Seeking Alpha

Since the Court upheld Obamacare, small business owners have gone from denial to outright anger....

Since the Court upheld Obamacare, small business owners have gone from denial to outright anger. Many entrepreneurs are focusing on figuring out what moves they can make to gum up the works and prove healthcare reform was a bad idea and offer a case study on why it will fail. Some of the top threats: Firing workers instead of hiring, stop providing health insurance altogether and pay the $2K penalty, or even going so far as to shutter their businesses.
Comments (92)
  • Terry330
    , contributor
    Comments (866) | Send Message
     
    Conservatives are so afraid the Obama plan will work, not as good as other countries,but a step in the right direction. Canada covers everone at 1/2 the money spent in US.
    17 Jul 2012, 07:35 PM Reply Like
  • coddy0
    , contributor
    Comments (1182) | Send Message
     
    Terry330
    Conservatives are so afraid the Obama plan will work, not as good as other countries,but a step in the right direction. Canada covers everone (everyone) at 1/2 the money spent in US.
    ----------------------...
    In Soviet Union everybody included myself was covered for 1/100 the money spent in Canada
    17 Jul 2012, 07:52 PM Reply Like
  • enigmaman
    , contributor
    Comments (2686) | Send Message
     
    In a letter to the Wall Street Journal, the President and CEO of University Health Network, Toronto, said that Michael Moore's film Sicko "exaggerated the performance of the Canadian health system — there is no doubt that too many patients still stay in our emergency departments waiting for admission to scarce hospital beds."

     

    He went on the say this:
    All Canadians have access to similar care (as US.) at a considerably lower cost." There is "no question" that the lower cost has come at the cost of "restriction of supply with sub-optimal access to services," said Bell. A new approach is targeting waiting times, which are reported on public websites.

     

    So as I said previously which these statement confirm. In Canada they pay less, they get rationing of care , they get less quality care and they wait longer for it.
    17 Jul 2012, 07:58 PM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    Something needs to be done to reign in health care costs. It is in the interest to the Nation that its people are healthy and cared for. This bill unfortunately does not do that. It was written by the drug companies, the health care insurers and the unions. Then it was jammed down the throats of legislators with the cry of Nancy Pelosi, "If you want to know what it says you will have to pass it." Well, now people are reading it, interpreting it and realizing that the 2300 page bill leads to 14,000 additional pages of Lobbyist written gobbley gook. Business owners will and they will abandon their company funded healthcare plans dumping millions of currently covered AAmerican workers on the government system driving the coasts even higher than they are. The stated purpose of health care reform will not materialize and the result will be catastrophic economically.
    17 Jul 2012, 08:27 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    This is confusing coverage with care. You're covered, but the care may not arrive, or will be much delayed.

     

    http://on.wsj.com/OS5x3g

     

    http://bit.ly/AyiL5Q

     

    http://bit.ly/AoAQU0
    17 Jul 2012, 08:36 PM Reply Like
  • mike8599
    , contributor
    Comments (583) | Send Message
     
    Terry have you ever gotten health care in Canada ?

     

    I have and my friends have too.... if you like lines and waiting around for sub standard health care in dirty hospitals - it's great.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:02 PM Reply Like
  • george.otty@yahoo.ca
    , contributor
    Comments (59) | Send Message
     
    Wow........can you qualify that with numbers, please? And somehow (and I'll admit I don't know how) can you correlate that to standards of care in the Soviet Union compared to North America and the level of medical technology available when you were there? Having spent a lot of time in both countries over here and having hired ex-Russians who moved here, I'm having trouble connecting what I've seen/heard to your comment.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:19 PM Reply Like
  • george.otty@yahoo.ca
    , contributor
    Comments (59) | Send Message
     
    What is sub-optimal access to services? Did he state what optimal access would be? Instantaneous? What a crock. I'm pretty sure, like anywhere, depending on which health facility (doctor office, walk in clinic, hospital, emergency room, specialist, etc) and where and when, sometimes it's fast, sometimes it's not. And it depends on what you are waiting for (broken toe vs heart attack). You can only offer what can be afforded. To expect "optimal access" for the entire population (not just those with money), I suspect most taxpayers would not be willing to pay that cost.......whatever "optimal access" is, exactly. Classic example of how you can twist any story or even any subgroup of facts into the message you want to put out.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:26 PM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    Mike, I obviously don't know you so I don't know how to value that information, although I am not doubting it either. With that said, I do know how to value something I witnessed first-hand... I watched the (American) Chief Economist of a major financial firm ask a room full of thousands of Canadians to respond by show of hands to the question "How many of you are happy with your healthcare system?". There may have been two or three hands in the room that didn't go up without any hesitation, but I couldn't see them.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:28 PM Reply Like
  • george.otty@yahoo.ca
    , contributor
    Comments (59) | Send Message
     
