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Bank of America (BAC) joins PayPal (EBAY), MasterCard (MA) and others in cutting ties with...

Bank of America (BAC) joins PayPal (EBAY), MasterCard (MA) and others in cutting ties with WikiLeaks. The decision may open BofA's site up to attack from pro-WikiLeaks hackers, but may also be a defensive move as many believe WikiLeaks is planning a major data dump that will embarrass BofA.
Comments (27)
  • The Geoffster
    , contributor
    Comments (4066) | Send Message
     
    What could WilkiLeaks reveal about the banks that we don't already know? Bankers are gangsters in bespoke suits with country club memberships? Everyone already knows the big banks are insolvent.
    18 Dec 2010, 01:43 PM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    Geoffster...

     

    "Bankers are gangsters in bespoke suits with country club memberships? Everyone already knows the big banks are insolvent. "

     

    For everybody that says big banks are insolvent give me some
    numbers ...some legitimate data....words... it always seems to be words....
    18 Dec 2010, 04:10 PM Reply Like
  • Tack
    , contributor
    Comments (14131) | Send Message
     
    Geoffster:

     

    Accounting-101 ideas of insolvency are meaningless when applied to the Big Banks, which form part of the Fed's monetary distribution system and were not, are not and will not be allowed to go under. Those investors that understood this simple reality have made nice returns on banks since 2009 ( a lot more if they bought preferred shares) and are likely to make considerable additional gains, as the economy recovers, rates rise and the banks really start lending for risk-based returns, again.

     

    All the banks' paper losses --and, that's what they are paper, not cash, as they're swimming in liquidity-- will be gradually offset against quarterly earnings until they're simply not there, anymore, vanished into the mist. Yet, there will be a hoard of folks railing against the banks, the whole way, and not making a dime.
    18 Dec 2010, 04:50 PM Reply Like
  • The Geoffster
    , contributor
    Comments (4066) | Send Message
     
    bbro: Tack's reply about the banks being TBTF is correct, but they are still insolvent under GAAP. I am not so sanguine about the ability of the banks to survive the collapse of the Fed's Ponzi monetary policy, but if they do it will be the result of inflation which is default by other means.
    18 Dec 2010, 05:41 PM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    But They were not insolvent under GAAP...they were extremely unprofitable...they had a liquidity crunch but all companies had problems look at
    commercial paper levels
    2008 09 15 2.73
    2008 09 16 2.81
    2008 09 17 2.66
    2008 09 18 3.05
    2008 09 19 3.05
    2008 09 23 3.18
    2008 09 24 3.20
    2008 09 25 2.82
    2008 09 26 3.40
    2008 09 29 3.30
    2008 09 30 3.61
    2008 10 01 3.81
    2008 10 06 3.99

     

    Look at Tangible common equity then and today....

     

    I know someone ( both doctors) paid 1.2 million for house...
    today it is worth 900,000....they are making payments every month ...don't
    want to ruin their credit...how do you value that loan???
    18 Dec 2010, 06:47 PM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    Financial solvency is defined as the ability of a person, business or organization to meet all of its debts or financial obligations with some cash to spare.

     

    If this definition is applied to any bank, it is by definition, insolvent. They always have been and they always will be. There is one simple reason for this and to understand it you need go no further than to watch "It's a Wonderful Life".

     

    The life expectancy or "term" of the assets invested in by banks, loans in the simplest form, exceeds the life expectancy of the liabilities (deposits) that are used to support them. In the event of a run on a bank it will never, never have sufficient cash on hand to pay out all of the "demand deposits" thereby creating and event of insolvency.

     

    It has always been this way. The comments on these sites treat this as a new phenomenon resulting from the financial crisis and something which can be changed. It will not be changed as long as we have banks that make loans with terms of longer than overnight and take deposits which are payable upon demand as they have for hundreds of years.
    19 Dec 2010, 04:18 AM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    "There is one simple reason for this and to understand it you need go no further than to watch "It's a Wonderful Life".

     

    So true...George Bailey,,,bankster....
    19 Dec 2010, 05:35 AM Reply Like
  • Joe Morgan
    , contributor
    Comments (1534) | Send Message
     
