Herbalife plunges on DOJ/FBI probe report


The FT reports the DOJ and FBI have joined the list of government agencies probing Herbalife (HLF -13.8%). Shares have nosedived in response.

Herbalife says it has "no knowledge" of any DOJ or FBI investigation, and hasn't received any requests for information from the agencies.

Herbalife received an FTC inquiry notice last month, and a U.S. senator sent letters to the FTC and SEC in January requesting investigations.

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Comments (60)
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    Let the fun begin!

     

    JJM
    11 Apr 2014, 03:56 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    How would the financial times,an English news rag get this info before anyone in the U S ?
    This smells bad.....ackleman?Raven? Matt?
    11 Apr 2014, 03:58 PM Reply Like
  • salvatort
    , contributor
    Comments (417) | Send Message
     
    Perhaps because they are a major financial publication and have a US version?
    11 Apr 2014, 04:02 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Doesn't smell right Salvatore
    The timing of the announcement etc
    Some inside info going on or not going on
    I think there should be an investigation
    And by the way,you should be investigated too Salvatore since you seem to know so much about it.empty your pockets!
    11 Apr 2014, 04:09 PM Reply Like
  • M dub
    , contributor
    Comments (81) | Send Message
     
    you don't want to know. they do what they have to do, lets just keep it at that. I wouldn't mind an NSA module on trade station or thinkorswim.
    11 Apr 2014, 04:14 PM Reply Like
  • salvatort
    , contributor
    Comments (417) | Send Message
     
    By saying I know too much you mean that the Financial Times has a US version? That is just a fact known to anyone who's not clueless about finance.. And unfortunately many people on this website are (hint..).

     

    What's wrong with the timing of the announcement? Do you think Ackman needed to raise so much for his weekend clubbing?
    11 Apr 2014, 04:18 PM Reply Like
  • Jason Johnson
    , contributor
    Comments (22) | Send Message
     
    A lot of money was made and lost today on April weekly options. Seems suspicious that article was released late friday.
    11 Apr 2014, 04:42 PM Reply Like
  • herbs4mike
    , contributor
    Comments (2064) | Send Message
     
    Yes, Ackman certainly had this timed..... And yes it's do that this information will not be gone over for 3 days. I hope the SEC is really on this.
    12 Apr 2014, 03:54 AM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    It has smelled bad for years. That's the point.

     

    JJM
    11 Apr 2014, 04:02 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    When has the financial times ever had a scoop?
    Someone fed them some self serving info
    That's my thought
    Now I'm going to buy
    11 Apr 2014, 04:12 PM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    Take a gander at the weekly chart on HLF. There exists the tastiest head & shoulders top I've ever seen.

     

    JJM
    11 Apr 2014, 04:15 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Charts are for suckers
    13 Apr 2014, 12:29 PM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    See ya' at $40!

     

    JJM
    13 Apr 2014, 12:33 PM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    You must be talking about a different stock than HLF.
    16 Apr 2014, 08:37 PM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    $40 before $60. And we're 4 1/2 points away from $60.

     

    Six pack. Deal?

     

    JJM
    17 Apr 2014, 01:49 PM Reply Like
  • RJM2
    , contributor
    Comments (1087) | Send Message
     
    Its a WHOLE new ballgame with 20/20 AND a criminal investigation.

     

    Watch out for $20 or less.
    11 Apr 2014, 04:33 PM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    RJM2,

     

    Yes, it is a whole new ballgame, almost except were wrong as usual.
    20 Jul 2014, 01:32 PM Reply Like
  • iCon23
    , contributor
    Comments (68) | Send Message
     
    Finally... These schemes get by on the tiniest technicalities within the law. They're severely detrimental to society, produce no value, and harm everyone in the scheme except for those at the very top.

     

    They may be 'technically legal' but they're certainly evil. If you're selling the business model and not the product, it's time to take a hike.

