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Apple reportedly ups 5S output by 75%, cuts 5C output by 35%

  • DisplaySearch's "latest channel checks" indicate Apple (AAPL) has raised iPhone 5S production (through its contract manufacturers) by 75%, and cut 5C production by 35%.
  • The report follows ones from the WSJ and Reuters indicating 5C production is getting cut by 20%-33% at Foxconn and Pegatron, and that Apple has notified a component supplier of a 50% cut in 5C component orders.
  • Plenty of reports (I, II, III) have come out in recent weeks pointing to soft 5C sales and ample supplies, and strong 5S sales and tight supplies. Survey/activation data suggests 5S sell-through is easily more than 2x that for the 5C.
Comments (50)
  • Do we know which phone has a better margin?, I'm guessing the 5C has a better margin. Even if that's the case, upping by 75% is impressive.
    18 Oct 2013, 06:33 PM Reply Like
  • I think it is the 5S.

     

    If so we are going to get one hell of a December quarter.

     

    $800 by next April anyone!!
    18 Oct 2013, 06:34 PM Reply Like
  • Oh, even better then. It's amazing how the sentiment has shifted toward $AAPL. It's no longer doomed, like it was 6 month ago.
    18 Oct 2013, 06:37 PM Reply Like
  • The 5S has the better margin. If buyers are opting for the 5S over the C so much the better.
    18 Oct 2013, 06:38 PM Reply Like
  • The iPhone 5S likely has the higher margins, the difference in component costs is almost certainly much less than the $100 difference in sale price. The display is a big chunk of the cost and it's common between the two.
    18 Oct 2013, 07:49 PM Reply Like
  • Yah doomed at 385 dollars......
    18 Oct 2013, 09:17 PM Reply Like
  • iSuppli says 5s cost $199 and 5c cost $173 to make.

     

    5s is selling $100 more than 5c.

     

    Who has the better margin?
    20 Oct 2013, 02:02 PM Reply Like
  • The 5s according to reports...
    18 Oct 2013, 06:34 PM Reply Like
  • Much of this is the confluence of corporate interest and early-adopters. It is also likely that expanding 5s by that much is constrained by components used in both phones, so that cutting 5c is necessary for the 5s rampup. Later in the release cycle 5c demand will pick up.
    18 Oct 2013, 06:45 PM Reply Like
  • So we are all just guessing here is my two cents worth. The 5c was mostlikely an esasier build, more component parts from the 5. I bet they had an easier time filling the chanels
    There were known problems with production of the 5s plus sales have been off the chard good
    This is a net increase of production of 35%
    Now look forward to christmas, dont think 100 bucks makes a difference. I bet it will to mom and dad who are gonna wrap em up for the kiddies
    Add in new ipads and Q1's gonna be killer
    18 Oct 2013, 07:01 PM Reply Like
  • tlevigne, is the previous production percentage of the 5S vs the 5C known? If so can you please share? (For example, 5S is 60% and 40%? of total production)
    Otherwise, how can you know that the increase in net production was 35%?
    18 Oct 2013, 07:12 PM Reply Like
  • Sorry about my lack of punctuation!!
    18 Oct 2013, 07:02 PM Reply Like
  • More Great news! Sell-off probably coming soon! This is getting more like roller coaster every month. Like they say in roller world, the longer and higher the first rise is, the wilder the ride. This last two years has been really wild ride for me.
    18 Oct 2013, 07:03 PM Reply Like
  • I hope you are talking about the overall markets, AAPL hardly moves ...
    18 Oct 2013, 07:19 PM Reply Like
  • Sell off for who? Google?

