Seeking Alpha

Loeb buys into BlackBerry, shares +2% AH

  • In its Q4 13F, Dan Loeb's Third Point LLC discloses it had a 10M-share BlackBerry (BBRY) position at the end of 2013. The position has a current value of $92M, and is good for nearly a 2% stake in the company.
  • Loeb's disclosure comes with BlackBerry shares having rallied sharply from their autumn lows due to investor optimism regarding new CEO John Chen's turnaround efforts.
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Comments (52)
  • LYogi
    , contributor
    Comments (2646) | Send Message
     
    Hmmmm

     

    First John Chen makes a nice personal purchase

     

    Then Fairfax makes a massive purchase on the open market

     

    and then Fairfax does it again.

     

    and now Loeb buys in for 2%.

     

    If you think this company is going bankrupt oh boy are you in for some serious serious

     

    PAIN.

     

    Long and Strong.

     

    Yogi
    14 Feb 2014, 04:46 PM Reply Like
  • jzheng220wz
    , contributor
    Comments (132) | Send Message
     
    LYogi,
    where can I find the purchase price and size for John Chen and Fairfax?
    Thanks for the info.
    14 Feb 2014, 04:57 PM Reply Like
  • LYogi
    , contributor
    Comments (2646) | Send Message
     
    search under Blackberry here: http://bit.ly/1kI0TsU
    14 Feb 2014, 04:58 PM Reply Like
  • Michael Blair
    , contributor
    Comments (4972) | Send Message
     
    @jzheng220wz - http://www.sedi.ca
    14 Feb 2014, 04:59 PM Reply Like
  • jzheng220wz
    , contributor
    Comments (132) | Send Message
     
    thanks a lot
    14 Feb 2014, 08:33 PM Reply Like
  • jzheng220wz
    , contributor
    Comments (132) | Send Message
     
    thanks for the info
    14 Feb 2014, 08:33 PM Reply Like
  • William Ford
    , contributor
    Comments (90) | Send Message
     
    I bought a bundle in the low $6, so what if Loeb did as well.
    That's how you make money.
    and I'm sure Loeb had several conversations with Fairfax and its leader!
    all they have to do, after they established the $10 conversion was to wait for the fools
    to rush in and push it to $10 and that didn't take too long.
    At this price, are they still willing to buy more?
    I'm not!
    15 Feb 2014, 08:18 AM Reply Like
  • GRojasHruska
    , contributor
    Comments (98) | Send Message
     
    I believe that the appropriate term to describe this investment is "gangsta", considered risky by many even if potentially extremely profitable.
    14 Feb 2014, 04:53 PM Reply Like
  • mikebator
    , contributor
    Comments (1840) | Send Message
     
    Interesting turn of event. Welcome aboard Loeb.
    14 Feb 2014, 04:55 PM Reply Like
  • gwynfryn
    , contributor
    Comments (5246) | Send Message
     
    When's he going to call for higher dividends?
    15 Feb 2014, 09:41 AM Reply Like
  • jbzet
    , contributor
    Comments (14) | Send Message
     
    Agreed @ yogi. I've been long since October 2012 and trading in between but have never left this baby. I love their products and the is us only getting better! Long live the $BBRY king!
    14 Feb 2014, 05:00 PM Reply Like
  • hofjac
    , contributor
    Comments (308) | Send Message
     
    Ahh. Just some large fish moving about. Investors come and go.

     

    There is too much positive going on at BBRY not to stick around.

     

    What with BB10 finally grabbing hold, Cross platform BBM becoming the social media app to contend with (More uptake in BBM voice once the public at large becomes aware of it), Access to Android Apps, Foxconn agreement, Enterprise finally back on the uptake, PW who knows the books keeps digging in deeper, new Foxconn devices to be showcased in a week or so, upcoming announcement of real estate sales, exceptionally strong cash position, cash burn largely eliminated (foxconn), a ton of talent from SAP recently on board, and last but certainly not least...CHEN.

     

    In short, this is not a time to run...patience young grasshoppa
    14 Feb 2014, 05:01 PM Reply Like
  • ihadnihn
    , contributor
    Comments (54) | Send Message
     
    Is BB10 taking hold more outside of the US? Because it seems to be the opposite everywhere I read and see, do you have some data to back that belief up? Certainly isn't reflected in their earnings like you'd expect. Android apps on Blackberry is a painful experience, the specialized ones (the ones you generally really want to use) don't work and the ones that do run behave more clunky than they would on native android on average. You could just get an Android phone for half the price and better performance these days (which I have done myself). BBM is about the only thing left people have value in and it's a legacy from a better time for them (makes me think of AIM from AOL back in the day). What is going to change their trajectory long term? They only thing that appears to be stable for them is business and loyal customers, everything else seems to be in constant decline, nothing is growing longterm as far as I can tell. Their management has been a constant disappointment to me over the last several years on the developer end of things, they have no plan as far as an app eco-system goes and they go back on plans they say will happen. I highly doubt developers are coming back to BBRY, I know I'm not...there is a reason their app selection is horrid.