     

    Now from an investor's standpoint - Will the government actually take action? Who knows.
    11 Apr 2014, 04:36 PM Reply Like
  • herbs4mike
    , contributor
    Comments (2064) | Send Message
     
    Sure ICon.... evil..... Herbalife has 8 million unique customers every 3 months and it's evil. Maybe you ought to try the product first before giving us your opinion of whether something is good or bad
    12 Apr 2014, 03:53 AM Reply Like
  • iCon23
    , contributor
    Comments (68) | Send Message
     
    My comments have NOTHING to do with the Herbalife product, just the business model as a whole. I could care less about 'what' is being sold - It's 'how' the product is being sold that matters.

     

    Your statement of 8M new customers every 3 months is damning in itself with regards to the 'pyramid like' structure of the company.

     

    That said, I don't have to like something to make money off it...It's called investing.
    12 Apr 2014, 05:19 AM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    Herbalife issued the following statement a few minutes ago.....

     

    Issues Statement

     

    .

     

    Business Wire
    Herbalife Ltd.
    3 minutes ago

     

    .

     

    .

     

    ..
    .
    .

     

    LOS ANGELES--(BUSINESS WIRE)--

     

    Herbalife (HLF) today issued the following statement in response to media reports and rumors in the marketplace:

     

    We have no knowledge of any ongoing investigation by the DOJ or the FBI, and we have not received any formal nor informal request for information from either agency. We take our public disclosure obligations very seriously. Herbalife does not intend to make any additional comments regarding this matter unless and until there are material developments.

     

    Doesn't it make sense that if there was an investigation that Herbalife would have been notified??
    11 Apr 2014, 04:38 PM Reply Like
  • Deja Vu
    , contributor
    Comments (1817) | Send Message
     
    Yes, every criminal wishes that the FBI notifies them when a criminal investigation is launched. "Hi Bob the conman, this is the friendly neighborhood FBI agent speaking, we intend to start a criminal investigation of you. We'll keep you updated with a daily progress report every day. Heck, we will even tell you where we have wiretaps, and whom we interview etc"

     

    Really??
    11 Apr 2014, 09:34 PM Reply Like
  • tsspry
    , contributor
    Comments (55) | Send Message
     
    Deja Vu, Why would the FBI tell Herbalife? It makes way more sense that the FBI sought out a rag of a publication to leak it to. Is that your thesis?
    12 Apr 2014, 12:14 PM Reply Like
  • Curious2
    , contributor
    Comments (1662) | Send Message
     
    The feds should go after Amway as well, I have TONS of information regarding their illegal pyramid and RICO fraud. Google "stop the amway tool scam wordpress"
    11 Apr 2014, 05:38 PM Reply Like
  • herbs4mike
    , contributor
    Comments (2064) | Send Message
     
    oh please..... give us a break. Amway is very legal whether you like it or not... RICO..... what a joke.
    12 Apr 2014, 03:48 AM Reply Like
  • minecanary
    , contributor
    Comments (1282) | Send Message
     
    Amazing that you can get the SEC, FTC, FBI, and DOJ investigating the sale of herbs and milkshakes and they can't find one banker who might be guilty of anything even after they pay 30-40 billion to settle investigations. This crap has got to change.
    11 Apr 2014, 05:38 PM Reply Like
  • samuraitrader
    , contributor
    Comments (883) | Send Message
     
    amen minecanary, amen.
    11 Apr 2014, 05:45 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Now let's see
    This British rag that has never had a scoop in its history comes up with this FBI and doj investigation news that the company knows nothing about.
    All of this minutes be for the close on friday(I'm feeling for the option traders caught with their pants down)
    Does that sound like someone is manipulating the stock and options market.
    And of course bloomberg repeats the news with FT as the source.
    And the company still hasn't been notified?
    This in itself is cause for an investigation
    First Markey and now the financial times manipulating the stock
    11 Apr 2014, 05:55 PM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    Oh wow. The Ackmanaholics think it's Christmas today. But once again, they confuse investigation with guilty and don't question the timing or who is behind this or the credibility.
    11 Apr 2014, 06:17 PM Reply Like
  • june1234
    , contributor
    Comments (4418) | Send Message
     
    Timing is everything. CO's sometimes release negative info late Friday hoping news will get buried/mixed in with other weekend news by monday open. At the end of the day gov will probably get a bunch of cash out of HLF as they did with BP, JPM etch, all still prospering.

