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Ford (F) says it will pass its full-year record for hybrid sales this month as demand for the...

Ford (F) says it will pass its full-year record for hybrid sales this month as demand for the new C-Max and electric Fusion looks strong. In April, the automaker delivered 35,034 Fusion hybrids compared to the 3,257 Camry and 19,889 Prius hybrids Toyota moved. What to watch: Analysts are still bickering over the impact of lower gas prices on hybrid demand heading into the summer, but Ford appears poised to grab even more hybrid market share.
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Comments (15)
  • wigit5
    , contributor
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    Interesting outselling Tesla's as well...
    3 May 2013, 08:30 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    Tesla makes electric vehicles, which are in relatively low demand - a few tens of thousands a year, or less than a half-percent of the total vehicle sales. Hybrids as a class sell hundreds of thousands each year - about 3% of the total. You need to compare apples and apples.

     

    http://bit.ly/VOufpN
    3 May 2013, 10:34 AM Reply Like
  • rkramer40
    , contributor
    Comments (2) | Send Message
     
    Open letter to Ford:

     

    I thought my 2013 C-MAX would be a Prius Killer? NOT! As a returning Ford buyer I feel deceived. I want to support US companies and US jobs. What was Ford thinking when they published 47/ 47/47 estimates? Based on the advertised EPA estimates, I would have been ok with low 40′s but 28-33 mpg is not even in the ballpark. This is not an issue about EPA testing standards, but rather an issue about setting false customer expectations in order to promote sales. Ford’s “47MPG” marketing campaign tarnished what should have been the roll out of a truly remarkable vehicle, the CMAX. Real world MPG estimates should have been promoted in the mid-30′s. No one would have questioned those numbers and the CMAX would have received the accolades it deserves. How these MPG estimates made it through Ford corporate is beyond me! Maybe it was the rush to go to market? I have been accused of not knowing how to drive hybrid. For the record, during the last three years I have leased both a 2010 Prius and 2010 Honda Insight Hybrid, and consider myself an experienced hyper-miler. My mileage in the Prius is 50 plus, the Insight is 40 plus. The C-MAX is a well-built car, with extremely inflated EPA estimates. I respectfully request that this matter be investigated as soon as possible. My efforts to deal with this locally and through Ford customer service have frustrated me to no end. The constant response? “You need to learn to how to drive hybrid type of vehicle “. Is there a difference how I drive Prius Hybrid vs. the CMAX hybrid? I think we all know the answer to that. I need someone at Ford to reach out to me and assist in a proactive manner so we can put this matter to rest.

     

    Ronald Kramer Yankee Ford Customer
    South Portland, Maine
    3 May 2013, 08:50 AM Reply Like
  • wigit5
    , contributor
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    If true it will more then likely end up in class action just like the Hyundai/Kia debacle. You should contact the dealership and a lawyer most likely.
    3 May 2013, 08:59 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    Ronald -

     

    Ford is legally obligated, by law, to report the exact fuel efficiency numbers achieved in performing the standard EPA drive cycles, all done by the book. There are no legal provisions with the EPA for "real world" fuel efficiency that some folks may get based on how and where they drive the car, and in what conditions. The EPA is not flexible, and an automaker publishing other numbers beyond the EPA sticker figures would be considered a major violation of the law.

     

    The numbers are what they are, and they are audited and certified with outside testing agencies, which also run the exact procedure by the letter.

     

    Consumer Reports ran "their own style Fuel Efficiency tests, which also showed results different from the EPA. They essentially claimed Ford was lying, and then retracted that claim when the EPA got involved in SUPPORTING Ford's numbers.

     

    If you have issues with the results, it would be up to your Congressman to make an Act of Congress to force the EPA to change the test procedures, or to allow the Automakers to publish results from alternative tests.

