than two years you can now in a more relaxed state (since financing is behind us) evaluate your investment horizon and determine if you need any of the three things mentioned above to come to fruition in the next 6-9 months in order to maintain your conviction in your investment. I think that is a pretty fair amount of time to give Axion to come up with some sales or at least very positive news. The best part is you do not have to worry about the company going bankrupt in the meantime, whereas yesterday we did have that consideration to deal with no matter how remote it may or may not have been.
    1 Feb 2012, 07:39 PM Reply Like
  • KirkTierney
    , contributor
    Comments (97) | Send Message
     
    JAK,

     

    I really liked your thinking in this.

     

    kt
    1 Feb 2012, 08:11 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (3662) | Send Message
     
    Thank you for the reality check and don't answer the phone if it's an unknown number from the 202 =).

     

    Alas, had we been able to stave them off for another month the 40D VWMA would have turned up nicely. But then again, we can't assume they'd still want to play nice. Anyhow those who wish they'd been allowed in on the deal had a chance today get in today under .40 and likely have this week to accumulate in the low to mid .40s. It'll be nice to put all this in the rear view mirror.
    1 Feb 2012, 10:18 PM Reply Like
  • anthlj
    , contributor
    Comments (227) | Send Message
     
    surely the price is the price negotiated via the broker and investor collective, and it is justified by whatever means. Otherwise they would have waited, no?

     

    Clearly a brutal funding environment, they took what they could get, and raised the minimum amount required, presumably to take them to meaningful orders toward the end of this year. I shudder to think what will happen if orders of size fall outside that timeframe. Could only be rail or Cube at this point, it would appear.
    1 Feb 2012, 10:46 PM Reply Like
  • KirkTierney
    , contributor
    Comments (97) | Send Message
     
    Ant,

     

    Well said.

     

    kt
    2 Feb 2012, 01:08 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    I just published a new Instablog on the alternative view of dilution that says if $0.62 was a fair price without the $9.25 million in new cash then the market price shouldn't be less than $0.54 with the cash in hand.

     

    http://bit.ly/zrZ767

     

    The market's reaction was overblown.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:16 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    481086 ... I thought you already had a theme song ...

     

    http://bit.ly/ylxtva
    2 Feb 2012, 09:42 AM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    That was the old me. I've made some adjustments: http://bit.ly/x5t6X9
    2 Feb 2012, 12:58 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    It's really nice dealing with guys who know more than the top-40. At least you were kind enough to avoid the more predictable http://bit.ly/AsBMZf
    2 Feb 2012, 01:09 PM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1778) | Send Message
     
    John,

     

    I think this one is a little more appropriate for me. :-)

     

    http://bit.ly/w5sYfW
    2 Feb 2012, 02:09 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    It's certainly a bigger favorite for me.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:12 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    JLP, WTB, & 481 ... that was fun, but you 3 are hurting for something to do today ! lol
    2 Feb 2012, 02:13 PM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    Labtech, brilliant!
    2 Feb 2012, 02:59 PM Reply Like
  • jpau
    , contributor
    Comments (960) | Send Message
     
    Do we have a good handle on how long $10 million buys us? Does it take us 12, 18, 24 months?
    1 Feb 2012, 06:37 PM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    End of 2012 per Axion stated within a comment in the previous Concentrator.
    1 Feb 2012, 06:43 PM Reply Like
  • jpau
    , contributor
    Comments (960) | Send Message
     
    Only 6-7 months? Was hoping for a bit more than that.
    1 Feb 2012, 06:55 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » jpau: Exactly how did you come up with six or seven months? What is your basis for this very borderline comment?
    1 Feb 2012, 07:09 PM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    I think he thinks we are in June. The year is going by fast but not that fast.
    :-)
    1 Feb 2012, 07:36 PM Reply Like
  • jpau
    , contributor
    Comments (960) | Send Message
     
    Sorry Maya, what I meant is that if the end of 2012 quote is correct, then adding 35 million shares to the float only bought us 7 months (given that we were supposed to have enough money to get through Q2 with existing cash).
    1 Feb 2012, 10:10 PM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1778) | Send Message
     
    If you read through the document that Axion emailed out this afternoon, there is a "going concern" statements to the effect that Axion sees it's sales for the coming year and this stock placement as enough money to get them to the end of Dec of 2012, at which time more financing will be required to go forward. The "silver lining" in the statement, if there is one, is that part of the list of things they will need money for is "capital investment". One could read that to mean that they think they will need further expansion to meet coming needs, but that the revenues won't gear up fast enough to cover the need to build out the plant. I for one "hope" that's what they mean. Anyway, here is the exact text:

     

    "Our business may not be able to continue as a going concern and we will need to raise additional capital to continue operations beyond December 2012.
    We believe that our current financial resources will support ongoing operations, working capital, and capital expenditures through the second quarter of 2012. We will not be able to continue operations beyond December 2012 without raising additional financing. We do not believe that we will be able to sufficiently increase our revenues to cover our costs of operations, working capital, and capital expenditures without raising additional capital. We cannot assure you that any additional capital will be available to us on favorable terms, or at all. If we are unable to obtain additional capital when needed, our research, development and testing, and other pre-commercialization activities will be materially and adversely affected, and we may be unable to take advantage of future opportunities or respond to competitive pressures or to continue our operations at all beyond December 2012. The inability to raise capital in sufficient amounts and on acceptable terms would have a material adverse effect on our ability to continue operations and could result in our inability to continue as a going concern which would mean that we would need to wind down our business. "
    1 Feb 2012, 10:47 PM Reply Like
  • jpau
    , contributor
    Comments (960) | Send Message
     
    I can't correct my previous post, but it's only 28.5 million shares. Sorry for the mistake.
    1 Feb 2012, 11:25 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » jpau: No problem. You've written that you are an Axion owner. What I read in your comment was clearly to me an unresearched, lack of due dilligence comment. In the last Concentrator was your answer.

     

    I welcome all new comments from those curious. But you have owned this stock for near a month. Received incredible gains, despite today's dilution. You are still in the green!

     

    I suggest you read more before writing such ill-founded comments in this blog.

     

    With current revenue streams, plus another order or three, including that small mountain of empty battery casings I saw, which you obviously have dismissed, or missed, I again suggest that you read more of all of these blogs. Especially the most recent ones. In those, you get answers.

     

    Again. No problem. And I'm not writing the following comment toward you directly. But anyone making sereptitious comments will not be tolerated.

     

    Get to work, buddy. Suggest for you to read all of these blogs. Take your laptop to your nearest Bravo Restaurant. Set up shop. Eat a good meal, and due some research! That's a damned good plan, in my book.
    1 Feb 2012, 11:27 PM Reply Like
  • KentG
    , contributor
    Comments (368) | Send Message
     
    LabTech: I like your thinking. Several commentors, myself included (but I did not comment) wondered why the capital raise, 9,250,000 after fees, would only get Axion through the end of the year when the burn rate was approx. 2.5M per qtr at the end of last year and before the capital rasie we had enough to get through the end of Q2 2012?
    With the capital raise I would have thought it would get us through at least Q1 2013 or maybe Q2 2013 but if we speculate that 3M is for a new electrode line the numbers seem to fit nicely IMHO. Pure speclation and a long wait for the definitive answer. 8-)
    1 Feb 2012, 11:32 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » KentG & Lab: Exactly. Three quarters of a million in "fees" to me seems a little exorbitant.
    1 Feb 2012, 11:38 PM Reply Like
  • jpau
    , contributor
    Comments (960) | Send Message
     
    Maya, I don't understand your post at all. There is nothing ill-founded in my comment. Go back and read again, please. I first asked how much time raising $10 million bought us. Bang said until end of year; so my response that it only buys us 6-7 months is spot on, given that we already had money to get through May or June (and assuming Bang is right on end of 2012).

     

    I've owned AXPW since last July; I've been following these concentrators very closely; it really helped me in December, when I greatly added to my holdings rather than panicking. I had 70k shares at the beginning of the year; that total is now 40k. I haven't missed, or dismissed anything. In fact, I'd like to think $10 million in fresh funds takes us beyond December 2012, hasn't the burn rate been about $8 million per year?

     

    All that said, while part of me is glad that we got our cap raise in, another part of me is mildly disappointed at the pricing. I don't think I'm alone. I realize these are tough times, and that it had to be done - I just wanted to know how much time we bought.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:09 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » jpau: Please pardon me. And please let me clarify, and evince.

     

    Here is bang's comment: "End of 2012 per Axion stated within a comment in the previous Concentrator."

     

    Then, here is yours right after: "Only 6-7 months? Was hoping for a bit more than that."

     

    This is obviously a communication issue.

     

    It's just Feb 1st. We shareholders know 6-7 months more w/o another shelf is way out of line. That's the way I read your comment. If I did, perhaps others did, too. Last thing I would want to have is newbies, perhaps deep pocket newbies reading here that by July or August, Axion needs to raise more moohlah.

     

    Again. Apologies.

     

    Your choice. I can lay waste (remove) all relative comments.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:35 AM Reply Like
  • KentG
    , contributor
    Comments (368) | Send Message
     
    LabTech, Bang, and anyone else: After reading Bangs' comment way below, the second line in the text you (LabTech) quoted "We believe that our current financial resources will support ongoing operations, working capital, and capital expenditures through the second quarter of 2012." seems like there is a typo in that sentence or seems out of place. The line before it and after it both talk about December 2012 and it seems to me the line in between should say "through the fourth quarter 2012" and not "through the second quarter 2012"? Is it just me? 8-)
    2 Feb 2012, 12:45 AM Reply Like
  • KentG
    , contributor
    Comments (368) | Send Message
     
    Only if your not the one getting the fees! LOL 8-)
    2 Feb 2012, 12:50 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » KentG: Probably at least a quarter mil went toward some form of application fees. Will be much fun to see how the sun rises over Swizterland tomorrow!

     

    I'm out for the night.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:54 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    The offering added 29.5 million shares, not 35 million.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:19 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    One of the SEC's requirements is that every offering prospectus include an estimate of how long the proceeds will last based on current plans. Lawyers who write those disclosures are generally conservative sorts who include all capital spending plans and all likely operating expenses, and discount anticipated revenues harshly.