    There goes 306 comments of any credibility you ever had.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:29 PM Reply Like
  • EMS
    , contributor
    Comments (564) | Send Message
     
    Do some research of your own, George, and pipe down, better for your health. For instance, you will not have the second eye with cataract done, as binocuar vision is not a right (you can pay a few thousand though for this service). And FYI you might have to wait a few months for your Coronary artery bypass when needed. Enjoy the other side, comrade.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:54 PM Reply Like
  • whataday222
    , contributor
    Comments (10) | Send Message
     
    Terry330...

     

    I'm from Canada and believe me, our medical system is very very flawed. Wait times of months to see a specialist where in the US it's a matter of just days. And, get this...to see a family doctor, it could be a couple weeks wait time and you only get 10 mins with him or her. And most are more interested in churning people through their practices and claiming through the government (er, tax payer) fundeded program. And, get this too...to see a specialist, you have to get a referal from your family doctor (who is typically out of their league unless you have nothing more than a cold). And each doctor seems to work indpendently of the next...no one...and I mean no one communicates or collaborates. Enjoy your new health care program USA. Good thing you're lawsuit happy down there...it's gonna sky rocket!
    17 Jul 2012, 10:05 PM Reply Like
  • Bigoptions
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    I'm a Canadian. I like that my healthcare is not predicated on whether I have a job. I'm self employed at the moment and I can do this without fear of catastrophic health care costs if I get sick or have an accident.

     

    My healthcare is as good as in the U.S. (I lived there for a year). My wait times have been low - I expect for big things like replacement hips I will have to wait about a year (but you can "book ahead" by knowing your hips are getting worse and pre planning things a bit). If I have a heart attack I'll get similar care as I would get in most plans in the U.S.

     

    And no insurance company is going to decide that my health problem was a pre existing condition! That's the worst part of the U.S. system. Everything that is covered here, is covered for everyone.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:13 PM Reply Like
  • Samroll
    , contributor
    Comments (6) | Send Message
     
    In Canada they have a longer life expectancy, lower child death rate, are happier, healthier and have a higher family net worth than us here in the great ol' USA. Dang socialists up there. Or is it dang idiots down here?
    17 Jul 2012, 10:20 PM Reply Like
  • Samroll
    , contributor
    Comments (6) | Send Message
     
    Yet they live longer, have a lower child death rate, are healthier, happier and a greater per family net worth. We don't need no dang health care here. We'ze Ameriguns.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:23 PM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    "to see a family doctor, it could be a couple weeks wait time and you only get 10 mins with him or her."
    How exactly is that worse than or different from the US system?

     

    "And most are more interested in churning people through their practices and claiming through the government (er, tax payer) fundeded program."
    If you replace the word "government" with "insurance company", how exactly is that worse than or different from the US system?

     

    "to see a specialist, you have to get a referal from your family doctor (who is typically out of their league unless you have nothing more than a cold)."
    How exactly is that worse than or different from the US system?

     

    "each doctor seems to work indpendently of the next...no one...and I mean no one communicates or collaborates."
    How exactly is that worse than or different from the US system?

     

    You have actually described the US healthcare system perfectly so it's unclear what the argument being made is.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:24 PM Reply Like
  • kcr357
    , contributor
    Comments (557) | Send Message
     
    So you would put money down on Americans life expectancy going up significantly after universal coverage?
    17 Jul 2012, 10:32 PM Reply Like
  • ByloSelhi
    , contributor
    Comments (177) | Send Message
     
    Visit with someone that lives in the state of Massachusetts. Romneycare works.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:34 PM Reply Like
  • jeanewight
    , contributor
    Comments (339) | Send Message
     
    Thinking people base their support or lack of support for Obamacare on the bill's merits. It's never a good idea to generalize about groups of people. I do not know one person - conservative or liberal - who is afraid Obamacare will work. To suggest such a thing is to reduce a complex and very important matter merely to the level of a political game, and personally I think the vast majority of conservatives, liberals, and independents alike all take health care of Americans very, very seriously.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:55 PM Reply Like
  • Art Trader
    , contributor
    Comments (120) | Send Message
     