     

    The current price for BBRY is tempting, the simple belief that they are making a comeback would be enough for a potential bounce, for a few months anyways. Long term though, I just don't see what they're doing right to curb the tide in the last ~5 years.
    15 Feb 2014, 05:36 AM Reply Like
  • Kurt Windibank
    , contributor
    Comments (1308) | Send Message
     
    Bets are being placed on them transforming into a software /security/MDm play.
    15 Feb 2014, 11:25 AM Reply Like
  • Kurt Windibank
    , contributor
    Comments (1308) | Send Message
     
    Isn't he Watsa's arch enemy?
    14 Feb 2014, 05:08 PM Reply Like
  • LYogi
    , contributor
    Comments (2646) | Send Message
     
    The power of Green can unite even the bitterest of enemies :)
    14 Feb 2014, 06:01 PM Reply Like
  • Flog
    , contributor
    Comments (208) | Send Message
     
    There will be some "Shorts" sweating this weekend, and it will not because of Valentines! LOL
    14 Feb 2014, 05:15 PM Reply Like
  • Thurai sivakumaran
    , contributor
    Comments (28) | Send Message
     
    Yogi, Blair are few that I see, with foresight and smartness, few above seem to be like the Rabbit off the bush startling and wondering looking at the Headlights.

     

    So long BB and wish them the best in future.
    14 Feb 2014, 05:17 PM Reply Like
  • The_C_Man
    , contributor
    Comments (2500) | Send Message
     
    I wonder how many stockists are wondering if they made a mistake in not pushing the Z10.

     

    There are not many products get the iF award. http://bit.ly/1ezNXgu
    14 Feb 2014, 05:39 PM Reply Like
  • ELLAS
    , contributor
    Comments (2602) | Send Message
     
    The Z10 is a fabulous device, that has already out classed both the best iPhone and best Android. In the case of the Z10, and especially the Z30, spec's don't matter. Give them a few high end phones to try out, such as a placebo effect and they will tend to lean toward the Z10 and Z30, once again, for obvious reason.
    15 Feb 2014, 02:18 AM Reply Like
  • convoluted
    , contributor
    Comments (2290) | Send Message
     
    Long via short puts, but watching flow indicates that's old news. Any spike acknowledging what has already happened will be short-lived. A real spike is predicated on totally unexpected, real-time activity.
    Thus, if you own the stock, you can sell calls. A spec play would be bear call spreads. Neither strategy is suggestive of longer-term activity. The idea, though, is to take advantage of event driven moves that come and go. Just like the days of our lives.
    14 Feb 2014, 06:59 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    @The_C_MAN wow that's no small feat, they also won the red dot award in 2013. We all new the Z10 as well the Z30 are the best smartphones bar none, of course some of the commentators on here will never admit to it, they would rather play with their plastic phone. ;)
    14 Feb 2014, 07:15 PM Reply Like
  • ELLAS
    , contributor
    Comments (2602) | Send Message
     
    jjtom,
    Great point.
    People don't realize BBRY phones are very well designed. Try dropping a BB10 device, and it will fall in a way to cause it minimal damage, where as iPhone's are famous for its screen to crack/break, for example.
    15 Feb 2014, 02:21 AM Reply Like
  • Cliff Hilton
    , contributor
    Comments (2310) | Send Message
     
    The Z10 won "Best in Class". For you owners of BB10 products, you have "Class". An eye for detail.
    14 Feb 2014, 10:03 PM Reply Like
  • SA User 74XXXXX
    , contributor
    Comments (772) | Send Message
     
    Citron betrayed the shorts on the one hand, Loeb's hedge fund draws smart-money following longs on the other hand. Conclusion: $BBRY attacks the shorts, not vice versa.