     

    Given what we can surmise about Axion's year end resources and quarterly burn rate, I'd expect that there's about $4 million in capital spending in the budget.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:25 AM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (3662) | Send Message
     
    Jpau thank you for clarifying your above thoughts we've seen other try to sneak in misinformation. Anyhow, I think everybody is on edge today. =)

     

    My read is that it appears Axion will ramp up their spending (that's the only way 9M+ cash runs low by year end). Seems like a good problem. Maybe more sales guys coming on board too.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:17 AM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1135) | Send Message
     
    If there is really 4million in there fir capital we should be very happy hy this time next year. Wasn't the estimated cost on an electrode line 1.25m. That s maybe three more lines.

     

    I had guessed at maybe 2m in capital thinking increased spend for inventory, production employees and more sales employees.
    2 Feb 2012, 07:53 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    I've always worked with an estimated cost of $2.5 to $3 million per electrode line, but that number may be on the high side.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:06 AM Reply Like
  • Tampa Ted
    , contributor
    Comments (2652) | Send Message
     
    Reading through the Form 424B5 right now.

     

    Previously, I have asked myself what the capital structure will look like when Axion has the ability to make meaningful sales:

     

    As discussed ad nauseum, currently, Axion unfortunately does not have this ability. As things stand today, the number of shares outstanding after the secondary are 114,949,854.

     

    If all options and warrants were eventually exercised, then fully diluted the total number of shares outstanding would be 130,475,774.

     

    It appears in the prospective that we can assume additional share issuances will be needed. As such, maybe a discussion on what the eventual capital structure will look like at the end of the share issuances is warranted.
    1 Feb 2012, 06:50 PM Reply Like
  • Tampa Ted
    , contributor
    Comments (2652) | Send Message
     
    "We established this price in connection with recent negotiations with prospective investors and with reference to the prevailing market price of our common stock, recent trends in such price and other factors."
    1 Feb 2012, 07:05 PM Reply Like
  • dogday1
    , contributor
    Comments (56) | Send Message
     
    I have the greatest of respect for the board of Axion in there ability to think with two minds . One day they think , and are able to sell a share price of' £1.5 as a share option to a perspective sales PV .
    Three days later they think and sell to new investors shares at .35
    This strikes me as schizoid thinking.(this is tongue in cheek,in the light the super-sensitivity demonstrated earlier in response to Johns suit comment).
    1 Feb 2012, 07:34 PM Reply Like
  • Oliver L.
    , contributor
    Comments (135) | Send Message
     
    fyi "schizoid" is not the same thing as "schizophrenic"—which also does not mean what you (probably) think it does (being of two minds about something, it's more a split from "reality")

     

    in general i think it's best to eschew casual use of psychiatric terminology, for multiple reasons

     

    http://bit.ly/WiSEH5
    11 Mar 2013, 09:15 PM Reply Like
  • Stilldazed
    , contributor
    Comments (3401) | Send Message
     
    Hi OL,
    This particular blog is a year and over 150 insta blogs behind. This link will take you to the current blog. http://seekingalpha.co...
    12 Mar 2013, 05:06 AM Reply Like
  • Al Marshall
    , contributor
    Comments (631) | Send Message
     
    After costs, Axion will recieve $.324 per share in proceeds (not counting $75k in expenses incurred by Axion).

     

    Part of my concern here is that we on this board see the incredible story that is Axion. I will say that it appears to be the best risk/reward potential of any stock I've seen in my investing lifetime. I suspect many on this board agree with that statement.

     

    Now, there are all kinds of private equity funds, hedge funds, and venture capital funds with lots and lots of un-invested cash looking for opportunities.

     

    Side note: I was at an investor presentation yesterday evening by a $20m/revenue company with outstanding strategic investors looking to raise $40m in follow-on equity. The CEO explained how, based on his meetings with 15+ private equity funds, they are all struggling to find opportunities for their large amounts of cash and are worried about having to return it to their investors.

     

    Well, here we are with Axion.......

     

    Maybe the company needs a CEO who is more externally focused. Maybe we need a CEO who can get outsiders excited about the company. I feel like Mr. Granville has the goose that lays the golden eggs and is having discussions with folks about the price of foie gras.

     

    I keep telling myself that issues like this are the inefficiencies in the market that give us small fry the opportunity to get outsized returns. Look on the bright side – at least we haven’t put our money into Facebook!
    1 Feb 2012, 07:49 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (3662) | Send Message
     
    Lead batteries are not a sexy story. Our payday will come from Sales and not hype. Either Axion executes it's plan or the ship sinks. I'm just glad we have another year of fuel.
    1 Feb 2012, 08:50 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13581) | Send Message
     
    I agree, bazooooka. The equation has not changed since yesterday. The risk is about Axion's execution with the opportunities in hand and those which will hopefully present this year. I like their chances.
    1 Feb 2012, 09:45 PM Reply Like
  • Tim Enright
    , contributor
    Comments (1345) | Send Message
     
    What a day! and I am glad to have this round of financing behind us. This is a new page and we would all be better served by keeping our attention in the future (having discussed all).

     

    On a personal note, neither clothes nor money make a man. Only the ego is interested in taking a stand on either side of those arguments.

     

    Have a pleasant evening everyone...
    1 Feb 2012, 08:02 PM Reply Like
  • dogday1
    , contributor
    Comments (56) | Send Message
     
    Is there any truth in the rumor, that it was Warren Buffett who has bought into Axion.
    1 Feb 2012, 08:11 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    Earth to 'dogday1'
    1 Feb 2012, 08:18 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Where did you hear this rumor that Buffett bought into AXPW?
    1 Feb 2012, 10:08 PM Reply Like
  • dogday1
    , contributor
    Comments (56) | Send Message
     
    Just a ridiculous statement to add to hysterical responses so far.
    It is ,as informed ,as many of the statements posted on the site over the last day or so .
    2 Feb 2012, 04:25 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    DD1: "hysterical responses so far"

     

    I may be blind in one eye and can't see out of the other. I didn't see any of what you characterized.

     

    I saw typical discussion by folks with different POVs, risk profiles, and incomplete information trying to read the tea leaves to make an effective, for their risk profile, decision.

     

    I never denigrate folks speaking honestly, regardless of how their POV and risk profile may differ from mine.

     

    I'll admit I liked DRich's response though - started my day with a grin. So I thank you both.

     

    DRich, "Ground Control to Major Tom" came to mind.

     

    MHO,
    HardToLove
    2 Feb 2012, 06:52 AM Reply Like
  • dogday1
    , contributor
    Comments (56) | Send Message
     
    H.T.
    I have no intention of denigrating you or any other contributed , I just feel that some people can not see the wood for the trees.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:05 AM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    DD1,

     

    There is no question in my mind that what you "feel" is absolutely correct. But what is the point of making such a comment? What is accomplished? There are undoubtedly people of all levels of intellect AND "vision" owning AXPW shares. In my mind, the only thing wrong with that is that they indeed may "not see the wood for the trees" and thus not fully recognize the potential of their investment. Should that be the case, you now have uniformed people potentially liquidating their shares. I believe the impact of such goes without saying.

     

    It would seem to me then, that if there are individuals participating here, that are perhaps not as fortunate as you, the most constructive thing to do would be to help them with their "vision"; help to educate them by sharing your fortunate and God given insight. All members of this community will appreciate your efforts to that end. It is the very essence of why we are here; to learn from each other and grow accordingly.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:04 PM Reply Like
  • D. McHattie
    , contributor
    Comments (1844) | Send Message
     
    For what it's worth (and that ain't much), I thought the Warren Buffett thing was funny, particularly with DRich's response.

     

    I actually once, in a fit of overexuberance, made a similar comment about Michael Burry. The difference is I wasn't trying to be funny, I just got a little caught up.

     

    I would also say in your defense that I thought some of the comments over the last few days have had elements of hysteria to them - I don't think you're that far off base.

     

    But I think it's a direct consequence of all our champagne and airplane talk when we experienced that double in January.

     

    Keep the emotions in check when things are going well and you'll find yourself better able to weather adversity.

     

    D
    2 Feb 2012, 11:12 PM Reply Like
  • jveal
    , contributor
    Comments (644) | Send Message
     
    I may have missed this with the flood of comments today. In case it hasn't been posted, a verdict was reached on the Honda Hybrid lawsuit.

     

    Woman wins small-claims suit over Honda hybrid mpg

     

    http://fxn.ws/zkSFjJ
    1 Feb 2012, 10:10 PM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    Ok, Since we have everyone guessing here. What price does this stock end up at the end of the week from a technical point?? Adding all those shares has to lower the price from where we are now. Am i wrong???

     

    My best guess is that this addition will adversly affect the stock for a short peroid of time. My best guess is half this board bought more today at this price without any news at all, except having added to payroll in a big way, and reduced the pps...starting Friday !!!
    1 Feb 2012, 11:05 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    I wrote an Instablog this morning that took a cynics view of dilution and concluded that anything less than $0.54 is a bargain.

     

    http://bit.ly/zrZ767

     

    On Tuesday Axion had a market cap of $54 million without cash. Adding $9.25 million in cash to the pie should take the market cap to a minimum of $63.25 million if the whole is not greater than the sum of its parts.

     

    With a market cap of $63.25 million and 115 million shares outstanding, the price should be $0.54.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:31 AM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13581) | Send Message
     
    This is a typical over-reaction, we've all seen it before in other stocks when dilution occurs. In fact, I predicted we might see this in the case of another stock I am very interested in (Lynas), when it recently raised money, but it turned out to be the exception to the rule because a key milestone which had been hanging things up was about to trip.

     

    As a persistant bottom feeder type of investor, I tend to run toward the sounds of panick, and if I had not already been invested in Axion, its likely that this episode would have drawn me to become one. Even so, and even though these prices are NOT lowering my average, I am adding because the reaction IS well over the numbers John just provided above.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:18 AM Reply Like
  • magounsq
    , contributor
    Comments (956) | Send Message
     
    ...and ZBB?
    2 Feb 2012, 03:05 PM Reply Like
  • bazooooka
    , contributor
    Comments (3662) | Send Message
     
    MAP,

     

    Most of us are looking beyond this Friday. The short term is driven by emotion. Who knows where it goes. Long term will be driven by company milestones.
    1 Feb 2012, 11:56 PM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    Bazoooka

     

    I asked from a technical point as i want to add shares and i am trying to gather info that i really do not understand how to compile properly yet.

     

    So trying to decide do i add this week or maybe a week later once the excitement calms down, thats all...

     

    Long term until i see sales no one has a clue, only wishes!!
    2 Feb 2012, 12:41 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    Someone straighten out my confusion regarding this statement: "We believe that our current financial resources will support ongoing operations, working capital, and capital expenditures through the second quarter of 2012."