     

    Be nice if a precedent was set but Im not counting on it. NAR and insurance companies use similar marketing methods MLMs do when they recruit newbie agents.It has never been illegal in the US to offer up any product or service of little or no value Unless you can prove fraud which requires proving intent and that is very tough to do.
    11 Apr 2014, 07:17 PM Reply Like
  • Deja Vu
    , contributor
    Comments (1817) | Send Message
     
    What would I not give to see Icahn do a perp walk.I'll enjoy it even more than DSK's perp walk. I missed an opportunity to short IEP today. I believe HLF is his personal money not IEP capital, but still if he gets dinged on HLF, I bet IEP will take a beating. After eBay kicked him to the curb, he is looking distinctly less prescient.
    11 Apr 2014, 09:40 PM Reply Like
  • tsspry
    , contributor
    Comments (55) | Send Message
     
    I wonder if Markey and Ackman will get adjoining cells?
    12 Apr 2014, 12:16 PM Reply Like
  • Matthew Davis
    , contributor
    Comments (4746) | Send Message
     
    Gee lets see...

     

    You walk around hawking protein powder, and recruit people below you so you get a cut of profits... PYRAMID

     

    Retail locations doesn't change the fact.
    11 Apr 2014, 09:55 PM Reply Like
  • herbs4mike
    , contributor
    Comments (2064) | Send Message
     
    You obviously do not know what the law says.
    12 Apr 2014, 03:46 AM Reply Like
  • User 4542301
    , contributor
    Comments (3854) | Send Message
     
    "You walk around hawking protein powder, and recruit people below you so you get a cut of profits... PYRAMID"

     

    That is your claim, but what does the law say? Show me what the law says about it. A claim without reference to the authoritative text (and a link to that text) is useless.
    13 Apr 2014, 03:01 PM Reply Like
  • User 4542301
    , contributor
    Comments (3854) | Send Message
     
    "You walk around hawking protein powder, and recruit people below you so you get a cut of profits... PYRAMID"

     

    A SUBWAY franchise or any other franchise appears to me to fit your definition of a pyramid scheme. The Subway co. will receive royalties (a percentage of your revenues) from your store sales.

     

    How is the Herbalife structure, itself, illegitimate?

     

    If you promise people that if they invest in Herbalife that they will "make a lot of money and become wealthy and successful", then you may be committing fraud or telling lies. But, how is the Herbalife structure, itself, fraudulent? It appears similar to me as any other business venture, such as the purchase of a franchise.

     

    Btw, if you "trust" someone with such nonsensical statements as in the above paragraph, you are a fool, lies or not.

     

    A fool and his money are soon parted.
    13 Apr 2014, 03:47 PM Reply Like
  • Quoth the Raven
    , contributor
    Comments (2063) | Send Message
     
    It's almost too easy.
    11 Apr 2014, 10:13 PM Reply Like
  • dakota444
    , contributor
    Comments (98) | Send Message
     
    Will they just stop this already. Don't they know that Carl Icahn needs to get filthy rich???
    12 Apr 2014, 12:56 AM Reply Like
  • Nate Acreman
    , contributor
    Comments (110) | Send Message
     
    The first part of this story that doesn't make sense to me is the fact that the DOJ and the FBI are investigating Herbalife. The FBI works directly for the Department of Justice, and the Department of Justice doesn't do any external investigations of it's own, as it's sole purpose is to oversee all of the federal law enforcement agencies such as: ATF, FBI, Marshals, and so on.

     

    Things not to be considered as here nor there is the FBI issuing no official word on a possible investigation. The FBI will not generally issue comment if there is no investigation, a pending investigation, or a current investigation. By issuing a comment for all non investigations, but issuing no comments on pending investigations and or current investigations they would be tipping their hand as the no comment would be an automatic yes.