     

    IMHO
    15 Feb 2014, 04:40 AM Reply Like
  • filipe115
    , contributor
    Comments (3) | Send Message
     
    http://bit.ly/1f4ZQkD

     

    Loeb may have had a shady and controversial history against BlackBerry. Cannot be trusted??
    16 Feb 2014, 10:01 PM Reply Like
  • 2374451
    , contributor
    Comments (163) | Send Message
     
    Dan did the same thing with Nokia. I think he takes advantage of situations where he sees that large short positions are going to be covering which usually drives up the stock price significantly. Not clear, however, how long term his investment intentions are.
    15 Feb 2014, 11:55 AM Reply Like
  • DonAmp
    , contributor
    Comments (164) | Send Message
     
    A) [The Defense Department Did Not Order 80,000 BlackBerry]
    B) "Dan Loeb's Third Point LLC discloses it had a 10M-share BlackBerry (BBRY) position at the end of 2013. The position has a current value of $92M, and is good for nearly a 2% stake in the company."

     

    I like (B) A Lot Better.
    I am long BBRY.
    15 Feb 2014, 05:56 PM Reply Like
  • Randal James
    , contributor
    Comments (3999) | Send Message
     
    John Chen (behind curtain) fields questions from analysts at a recent tech conference.

     

    http://bit.ly/1bzPxV5

     

    :)
    15 Feb 2014, 07:49 PM Reply Like
  • Cliff Hilton
    , contributor
    Comments (2310) | Send Message
     
    @Randal James,

     

    It's hard to find a qualified analyst nowadays, it appears. John Chen will show up when they do. Check out the next Forbes edition in a few weeks. You won't have to look for him, he'll be there.
    15 Feb 2014, 11:30 PM Reply Like
  • Randal James
    , contributor
    Comments (3999) | Send Message
     
    Cliff

     

    You know I was mos'ly funnin' with that. Still, I'm reminded of the football coaches at one of my favorite schools, the U. of Wyoming. They've had some great ones over the years but most of the really good ones became great at other colleges, like Devaney at Nebraska or Fred Akers at Texas. Several years ago following a significantly sucky season they jettisoned a coach and hired a great guy out of division II. He was a great recruiter and had an infectious enthusiasm.

     

    One could almost sense great things were about to happen. But with football, the game is played for about 4 months and then you rebuild and try again. In that way it is sort of like business except for the long off time between reality. I don't think I've seen a more gifted cheerleading coach, but it wasn't enough. A few key wins here and there, but nothing to speak of. Wyoming is a small university high in the Laramie plains and most good college recruits would much rather be in Miami or Tempe. No one mistakes the town for a theme park.

     

    And I suppose Coach is retired now as they let him off the hook after several years of ho-hum seasons. They are planning for another head coach this for this coming year following yet another coach who was not great either.

     

    Back in the 1950's and '60's, Wyoming was sometimes a contender. It was when budgets for sports were much smaller and students happy to play for the sake of the game rather than a career and draft eligibility. Those times are gone and it would take a miracle or outright bribes to replicate the best teams of the old days.

     

    BlackBerry has some 'seasons' coming up that will show how well Coach Chen is doing. No one expects victories on every front, but the tangible good news needs to show up. Cheerleading is nice but the score is what counts.
    16 Feb 2014, 02:12 AM Reply Like
  • mikebator
    , contributor
    Comments (1840) | Send Message
     
    @Randal,

     

    Love analogies like this. Go Chen Go!
    16 Feb 2014, 10:35 AM Reply Like
  • Cliff Hilton
    , contributor
    Comments (2310) | Send Message
     
    @Randal James,

     

    I knew you were fun'n. I wish I could find that mess and post before you and Mr. Knowitall.

     

    I'm in business myself. I see BlackBerry as a start-up, very risky and speculative. But there exists that same spirit in BlackBerry and anything is possible and all things seem to be on the table. But they have such a powerful name. Folks love them and hate them more.

     

    They alone hold the keys to their success. BlackBerry is being held to such a high standard that is almost impossible to achieve. This is my greatest concern.

     

    I'm still long the stock. I have not sold one share. I am staying with them. What a thrill-ride.
    16 Feb 2014, 11:24 AM Reply Like
  • jeepman58
    , contributor
    Comments (221) | Send Message
     
    Randall, great story. Kansas City Chiefs have been perennial also-rans for years. They bought in Andy Reid and he molded the same players into a cohesive team that put together a terrific season.

     

    Seattle Seahawks had been so-so over the years, Pete Carroll arrived and they drafted some young talent (Russell Wilson was "too short to play in the NFL" but he's been a winner everywhere he played with great charisma and leadership abilities). They did nothing but win a Super Bowl in 2014.

     

    Those who focus on what has been, are has-beens. Those who point to past mistakes by past management at BBRY are looking the wrong way. John Chen, who has turned around a mid-cap company before, arrived, created his new team of upper managers, instilled a new attitude, and has started the process.