     

    The first thought that hit me was a statement in Q4 2011 that the company had sufficient resources PRIOR TO THE CAPITAL RAISE to operate through Q2 2012. There has since been a net capital raise of roughly 9M (guessing on the net so don't fry me over an over or under estimate) and the company still says its "financial resources will support ongoing operations, working capital and capital expenditures through the 2nd quarter of Q2 2012.

     

    I suppose that means that they plan new capital expenditures with funds from the new capital raise, but no further capital expenditures after Q2 2012. Whatever is left after the apparently planned new capital expenditures will only support ongoing operations and working capital needs until the end of 2012, but that's all folks.

     

    It also seems there was no relief from the "going concern" statements made in Q4 last year. Agreed?
    2 Feb 2012, 12:15 AM Reply Like
  • KirkTierney
    , contributor
    Comments (97) | Send Message
     
    I thought the statement was meant to indicate the situation without the raise having gone through -- because it has not actually closed yet as of the issuance of the prospectus.

     

    My understand was that they would run out of funds by August, or thereabouts. With this capital, of course, this changes, and the question is what is the current net burn rate, and what will happen in while this cash is being consumed. We will sure be watching that in the next ConfCall.

     

    kt
    2 Feb 2012, 01:03 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    The primary purpose of every financing is to carry current operating expenses and expand operations. At September 30th Axion had $6.9 million in working capital and a burn rate of $2 million per quarter. It's plan was to limit cash expenditures until it was able to raise new money. Under that plan there was adequate cash to survive through the end of Q-2.

     

    The registration speaks to what the new plan is with $9.2 million in additional cash that can be used to support ongoing cash expenses and desirable capital spending. Plans with new money are always different from plans without new money.

     

    My best guess is that cut-off financial statements at January 31st would have shown about $4.3 million in working capital and a burn rate of about $700,000 a month. That suggests that the new plan with an additional $9.2 million in cash includes something on the order of $4 million in capital spending plus a reasonable increase in quarterly operating expenses.

     

    You can't sell product without fronting the cost of the sales team. You can't build product without fronting the costs of necessary materials and equipment. Now that the financing risks are resolved, Axion plans to be more aggressive on both fronts. It's all good.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:44 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    OK, let's say that is correct - that current funds would only support operations until the end of Q2 2012. So now add a net of $9M to the pot, but it only gets them to the end of Q4 2012?

     

    Where is all the new money going to be spent if they could get by on roughly $2M a quarter to the end of Q2 2012, but now they need $4.5M a quarter for the 3rd and 4th Quarter of 2012? Whatever the intent of the wording its confusing to me. I suppose it will become more clear to me as we learn more in the coming days and with the first 10Q and conference call in 2012.

     

    One possibility is what is actually going to happen is that the burn rate in 2012 will increase as a result of cap-x and increased expenses for sales and marketing, operations, working capital, etc., resulting in all the existing funds as well as the funds from the capital raise being exhausted by the end of 2012.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:47 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    Without debating the amount of cap-x versus other outlays all that really matters is they say they will need new funds by the end of 2012 and that means they will burn all the have between now and that date on expenses and cap-x regardless of the split between cap-x and expense spending. It just seems like a poorly worded sentence to me that could have been more clearly stated, but that's just MHO.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:31 AM Reply Like
  • KirkTierney
    , contributor
    Comments (97) | Send Message
     
    Heyaz JP,

     

    A smattering of thoughts relating to your comments. There's a mouthful, JP, so don't get all "I-gotta-answer-all-this" about it, my friend.

     

    o At this point, page turned, I feel that the miles marched toward a break-even on cash flow is the the measure that most counts. The balance between burn rate, reserve, and hard orders is going to be our new topic for a fair while. Do you agree?

     

    o I would prefer, on that march, that "nickles-like-manhole-... concept should stay firmly in place. I imagine that I am not alone in that, but there are some difficult issues. There are frankly some compensation issues that do not seem to be in line with that strategy, and I'd love to hear some opinions on that.

     

    o The Gen 2 line can make hundreds of thousands of batteries. I cannot recall the numbers at this coffee-deprived moment. Time for a new guesstimate? Can a breakeven quantity be achieved on this line? Is capital required at present to hit break even.

     

    o We do need to remember that getting an order "made" involves spending money, but could that be debt financed? There's a discussion there.

     

    o What was done in the raise was frankly the minimum needed. Double that at double the price would have been better, but that required more than just a high market price. I think we all wonder about another raise in the future. Remind me of the "rules of thumb" needed to get off this exchange?

     

    ---

     

    Some work for the many to do, and probably just the tip of the iceberg. Maybe I should have said these as separate topics, but then again, this is a list, not a discussion, so I'd love to see other people's lists collated too.

     

    kt
    2 Feb 2012, 08:48 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    KT,
    Good list of questions. They would make a good header for the next concentrator ( or several concentrators). Maybe each question could be a topic for a new concentrator. Will let Maya think about that.

     

    I will have to go back a few concentrators to see the production numbers I posted in the header article. I know I have the Gen 2 line numbers for you there.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:53 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    KT.
    Holy smokes Batman it was December 12 and we only had 37 concentrators. I wrote this way back then:
    "As I understand it, the Axion negative electrode line can make about 300 battery units of negative electrodes--it takes about 30 electrodes for one PbC battery-- every day if they ran 3 shifts per day, right now."

     

    300 PbCs per day x $50 ( profit) per battery x 250 days per year equals net income of $3,750,000. The flooded lead acid battery production adds more to the bottom line. For easy numbers I have always thought it a net 1 million on a 6 million dollar contract.

     

    Hope this helps.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:03 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Excellent list KT...and the last point on "this exchange" should soon be the next topic...We can't beat the financing we just got if we stay on this exchange.

     

    I expect it maybe next year-2013 late...we need revenues to move up the ladder...the sooner the better in my book.

     

    As I keep hammering home...we need the new lines in place and certified and then push the product out the door win, lose or draw...no one is going to buy PbC in quantities (and we couldn't produce them if they did) until they see them in action and actually gain market acceptance...
    2 Feb 2012, 09:51 AM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    Yes now with your comment I have new questions as;

     

    2 million burning rate per month....what for Capex and what of administration?

     

    After 4 months of that burning rate what we have?

     

    Do we REALLY have a product desirable for any ? in grids, cars, eolic, solar, railcars?, are we sure that product fits expectations of any of this markets?

     

    Are we still in "testing phase" in ALL the markets?

     

    Is the electrode plan really a feasible one instead of selling complete units?

     

    Why being so obvious the difference there is no more buzzing around the technology by competitors?

     

    I have a deja vu feeling.........

     

    Regards.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:41 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    The burn rate is $2 million per QUARTER including administration and R&D.

     

    The ongoing testing is designed to find out for certain whether the PbC is desirable in automotive, rail and stationary applications. The testing is not complete yet but all of the testers design their protocols to disqualify unsuitable products as quickly as possible. The fact that the PbC has not failed after over two years of testing in automotive and rail is very strong evidence that it is suitable.

     

    We believe the plan to sell components rather than complete batteries is feasible because other companies do it all the time. We won't have proof that it's feasible until we have a signed contract.

     

    The underlying patents for the PbC technology include fundamental blocking patents that prevent a competitor from making a device with lead-based positive electrodes and carbon based negative electrodes. The closest any competitor has dared come is the Ultrabattery which uses a split negative electrode design where one of the lead-based negative electrodes is carbon coated. We won't know whether the Ultrabattery violates Axion's patent until they start selling the device commercially instead of using it in proprietary projects.

     

    If you're having a deja vu feeling the only sensible thing to do is sell. No investment is worth losing sleep over.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:04 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    I gotta think we're heading in to the home stretch with BMW for some kind of result. This July will be three full years of testing, and I remain mindful of TG's "fast track" comment, and the monthly coordination calls ongoing between them. Is that frequency perhaps indicative of a tempo more nearer a decision point than not? For the automotive gurus here, are we in the window now for a possible 2013 model year decision? If so, when does that close?
    2 Feb 2012, 02:15 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    >481086 ... If a BMW 2013 model year product was in Axion's future we will have to hear about it in the next CC because concrete action on manufacture would have had to been made last fall.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:24 PM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13581) | Send Message
     
    Much as I hate to be throwing cold water here, I really doubt we are looking at 2013 adoption of the PbC. The 2013 models go on sale in just 8 months or so.

     

    2014 might work.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:35 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    I would not expect a mainline product contract for 2013, but then again I wouldn't expect a mainline product contract for any initial production decision.

     

    I do hold out some hope, however, that BMW will decide to use the PbC in one of their limited production 2013 vehicles, something with maybe a 20,000 to 30,000 unit production plan.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:39 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    The cars for 2013 has already decided all the components and are now in the contract phase, so for sure Axion should know it now, otherwhise it will be in 2014 model as the earliest with contract st this dates next year.

     

    Don´t know in grids or rails or the others.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:52 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    When Maxwell and Continental were selected for the Peugeot diesels, the fact of their selection was not publicly disclosed until October 2010 when the cars went into production. – http://bit.ly/zrcmXi

     

    Maxwell and Continental both knew about the design win for months before it was formally announced at a time that suited the customer. I've not heard any rumors about BMW, but I also didn't hear any rumors about the PowerCube being integrated as a frequency regulation resource in the PJM grid. Axion has gotten real good at keeping its mouth shut until the customer says it can talk. But the fact that Axion is not talking does not mean it has nothing to say.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:00 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    I have a deja vu not a deception yet, I´m not ready for a second big loss in the battery market.

     

    But I think that a fresh sight of what has been happening in the past, why, where we are now and specially what we can honestly expect in the future.

     

    Rgds.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:05 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    Ok, that is a good point

     

    Thaks.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:12 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    Some kind of limited production model was in the realm of what I was thinking... I mean, three years *is* a pretty long time. And BMW has to be aware to some extent of Axion's trajectory and needs... From BMW's point of view they may feel it important to nurture a potentially significant supplier... in as timely a way as possible... to keep the vine fed, watered, and growing as it were. Such a consideration would obviously not rank exceedingly high in their decision matrix, but it could be a factor. A smallish, but real implementation of PbC into their line would certainly be advantageous for both in working out all the kinks before a really big commitment...
    2 Feb 2012, 03:17 PM Reply Like
  • magounsq
    , contributor
    Comments (956) | Send Message
     
    John P...with all the Q&A...repetitive and otherwise, you must feel like a pregnant elephant in the 21st month...if it were possible for a male to "feel" that way...
    Being facetious everyone!!!!!!!!!
    2 Feb 2012, 03:20 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    If it's any comfort I have some new information on stop start that I'll be sharing in the next few days.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:21 PM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    John,
    Would I be wrong in adding to that, that if Axion does have an agreement with BMW or even NS for that matter but neither of those customers are willing to let Axion speak, Axion could not have spoken about it to the new investors either. Even if it would have helped with the offering price, correct?

