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The U.S. Postal Service fires a shot across Washington's bow by proposing to cut 120K jobs...

The U.S. Postal Service fires a shot across Washington's bow by proposing to cut 120K jobs through union-prohibited layoffs, and to withdraw its employees from federal health and retirement plans. The proposal requires the approval of Congress, but, if passed, could have serious ramifications for government workers, as well as the national labor movement.
Comments (54)
  • PVizzle
    , contributor
    Comments (741) | Send Message
     
    The national labor movement is a large reason why the US Post Office lost over 3 BILLION DOLLARS last quarter. THREE BILLION DOLLARS!!!!
    11 Aug 2011, 06:55 PM Reply Like
  • catamount
    , contributor
    Comments (374) | Send Message
     
    That was incidental. The USPS lost money because it's run by a bunch of bureaucrats that can't figure out how much less their service remains relevant in his day in age. They make money sending spam snail-mail to "resident of 123 state street."
    11 Aug 2011, 07:32 PM Reply Like
  • Ken Solonika
    , contributor
    Comments (165) | Send Message
     
    Actually, I think email and the internet explain that much better.

     

    Thankfully the USPS isn't a business but instead has to deliver mail to everyone, not just the customers it chooses to service.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:46 PM Reply Like
  • Stoploss
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    I can't get my junk mail before 5pm anyway. Just put the postal service out of everyones misery already.
    11 Aug 2011, 06:59 PM Reply Like
  • dividend_growth
    , contributor
    Comments (2878) | Send Message
     
    Raise prices or cut costs, no other choice for USPS.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:00 PM Reply Like
  • Poor Texan
    , contributor
    Comments (3529) | Send Message
     
    "Raise prices or cut costs"

     

    Cutting costs raised a lot of opposition in the recent debt deal.
    11 Aug 2011, 09:51 PM Reply Like
  • DVW
    , contributor
    Comments (157) | Send Message
     
    They could deliver every other day and I'd be OK. Big savings right there.

     

    Actually, they should put it up for bid and let UPS/FedEx/Whoever bid for it.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:10 PM Reply Like
  • catamount
    , contributor
    Comments (374) | Send Message
     
    I'm with you on the every_other_day idea, but I I'd rather they became a non-profit with by-laws that tied the salaries to EPS performance; and, that they operate a secure email service for a reasonable fee that guarantees Constitutional protections.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:39 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3355) | Send Message
     
    Yea, that'll happen. Secure and reasonable fee. No thanks, my email is free and far more secure than any governmental or quasi-governmental agency could provide. I could just see the next argument being they need to have a monopoly on email as they do with 1st class postal services. It'll be for my own good of course.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:55 PM Reply Like
  • enigmaman
    , contributor
    Comments (2686) | Send Message
     
    get it done
    11 Aug 2011, 07:11 PM Reply Like
  • warrenrial
    , contributor
    Comments (558) | Send Message
     
    The unions destroyed the USPS.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:12 PM Reply Like
  • bartolomo
    , contributor
    Comments (5) | Send Message
     
    Well, maybe. If so, it took 122 years. Think email and fax had anything to do with it?
    11 Aug 2011, 07:21 PM Reply Like
  • spald_fr
    , contributor
    Comments (2705) | Send Message
     
    120K jobs? Holy moley.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:22 PM Reply Like
  • 1980XLS
    , contributor
    Comments (3314) | Send Message
     
    S&P made a "shot across the Bow" weeks ago too.

     

    But Obama has other things on is agenda besides jobs.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:26 PM Reply Like
  • catamount
    , contributor
    Comments (374) | Send Message
     
    Please change your name to fact hater. Thanks.

     

    [If you people could do anything but type ~10 word sentences that make unfounded claims, it would be impressive.]

     

    [[I never have nor will I ever vote for Obama.]]
    11 Aug 2011, 07:48 PM Reply Like
  • Wyatt Junker
    , contributor
    Comments (4503) | Send Message
     
    President Downgrade can't be bothered.

     

    Owebama was out raising 2012 campaign dollars at $78,000 a plate. I think he was selling it to the Saudi royals to prop up his part 2 bid as A. Clown in chief.
    11 Aug 2011, 07:57 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3355) | Send Message
     
    [[I never have nor will I ever vote for Obama.]]