     

    APPLE also needs to go up 25%. Google has made most of their latest ad revenue on the back of Apple mobile devices! Android device owners don't buy near as much. Maybe because the top 5% buy Apple devices. Apple needs to start placing thin colorful banner ads at the top of their browser window when any search is done! They need to cash in on searches!
    http://bit.ly/1exKS3c
    18 Oct 2013, 07:20 PM Reply Like
  • This makes sense! Cannot find a 5s anywhere in my area - sold out at best buy, AT&T stores, and both local AAPL stores.
    18 Oct 2013, 08:47 PM Reply Like
  • Funny as usual... all of the reports talked about cutting 5c production, but none of them mentioned increasing 5s production. Sure the talk was about low supplies, but i sure hadn't seen a report that net production needed to be increased.
    18 Oct 2013, 08:51 PM Reply Like
  • If..... These News where from Google or Samsung..... WS, would have take the headline of 75%!!!!!.... For SURE!... But being AAPL.... Only BAD things Make the HEADLINES!!!... I'm tired for all of their BS!!!!.....
    18 Oct 2013, 10:38 PM Reply Like
  • Apple's strategy on pricing 5c proves that they're just as brilliant at marketing as they are at innovative product development. Long AAPL, and getting longer month by month.
    18 Oct 2013, 08:58 PM Reply Like
  • Chink in AAPL's armor here is that they thought 5c was a good idea.

     

    Jobs never would've done 5c.
    18 Oct 2013, 09:46 PM Reply Like
  • the brilliance of 5c was to allow for choice. No more bemoaning the lack of a less pricy choice with fewer bells and whistles. And you can't say 5c wasn't profitable. A 5c release alone would have solidified the complaint of "lost MoJo". 5s alone would have garnered criticism of a tone deaf leadership. In both cases critics would have been on to something and we wouldn't be thinking anything close to doubles. As it is, 5s & 5c is just the warm up. And what's more, I am great-full for all the b'n and moanin that took shares down to solid entry levels for me as a recent entrant to AAPL ownership.
    19 Oct 2013, 09:52 AM Reply Like
  • For information, it was time to upgrade my wife's iPhone , went T store and there were no 5s' . So the only choice was the 5c. She was ok with that being she doesn't really need the bells and whistles. I am sure there are more like her. The 5 c fills a void.
    21 Oct 2013, 11:41 PM Reply Like
  • Technically I think Apple could go up over $800 within a year. I just wish that Carl Icahn guy wasn't involved and proposing weird stuff.
    He says AAPL is under valued relative to the SP 500. So why doesn't
    he just buy AAPL, short the SP 500, and shut up.
    18 Oct 2013, 10:40 PM Reply Like
  • The good thing about AAPL's gigantic market cap: Icahn can scream all he wants, he can't bully AAPL even if he buys a few billion more...this target is too big for activist Investors like Icahn.
    19 Oct 2013, 12:03 AM Reply Like
  • Because he can draw lots of attention to the fact that AAPL is undervalued and his stature is giving courage to weaker hands thereby driving share price up making us all more money. Money money money, oh yeah, go Carl.
    19 Oct 2013, 09:51 AM Reply Like
  • He did buy Aapl. he also bought netflix. If he shorts the s&p you should pay attention. Technically you should shut up and follow Icahn. He is richer than you for good reason.
    19 Oct 2013, 10:19 PM Reply Like
  • No one it seems has ever mentioned the phone resale industry that has taken off over the last several years. When people like me are able to sell an iphone 4s for $200 and get a 5s through my carrier and offset the remaing cost, it makes upgrading a no brainer and accelerates Apple 5s sales.
    19 Oct 2013, 08:25 AM Reply Like
  • According to Cramer 5 s margins much better than 5 c
    Aliboy113
    19 Oct 2013, 09:24 AM Reply Like
  • If 5s sales are off the charts, and are 2x the sales of the 5c, then 5c sales are very good. A week ago, several carriers said the top 2 sellers were 5s and 5c, followed by Samsung and the rest. All in all, the 5c is doing quite well, unless the blowout 5s sales comparison is used to suggest otherwise.
    19 Oct 2013, 10:30 AM Reply Like
  • We were told, or it was inferred that manufacturing volumes for 5S were larger than 5C to begin with.