     

    So we can't speculate that Axion isn't any closer to a sales contract because they did not raise more money to increase production as some have mentioned. Why would they do that when they know in six months they will be able to publicly disclose design wins that will significantly impact the terms on the next financing round.

     

    We all assumed when they made the shelf offering announcement they would raise the big $18M first and then go back to the board and raise $10M if they needed to for manufacturing expansion. Maybe we got it in reverse. Do the small raise now on the not so desirable terms and do the larger raise on much better terms to expand production after publicly announcing the design wins.

     

    I know Jveal mentioned this as well as others but I think it is making more and more sense to me that they have chosen to execute financing this way and I don't think it is a bad thing to repeat it.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:31 PM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    So, do we have some candidate models?

     

    Someone (sorry, don't have who) posted a Munich Police using some BMW cars blurb:

     

    http://bit.ly/tos7z2

     

    Wonder if they supply many European police departments.

     

    I was wondering whether there might be rental companies that would use any BMW models in cities and form a test bed where if something went wrong you didn't annoy the rich folk, so I did a little research. First thing that popped up was this:

     

    http://bit.ly/yIgUmX

     

    And then there are fleet sales: couple articles on US Fleet Sales:

     

    http://bit.ly/yLuCSz

     

    http://bit.ly/zbpnBs

     

    No idea if BMW makes anything that is significantly sold to fleets, or any quick search info on European Fleet Sales.

     

    Can't really see them producing two different versions of the same "model" with and without PbC since it's not exactly a drop-in for AGM Batteries, although maybe they would do a limited run first for a particular "audience" and then switch back to the "tried and true" for that particular year.
    2 Feb 2012, 04:14 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    BMW uses police and airport shuttle fleets for their road testing programs because their mileage is high and maintenance is centralized in a location where they can keep detailed records. They don't sell different products to fleet customers.

     

    Every automaker has limited production models that are directed at a "halo" market in addition to their large run production models. The M3s in both the 3 and 5 series are in that class. If you were going to offer a souped up micro-hybrid system the first place you'd launch it would be a halo model rather than a mass market model. It would also be the logical starting place for a souped up battery like the PbC.
    2 Feb 2012, 04:28 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    As much as I drink the kool-aid and as much as I cringed at the offering, I find your statement to be my guiding light.
    If Axion had used the entire shelf registration I would be downtrodden.

     

    The fact that they used what they needed to use is somewhat heart warming. Ues ,they will need more later. Hopefully after a size-able order.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:30 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    C' mon mago, the amount of information by comments thanks to Maya initiative is really abundant , personally I have not time to read them all I enjoy it when have the opportunity.

     

    JP is kind enough to understand this situation I think is in many readers...having over 20k means that John knows how the interaction is ( I followed him since 2009)

     

    Rgds.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:58 PM Reply Like
  • magounsq
    , contributor
    Comments (956) | Send Message
     
    Advill...maybe it's a cultural misunderstanding, it was tongue in cheek...Tongue-in-cheek is a phrase used as a figure of speech to imply that a statement or other production is humorously intended and it should not be taken at face value.
    Just kidding.
    I fully appreciate John and Maya's work and John's patience.

     

    Geez...tough week for posting all!
    This too shall pass...
    2 Feb 2012, 09:54 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    "We will sure be watching that in the next ConfCall." Understatement of the New Year sir! ;) Seriously, this CC threatens to be doozy. But we have at least six weeks to go in which something good can happen. I can't imagine TG wants to commence that call without having at least a few bones to throw us.. And heck, might even be a couple of pork chops in there... ;)
    2 Feb 2012, 01:24 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Time for a reality check, I think there is a wide varying view on the financing, but most of the negative views is that the stock dropped from.60 to .47 & the shelf was at .35. We forget that this deal was likely inked months ago with the stock at .25-.40 with the terms set out on the 40 days moving average with a maximum price established. If TG had done it when the stock was cheaper we would have cheered, but in reality it is the same...we still have 114m shrs. out and it was still .35 or lower. Here is just a brief list of facts below that we all knew for since July of last year.
    1. AXPW would have to raise capital..they were running out of money
    2. They needed the gen2-a & gen.3 lines
    3. When these lines are added they will have to be certified
    4. At some point we had to have sales/marketing team (done now with the new hire and Rosewater relationship, with more sales personnel to follow makes sense) th
    5. These new lines & additional manpower cost money to purchase, money to install and money to certify...manpower increases have to fronted up front as JLP stated earlier.
    6.TG has said previously that it was too early for auto
    7. NS was delayed by EPA review, a better BMS needed and the larger battery installation probably had to be installed and tested in the 999. We were told this order was delayed.

     

    Positives:
    1. Most of us expected a drop in price due to the additional shares, I won't say how much because it varies by individual opinion.
    2. So far we have only dropped about 20% -- I would have expected much more. That tells me the float is still the same, axionistas still control a huge block of available stock and covered whatever other axionistas sold.
    3. Desperate sellers at any price are gone for now (SS is probably out ...we will know for sure this quarter), Quercus close and remaining disciplined on their selling.
    4. $10m is not that much money, but it gets us to Dec.'12, whereas without it we were "out of business" within 3-5 months. Now we have the cash to build another line - get it certified- and cover cash burn til the end of the year roughly.
    5. We now have a very qualified marketing expert with experience & a deal with Rosewater.
    6. Last year we had no Power Cube, we did not even know it existed. Much less that one would be connected to the grid & working. now we do
    7. The 999 sat on a side rail in the middle of nowhere with not much happening....now it's moved into Altoona yard and things are moving forward ... see WTBlanchards post in the last concentrator.
    8. As soon as SS was out, as sale of 30+ batteries to the navy, hiring a new marketing guy, PJM/Viridity Energy/Power Cube the stock price goes from .25 to >.60....guys that is almost a triple in less than 2 months. We got spoiled to seeing our brokerage accounts in the green...maybe even greedy wanting it to just keep going, going & going....we kept looking for the huge auto order & NS order that we have been told won't happen yet. JLP has stated that if we could just double (maybe triple at best) revenues in 2012 he would be very happy as it shows tremendous growth yr/yr.
    AXPW cannot be a billion $ company without the expansion we all knew was coming, but we have made huge progress after a long dry spell of news from last July-November with some potentially game changing innovations. I think most of the anger rests in hindsight ...wishing we had all sold last year at >$1, bought back at .25, sold again at .60...etc.
    The story is still intact. Most have said we're in it for the long haul. Things are progressing...I think the new marketing VP should tell us that we are still right...He would not have went to a "dud". I am sure there will be more sales announced this year, but maybe not enough to satisfy some that are upset. IMO, we just lower our short term expectations & view the positives for what they are. Forget what happens in a week Rome wasn't built in a day.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:35 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    Well summarized LT, about the only thing I'd add was that Axion's market capitalization was $53 million at Tuesday's close. Tomorrow it will have $9.2 million more cash and equity than it did on Tuesday. To my way of thinking the market cap should be $62.2 million at a minimum because there were financing uncertainties on Tuesday that were eliminated yesterday.

     

    With a total of 115 million shares outstanding, a $62.2 million market cap would be $0.54 per share.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:58 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    I have been struggling trying to wrap my mind around why I didn't like this equity raise any more than the last one. I like the Axion story but it was hard for me to accept that ZBB can raise small amounts of capital at market prices but Axion can't. It basically just deflated me that I was wrong about when and how the next capital raise would go.
    I'm not disappointed that Axion can move forward. In fact I'm elated that they can move forward. Its simply one of those times as an investor when you realize that your self imposed view was incorrect. I do suspect that the price will be back above $.50 pretty quickly. I found the buying power yesterday to be incredibly strong.

     

    I wrote the following comment on JP's instablog this morning. I repeat it here simply to see if others are feeling the same way.

     

    A Bartenders viewpoint.

     

    I have always understood JP's reasoning that adding whiskey to a beer doesn't dilute the beer. However, I am not sure I agree with the analogy.
    When I buy a stock it is with the expectation that the company will be profitable. The value I place on that stock is not just the
    book value. I buy the book value as well as anticipated earnings ( losses). The value of the future profits to me is based on the number of shares outstanding. Axion had 85 million shares at one point. Now we have 114 Million. The future division of profits is diluted. This is the frustrating part of an equity capital raise. This is why shareholders feel dilution has occurred. In the sense of a future division of profits it is a real dilution.
    Now, that said, it is only part of the discussion. As an investor, I am responsible for calculating the future profits and the value of the stock. It is my responsibility to factor in the possibility of the company not having expansion funds and realize that a capital raise is coming. It is my responsibility to factor in the companies inability to ramp sales prior to running out of money. Once all those factors are taken into consideration I can only blame myself for purchasing stock at a price higher than the latest capital raise. I'm sure the insiders that have owned the stock for 8 years feel the same way.

     

    Now to the analogy:
    When I buy a beer or beer and a shot,it is with the expectation that I will get a little profit (kick) from that, also. My beer is not diluted. But when the bartender charges less to the guy sitting next to me for the same drink, I feel dilution just hit me in the face. My drink is just as strong. But I ordered it one minute before happy hour started. My fault for not paying more attention.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:04 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    He paid less for his boiler maker because he's "newer".
    2 Feb 2012, 08:35 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    To my way of thinking, part of Tuesday's market capitalization was an expectation by many that we would NOT be selling stock at .35
    2 Feb 2012, 10:26 AM Reply Like
  • SMaturin
    , contributor
    Comments (2268) | Send Message
     
    Or did he pay less for his boiler maker because he is one of the casino's favored regular customers?