     

    It will not be a smooth ride, and it will take 4 - 6 quarters as Coach Chen has stated. But Chen has a game plan he is implementing in a methodical, step-by-step approach on many fronts.

     

    I gladly invest in new, energized, experienced management teams with $3 billion in cash and plenty of strengths to work with and build upon.
    4 Mar 2014, 09:08 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    @ELLAS .. the reason the Iphone usually does a face plant when its dropped is because of the centre of gravity of the Iphone. where as BB phones the center of gravity is at the bottom of the phone. Anyway i don't think Apple is too concerned, since they sell millions of Iphones and Isheep will simply go and buy a new Iphone if they break the Screen.
    15 Feb 2014, 07:59 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    @ ihadnihn I'm not sure what your talking about when you say Android apps run clunky on BB10.2. I have down loaded so many Android apps using snap on the latest version of BB10.2. Actually Android apps run in a secure container and most actually run faster and smoother than on an Android phone (seriously). Using snap all you do is download a APK file and that's all. What is so hard about that? Yes the Android apps run very well on BB10 smartphones. About maybe 90% of android apps are available and can be installed. Also they are more secure on BB10 than an android phone (go figure). All or almost all the must have apps are downloadable and work very well. Why don't you go to Crackberry.ca and see for your self. BTW you say you will never develop apps for BB10 i think your missing out an a great opportunity if you ask me. It seems like it quite a while since you checked out what is available for developers of BB10 apps. I have read some great reviews about developer tools on Crackberry.ca, So my advice is go find out for your self and stop making comments about stuff your out of date on!
    15 Feb 2014, 08:26 PM Reply Like
  • 10553331
    , contributor
    Comments (113) | Send Message
     
    Actually, the security issue with an Android app is not that it will corrupt the OS. That's a high level security issue and Android apps can't touch the OS at all.

     

    The risk is a consumer level risk. Android apps from most stores (including Google) are not vetted. Whether on Android or BB, you cannot check off permissions on these apps. When BBM went android, there were no less than 50 counterfeit apps purporting to be BBM. All of them, when loaded, had access to your files and contacts and could use virtually your entire phone. Native BB apps allow you to refuse certain permissions, if you like and the app will either run or tell you why it won't.

     

    I run Android apps on my Z10. They are universally slow to load, which may be corrected with the new OS (2141)- we will see. It is true that 90% do run well after loading, though to say better than Android is a stretch. Love your phone as you may, it isn't ready for mainstream until you can download an app from an app store with minimal effort (Snap is great, but my mom doesn't surf Crackberry) and they all work and interact with a login, like Google Play.
    BB's future is in Enterprise and lower end phones, for now. Traction in consumer markets will follow , but only if they succeed there first. Time will tell.
    17 Feb 2014, 12:33 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    @ Marcap So what's your take on Blackberry Z10 winning the iF award for 2104, for design excellence? They also won the red dot award last year for the Z10. Do you think it was fluke, or maybe the judges got paid off?
    15 Feb 2014, 08:51 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    I think it's quite obvious what's happening here with the recent purchase by Loeb. He thinks the short sellers are going to have to cover soon, and when that exodus occurs it will cause the share price to rise dramatically, in which case he sells for a tidy profit. Basically this is bad news for the shorts anyway you want to put it. I kept warning shorts on this forum to cover before they lose their shorts LOL. maybe it's too late to heed that warning who knows, time will tell. BTW it's also good news for other shareholders (other than shorts) if the stock price goes up am i correct!
    15 Feb 2014, 09:18 PM Reply Like
  • anstin
    , contributor
    Comments (92) | Send Message
     
    whats wrong with u guys...r u seriously analyzing the financial data/reports or just like writing on the fly? Hold on until March 28th..
    16 Feb 2014, 01:17 AM Reply Like
  • Tales From The Future
    , contributor
    Comments (6267) | Send Message
     
    I don't know why many of the comments go on about BB phones and BB10. If anything, handsets for consumers were dragging down BBRY in 2013, carriers are abandoning or scaling back their offers lately. Just one example:

     

    http://bit.ly/1fqp73H

     

    If BBRY has a future, it is outside of handsets/end-user hardware in my opinion, the critical mass of distribution and developers is getting too small.
    16 Feb 2014, 04:45 AM Reply Like
  • DonAmp
    , contributor
    Comments (164) | Send Message
     