     

    That's a tough one to explain. All I can come up with is felons can't vote.
    11 Aug 2011, 08:04 PM Reply Like
  • Joe Morgan
    , contributor
    Comments (1500) | Send Message
     
    Barracka Hussein Omama should be impeached. He is destroying this country.
    11 Aug 2011, 08:03 PM Reply Like
  • woollyB
    , contributor
    Comments (1019) | Send Message
     
    Serious question: Is there any material difference between Obama and Bush on issues of economic or foreign policy? Bush started the wars and the bailouts and the stimulus, Obama kept his foot on the gas pedal. They both get their money from the same sources and they both support the same Fed regime.

     

    Best I can tell, republicans want grow the authoritarian state through the warfare state and religious zealotry, and democrats want to grow the authoritarian state through the welfare state. Bottom line is the same, more or less.

     

    p.s. it's no coincidence that the most ravaged and destructive industries in this country are/were the most unionized: steel, railroads, airlines, automakers, government ....
    11 Aug 2011, 09:25 PM Reply Like
  • The Patriot
    , contributor
    Comments (320) | Send Message
     
    I appluad the USPS for trying to do the right thing. The answers to fix this country arent that difficult. It aways ends up being so damn political that the "right" thing is never done.
    11 Aug 2011, 08:50 PM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    Most of the USPS problem are caused by congress, not Obama or any other president.

     

    The USPS has been used as a free-for-all pork barrel by both sides in congress for years, and the majority of their losses and inneficiency come from congressional mandates. One of the major pork barrel projects for decades has been to build a post office in a congress critters district, whether needed or not.
    11 Aug 2011, 08:59 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    You people that bash unions are of course just mindless Limbaugh sheep.

     

    The fact is if Congress finally okays a streamlining of the postal service you clowns will be at tea party rallies next to a deluded fool on Social Security holding signs saying "Keep government's hands off our Social Security and postal service."

     

    The reason is of course jobs in districts that have big postal facilities. When one of your tea party republican congresscreeps demand a postal facility in his/her district be closed, then you guys will have some integrity. Now you're nothing but Limbaugh and Fox News sheep.
    11 Aug 2011, 09:10 PM Reply Like
  • davidbdc
    , contributor
    Comments (3141) | Send Message
     
    Joe,

     

    Where I live, I can drive from the next town over to the small town outside my town.... its an 18 mile drive. And I'll pass 6 post offices. And we're talking about two towns that have populations around 9,000 and 8,000 with very small "towns" in between (if you can find them).

     

    I can understand why a post office serves a function in small towns where the nearing "large" town is 20-30 minutes away - but I don't comprehend having a post office literally a 5 minute drive from another. The two that are "in town" in each town I can understand - but the other 4 no one can really walk to so whats the point?

     

    Close them - start with 3 or 4 of the ones near me.

     

    And I'm fine with my social security being cut also.

     

    And lets be clear - your anger towards Tea Party folks that voted against the bailout was actually one of integrity - they ran saying they wouldn't vote to raise the debt limit and then they followed through.
    11 Aug 2011, 09:59 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    I have no problem closing redundant facilities. My point was that nobody in Congress will allow the cuts to be made. There are, in actuality just a few posing as different people, nuts trolling message boards bashing unions or Obama spreading BS. I answer them.

     

    I'm an admitted liberal, but above all a capitalist. I alos know we need a middle class that can afford stuff for business to have the demand to make it profitable.

     

    12 Aug 2011, 04:17 PM Reply Like
  • TomasViewPoint
    , contributor
    Comments (4845) | Send Message
     
    Joe

     

    If you are a capitalist then look at the return on capital for the USPS. It needs transformation.
    12 Aug 2011, 04:53 PM Reply Like
  • nomore
    , contributor
    Comments (40) | Send Message
     
    Dear Joe,

     

    It is all about cutting waste, postal service is outdated and over employed and is just one budget item that needs to go away. I am not part of any political party as I see the whole think as a sick joke, unfortunately.it is on the american people.
    11 Aug 2011, 09:24 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    When both parties cut waste I'll be standing next to you applauding Mr. Nomore.
    12 Aug 2011, 04:18 PM Reply Like
  • TomasViewPoint
    , contributor
    Comments (4845) | Send Message
     
    Another poorly run enterprise by the Federal Government. Does anyone need convincing that our government is not structured to run businesses? Delivering mail is a business. It belongs in communications and logistics.