     

    Oops... I mean "accredited investor."
    2 Feb 2012, 11:29 AM Reply Like
  • Frrat
    , contributor
    Comments (76) | Send Message
     
    Futurist, I have been struggling for 2 days to find words to say what I feel about the captial raise. What you write above is just what I want to say. Thank you!
    I am also blaming myself for over optimistic and not factoring those factors you mentioned. Lesson learned....
    2 Feb 2012, 12:55 PM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1135) | Send Message
     
    I think part of the reason that ZBB and others can do deals at perceived better terms is that they are on the AMEX and we are on the OTCBB. That is very important and why I brought it up a few dozen concentrators ago about maybe a reverse merger as we qualified for AMEX and maybe NASDAQ membership outside of the shareprice. Those exchanges are more reputable. I may be an idiot but I bet that the guys who get the calls to suscribe to the OTC deals are not the same as Morgan called for the Facebook IPO. Different sharks in different pools. Buying OTC in general means you have to have a more thick-skin and want a greater risk/return as there are some frauds out there therefore you want a bigger discount.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:34 PM Reply Like
  • Nicholas Chen
    , contributor
    Comments (2717) | Send Message
     
    I expected the dilution to once again be a significant discount to market, like in 2009. So I refrained from buying until today.

     

    Though I didn't expect how this stock would rally and missed out on many trading ops and still paid a higher price than I would have (I saw this stock go to 25c and thought the new year would mean the selling would stop).

     

    Still, my intent for Axion is to be a small long term holding, and now that financing is out of the way, I can buy in peace.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:52 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    John:
    Who bought the 9.2 Millon?
    2 Feb 2012, 02:56 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    LT, I agree with your analysis speciallly the first part related to how the PO price was set. but still a coupkle of questions:

     

    What is the payoff of gen.1 line?

     

    Who bought now another sort of Quercus?

     

    Rgds.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:10 PM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    In 2009, Emerging Growth Equities and Philadelphia Brokerage, the firm who handled the current placement, sold stock to a total of 50 individual investors and small funds. I'd expect the same kind of distribution this time around.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:23 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    MRH,
    I 'm not sure I agree with your analysis. Certainly it could be right. Your really making a liquidity argument. I would say that ZBB which trades less shares per day is less liquid, no matter what the exchange.. I doubt the make-up of the exchange or OTC really would influence a significant investor. The financial security of the company would be a more realistic factor in investing a large sum of money.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:26 PM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    Futurist & Frrat, here's a thought for both of you...

     

    Is it possible that without the raise your shares would never have earned any "future profits" and would likely have withered away, perhaps even well below the $.25 level? If the answer is "yes", and I believe it must be, then, IMO, the "future division of profits" has not been diluted. Rather, the "dilution" has given your shares the opportunity to realize future profits; without you had nothing and certainly no future profits. The dilution can reasonably be viewed as a life preserver thrown to your shares.

     

    For the purpose of visualization and getting your emotions in touch with my analogy, let's say that the dilution is a life ring thrown to your shares, without which would likely have cramped and drown or been gobbled up by a great white. Now, insert yourself into that scenario in place of the share floundering in the water and facing imminent death. How much would it be worth for me to throw you a life preserver?

     

    In that context, the dilution doesn't seem sooo terrible to me.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:50 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    eggwis,
    Your commentary exactly points to my comment. We are in total agreement. I was trying to show that my feelings about the dilution of share price was not supported by the facts. Simply, that as an investor , I had higher hopes than the reality.
    But, that does not stop Axion from being a home run stock. It simply means that more shareholders will reap the great reward than before the offering.
    2 Feb 2012, 06:12 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    I think JLP answered the last question and they maybe owe a million on the equipment. Can't prove it, but that was in the last quarter form they filed.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:42 PM Reply Like
  • Frrat
    , contributor
    Comments (76) | Send Message
     
    egg, I was upbeat about AXPW even at the end of last year, but what happened on Feb 1st really forces me to cool down, put aside my emotion (or love) towards AXPW at least for a few weeks, and redo a reality check. What I can say now is (1) I still believe the the product of PbC and long term potential of Axion; (2) in short term, the uncertainties and unknown factors, such the stage of product commercialization and sales, exceeds what I perceived before. So after being slapped in face so hard, I won't be in a rush to add in AXPW again in short time....
    2 Feb 2012, 10:00 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    >Frrat ... Everyone here seems to forget that the stock is not the company. The stock (of most companies) is as much perception as fact. Wish it weren't so but ... This game would be kid's play if they were the same.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:05 PM Reply Like
  • Frrat
    , contributor
    Comments (76) | Send Message
     
    Drich, <....this game would be kid's play if they were the same> totally agree. I am no longer emotional about AXPW although I still like PbC and Axion Power a lot.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:14 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    Frrat, FWIW I think your reflection is a healthy one. All of us should be, and probably are, doing the very same, or we shouldn't be here. If you haven't read it already, JP's latest instablog on an alternate view of Axion's "dilution" could be helpful. Futurist's (among others) comments there as well..
    2 Feb 2012, 10:29 PM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1135) | Send Message
     
    I hear you but I personally disagree. Liquidity is one factor so is your neighborhood. The OTC BB is a pretty crappy neighborhood.

     

    I asked John probably a month ago why AXPW was on the OTC BB and not Toronto or done a reverse merger to get on the AMEX because of a conversation with a friend I had had and I had an eye to the financing needs of the company.

     

    My friend who is an investor who B & C level shops would be calling for placements of stock like these. He's not big enough that Goldman knows who he is but he's on a bunch of the smaller guys rolodex. He's invested in one of the ZBB placements (we're in Wisconsin) and he probably bites on 1:10 calls. His brokers don't bug him on certain business' but he'll invest in Toronto before an OTC BB stock. Period. He won't look at them as he considers them to be home of pumps/dumps and his time is too valuable to him to sort through the good and bad. I doubt he's alone as our neighbors suck.
    3 Feb 2012, 04:30 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    Fair enough.
    Hadn't thought about investors "not looking" because of the pink sheet designation. But to me that is on the broker. Why Axion chose which broker to use is above my paygrade.
    4 Feb 2012, 06:39 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    Emerging Growth Equities and Philadelphia Brokerage did the small fund and individual investor tranche of the 2009 placement so there was some good history. The next step up the food chain begins once the price recovers a bit. At that point the A & B tier investment banks will start calling on Axion to solicit its business. That's when raising money gets fun instead of being a dog eat dog grind.
    4 Feb 2012, 09:19 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    This Honda suit settlement could advance us much faster as evidenced below:
    Peters claimed her he car never came close to the promised 50 mpg (21.26 kpl) and that it got no more than 30 miles per gallon (12.75 kilometers per liter) when the battery began deteriorating.

     

    A Los Angeles Superior Court commissioner has awarded Heather Peters $9,867.

     

    Peters, a former lawyer, hoped to inspire a flood of such lawsuits by the other 200,000 owners of the Hybrid Honda Civic model sold in 2006. She said that if all 200,000 owners of the cars sued and won in small claims cost, it could Honda Motor Co. $2 billion.

     

    $2b potential liability will bring battery changes...I guarantee.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:55 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    LT,
    The reason Honda will not pay 2 Billion dollars is two-fold. First they will probably appeal and stretch this out. Second, no group of 200,000 people ever have connected together to bring 200,000 separate small claims suits. 199,000 of them are not attorneys and are frightened of the system. These cases would be brought nationwide, with varying jurisdictional amounts and thousands of different judges. No one knows what the outcome would be. Each case would stand on its own merits. One wouldn't influence the other.

     

    Honda could easily make this right. But admitting a mistake is not easy in the Asian culture.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:17 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Futurist, I am well aware they won;t pay $2b...but they & all other makers now know that they can be liable. That alone will bring change....We all know that all companies go to great lengths to limit liability...This battery thing was a known upfront and they misled people to save a dollar. That makes it even more interesting.

     

    This is a new way to attack big corps too...I expect them to cry foul if this begins a trend and want a law change...I think it is great that this girl did not sit back and do nothing like most of us..she actually did something heroic in her own way. It may not help AXPW & it might, but I do guarantee that it will bring about change was my point.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:34 AM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    LT,
    It would be nice if the media runs with this story and gets the technical side right. Its the David and Goliath story they want to report. Not the truth about dynamic charge acceptance of lead acid batteries.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:39 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    very true...you raised a good point...sorta like what I wanted to accomplish...I bet the media drops it like a hot potato,,,
    remember the Toyota fiasco....

     

    we axionista's need to make sure the media gets the charge acceptance of the AGM lead acid battery story right....it could be the best thing we ever done.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:51 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    Wonder if our ole buddy GM is paying attention? :-)
    2 Feb 2012, 10:36 AM Reply Like
  • LabTech
    , contributor
    Comments (1778) | Send Message
     
    Futurist,
    One thing about your comment. The woman in question won the lawsuit in small claims court. To my knowledge there is no appeal of a small claims court verdict. Just like there are no lawyers allowed in them. So while I agree that it is unlikely that all 200,000 people will try this route, it is possible that a lot more will do so than would have if she had lost, and Honda may be on the hook for a lot more money than they originally thought.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:40 AM Reply Like
  • tripleblack
    , contributor
    Comments (13581) | Send Message
     
    Although I consider this extremely unlikely given the political conditions...

     

    Imagine the Feds forcing a general recall for car battery packs to be checked against a standard, and free replacement for those which do not meet spec?
    2 Feb 2012, 10:46 AM Reply Like
  • brishwain
    , contributor
    Comments (84) | Send Message
     
    And as a former class action lawyer I can assure you all that more important than what other honda owners may or may not do in small claims court on their own, there are class action lawyers now looking at making these same arguments next time around - and that the class action lawyers and judge (and likely objectors) on the current honda suit are all looking at ways NOT to finalize it on the current terms.

     

    I think this development is a huge positive for Axion - so long as it is able to deliver PbC's in significant quantities.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:49 AM Reply Like
  • mrholty
    , contributor
    Comments (1135) | Send Message
     
    The problem from our standpoint is so what if they run with this story.