    Works in Massachusetts. So as long as you have a disproportionately high number of residents with advanced degrees, a hundred colleges and universities with great coverage, an insurance and finance hub, and a biotech haven universal care works well. Massachusetts is obviously a microcosm of the United States. I'm sure you can find an analogous population to represent overweight, deep fried eating, chewing tobacco loving, Mississippi. This is going to work out great.
    17 Jul 2012, 11:05 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    If it works in Mass., then perhaps we should let all the other states decide if they want to copy that program. This is a state's rights issue. If people like the coverage in Mass. so much, then they can move there.
    17 Jul 2012, 11:27 PM Reply Like
  • c5Rouger
    , contributor
    Comments (5) | Send Message
     
    Oh by the way, the worn trails that lead from Canada to American health services is only one-way. While we may smuggle cheaper Maple leaf meds into the U.S., we never go to Canada for health care.
    17 Jul 2012, 11:28 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Nah.....not until the ban super-size sodas and happy meals!
    17 Jul 2012, 11:30 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Don't know much about healthcare informatics DAG?
    17 Jul 2012, 11:31 PM Reply Like
  • c5Rouger
    , contributor
    Comments (5) | Send Message
     
    I don't see anyone except folks from the poorest satellites to rushing to Russia (especially Soviet Russia) for health care. When they are dying and need the best care they come to the U.S.A. That will cease to be true under Obamacare.
    18 Jul 2012, 12:47 AM Reply Like
  • c5Rouger
    , contributor
    Comments (5) | Send Message
     
    Conservatives are NOT afraid Obama care will work. We already know it won't by looking at the other socialist countries that have failed. We are worried that it will take our country over the edge into bankruptcy and down the road to socialist ruin.
    18 Jul 2012, 12:47 AM Reply Like
  • c5Rouger
    , contributor
    Comments (5) | Send Message
     
    The two biggest solutions to sane health care costs are tort reform (so we can get the greedy lawyers out of healthcare) and allowing health insurance competition across state lines. More competition always means lower prices.
    18 Jul 2012, 12:47 AM Reply Like
  • The Mighty Wart
    , contributor
    Comments (112) | Send Message
     
    Life expectancy in Canada (overall): 80.7
    Life expectancy in USA (overall): 78.2

     

    It looks to me like a terrific deal for the Canadians if you believe, obviously, that there is strong correlation between health care and life expectancy.
    18 Jul 2012, 06:01 AM Reply Like
  • mike8599
    , contributor
    Comments (583) | Send Message
     
    George - I assume you are Canadian ??? or your comment is just to irritate. My kids were never diagnosed in Canada for a birth defect (that was easily fixed) because the doctors are not trained and they don't even try to get you to a specialist. By the time I moved to the US the damage was done, and my kid has to live with the problem.

     

    The Canadian doctors told us that they move to the US to make money. There is a reason their life expectancy is longer but it ain't their healthcare.... probably their stress level not having to deal with irritants.

     

    Basically if want convenience the Canadian system is great. If you want comprehensive quality you want the US system (or did)....
    18 Jul 2012, 09:15 AM Reply Like
  • wigit5
    , contributor
    Comments (3964) | Send Message
     
    WMARKW,

     

    Couldn't agree more let the states decided, if the people want it they will vote for it... The federal government wasn't designed for this crap.
    18 Jul 2012, 09:43 AM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    The states should stay out of it..it is a local, city or county issue.
    18 Jul 2012, 11:51 AM Reply Like
  • wigit5
    , contributor
    Comments (3964) | Send Message
     
    I think most states probably could handle, the ones with larger constituent base and geographies probably would need to be broken down further.

     

    It doesn't matter though, the ruling has been made and in the current political climate it will be nearly impossible to reverse.
    18 Jul 2012, 11:54 AM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    But you are so wrong..single payer (which is not Obamacare) IS working, and people are much healthier than in the U.S. Read the following, especially the health statistics...now, if you have great insurance, and plenty of money, and require some very high end health care specialists (the people making $500 thousand per year), we DO rank very high..which is why stars and heads of other governments come here sometimes..