     

    Between a dysfunctional and at best slow political process and ridiculous unions this business will never be nothing but a drain on the taxpayer. Anything that should be done cannot be done because of politics and unions. The unions today have turned into nothing but tools of economic destruction and in the long run they do their members such a disservice.

     

    The USPS has 583K employees. Half of their work is probably delivering checks from the government. Can we cut out a lot of the government checks and also throw the USPS into bankruptcy, get rid of the union and then redo all the benefits and employee contracts? We would solve two problems at one time.
    11 Aug 2011, 09:54 PM Reply Like
  • rwkoch
    , contributor
    Comments (18) | Send Message
     
    Yeah, another victim of union labor. First the auto industry; and many other industries, now USPS. The wage scale and benefits don't really fit the skills required to work for USPS. USPS is not really needed that much anymore anyway, but I do feel for the employees who have had it pretty easy for a long, long time.
    11 Aug 2011, 10:19 PM Reply Like
  • Josh ODonnell
    , contributor
    Comments (229) | Send Message
     
    You know what they should do? Add another 100,000 post offices and create another 100,000 jobs instead of cutting.... Why not? Were all FU***ed anyway when the dollar bubble pops..that is after the govt debt bubble pops.
    11 Aug 2011, 11:13 PM Reply Like
  • warrenrial
    , contributor
    Comments (558) | Send Message
     
    Obama is doing a good job of destroying this country.
    11 Aug 2011, 11:24 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    Obstructionist republicans and the sheep who blindly follow them are the destroyers. Or in a language you can understand: Baaa. Baaa baa baaa...
    12 Aug 2011, 04:19 PM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3355) | Send Message
     
    Joe, we have more government and more spending than ever before and it hasn't - and isn't - fixing a damned thing. We need more obstructionists - at least until reductionists achieve a majority.

     

    The sheep are those that believe that doing the same damned thing that's failed over and over is somehow going to start working all of a sudden. You're one of those.
    12 Aug 2011, 06:22 PM Reply Like
  • askanangel
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    Some services basic services that are considered essential for everyone, such as power, water, sewer, and before the advance of modern tech, phone, are only economical when provided by with government support.
    Everyone needs these services and they cannot be delivered profitably in rural and lightly populated areas by private industry.
    The nationwide telephone, electrification, highway and other infrastructure projects built the foundation of our prosperity.

     

    If Fedex or UPS could deliver a letter to anyone, anywhere in the country for less than the cost of a stamp, and do it profitability, they would already be doing it.

     

    Also, I want my local postal workers to be able to shop at my business, buy a car every 10 years or so, be able to make a mortgage payment, pay taxes at the middle class tax rate and not end up in with a minimum wage job that does nothing to drive consumption or support the local tax base too.

     

    Our middle class is under tremendous pressure and

     

    Do we really want to
    11 Aug 2011, 11:54 PM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    "Some services basic services that are considered essential for everyone, such as power, water, sewer, and before the advance of modern tech, phone, are only economical when provided by with government support..."

     

    That is absolute baloney. I get my power from a private company, and it is cheaper than government power. I get my tech services from private companies. I will concede that water/sewer are government jobs, but not because they are any cheaper.
    12 Aug 2011, 04:00 AM Reply Like
  • TomasViewPoint
    , contributor
    Comments (4845) | Send Message
     
    I fund my own water and sewer. Use geothermal for heat and buy electricity from the local power company.
    12 Aug 2011, 10:11 AM Reply Like
  • Wyatt Junker
    , contributor
    Comments (4503) | Send Message
     
    I punched a hole in the ground & dug a well. Water solved. Sewer? Its called a septic tank, it leeches into the soil. Electricity? Some of my neighbors have generators, others solar. And for the rest, PG&E.

     

    Cops? Not out here. Its too far a drive for most of them and plus we're unincorporated. We can blast our rifles into our own backstops we made ourselves from homemade dirt berms we raised up with our tractors. No one effs with each other out here. We're all very well armed. We are our own cops.