    To follow the BBRY price on 18 Feb 2014.
    Game changer is just beginning.
    The GOOD or The BAD will be shown...
    I'm long BBRY - just for now.
    16 Feb 2014, 09:07 AM Reply Like
  • User 16302232
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    I live BB even in today's world. I have a bold now for 4 years and it runs super as new. Their products are far superior then the Samsung and iPhone. They just need to get their confidence back and oh boy it will be too late to buy these shares. I predict a 20 usd in the 1 year from now. To be fair I am an investor in BB shares and have an interest.
    16 Feb 2014, 11:59 AM Reply Like
  • stockplaza
    , contributor
    Comments (797) | Send Message
     
    BBRY is a dead man walking like DNDN
    Its days are over. Intermittent spikes are common for stocks like DNDN or BBRY followed by buyout rumors, management changes or some news here and there. But the ultimate death of these companies are as certain as any one can see.

     

    If Loeb is still involved, maybe he got desperate for "returns" and took a gamble. Many funds Soros and others are getting involved in many dead man walking type stocks like JCP DNDN WLT etc. in the hope (big hope) of a turnaround and massive pay off .. More likely these investments will end badly.

     

    Look at DNDN chart .. People have been saying great things ever since it was at 40s .. Even when it was $8, people were duped into buying. Now it is $3 or less and still a STRONG SELL until it files bankruptcy .. One look at bonds of DNDN should be clear to anyone that DNDN is expected to file bankruptcy with bond payers getting 50 cents on the dollar and shareholders getting ZILCH!

     

    BBRY will end the same way as DNDN
    16 Feb 2014, 06:58 PM Reply Like
  • jeepman58
    , contributor
    Comments (221) | Send Message
     
    2003 Apple was roughly $6 a share with $5 billion cash and given up for dead as a has-been. Apple's days were said to be behind it. Little value was given to a special strength in the form of Steven Jobs and his management team. After all, management is not a balance sheet or income statement line item.

     

    I think BBRY is more likely to follow the Apple rebound than the dead cat bounce. Perhaps not as substantial as Apple, but I believe they have everything needed to have a robust rebound into a profitable niche company. I am long BBRY.
    4 Mar 2014, 09:39 PM Reply Like
  • idkmybffjill
    , contributor
    Comments (1758) | Send Message
     
    Not sure why people are giving this any significance. Loeb's holding is worth $92M; his fund has net assets of over $14 BILLION.

     

    Let's do the math on that. $92,000,000 / $14,000,000,000 = 0.65% of his portfolio.

     

    BBRY could go to 0, and it wouldn't even dent Third Point's portfolio.

     

    Move on people.
    16 Feb 2014, 07:07 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    What is it that short sellers don't get? The fact that Dan Loeb bought 2% shares of Blackberry is bad news for short sellers and good news for long term investors., its that simple. Short sellers listened to Marcap and got burned. So now is the time to cover and move on!
    16 Feb 2014, 07:18 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    IDKMYBFFJILL What your saying doesn't make sense. 92, 000,000,000 Is not exactly chump change. Why would this Loeb fellow risk that kind of money on a lark Get real man.You short sellers are really sweating it now. But your comments are falling on deaf ears.
    16 Feb 2014, 07:25 PM Reply Like
  • idkmybffjill
    , contributor
    Comments (1758) | Send Message
     
    Did you actually read my whole post? Do you see what %age of his portfolio that is? Let's pretend you have a $100,000 portfolio. That's $650 worth of BBRY in your portfolio. Hardly a mover by any means.

     

    Importance is based on the size of the position RELATIVE to your portfolio, not it's absolute position. If Loeb's BBRY position was worth 5% of his portfolio, then let's talk. BBRY has such a small market cap now that there are many hedge funds in the world today who could swallow the company whole and still have billions in leftover cash in their coffers to play with.

     

    Disclosure: I'm neither long nor short the stock and wouldn't touch it either way with a 10 foot pole.
    16 Feb 2014, 08:47 PM Reply Like
  • psychological-dividends
    , contributor
    Comments (819) | Send Message
     
    Short term thinking. We must pursue that.
    17 Feb 2014, 05:57 AM Reply Like
  • 10553331
    , contributor
    Comments (113) | Send Message
     
    Since the data is 45 days old, no one except Loeb knows his current position. If he still has it in the next filing, then you can better judge if it is a statement on the future of the company or a short term bet from $6-9.
    17 Feb 2014, 01:10 PM Reply Like
  • jjtom
    , contributor
    Comments (443) | Send Message
     
    idkmybffjill okay so you don't own the stock you don't want to own the stock and you don't have any intention of ever owning the stock, so why are commenting in this forum, don't you have anything better to do?
    17 Feb 2014, 07:31 PM Reply Like
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