     

    http://nyti.ms/OGquwZ
    18 Jul 2012, 11:58 AM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    Don't worry, the Canadians appear to be catching up to US obesity and diabetes rates, which of course is what really matters.

     

    http://huff.to/NzWUvY
    18 Jul 2012, 02:28 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    Single-payer isn't working. Canada and the UK are two very good examples of that.

     

    http://bit.ly/NzvPaP

     

    And the rationing in Canada is only going to get worse as the system is bankrupting the provinces and federal government.

     

    "Healthcare in Canada is delivered through a publicly funded system, which covers all "medically necessary" hospital and physician care and curbs the role of private medicine. It ate up about 40 percent of provincial budgets, or some C$183 billion ($174 billion) last year."

     

    http://reut.rs/OlJCUx
    18 Jul 2012, 02:46 PM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    Don't know much about life, WMARKW? That's understandable considering the amounts of time you've obviously spent coming up with a shallow contrary argument for practically every comment on this one article alone.
    22 Jul 2012, 10:13 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Thanks...I've had a full life and learned a lot about a lot of things. Having spent nearly 20 years in the medical industry....I suspect I can contribute to the debate. Your comment was a support of the contention that Dr's don't communicate. Well, my comment was about healthcare informatics and if you knew anything about it you would understand that there has been a big push to get medical records connected at all levels - especially within hospital organizations.

     

    My "shallow" comments have been rebutts to the nonsense that has been spit out on this particular thread.
    23 Jul 2012, 12:34 PM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    I am duly impressed and concede to your brilliance as it's quite obvious that the very recent and largely fruitless "big push" to bring medical records systems into the 19th century is obviously unrelated to communications issues in the medical field... or, as experts such as yourself clearly prefer, the medical "industry".
    23 Jul 2012, 01:06 PM Reply Like
  • Tricky
    , contributor
    Comments (1583) | Send Message
     
    Err, the article shoots down each one of these. But I understand, SA can use the page views for income. It's cool.
    17 Jul 2012, 07:35 PM Reply Like
  • zhellc
    , contributor
    Comments (58) | Send Message
     
    Scare tactics. Everybody knows that health care spending are out of control in this country. And we are alone among the developed country.
    17 Jul 2012, 07:42 PM Reply Like
  • Paul Nelson
    , contributor
    Comments (225) | Send Message
     
    More bs-appears in Forbes-need I say more!
    17 Jul 2012, 07:44 PM Reply Like
  • EngEdge
    , contributor
    Comments (52) | Send Message
     
    "shutter their businesses" - There's a knuckle head move I hope my competition does.
    17 Jul 2012, 08:03 PM Reply Like
  • $CLU
    , contributor
    Comments (207) | Send Message
     
    EngEdge, you are so right.
    We can only dream.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:23 PM Reply Like
  • george.otty@yahoo.ca
    , contributor
    Comments (59) | Send Message
     
    Yeah, no kidding. Frankly, it's ridiculous to even make such a comment. If entrepreneurs are shuttering their businesses because of this, then they probably making a smart decision and going back to just being employees because they are NOT entrepreneurs.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:31 PM Reply Like
  • Asif Suria
    , contributor
    Comments (332) | Send Message
     
    I am glad some businessmen brought this up. That comment made no sense.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:34 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    George? Ever run a business - small or large?
    17 Jul 2012, 11:32 PM Reply Like
  • Be Here Now
    , contributor
    Comments (3797) | Send Message
     
    I expect creative solutions will emerge that nobody foresees now. One man's problem is another's opportunity. In the end the sky will not fall.
    17 Jul 2012, 08:06 PM Reply Like
  • Yokyok
    , contributor
    Comments (325) | Send Message
     
    wacko chicken little talk from wacko steve forbes magazine. ignore.
    funny how all those businesses in Germany, Japan, Taiwan, Canada and countless others have been able to survive with universal coverage isn't it?
    17 Jul 2012, 08:12 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Yok....know anything about how it's done over there? Any reason that people in France will have supplemental insurance policies to cover what their "national" coverage won't?
    17 Jul 2012, 11:34 PM Reply Like
  • Whitehawk
    , contributor
    Comments (3129) | Send Message
     
    Private individual and small business group insurance will likely increase dramatically in the next year or two, even with the advent of "exchanges." That is not a positive development. Yes, small business owners responsible for buying insurance are looking at all the options.
    17 Jul 2012, 08:29 PM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    Perhaps the bill is not perfect, but it is a starting place, and can be tweeked...the idea is that all companies and people should be on a level playing field...the so called "free market"...large companies right now get a big tax break for making insurance available, e.g..
    18 Jul 2012, 12:00 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    And it's that tax break that needs to end, as it greatly distorts the system, and separates the payer from the consumer. Obamacare is designed to take us to single-payer which has exactly the same problem, but far worse as you have the government dictating a single solution of what insurance should be and how it's implemented and run.
    18 Jul 2012, 02:50 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Topcat....all business (both big and small) that spend money to provide insurance for employees get to take the same tax deduction on their tax return.