     

    Fire? We police each other there too. But if there was a real problem, the best result is letting it burn itself out naturally.

     

    Now, go out to the DNC blue urban puppy mills and watch them bleat for Big Bro's help. Yeah, not my style, lefties. I guess you don't realize just how helpless you really sound. And, you're not even embarrassed about it.
    12 Aug 2011, 11:20 AM Reply Like
  • ColdLogic
    , contributor
    Comments (81) | Send Message
     
    Fedex/UPS/DHL aren't allowed to compete on 1st class mail, so we don't get to see whether they'd do it cheaper. Lysander Spooner (a genius anarchist philosopher/author of No Treason: The Constitution of No Authority) created the American Letter Mail Company, which then proceeded to lower the cost of sending a letter b/w Boston and NY from 18c to 3c. The competition also forced the USPS to lower it that much, until the ALMC was disbanded by government. What's wrong in allowing those who add cost to a system to be the ones responsible for paying for that added cost? A la carte is fairest. If someone lives out in the boonies, charge a nickel higher. If they don't need home delivery or only want delivery 1x/week, give them a discount on postage. 90% of the time my mail goes straight in the trash. I am an active mind, an active consumer. Ads have negligible effect on me. As it is, the USPS functions as an advertising agency, selling ad space (our mail box) to customers who can't opt out. The ad dollars go straight to paying for excessive USPS employees. A private letter company could cut out the BS customers don't want and innovate in any way the customers desire. With big govt services, the customers are not the masters. We're the slaves whose $ is stolen and then have no choice in how our services are provided to us, since govt services operate as a monopoly.

     

    www.lysanderspooner.or...
    12 Aug 2011, 02:15 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    You are full of it. I do have experience in these matters. private run companies such as AWW as a rule double to triple rates within three years of getting a municipal utility.
    12 Aug 2011, 04:21 PM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    And if they actually do triple rates, is that because the water plant was running in the hole when government had it, and was losing money?
    13 Aug 2011, 09:26 AM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    Would you rather have had the financial system crash Cinci?

     

    I find it strange you would call me a sheep when you're taking the side of the trolls who add nothing to the conversation stock and profitwise, which is what we're all interested in.

     

    You think it's good for water rates to triple if a private company owns it? Neat Cinci. Privatize the whole federal government and instead of taxes we can pay a management fee of triple what we paid in taxes. If that would make you happy.
    14 Aug 2011, 12:23 AM Reply Like
  • Cincinnatus
    , contributor
    Comments (3355) | Send Message
     
    Joe, it's the bleating sheep that bought that a financial system crash was averted by paying off the banksters. You're confusing me with yourself.

     

    As to water, sewer, power, etc. they're provided to me by businesses and I pay for those services. The feds don't do a damned thing for me but provide the means for deadbeats like you to steal the fruits of my labors from me. Getting you off my back and forcing you to pull your own weight would make me happy.
    15 Aug 2011, 01:04 AM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    "..You think it's good for water rates to triple if a private company owns it?.."

     

    If the government entity that was running it before was selling the water for $1 per thousand gallons, and it was costing them $3 per thousand gallons to process, then yes. If something is subsidized, there is a lot more waste - that is born out by the water rate usage in places like Las Vegas and Phoenix when rates were raised to the actual costs of production. (BTW, the rates were raised to deter water usage in the desert cities, but that was the method used, and it worked).
    15 Aug 2011, 10:19 PM Reply Like
  • enigmaman
    , contributor
    Comments (2686) | Send Message
     
    Government run services are never ever cheaper then those same services provided by private companies. Both government run services and privately run services want more or less the same things, to increase its power and control over the people and their money. Where they differ and its a big difference is once government controls a service, efficiencies go down, and costs go up (unions) while the opposite is true for private companies. The government motivation is it wants control over people, the main driver for business is profits. So while "gov." need only raise taxes and or fees to maintain its body count, private business is forced to increase business efficiencies to maintain its profits. There you have the difference between the left and right, the left believes government makes decisions they believe is best for the people and the right believes the private sector allows the people to decide with their pocket books what is best for them. Privatize the postal service and watch it transform into a more efficient, more profitable business that doesnt require postage stamp price increases. Need confirmation of this concept, just look to the Greece restructuring, top on their list is to sell off government entities to the private sector to run. Looks like they believe the only hope for Greece is to abandon some of its socialist tenets and embrace the free market principals. If they do and stick with it who knows Greece may finally be able to pay its own way
    12 Aug 2011, 08:48 AM Reply Like
  • TomasViewPoint
    , contributor
    Comments (4845) | Send Message
     