     

    So . . . a 75% increase of a larger number is a much larger number, a 35% decrease of a smaller number is . . . well you get the point - almost meaningless, noise, etc

     

    Yes margin % will be adversely affected since C's high price, and lower manufacturing costs drove a healthy marg%, but what the heck. High volume generates higher PE and share value
    19 Oct 2013, 10:39 AM Reply Like
  • Gary,

     

    5 s has the higher margin according to apple info.
    19 Oct 2013, 11:27 AM Reply Like
  • Aapl has the highest profit margins in the business....so there. .....Even higher than amazon...lol
    19 Oct 2013, 01:01 PM Reply Like
  • I think initial production probably favored iPhone 5C which was targeted at higher volume markets. Reports were that the 5C was initially running at 300,000 units daily or about 24 million units per quarter based on a 6 day work week. My guess in the 5S was running initially at more like 240,000 daily or about 20 million units per quarter. With 5C cut by half and 5S up 75%, current production rate is on the order of 12 million 5C's and 35 million 5S's or about 47 million phones quarterly. Add some 4s devices and the quarterly run rate might be 45 to 50 million plus or minus given there were reportedly some component supply issues. I would expect Christmas sales to deplete inventory a bit so you could reasonably see unit sales in the mid 50's over the December quarter and with a richer mix in terms of margin than if the 5C had been a bigger seller.
    19 Oct 2013, 05:41 PM Reply Like
  • My friend who I bought the Nexus 4 on behalf of was having difficulties with it. It ended after a while she found the after-sales service center, she said they erased the OS and reformatted the HD.

     

    I have nightmares of that happening in Beijing with my Vista catastrophes. Apple's excellence in after-sales support are par excellence!
    20 Oct 2013, 04:46 AM Reply Like
  • Michael, the 5S is up 75 percent. Almost double the initial rate, in one month! This is after initial fingerprint sensor problems with the 5S.

     

    The 5C is down 20 to 33 percent at Foxconn and Pegatron assembly factories. You really got that number wrong! It is the iPhone assembly rate that matters, not some resistor manufacturer or a minor part supplier!!!! Foxconn and Pegatron are making room for more 5S phones.

     

    Apple makes a $100 extra on each 5S over each 5C. While the 5C is just a slight upgrade to last year's iPhone 5, it is not the focus for current iPhone marketing.

     

    The investment news is Apple continues to excel while WP8 is a free add-on to some Android phones.
    20 Oct 2013, 11:11 AM Reply Like
  • htp://http://bit.ly/H8KflD
    "The CN carriers were looking to get more subscribers through that whole week," said Teng of Golden Week. "But because Apple wanted to sell the iPhone 5C at the same profit margin and because the carriers didn't want all the eggs in the same basket, they weren't willing to give even more subsidies to Apple's devices."
    20 Oct 2013, 11:35 AM Reply Like
  • A lot of battery problems with s3 and s4 reported, battery swelling so much popping rear cover off....
    20 Oct 2013, 01:54 PM Reply Like
  • great news for AAPL longs..we could rise $100 on earnings day
    19 Oct 2013, 07:31 PM Reply Like
  • i dont about you all, but i live in the bay area. east bay to be exact. And im seeing alot of iphone 5c my friends are getting super deals by trading in their old 4s and 4(S). and getting a 5c free. i ride bart and are seeing all the hipsters, students, tweens and kids with 5c its amazing. i knew the C in standed for colors, and i always thought C for Children too. now a days everyone in the family has a iphone. im long apple and of im still waiting for my gold 5s. btw i have unlimited data package through verizon, if i update to the 5s i loose my unlimited so well see
    19 Oct 2013, 09:56 PM Reply Like
  • thats another big reason Verizon CEO said there should have been way more iphone activations but people who have the unllimited data who bought iphone 4s 2 years ago WILL LOOSE their unlimited if they update so im sure alot of people dont want to loose that!
    19 Oct 2013, 09:58 PM Reply Like
  • Rick, you need to figure out the difference between lose (opposite of gain) and loose (opposite of tight).
    19 Oct 2013, 10:20 PM Reply Like
  • So just buy one outright and keep the unlimited data plan.
    20 Oct 2013, 03:22 AM Reply Like
  • Apple's iPhone 5s and 5c to land on U.S. Cellular on Nov. 8
    America's fifth-largest carrier, U.S. Cellular, announced on Friday that it will start carrying the latest iPhone 5s and 5c on Nov. 8, marking the first time Apple's popular handset will be available on the telecom's network.
    20 Oct 2013, 01:41 AM Reply Like
  • US Patent and Trade Office just killed Android by re-affirming the famous "Steve Jobs" multi-touch patent that basically governs ALL the touch controls on a touchscreen developed by FingerWorks that Apple bought before the iPhone came out in 2007. Steve Jobs is smiling in Heaven.