     

    If I own a barber shop or a small collision repair shop.....I suspect there is not sufficient profit to provide health insurance for anyone who works there - other than the business owner.
    18 Jul 2012, 05:39 PM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    Thx for the clarification...
    19 Jul 2012, 11:42 AM Reply Like
  • chopchop0
    , contributor
    Comments (3135) | Send Message
     
    Maybe Obama should have been focusing on trying to get the economy back on track instead of trying to get government more in the lives of people. The rules have been changing so much, it's no wonder that businesses large and small have been sitting on unprecedented amounts of cash.

     

    Now with the fiscal cliff looming, businesses have yet another reason to just sit on their hands and wonder what the heck to do next.

     

    Obama and the GOP congress share an equal blame on the second issue
    17 Jul 2012, 08:42 PM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    Please tell me how Obamacare is the government getting in people's lives? It is all implemented privately, and no one has to participate, and the insurance exchanges should at last bring free market competition, which does not exist today...and, it reduces the deficit...
    18 Jul 2012, 12:01 PM Reply Like
  • chopchop0
    , contributor
    Comments (3135) | Send Message
     
    Please tell me you've actually understood the entire Obamacare bill including the penalties on businesses with 50 employees or more, along with the increased medicare and investment taxes that will hit anyone making over $200K a year.

     

    And if you believe in entitlement program will actually reduce the deficit long-term, let me give you a tub of my fat-free, salt-free fried chicken with nacho cheese sauce LOL

     

    Remember, no one worried about medicare expenditures when LBJ created it in the 1960s because the average life expectancy was ONLY 68 and so people would ONLY collect medicare 3 years.
    18 Jul 2012, 02:10 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    "It is all implemented privately, and no one has to participate..."

     

    In other words, you're saying you have no idea what Obamacare is.
    18 Jul 2012, 02:54 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    And don't worry about paying a tax on the proceeds from the sale of your home....

     

    Forbes - April 2, 2012
    "the health law will impose a 3.8 percent tax on investment profits and other non-wage income starting in 2013. But that tax applies only to couples with adjusted gross income of $250,000 (or individuals with AGI of $200,000). About 95 percent of households make less than that, and will be exempt from the law no matter what." Whew....soak the rich !!!

     

    "In addition, couples who sell a personal residence can exclude the first $500,000 in profit from tax ($250,000 for singles). That would be profit from a home sale, not proceeds. So a couple that bought a house for $100,000 and sold it for $599,000 would owe no tax, even under the health law." Whew.....soak the rich !!!!

     

    I am glad I am not rich !!!!! (oops, maybe someday I will be and then what?)
    18 Jul 2012, 05:41 PM Reply Like
  • kmi
    , contributor
    Comments (3984) | Send Message
     
    "Firing workers instead of hiring, stop paying insurance altogether and pay the $2K penalty, or even going so far as to shutter their businesses."

     

    No one is in business because they want to 'shutter their business.'

     

    I find this ludicrous in the extreme.
    17 Jul 2012, 08:48 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    A typical family policy around here costs an employer more than $1000 a month? Does that alternative make sense vs. the $2k penalty. Of course, the risk is that your employees walk?
    17 Jul 2012, 11:35 PM Reply Like
  • kcr357
    , contributor
    Comments (557) | Send Message
     
    Walk to where, the unemployment office? Last I checked there wasn't a job glut ;)
    18 Jul 2012, 01:02 AM Reply Like
  • varan
    , contributor
    Comments (3519) | Send Message
     
    Press release from RNC?