    Enigma

     

    Another way to say it is that private business will make market based decisions while the government will make vote driven decisions. And we know where that ends up.
    12 Aug 2011, 10:13 AM Reply Like
  • 1980XLS
    , contributor
    Comments (3314) | Send Message
     
    Yes, I vote for Market based decisions
    12 Aug 2011, 10:15 AM Reply Like
  • Wyatt Junker
    , contributor
    Comments (4503) | Send Message
     
    I vote for anarchy, the ending of Braveheart when Big Government was disemboweling Wallace and he screamed FREEDOM. Just leave me the hell alone! Why can't I be left alone? Is that so difficult to understand?

     

    Just. Leave. Me. Alone.
    12 Aug 2011, 11:25 AM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    So decisions on the safety of your drinking water made with profit as the motivating factor makes you feel better?
    12 Aug 2011, 04:22 PM Reply Like
  • Wyatt Junker
    , contributor
    Comments (4503) | Send Message
     
    Primarily profit, yes. Not sure why you think govt. which doesn't have profit as much as graft(as well as destroying profit) as a motivating force will be somehow better. Alhambra Water Co. would have to follow the same laws as anyone(thing) else. So, again, we would need some agency why?
    12 Aug 2011, 05:22 PM Reply Like
  • joe kelly
    , contributor
    Comments (1727) | Send Message
     
    You would agree, if I accurately peg you from some of your comments Wyatt, that government's most important role is the safety and security of the citizens it works for.

     

    So wouldn't you agree that safe drinking water is part of that mission?

     

    The ability of communities to compete for business depands much on it's infrastructure. Controlling key components like water delivery gives communities far more to deliver than hoping a private service doesn't raise rates so high it drives businesses that consume lots of water out.

     

    These are virtual monopolies since there is only one distribution system. I'd much rather have the ability to fire elected officials through the electoral process than hope the private water company cares about the product and safe delivery because the fact is if they don't, there really isn't a whole helluva lot anyone can do about it unless you live in the country and can dig a well. That's expensive also, And maintaining it for coliform, fecal etc. isn't cheap.
    12 Aug 2011, 06:00 PM Reply Like
  • Wyatt Junker
    , contributor
    Comments (4503) | Send Message
     
    "You would agree, if I accurately peg you from some of your comments Wyatt, that government's most important role is the safety and security of the citizens it works for. "

     

    Nope, even that's too much. Just the legal protections guaranteed under our Constitution, namely those related to personal property rights. Everything else the govt. does can just kind of stop or go away.

     

    What does that mean? Low, very low, taxes overall, the fewest possible amount of regulations and general absence. The only thing govt. should be doing is protecting our borders and they can't even do that right. The problem is the govt. is doing everything they shouldn't be doing and nothing that they should be doing.
    12 Aug 2011, 07:08 PM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    Joe - In an internet search for contaminated water in the news, every single news story I could find was about a government run water plant.
    13 Aug 2011, 09:29 AM Reply Like
  • Windsun33
    , contributor
    Comments (4254) | Send Message
     
    Joe - there is little or no evidence to show that water companies owned by private firms do any better or any worse than government run ones when it comes to water safety. The track record of government is not good in that respect.
    15 Aug 2011, 10:28 PM Reply Like
  • Agbug
    , contributor
    Comments (1085) | Send Message
     
    They have seen the writing on the wall on this for years, everyone has. When it was the airlines or the steel industry that had to shed legacy costs in a changing business climate it was a somewhat painful bankruptcy for some, then a new company emerged after going on Jenni Craig for 6 or 12 months in bankruptcy court.

     

    The slightest change in government invokes the word "draconian". Government sponsored entities will absolutely refuse to face reality and adapt until they are absolutely forced to, simple as that. The ONLY thing that forces them to change is $.
    12 Aug 2011, 03:35 PM Reply Like
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