     

    What does strike me as comforting is Herbalife's response to the rumor. There is no reason as of now to believe that Herbalife would be lying about not being under investigation as they were the first to tell everyone that they were being investigated by the FTC.

     

    Finally, I have never been a fan of stories that use a person that is close to the situation, rather an actually named individual or at the least letting us know what department said individual works in. For all I know, this story could have broke with Ackman making a call to the reporter. He is obviously someone who is close to the situation, as has been the case so far in all investigations Herbalife may be facing now.
    12 Apr 2014, 01:26 AM Reply Like
  • june1234
    , contributor
    Comments (4418) | Send Message
     
    Could have been worse. if I'm HLF i'd rather see bad news hit the late friday wires than before the open on monday; same thing happened with CAT last yr when they couldn't locate $650M worth of revenue
    12 Apr 2014, 03:26 AM Reply Like
  • herbs4mike
    , contributor
    Comments (2064) | Send Message
     
    At the end of the article, it says that..... Herbalife has not been accused of wrong doing and may not lead to charges..... (but the stock dropped from the sixties to the low fifties again.

     

    All this is Ackman pulling another lever; another orchestration by Ackman to manipulate the market. The stock gets to $60, he pays more money to get something done.

     

    I have to wonder what the FBI would be doing in something like this anyways..... But we will see. I'm still getting my paychecks out of Herbalife Thailand. Quite nice last month. Sorry about you guys in the states. I hope that the SEC shuts Ackman down. I think that it would take a massive protest about what pershing square is doing to really put some pressure on them. And if I get a chance to talk to MOJ, I'm certainly going to inquire about this.
    12 Apr 2014, 03:45 AM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    What I like is that no one has identified this person who is the source of the article and what were his motives?
    Did the times or ackmanns pay him.is he light.if this was going on for months ,why disclose it 15 minutes before the close on a Friday?
    Did he make money on this info.is he light
    I want some answers g d it
    12 Apr 2014, 02:04 PM Reply Like
  • CrimeBustersNow
    , contributor
    Comments (2546) | Send Message
     
    To all Herbalife longs, other MLM and sympathizers…. Again, we at (CrimeBustersNow) have destroyed several pyramid schemes, exposed one of the largest telemarketing charity and non-profit scams in the world and have never been proven wrong on any fraud we have pursued.

     

    Donald Trump and his scam we called out as a fraud over 8 years ago. Currently “The Donald” is being sued by the NY AG for $40,000,000 for fraud. In our view he, like the rest of the fraud artists should be charged criminally and face jail time.

     

    That’s our record….. Herbalife we called out as a pyramid scheme over 7 years ago.

     

    Now, taking that record into consideration, anyone is at liberty to calculate their own odds on Herbalife..... just saying.

     

    David Thornton
    Activist & Concerned Canadian Citizen: Simply doing what WE can to expose and eradicate fraud.
    12 Apr 2014, 05:16 AM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    AS I mentioned in another post above, I knew that the anti-Herbalifers, shorts, bashers and those just harboring with misinformation would be all elated over this announcement on Friday and would jump to conclusions. And look at this thread! WOW

     

    Please note:

     

    Herbalife has not been accused of wrong doing and may not lead to charges..... (but the stock drop from the sixties to the low fifties again. moving up in after hours.)

     

    As many of have posted regarding the FTC Probe, this is an investigation. No charges have been made. No one is accusing Herbalife of any wrong doing and no doubt, nobody probably ever will.

     

    What are you going to do when this and the FTC investigation concludes with no action taken against Herbalife?
    12 Apr 2014, 07:41 PM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Crime basters
    Yeh?
    Just name one crime you've busted
    That's what I thought
    13 Apr 2014, 12:37 PM Reply Like
  • teancum
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    very interesting....you called Herballife out as a pyramid scheme over 7 years ago...but you have never been proven wrong? What consitutes being proven wrong?
    12 Apr 2014, 09:10 AM Reply Like
  • tsspry
    , contributor
    Comments (55) | Send Message
     
    For seven years running you have been wrong. I seem to have missed the trial of Herbalife, and their sentencing. Must be you foreigners get all the information before anyone in the U.S. We need an investigation into this.
    12 Apr 2014, 12:22 PM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    Right. Like the well-known story of Ackman being "wrong" on MBIA for 6 years until one day he was "right".