     

    See "Apple Patent on Touch Typing, Multitouch Upheld; Allows Ban on Most Androids" - http://bit.ly/18y4fYA

     

    Also, see "U.S. patent office confirmed all 20 claims of the Steve Jobs patent: bad for Samsung, Google" - http://bit.ly/18y4eDS
    20 Oct 2013, 03:15 AM Reply Like
  • Actually, Google is bleeding money on Android and makes bundle on iOS.

     

    Samsung, however, is DEPENDENT on Android; its Tizen is already DOA.
    20 Oct 2013, 02:05 PM Reply Like
  • dividend_growth:

     

    Can you site your source.

     

    As I have heard that Google charges for other services such as G-play for the OEM to stay in the Android-update ecosystem.

     

    Sam
    20 Oct 2013, 10:56 PM Reply Like
  • who knew everyone wanted a fool's gold color phone.

     

    genius.

     

    Other phone makers are scrambling with their "me too" phones, with gold colors and fingerprint readers.
    20 Oct 2013, 03:17 AM Reply Like
  • In Apple's January quarterly earnings conference call, Cook warned analysts, "the supply chain is very complex, and we obviously have multiple sources for things. Even if a particular data point were factual, it would be impossible to interpret that data point as to what it meant for our business.""Even if a particular data point were factual, it would be impossible to interpret that data point as to what it meant for our business." - Tim Cook

     

    Cook continued to recommend that analysts not base their predictions on supply chain "checks" throughout 2013. However, a series of analysts have continued to issue "supply chain check" reports that fueled headlines despite being, more often that not, completely wrong.

     

    One year ago, Citi analysts Glen Yeung, Walter Pritchard and Jim Suva issued a pessimistic report on iPhone 5 demand based on "near-term supply chain orders."

     

    Not only was that information subsequently found to have inappropriately leaked to hedge fund SAC Capital, allowing that firm advanced opportunity to profit from the stock selloff Citi's predictions triggered, but the information itself was not correct. Apple's iPhone 5 was the world's top selling smartphone and continued to enjoy rapid sales even as investors began dumping Apple's stock on the "news" that its phone wasn't selling.

     

    Such "supply chain orders" weren't just scandalously used to fuel insider trading (Citi was subsequently slapped with a $30 million fine for this), but they were false information that had a very material, negative impact on Apple's business.

     

    That false information was subsequently picked up by journalists and spread around throughout 2013, creating the impression that Apple was faltering and poised to lose its leadership position to Samsung, a preposterous charade some journalists still continue to repeat, despite a preponderance of evidence against such a conclusion.
    20 Oct 2013, 11:05 AM Reply Like
  • Could it be that the 5c was deliberately priced high to steer people to the 5s? For a hundred bucks, who wouldn't go for top of the line?
    20 Oct 2013, 11:24 AM Reply Like
  • Tyzo, I don't think that was the case. The 5C was meant to replace the iPhone 5 in the sales lineup. When you go into an Apple store, you cannot buy the iPhone 5 anymore, only the 5S, 5C, or 4S. It is difficult to replace the 5 and not price it at the same price point = exactly in between the 4S and the 5S. I think Apple priced the 5C where they are almost invariant between the 5C and 5S such that both generate a similar, while not exact, but relatively close profit margin. So, you can't sell it lower that the older iPhone 5 to invade the 4S pricing territory, and you can't price too high to invade the 5S.
    20 Oct 2013, 04:24 PM Reply Like
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