     

    Or the would-be President who retired retroactively?
    17 Jul 2012, 08:53 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    Confused as usual. It's a puff piece that is pandering to the left. The author is a blogger and she's managed to come up with some silly strawmen to attempt to paper over the fact that Obamacare is shutting down job creation.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:09 PM Reply Like
  • jdjones
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    Please, the Affordable Care Act is not "shutting down job creation"; the private has been creating jobs albeit at a slow pace. Unemployment remains high due to public sector job cuts. The numbers from the Labor Department clearly show this fact. Last month 14,900 teachers were laid off. A recent piece in Business Week with BLS numbers shows that public sector employment is down 729,000 since 2008.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:12 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    The facts speak for themselves - spin isn't going to change them. 75k monthly average in Q2 versus 226k in Q1. That's not just shutting down, that's falling off a cliff. Job grow in the last three months is less than half what is needed just to keep pace with population growth, let alone work down the backlog of the existing unemployed. The stated unemployment rate of 8.2% vastly understates reality, as many have simply stopped looking and are thus not counted.

     

    http://seekingalpha.co...
    http://seekingalpha.co...
    http://seekingalpha.co...
    18 Jul 2012, 12:34 AM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    Hooray!! It sounds to me like this means we'll eventually have fewer morons running businesses, which will ultimately give the economy a huge boost!!
    17 Jul 2012, 09:17 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Really? How many people do you think are out there running businesses that employ a handful of people. If they shut down.....I guess they and all their workers will just find another job somewhere else.....right?
    17 Jul 2012, 11:38 PM Reply Like
  • zorrow
    , contributor
    Comments (848) | Send Message
     
    Who posted this on a business website---and why?
    17 Jul 2012, 09:17 PM Reply Like
  • Mark Humphrey
    , contributor
    Comments (588) | Send Message
     
    Obama Care will bring further ruin to American medicine, because it will impose dogmatic and wrong-headed "standards of care" on practitioners. Proper medical attention is based on good abstract reasoning, not on consensus. Politics enforces consensus.

     

    It's tragic so few understand why socialism always brings demoralization, suffering and poverty.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:49 PM Reply Like
  • EMS
    , contributor
    Comments (564) | Send Message
     
    Right on.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:56 PM Reply Like
  • Yokyok
    , contributor
    Comments (325) | Send Message
     
    hogwash
    17 Jul 2012, 10:34 PM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    I would rather have us (via the government), making "standard of care" decisions, than the insurnace companies, who are making those decisions today (and the are in it for the profit)...
    18 Jul 2012, 12:04 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    You might want to read up on Hospital Quality measures, certifications, reporting statistics, etc. Here's a good place to start: The Joint Commission - a non-profit organization that certifies hospitals, etc.

     

    http://bit.ly/Mll1j9
    18 Jul 2012, 05:53 PM Reply Like
  • 1980XLS-2.0
    , contributor
    Comments (525) | Send Message
     
    Welcome to Hope & Change.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:52 PM Reply Like
  • 1980XLS-2.0
    , contributor
    Comments (525) | Send Message
     
    When they shutter their businesses, it will be their fault, but they had no responsibility in creating them to begin with.
    17 Jul 2012, 09:52 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3354) | Send Message
     
    1980, you're going to have to diagram that one. The Obamabots aren't going to get it. (I think most don't actually listen to him - which makes it much easier to blindly follow him.)
    18 Jul 2012, 12:40 AM Reply Like
  • kingdoms333
    , contributor
    Comments (13) | Send Message
     
    I am a small business owner. When the competition decides to drop their employee healthcare insurance and just pay the approx $ 2000 'tax' penalty.....that will make other competitor companies drop theirs...force their employees to purchase their own health insurance with 'after tax' dollars....and the company will pay the penalty...whoops....TAX! this will be required to remain cost competitive with the competition. But,,,,,,the employees will be the ones that are hurt financially as they will buy their own insurance and in most instances it will be a less coverable insurance. BUT,,,,THE OBAMA ADMIN AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE NOT REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT THOSE OF US PAYING ALREADY FOR INSURANCE...ALL THEY WANT IS THE 30 MILLION WHO DON'T HAVE INSURANCE.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:00 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    More voters !
    17 Jul 2012, 11:38 PM Reply Like
  • reid370
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    These "small business owners" apparently think it is fine for their uninsured employees to get sick, run up a huge hospital bill, and then leave it to the taxpayers to pay the cost. We are currently paying billions to take care of the employees of "small business owners." It is time that we collect some premiums to cover this drain on our economy and government. By the way many, many small firms value their employees, provide health insurance, and do not want to see them bankrupted over an illness.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:04 PM Reply Like
  • DAG1996
    , contributor
    Comments (3066) | Send Message
     