    Why the jealousy toward bankers? Frustrated, that you never reached the cusp of financial success, where the have's had reached?
    19 Dec 2010, 07:11 AM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    Are you suggesting a bankless society or are you simply being overly sarcastic? If it is the former do you have a vision of how commerce on a global or even large national scale would be carried out without banks? I am simply inquiring of your thinking.
    19 Dec 2010, 07:21 AM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    I am being overly sarcastic....
    19 Dec 2010, 07:52 AM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    Thanks,
    being not politically correct, Merry Christmas
    19 Dec 2010, 08:00 AM Reply Like
  • The Geoffster
    , contributor
    Comments (4066) | Send Message
     
    bbro: love your optimism, but I know a credit collapse when I see one.
    www.breakingviews.com/...
    19 Dec 2010, 09:55 AM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    And, how might you define a credit collapse and in what context are you using the term? It appears that the link you provided pertains to European banks.
    19 Dec 2010, 11:01 AM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    Geoff....I loved those Basel 3 articles...if Basel3 has been in effect...
    about the same as saying if you paid all you taxes due this decade
    next year you would be way under water,,,,typical media National
    Enquirer headline...
    19 Dec 2010, 05:25 PM Reply Like
  • anarchist
    , contributor
    Comments (1488) | Send Message
     
    Correct me if I am wrong but I haven't seen anything that WikiLeaks has leaked that would endanger National security, just stuff we citizens should know anyway but has been hidden from us by our Government and corporations. You can tell they are touching some sore spots with the mass exodus in support for WikiLeaks by the corporations and the sound off squealing government pigs.
    18 Dec 2010, 02:02 PM Reply Like
  • The Geoffster
    , contributor
    Comments (4066) | Send Message
     
    Your comment is no surprise given your moniker, but I tend to agree with you. Most secrets are only secrets because they would embarrass their keepers if leaked.
    18 Dec 2010, 02:20 PM Reply Like
  • Jasper M
    , contributor
    Comments (1652) | Send Message
     
    While I count myself a Wikileaks partisan, I genuinely wonder what they could possibly reveal now that would materially damage BoA's image any further than it already has been at this point. BoA is pretty much the Elliot Spitzer of the banking world – no where to go but up.
    18 Dec 2010, 04:17 PM Reply Like
  • nobby73
    , contributor
    Comments (1177) | Send Message
     
    Evidence BofA senior execs know that a much higher proportion of mortgages were never conforming when places into securitization vehicles? Evidence money is being received directly from the Fed to continue making payments into MBS deals where BofA services the mortgages, but was also involved in the origination and they know they cannot foreclose owing to serious problems with the documentation.
    18 Dec 2010, 05:03 PM Reply Like
  • Tom Au, CFA
    , contributor
    Comments (6780) | Send Message
     
    Willie Sutton: "Why do I rob banks? Because that's where the money is."

     

    Ditto for the white collar kind.
    19 Dec 2010, 02:06 PM Reply Like
  • Tom Au, CFA
    , contributor
    Comments (6780) | Send Message
     
    The large financial institutions are waking up (and reacting to) the fact that the Wikileaks revelations will embarass ALL of them.
    18 Dec 2010, 07:05 PM Reply Like
  • MarketGuy
    , contributor
    Comments (3983) | Send Message
     
    BAC is a C value. Between 4 and 7 is where is should be right now...and where it will go.
    18 Dec 2010, 11:42 PM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    So you must be loading up on the Jan 2012 10 put at .99??
    19 Dec 2010, 05:15 AM Reply Like
  • MarketGuy
    , contributor
    Comments (3983) | Send Message
     
    Nah, no puts needed...been short BAC since the "robosigning" news first broke in Florida headlines. I knew it was going to snowball. Since then I've removed 2/5's of my short position for huge net. The rest is house money letting ride. I keep doing my DD and see the pain for BAC hasn't even started. This last cute run-up of theres is a nice end of year "bonus pump", that's all.
    19 Dec 2010, 02:00 PM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    Interesting it is going to between 4 and 7 ( which is a bold statement)
    BUT you cut your position 40%,,,you talk bold but you are a smart trader....basically you are a short short term trader,,,,cause your short
    at best was in the high 13's.....a call to 4 to 7 is your long term call....
    19 Dec 2010, 05:35 PM Reply Like
  • 7footMoose
    , contributor
    Comments (2266) | Send Message
     
    Any revelation by Wikileaks unless it involves financing terrorists, knowingly laundering drug money, manipulating a commodity market, or conspiring to overthrow a government is likely already baked into BAC's stock price. How many more times can we reveal that they have screwed up mortgages, foreclosure proceedings and mortgage securitizations?
    19 Dec 2010, 04:26 AM Reply Like
  • bbro
    , contributor
    Comments (10143) | Send Message
     
    Agreed...a lot is baked in the price....
    19 Dec 2010, 07:51 AM Reply Like
  • Venerability
    , contributor
    Comments (3048) | Send Message
     
    BAC is now the Teflon stock!

     

    I predict that Julian Assange will reveal that at their Board of Directors' meetings, BAC Directors staged sadistic snuff films featuring illegal immigrants.

     

    As soon as the news is released, the stock will go up by 25 percent, on the theory that it could have been worse.
    20 Dec 2010, 09:18 PM Reply Like
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