     

    We would want them to say that batteries with Axion inside" work as advertised but we cannot. We feel that they could but no reporter is going to knock a hybrid and show that an R&D has a replacement. No they will go with another full scale company such as A123 or something like that.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:46 PM Reply Like
  • jveal
    , contributor
    Comments (644) | Send Message
     
    If the reporter did his homework he would find the test data BMW and Axion released. That would indeed be good press.
    2 Feb 2012, 01:16 PM Reply Like
  • 481086
    , contributor
    Comments (3431) | Send Message
     
    Paging Phil Lebeau... ;)
    2 Feb 2012, 02:00 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    we have to provide the links for them.
    2 Feb 2012, 02:17 PM Reply Like
  • Futurist
    , contributor
    Comments (2109) | Send Message
     
    The rules vary from State to State but I am not aware of any judicial system that does not allow review of unconstitutional, illegal, or otherwise non correct rulings, no matter what the level.
    Perhaps someone else knows for sure.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:32 PM Reply Like
  • magounsq
    , contributor
    Comments (956) | Send Message
     
    Ahh...jveal..."homewor... press..."
    One can not assume a reporter will actually do the homework and write a learned piece...unless there's a fire or explosion...a la Li batteries...small price of freedom of the press...
    2 Feb 2012, 04:20 PM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    Marketing and media aspects aside, I have a ? in my mind as to whether or not there is potential upside to this for AXPW. What is the form factor and weight of the battery originally installed in the Civic and can its design even accommodate our battery?
    2 Feb 2012, 06:37 PM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Bang..you are probably right...Spending is going to increase this year and next year too...but you can't grow sales & revenue without it. TG has been ultra conservative and squeezed pennies but now is time to ramp it up...get product out.
    With the Honda lawsuit (IMO this changes all companies & really damaged AGM battery acceptance), Start/Stop we know is in the process of a mass adoption, The stars are aligning for AXPW.

     

    AXPW is still debt free...
    We now have cash to keep expanding

     

    Let's quit focusing on the financing...focus on the new developments, and move forward.

     

    My only complaint is that like the deal in china...that we couldn't have been included in that test. IF we have to give product away...then do it..just get it out in real life uses. (that's what AONE has done)
    2 Feb 2012, 06:35 AM Reply Like
  • Ricknplano
    , contributor
    Comments (318) | Send Message
     
    I believe there is debt on the real estate. I do not remember how much, less than a million I think.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:53 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    Axion leases the real estate for both plants. The only debt on the balance sheet is an equipment loan from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:07 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    My last rambling for this morning:

     

    I can't take the long term view and day trade or short term trade AXPW...I want that 10 bagger that Maya talks about.
    One breakthrough deal and it skyrockets to over $1
    It messes up my long term capital gains position (unless u have 2 accounts) Someone may enlighten me as to how to do this legally.

     

    I had a conversation with someone last July when the need for capital was stated about the possibility that without sales announcements that the stock would go to .35...they did not see it happening. It went to .25....There was a lot of available capital on the sidelines and put to good use at .25-.35/shr. by many who follow this concentrator and JLP's laborious and diligent work and articles educating us on the AXPW's story and the battery, alternative energy business in general.
    Many more wanted to average more at a cheaper price when it was .60+ last week and did so yesterday and will probably get a chance again...but I am not sure when the dust settles that we don't go right back there...the only caveat is if the new owners of the 28m shares start feeding the market...there is no doubt that shares were tight for the last few weeks. I think JLP's supply inflection point happened. To buy any large blocks it moved the price upward...something not seen since last July.

     

    I still believe with all the late stage testing and the PcB has not failed in 2-3 years that we get an endorsement this year or next year at the latest. I don't want to be out of stock when it happens...we could go from .50 to $3.00 overnight. I do not want to miss that.
    2 Feb 2012, 06:51 AM Reply Like
  • Deamiter
    , contributor
    Comments (165) | Send Message
     
    LT -- if you want to trade around a core position, you should be able to do that. The default for sales is usually FIFO (first in, first out) but you should be able to specify lots or sell last in, first out.

     

    Some basic brokers might not make it easy for you to specify lots (shares purchased at different times). I'd suggest switching brokers.

     

    You just have to be careful every time you sell to ensure you're selling short-term shares, not your core position. Screw up enough times and you'll have to wait another year to have long-term capital gains.
    2 Feb 2012, 07:39 AM Reply Like
  • mds5375
    , contributor
    Comments (174) | Send Message
     
    Maya -
    Where is New-Castle-Phil this morning telling us that we don't have 6 more months of Axion winter? :-)
    2 Feb 2012, 07:49 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » mds: That's funny. Over there, north of Pittsburgh, at least they've had a little bit of winter.

     

    Earlier today, I wrote that over here, near Philly, this so far is the winter that wasn't.

     

    And over here, somewhere within maybe 50 traffic lights of where I live, a troop of folks just came forth and injected $10M into our company.

     

    Essentially, they gave us 9 more months of allowing the Axion Power sun to shine.

     

    Here's the really funny part. These new investors are dwarfed by what percentage of AXPW we Axionistas own.

     

    Damned near "chilling" to ponder.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:04 PM Reply Like
  • Advill
    , contributor
    Comments (2320) | Send Message
     
    Axionistas......that´s a good one, your spanish is quickly improving.

     

    Rgds.
    3 Feb 2012, 05:33 AM Reply Like
  • mds5375
    , contributor
    Comments (174) | Send Message
     
    It has been a very warm winter on the East Coast. (North Carolina and DC, myself).

     

    I don't comment much. But I was the one that initiated the conversations on the % of ownership by Axionist-long-term-hol... based on my guess of the number of hardcores, number of lurkers, and number of shares owned out of 85M (at that time). My guess was just over 50%. John pushed the numbers higher in subsequent responses, and then Futurist attempted a count.

     

    I’m mostly quiet, I can’t watch all day, but I’m here and do genuinely appreciate your effort to manage this – especially since the number of people feeling they have to say SOMETHING when they should just listen has gone way up. ;-)

     

    Now here’s a question for you that has puzzled me – Have you ever thought about how you’re going to finally end this concentrator?
    3 Feb 2012, 08:38 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    IT'S ALIIIVE!
    3 Feb 2012, 08:39 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » mds: I think $10/share would about do it! :-)
    3 Feb 2012, 08:53 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    How many Grandsons do you have? :-)
    3 Feb 2012, 09:19 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    Related, there are now folks selling systems that analyze tweets for investment decisions.

     

    We'll know we've really made it when the first "Concentrator Analysis System" (CAS) (Patent Pending) is produced.

     

    HTL, I got a new project for ya .... :-)
    3 Feb 2012, 09:23 AM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    mds,

     

    AXPW shares are the blood that flow through the veins of this Concentrator. Axionistas are the heart that pumps it. So long as Axionistas and AXPW shall thrive, so too, shall the Axion Power Concentrator, even if Maya should tire of his labors.

     

    **EDIT**
    Please insert "So long as Axionistas, AXPA and SA shall thrive..."
    3 Feb 2012, 11:31 AM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    WT,
    Ssshhhh... You should have PM'd that. If SA is smart (..and I believe they are ... for the most part), they'll gobble that idea right up. They already have a full staff of Web/App Devs. Imagine what that could do for traffic on SA...!
    3 Feb 2012, 11:36 AM Reply Like
  • Ricknplano
    , contributor
    Comments (318) | Send Message
     
    Previously management said they have liquidity to get through the 2nd quarter, but prudently chose to issue capital about six months before running out of cash. They now say they have cash to go through year end. Can we expect another capital issue in June-July?

     

    Management was willing to sell 28.5 million shares at a net to the company of just over $0.32 per share. The seasoned investors were willing to pay only $0.35 per share. The best informed insiders will sell Axion stock, and expert investors will buy the stock, in the mid thirty cents. I do not think I know better what the stock is worth than Tom Granville and the board of directors. And they are willing to sell 28.5 million shares of company stock at $0.32 cents. Hence my caution. I am a believer in the long-term potential, but I am cautious regarding the near term stock price.
    2 Feb 2012, 08:49 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    In a direct placement transaction, liquidity is a big concern for the investors that usually doesn't arise in open market transactions. If you compare a 50,000 share retail investor with a 1,000,000 share direct placement investor, the 50,000 share retail investor has a pretty high degree of confidence that he can sell his entire position in a day or two if he's so inclined and the market will accommodate him.

     

    A sophisticated million share investor, on the other hand, knows that he can't sell more than about 10% of daily trading volume without pushing the price down. Unless he's willing to pay the price for crushing the market, he has to plan on selling over the course of a month or two. If he's one of several similarly situated investors, he has to rely not only on his own good behavior, but on the good behavior of all his fellow investors.

     

    The market risk associated with a two-day selling program isn't close to being in the same league with the market risk associated with a two-month selling program.

     

    If you think back to my old rule of thumb that private placement investors never want to pay more than 50% of the expected stabilized market price, that dynamic exists because of the much higher market and liquidity risks.

     

    The risk is slightly lower in a direct registered offering because there's no fixed stand down period when the investors can't legally sell, but that risk never goes away. When you're trying to get a group of 20 or 30 investors to spring for $10 million in cash, and they're adequately represented by a good broker-dealer, the negotiations are very bare knuckle affairs.

     

    Currently Axion turns its outstanding stock over once every 250 days or so. When you get to companies like JCI, the turnover period is closer to 120 days. So while Axion's liquidity is way better than it was, it's still less than ideal.

     

    One other factor that's important to carefully consider is the difference between open market transactions and direct transactions. In an open market transaction Stockholder A sells his shares to New Investor B and all the money goes into Stockholder A's pocket. In a direct placement Axion sells shares to New Investor B and all the money ends up on Axion's balance sheet. From that point forward New Investor B bears all the risk of what New Investor C might be willing to pay in an open market transaction.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:27 AM Reply Like
  • Ricknplano
    , contributor
    Comments (318) | Send Message
     
    I appreciate the explanation. Using your prior analysis and projections you said that this type transaction should be within or less than 20% of expected market price or share value, as ascertained by the investors and selling company. At the transaction price of 35 cents that means the company and inside investors believe a price 42 cents or so is the appropriate market price at this time.

     

    A second analysis would just look at value per share as the discounted present value of expected future earnings per share (which is actually just the definition of value). If I assume the market price of 60 cents the day before the offering and adjust the discounted present value of future earnings for the additional 28.5 million shares (approximately 1/3 less future earnings per share due to 1/3 more shares), then the appropriate price again puts us at about 40 cents per share. The two approaches to value both agree with a fair value in the low forties.

     

    Again, I love the tech and appreciate the potential. But the best informed buyers and sellers are trading stock in the mid thirties and even with a market adjustment of 20% due to bulk sales the market value still gets us to low forties for a current market price.