    Well said, @reid370.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:27 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Pleas reid370. Did you join SA just to comment on this article? Sounds like you don't have a clue about small business. Ever run one? Ever make a payroll? Ever had to take a cash advance on your credit card to make a payroll or make sure the witholding taxes get paid so you don't go to jail? I doubt it !
    17 Jul 2012, 11:40 PM Reply Like
  • kcr357
    , contributor
    Comments (557) | Send Message
     
    If he did, I am sure he would pay at least 20/hour to every employee and provide a cadillac health plan with 8% raises per year, profit sharing, and a company picnic every other weekend. Anything less is just greed on the owner's part. Oh, company vehicles too. Chevy volts.
    18 Jul 2012, 01:08 AM Reply Like
  • kcr357
    , contributor
    Comments (557) | Send Message
     
    Where exactly do you believe the money to pay employees' health bennies comes from, btw? Here's a hint, it's the same place the money for taxes comes from. And it's not the greedy biz. owners' pockets...Follow the money to the source.
    18 Jul 2012, 01:14 AM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    That's too complicated for their liberal minds kcr. Follow the money....to them that means to the ATM machine.
    18 Jul 2012, 09:06 AM Reply Like
  • MICHAELIRISH131
    , contributor
    Comments (43) | Send Message
     
    The basis of this article I hope is for a consensus for the full story next year. The little guy will get help directly from the fed/tax payers allowing for a shift in payment as better used taxed dollars are moved from government to the private sector with controls. That part is causing the confusion for big business not getting the tit to themselves. A Dr charging 100k per procedure. Back surgery making is sound that for a 100k its gotta be good. The next 100k Dr says the other guys thinking was to small for the job. Should have charged 200k.
    17 Jul 2012, 10:49 PM Reply Like
  • enigmaman
    , contributor
    Comments (2686) | Send Message
     
    Obama has by design set into motion the destruction of our health care system which will soon be replaced by a one payer national Medicare system for all. This has been the goal of the democrats from the very beginning going back 80yrs. Its has nothing to do with fairness, nothing to do with cutting our premium costs, nothing to do with improving quality or access. It has always been about POWER and CONTROL of the many by the few. Obamacare will cost more, provide less and will add to our national debt. Obama and his ilk already knew that going in, it was the point of this all the long, its called job security. Enjoy the honeymoon because when it is over you will soon regret saying "I do".
    18 Jul 2012, 09:00 AM Reply Like
  • jeanewight
    , contributor
    Comments (339) | Send Message
     
    I so agree with you, enigmaman. I am also grieved and dismayed by and angry at that one critical decision and by the magnitude of the devastation that has been wrought by the witting or unwitting complicity of
    Justice Roberts
    18 Jul 2012, 09:09 AM Reply Like
  • Topcat
    , contributor
    Comments (413) | Send Message
     
    Poor Roberts...guy just interpreted the Constitution, and correctly as far as I understand...he did not cave to politics...otherwise, what exactly was his motive?
    18 Jul 2012, 12:07 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    To toss the dead cat over the fence back to Congress to "fix" the bill rather than ruin the reputation of the Court. If you read his opinion - you would lose about 5% of your brain cells just trying to figure out his lack of logic.
    18 Jul 2012, 05:54 PM Reply Like
  • Mark Humphrey
    , contributor
    Comments (588) | Send Message
     
    Obama Care is a Great Leap Forward into politically correct medicine, as defined by politically connected medical societies and government agencies. Any responsible doctor who questions the orthodoxy will get punished for speaking truth to power. The punishment of heretics has long held sway in American medicine. Now dissenters will have no place to hide.
    18 Jul 2012, 02:17 PM Reply Like
  • WMARKW
    , contributor
    Comments (10251) | Send Message
     
    Oops.....now the stage is set for the Global Warming "failure to participate" penalty for those who choose not to buy Solar Panels.
    18 Jul 2012, 05:56 PM Reply Like
DJIA (DIA) S&P 500 (SPY)
ETF Tools
Find the right ETFs for your portfolio:
Seeking Alpha's new ETF Hub
ETF Investment Guide:
Table of Contents | One Page Summary
Read about different ETF Asset Classes:
ETF Selector

Next headline on your portfolio:

|