     

    His $30 million became $1 1/2 Billion.

     

    Worth the wait?

     

    JJM
    13 Apr 2014, 11:19 AM Reply Like
  • JimboWHO
    , contributor
    Comments (106) | Send Message
     
    Where does one start with a post like this? The FTC, FBI and DOJ just begin to do their work and yet 50 cents declares HLF "squeaky clean"!

     

    You throw around wild claims of 'manipulation' and 'fraud' with zero evidence and assert that people (Ackman) need to be "prosecuted."

     

    50 Cents, MAKE YOUR CASE! We're all waiting.

     

    JJM
    13 Apr 2014, 01:26 PM Reply Like
  • laltha
    , contributor
    Comments (10) | Send Message
     
    I wonder why Carl is so quiet ? Ackman is pulling all the strings to make sure that his financial kingdom stays intact. Did WSJ published the same information which FT published ? Just wondering. Guys, it is the game so called financial genius play. We need to learn to swim with this sharks. Bought some more HLF.
    12 Apr 2014, 09:58 AM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Lath
    Good point
    And who is the mysterious source for all of this info
    Why is he so shy as to withhold his name?
    12 Apr 2014, 02:06 PM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    I am sure that we will be hearing from Carl, MOJ and other representatives from Herbalife.
    12 Apr 2014, 07:43 PM Reply Like
  • CrimeBustersNow
    , contributor
    Comments (2546) | Send Message
     
    I'm sure we will. But the appropriate adage for "Uncle Carl" MOJ and other representatives from Hebalife to consider before they "hang themselves with the extra rope they have been given”.... "When you’re already in a hole.... stop digging."

     

    David Thornton
    Activist & Concerned Canadian Citizen: Simply doing what WE can to expose and eradicate fraud.
    13 Apr 2014, 09:05 AM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Crimes
    If you are trying to expose fraud,turn your attention to ackmanns.
    13 Apr 2014, 12:48 PM Reply Like
  • Nettligent
    , contributor
    Comments (1346) | Send Message
     
    We love our FBI and DoJ. Thank you.
    12 Apr 2014, 12:12 PM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    Oh yes. We love them too. Hope you love them as much when then pick up Ackman.
    12 Apr 2014, 07:44 PM Reply Like
  • Dave Ritchie
    , contributor
    Comments (2924) | Send Message
     
    For anyone who's interested in the several reasons the FBI/DOJ launches any criminal investigation into "white-collar" crime, this website appears to be an authoritative resource on the subject...best I could find anyway.

     

    http://bit.ly/1kkRki0

     

    If I'm not mistaken, there are SA commenters on the Herbalife situation who are attorneys. Maybe they could shed better light on the FBI's investigative process.

     

    Best of luck.
    13 Apr 2014, 11:28 AM Reply Like
  • 50 cent it is
    , contributor
    Comments (1453) | Send Message
     
    Good post,Davies
    Thanks
    13 Apr 2014, 12:49 PM Reply Like
  • june1234
    , contributor
    Comments (4418) | Send Message
     
    "free market" means different things to different people.Tobacco co's have been doing their thing for many decades now. Courts have let em time after time after time, not illegal. 15 yrs ago or so voters of California voted to chop auto insurance rates, courts reversed that decision, rates went back to where they are now.

     

    MLM Living life sells essential oils. You can buy those same exact essential oils from any number of non MLM companies for 1/2 that, same exact product. Nothing with any of the activities just described is illegal.
    14 Apr 2014, 04:55 AM Reply Like
  • Tony Dee
    , contributor
    Comments (634) | Send Message
     
    More information as to why we shouldn't listen to Ackman>>>>...

     

    http://bit.ly/WvGT3F
    20 Jul 2014, 01:34 PM Reply Like
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