     

    I am on this blog not to profess my love for Axion, but to make money. Axion is the vehicle to make money. If I was overly optimistic in my previous expectations I have to accept that. I am still a long-term believer, but I will buy below 40 and sell above 60 until circumstances improve. I hope everyone here makes an absolute fortune. But I have taken off the blinders and am looking at the reality as management is showing it to be.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:59 AM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    Rick,

     

    A123 just raised, I think, 18M or $25M at just above $2. The price has been beaten down very hard last year and this year, Regardless of what I think of the company I do not believe there offer price of ~$2 was indicative of what their management thought the fair value of the company was. It is merely the price they could all agree on with the investors at this very specific time when they needed to raise the cash.

     

    I also have to push back on all of the sudden everyone evaluating their investment in the company based on future earnings, book value, fair value etc.

     

    The entire nature of Axion at this stage is that it is a speculative investment. The only way to evaluate that investment is based on risk versus reward. Time and again we have said the reward coming from NS, BMW, PJM, GM, oil rigs etc. far outweighs the current risk. Now that they have financing behind them the risk is even less than it was two days ago.

     

    I believe you said yourself a month or two ago that it doesn't matter what price we bought it for, anything under .50 would look the same on the chart when this hits $5. What has changed for you between now and then? This stock is all about monstrous potential versus minimum risk. I think some are forgetting they never bought this stock based on fundamental past earnings or book value or anything else, while taking those things into consideration might help an investor to minimize the risk it has really nothing to do with the "fair value" of the company.

     

    The potential has never been better and, in my view, the risk has never been less (at least for the next 9 months). That is really the only proper mechanisms for evaluating this stock at this stage, imo.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:27 AM Reply Like
  • Ricknplano
    , contributor
    Comments (318) | Send Message
     
    What changed for me was the fact that management increased the number of shares by a third, thereby reducing the future earnings per share by a third. This means they increased the time frame for reaching $5 by a third longer time period. They also sold for a price that shocked the hell out of me. So I would say I have been forced by reality to reconsider my prior expectations. I realize I was ridiculously over optimistic.

     

    They now have 115 million shares (130 million fully diluted). Using a simplified model of 10% net profit on sales and a PE ratio of 10 Axion now needs $115 million in sales to justify a market price of $1. How long will it take to get that level of sales? Apparently, given management's willingness to sell at a net of 32 cents, it is going to take a lot longer than I used to think. If we try to go much over a buck a share in value we have to go with the diluted number of shares so there is an additional hill to climb there. Also, there is the possibility of even more capital issues, according to what management has specifically told us. So management has thrown cold water, ice water in fact, over my warm fuzzy feelings about the stock. The tech is fantastic. The stock prospects, near term, not so much.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:38 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Good morning Rick, your thinking is more rational and on track this morning :) (no pun intended) I own about the same amount of shares as you do and can certainly feel the same pain when account balances drop that much suddenly. My average is .71 and I placed and order at .35 yesterday and it didn't get filled....I will continue to bottom fish in the 30's too using 10,000 shr. blocks. Last time I bought was at .34..would like more there .
    2 Feb 2012, 10:46 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    Let's go to another dynamic and pretend that John is developing a 40 story condominium building and my buddy Rick buys 10 floors of the project as an investment.

     

    Are you going to agree that the guy who wants to buy an 800 sq. ft. efficiency should pay the same price per foot you did because your purchase price represented the absolute fair market value?
    2 Feb 2012, 10:49 AM Reply Like
  • Ricknplano
    , contributor
    Comments (318) | Send Message
     
    No, I agree with you and with the anology. But if the typical price premium for bulk versus small sales is 20%, then I would expect that to be the spread. In fact we use bulk sales analysis regularly in real estate and the premium does vary based upon the circumstances of the various transactions. I have seen bulk sales that were higher than market sales (referred to as an assemblage premium) and bulk sales as much as 60% below market (distressed transactions - fire sales as it were). But when I see fire sale prices that usually indicates there is a fire somewhere. I try to avoid being the one getting burned (not always successfully).

     

    In the present case management is telling me there is a fire somewhere that I did not see coming. I am simply adjusting my expectations according to what is slapping me in the face. As always I respect that I am not necessarily correct and everyone should make their investments as they think appropriate for themselves. I still hope Axion makes me and you such a huge pile of money that we need wheelbarrows to haul it to the bank. But I will adjust my time horizon and entry and exit prices according to my best understanding of what management is telling me.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:59 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    All I can tell you is the securities market is much tougher than the real estate market in terms of the discounts investors demand when they invest in common stock of development stage companies. There is no fire but there are a raft of uncertainties that we all know all too well. The new investors understand them as well.

     

    I have walked many miles in the shoes management is wearing right now and know first hand they did nothing unusual and made no unfair or unusual concessions. It's just a brutal "Golden Rule" market out there and them that's got the gold makes the rules.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:07 AM Reply Like
  • thegreekgatsby
    , contributor
    Comments (53) | Send Message
     
    "They now have 115 million shares (130 million fully diluted). Using a simplified model of 10% net profit on sales and a PE ratio of 10 Axion now needs $115 million in sales to justify a market price of $1"

     

    PE ratio of 10 .... i find this overconservative. AXPW remains a speculative stock, and someone should calculate sales+market potential if he wants to get a fair price.
    The above mentioned kind of calculation could apply to companies like CMRE..
    2 Feb 2012, 11:08 AM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    So, now you are saying that two days ago they needed $85M in sales to justify a price of $1? Then why did you buy at .50 when they had zero sales? Come on Rick, that can't be what you think or else you never would have invested in the first place. You are now evaluating the stock on completely irrational terms. Completely different from what you were evaluating the stock just three days ago other wise you would not have been invested then.

     

    Maxwell has a $600M market cap and had ~$150M in revenue last year. The potential for Axion over Maxwell is at least twice.

     

    A couple design wins and a healthy year-over-year revenue increase is all that is necessary to pull back the shroud of mystery around the PbC and reveal an enormous market potential that will be valued well over $115M.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:24 AM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    LT, Where do you find rationality in him all of the sudden trying to state the market price should equal sales?
    2 Feb 2012, 11:29 AM Reply Like
  • jakurtz
    , contributor
    Comments (1959) | Send Message
     
    One more thing Rick that might help a little is that your dilution view percentage of a third is wrong. 28M new shares is 24.7% of 113M, math is funny that way but it is always true. This is why yesterdays close of about 22% down from the previous days close actually kept the company's market price worth the same amount of money when you add in the additional shares.

     

    I am honestly not trying to change your mind I have no problem with your new strategy for yourself, I am really just attempting to help hold things in proper perspective.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:05 PM Reply Like
  • magounsq
    , contributor
    Comments (956) | Send Message
     
    JP/Rick...that was my question...are we comparing apples (AXPW) to oranges (Real Estate) to some extent?
    2 Feb 2012, 04:48 PM Reply Like
  • Tampa Ted
    , contributor
    Comments (2652) | Send Message
     
    Just reviewing the dialogue today and wanted to point out that the above exchange was great! Nothing beats civilized debate where intelligent individuals stake out positions about which the observer cares about.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:12 PM Reply Like
  • DaveT
    , contributor
    Comments (209) | Send Message
     
    Rick, I don't think you can simply pro-rata the DCF because whatever discount rate you use initially should, I think, change to reflect a lower risk (which is quite a bit lower now). It is not unknown for sp to rise after a raise at below market, which maybe reflects that revaluation. At least the uncertainty is removed.
    And although we haven't got there yet I expect, if the extra cash is used to increase profitability (lower cost of production etc) then there is also the argument that the EPS will increase and can possibly override the dilution.

     

    Not that I'm happy with the raise price, and I haven't tried to do a DCF either. What we need most now is a sniff of good margins.
    3 Feb 2012, 09:02 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    It helps to remember what Axion stated in its 2011 Q3 10Q would be the purpose of the planned capital raise: "The Company plans to use a portion of the increase in authorized common shares to raise additional capital to fund growth and strategic investments including the following:

     

    1. For ongoing R&D activities to maintain the Company’s technical advantage.

     

    2.For planned PbC® demonstration projects in our identified market applications (hybrid vehicle, hybrid locomotive and stored energy systems, including various PowerCube™ applications).

     

    3.To build a modest sales and marketing function to implement the Company’s near and long term platform technology business model.

     

    4.To build a recognizable brand to increase awareness of the Company’s PbC® product and to effectively penetrate the mass market with that product.

     

    5.For continued refinement of the Company’s manufacturing processes; for the next generation of our new robotic negative electrode assembly line; and to continue to improve the machinery and equipment in our existing facilities in order to meet the quality requirements for commercialization of our PbC® battery.

     

    6.To invest in the next stage business information system to facilitate efficient and effective execution of supply chain business processes with our business partners.

     

    7.To provide working capital and operating expenses to fund implementation of the Company’s business model on an interim basis until our full commercialization phase is fully underway."

     

    Axion planned to raise up to $18M but only raised half that amount NET. So the question becomes where will the reduced funds be spent and what will be cut or substantially reduced in scope? We won't really know much in detail until the Q1 CC and 10Q. It is obvious that building a sales and marketing function has a high priority and I couldn't agree more with that decision.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:00 AM Reply Like
  • wtblanchard
    , contributor
    Comments (2410) | Send Message
     
    Since we don't know what the sales will be, or what they might have in hand, we don't know for sure that any of those items will be cut.

     

    I'm not sure we have a good handle on what our flooded battery profits (or demand) will be either.

     

    Or for that matter, whether some part of the capital raise will be spent to improve the profitability of that side of the business while we wait for the Big PbC orders.
    2 Feb 2012, 10:54 AM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    >wtblanchard ... Big PbC orders? I'm looking for Customer No. 1, so I'll take any.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:06 AM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    Wasn't that Navy installation of the mini-cube customer # 1?

     

    HardToLove
    2 Feb 2012, 03:38 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    >HTL ... I'm not going to consider a demonstration project as a customer sale. It is just one of, I'm sure, many competitors in a contest. The Navy didn't buy it because they were going to deploy it across the service. My idea of a customer sale is one where it is bought as best qualified to do real economic benefit. More than 1 RR loco, a data center, a utility substation ... real standalone work.
    2 Feb 2012, 03:45 PM Reply Like
  • H. T. Love
    , contributor
    Comments (19390) | Send Message
     
    Aha. I was thinking too small.

     

    HardToLove
    2 Feb 2012, 04:40 PM Reply Like
  • DRich
    , contributor
    Comments (4819) | Send Message
     
    >HTL ... Demonstrations & testing are just fine. Necessary. That doesn't qualify as a customer sale (to me) unless it is a chosen solution for a task & deployed. I could add things like Walmart, housing subdivisions ............
    2 Feb 2012, 05:58 PM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    I would think that item #7 is surely going to be truncated; i.e. I would expect that "...until our full commercialization phase is fully underway." is a long time out. Certainly past Dec., 2012. Thus, that item might be truncated as "7.To provide working capital and operating expenses to fund implementation of the Company’s business model on an interim basis."

     

    With another $8 - $10 mil, as originally planned, there would be enough cash to carry them through 2013, which would be a reasonable time to get fully commercialized.
    3 Feb 2012, 02:51 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » mds: I'm not sure "weather" or not I like that comment ;-)

     

    Funny part is how can we say six more weeks of winter, when it's yet to be winter around here? I still have a couple of spike plants in outdoor pots that are still green, and still growing. Unprecedented. Even have primrose popping new leaves.

     

    So far, this is the winter that wasn't.
    2 Feb 2012, 09:09 AM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    LURKING and picked up some more shares at 45 cents...Have an order sitting out there for way below this just in case someone gets itchy!!!
    2 Feb 2012, 09:59 AM Reply Like
  • LT
    , contributor
    Comments (5783) | Send Message
     
    Interesting who is involved in the "Smart Grid" must be a big market:
    http://seekingalpha.co...
    http://seekingalpha.co...
    2 Feb 2012, 11:00 AM Reply Like
  • eggwis
    , contributor
    Comments (756) | Send Message
     
    It is IMMENSE!
    3 Feb 2012, 03:07 PM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » LT: I read that article yesterday, and forgot to post it. Thanks. There's also a link where you can buy a report for something like $465 (or, was it 465 pages?). I passed.

     

    Thanks for posting. It's truely amazing to look at the graphics of the big shots in the electrical power grid.

     

    Eggwis is right, it is immense. TG stated that something like $122B will be spent on USA's grid by (I believe) 2022, and joked that Axion likely wouldn't get all of it.

     

    Axion needs a VP in Marketing for the grid alone.
    3 Feb 2012, 03:36 PM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    Folks

     

    We just hired a high paying salesperson that came from a company that went bankrupt. I know he comes with supposedly high credentials. I also know as a salesperson you CAN be better than your product,

     

    I will be interested in seeing if his sales skills finally gets us rolling or we just overpaid for a very important position. He did come from a bankrupt company so i am personally not jumping up and down right now.( can't just had knee surgery )

     

    Had he come from a company that he made profitable i would feel differently. But lets put some pressure on him to prove his worth to us. Personally , i hope we did not jump too soon to grab him.

     

    I have no facts to justify my comments other than he is holding our investments in his hands. A hired gun i hope full of bullets instead of full of ..... I owned an Executive Search Firm for 20 years and hope TG used the current market conditions to his favor.

     

    Time will tell, and time is getting shorter....
    2 Feb 2012, 11:20 AM Reply Like
  • John Petersen
    , contributor
    Comments (30629) | Send Message
     
    The important thing you need to understand about Ener1 is that it was building a very effective sales channel for its batteries but executive management made a catastrophic error when they tried to pull Th!nk Motors out of the Norwegian equivalent of a bankruptcy proceeding.

     

    They took $36.8 million that should have been spent on their battery business and dumped it into the EV business instead. They then extended $14.3 million of trade credit to Th!nk and loaned Th!nk an additional $17.1 million. To top off the brilliance, when Th!nk needed financing Ener1 agreed to give the Th!nk investors a right to put those shares to Ener1 in exchange for newly issued Ener1 shares. You can read the whole bloody story here:

     

    http://bit.ly/wzpini
    http://bit.ly/zd8IXh
    http://bit.ly/wDGwSD
    http://bit.ly/wpH9PT

     

    I've had lots of terrible things to say about Ener1 over the last few years, but I wouldn't dream of laying those problems at Mr. Dantam's feet because he didn't make the bad decisions.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:32 AM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    I had 15 years in the executive search business myself MAP and I think he has the right skills. I've also been a hired gun on turn-arounds, acquisitions, and start-ups. In one case taking a $100M engineering firm into the DOD business if anyone asked me who I was I answered "I'm the corporate Kamikazi." I don't hold Ener1's problems at his feet.

     

    I think John nails it. Ener1's management made a stupid decision and nobody other than a deity could save them. He had a long and obviously successful career at Delco and he's very aware of the market and can translate what he knows into where the PbC can gain sales traction the quickest I believe. The fact the Ener1 shot themselves in the head shouldn't mean all their employees are suspect.

     

    He also just had the experience of having his horse shot out from under him - something he is probably anxious not to have happen again.

     

    During my time in the search business I frequently noted that a person's first job change after a long tenure at a previous company didn't last that long. The usual result was another job change that had good results. It takes a while to adapt to not being who you used to be in familiar surroundings. The coffee is not as good, your secretary isn't as quick, you aren't as plugged into the corporate "nervous network" which is the real org chart versus the one on paper, etc.

     

    I think his Ener1 experience has knocked off any barnacles from his Delco days, brought him thoroughly up to speed on the overall market, and I think he's a good fit. Just MHO.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:55 AM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    Bang

     

    Thanks for your opinion. I do agree with you that he only had so much pull in his position. My point is if he is highly (over ) qualified then we should see some sales at some point. Having him move is a good sign, and i hope he is chomping at the bit.

     

    Someone posted to actually give away the product to prove it's worth. I agree we need someone to think outside the box to get the sales rolling.It only takes that first BIG ONE then it usually becomes easier ...

     

    But times are tough on companies, and to have them change sometimes drastic measures need to be taken. I pray the person is up to it. It seems most feel he is so i now feel moe comfortable..

     

    Just bring in that one big order with all these connections he has. I know he needs time but i also think we might have found that missing part of this puzzle.

     

    BANG.....Miss those cold calling days???/....lol....

     

    MAP
    2 Feb 2012, 01:10 PM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    MAP> How many times did we say "I gotta get on the phone!" :<). I sure don't miss the travel either. That was the greatest thing when I opened a small manufacturing firm in the early 90's - no frigging travel. I can always spot a headhunter at the airport. He's dressed nice, travels in style, stays at the best hotels, eats at great restaurants and he's in the middle of a divorce.
    2 Feb 2012, 05:49 PM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    BANG

     

    You looking in my window?...But left that business and found another great women....Plus i really never stayed at the best hotels. Owning the company i needed to cut cost somehow!!!

     

    map
    3 Feb 2012, 10:21 AM Reply Like
  • Mayascribe
    , contributor
    Comments (11197) | Send Message
     
    Author’s reply » Just put in a "day order" for another 50,000 shares at $0.44. These will be trading shares around my core.

     

    Off to the dermy's office to get my face "burned off," then onward to get some Supe fixins'.

     

    Highly likely I'll start another APC as soon as I get back home.
    2 Feb 2012, 11:49 AM Reply Like
  • Metals are Precious
    , contributor
    Comments (707) | Send Message
     
    JP

     

    Not laying 100% blame at anyones feet. I am just stating my professional opinion as what my expectation are. I do not have his Resume in front of me. But lets not underestimate his importance to our future. He CAN make or break us with the steps he takes. Excuses start to get old real quick when surprises hit you in the face.

     

    He has a few hats to wear and i am assuming the management team will be listening to a person of his stature..But i still come back to his batting average. To me a ballplayer hits .300 because mostly of what he does, not the hitting coach...

     

    Again, time is running out before more money without sales is needed. Being a newbie i have no clue what each individual feels about the 35 cents. I know i wasn't happy. But accept it as part of staying in the game.

     

    LURKING for sales now !!!!! Reading almost 10k posts makes one wonder when is it gonna start hitting ...I will take some singles before the homers start coming,

     

    map
    2 Feb 2012, 12:07 PM Reply Like
  • bangwhiz
    , contributor
    Comments (2240) | Send Message
     
    I posted a "snapshot" resume in a previous concetrator the day his hire was announced.
    2 Feb 2012, 12:14 PM Reply Like
  • D-inv
    , contributor
    Comments (4777) | Send Message
     
    ZBB has also made a $3 million direct placement of registered securities at a discounted price of $0.71 share. Trading range earlier this week was $0.76 - $0.85, the direct placement price was not discounted much. That direct placement, though, was accompanied (or preceded) by a private placement of restricted securities to ZBB officers and board members.

     

    http://tinyurl.com/7ct...

     

    "MILWAUKEE, WI--(Marketwire -02/02/12)- ZBB Energy Corporation (AMEX: ZBB - News), a leading developer of intelligent, renewable energy power platforms, today announced that it has entered into a securities purchase agreement for a registered direct offering with several investors (the "Registered Direct Offering") to sell a total of 4,225,353 shares of common stock, for gross proceeds of $3.0 million before deducting placement agent fees and estimated offering expenses. The shares will be sold for a per share purchase price of $0.71. MDB Capital Group, LLC acted as the placement agent for this offering.

     

    ZBB also entered into a stock purchase agreement with certain members of its board of directors, officers and advisors providing for the sale of a total of 206,250 shares of common stock for a price per share equal to $0.80 which was the closing price of the Company's common stock on January 30, 2012 (the "Private Placement Transaction").

     

    Eric Apfelbach, Chief Executive Officer of ZBB Energy Corporation, commented, "This financing not only strengthens our balance sheet, but also continues to demonstrate our ability to attract fundamental investors and raise money with attractive terms. The participation from Directors and Management is a reflection of the belief in the mission."

     

    The transactions are expected to close on or about February 7, 2012, subject to satisfaction of customary closing conditions.

     

    The shares to be sold in the Registered Direct Offering are being offered by ZBB Energy Corporation pursuant to a registration statement previously filed and declared effective by the Securities and Exchange Commission. The securities may be offered only by means of a prospectus. Copies of the final prospectus supplement and accompanying base prospectus relating to this offering may be obtained at the Securities and Exchange Commission's website at http://www.sec.gov.

     

    The shares to be sold in the Private Placement Transaction are being sold without registration under the Securities Act of 1933, as amended (the "Act"), or state securities laws, in reliance on the exemptions provided by Section 4(2) of the Act and/or Regulation D promulgated thereunder and in reliance on similar exemptions under applicable state laws. Since these shares have not been registered, they may not be offered or sold by the investors absent registration or an applicable exemption from registration requirements, such as the exemption afforded by Rule 144 under the Act. "
    2 Feb 2012, 12:18 PM Reply Like