     

    "Your Mileage May Vary" is true for any vehicle, perhaps more so with Hybrids like Ford's which can run in EV mode for a long time, as long as you keep the speed down and don't tip in too hard on the accelerator. Also, cold weather can disable the "EV mode" availability, especially when the Heater or Defroster is on. With the gas engine doing all the work, including hauling around all the hybrids equipment, then yes the 47 mpg average becomes more like 30 mpg.

     

    If you want to achieve the claimed 47+ mpg, then you have to drive like the EPA test, keep the speed below around 62 mph, tip in gently on the accelerator, let the car "glide along" in EV mode as much as possible, raise or lower the AC / Heater temperature to minimize the AC usage, and drive in milder weather. hypermiling works extremely well in Hybrids, if you know what the vehicle capabilities are.

     

    As an example, Ford ran a single tank of gas in one of their hybrids for nearly 1500 miles - achieving over 80 mpg in a car rated at 41. Racing the exact same car around on a race track at max speed yielded more like 10 mpg. But those numbers are to be ignored in EPA label quotes.

     

    If there is a lawsuit against Ford that makes it to trial, the witness for the defense is The US Government. Good luck with that!

     

    In Hyundai/Kia's case, they found that they had incorrectly calculated the Drag Coefficient on the car, and used the wrong aerodynamic results in the EPA tests. They discovered the error, and are paying for it. There is no such evidence or claims of errors in Ford's results.
    3 May 2013, 10:20 AM Reply Like
  • tyoung33
    , contributor
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    I have a C-Max and I get 38-40 without trying all that hard. And this is my first hybrid.
    3 May 2013, 09:03 AM Reply Like
  • Gosho
    , contributor
    Comments (58) | Send Message
     
    After those good news we can expect $F to go up by 0.00001% today, because as we all know - good news = massive upside day for $F :)
    3 May 2013, 09:24 AM Reply Like
  • panheadpj
    , contributor
    Comments (11) | Send Message
     
    We'll see,i'll wait,the new G.M. clean diesel with over 40 M.P.G.proven in Europe might be the way to go,when if ever do you think C.E.O.,s will stop the lies,answer never as long as they make money.
    3 May 2013, 09:41 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    Pan - The problem is, in Europe, their Imperial Gallon is 20% bigger than the US Gallon, and their fuel economy drive cycle is much easier on fuel consumption. Results from there must be corrected to US Gallons, and to the US EPA Drive Cycles, in order to properly compare.
    3 May 2013, 10:26 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    Also Pan - I've personally driven diesels (not GM) that show 50+ mpg (US) in steady-speed cruising at moderate speeds, but then less than 10 mpg when accelerating, and "99.9" mpg when decelerating (due to fuel being cut off when coasting and braking to a stop).
    3 May 2013, 11:22 AM Reply Like
  • cajuncarguy
    , contributor
    Comments (12) | Send Message
     
    While I love Ford I have to point out that this sales figure for Fusion Hybrid is wrong. The actual sales for the Ford Fusion Hybrid in April of 2013 was 3989, up by 400%, according the the official registrations as quoted in Detroit News article. Total Ford Motor Company hybrids in April was 8481 which includes Fusion and C-Max. Toyota still holds 58% of the US hybrid market, down from 71% from this time last year. Please check these articles for accuracy before publication.
    3 May 2013, 10:21 AM Reply Like
  • Joshua007
    , contributor
    Comments (39) | Send Message
     
    I thought the numbers seemed a little off, but I still think that ford has some of the best looking hybrids. The cost of gas going down is not going to affect the sales of hybrids in the future as much as it did in the past. Why? Because they are not as cost prohibitive anymore, as well as people realizing that fuel can always go up, and any temporary relief at the pump will not last indefinably. As more hybrids get made, the economies of scale make the components less expensive per unit, and as companies build more they will improve the technology. Now, I realize that they will always cost more than their standard engine counterparts, but the cost will not be astronomical and more and more people will opt for the higher MPG. Also, do not discount the effect of people becoming more and more environmentally conscious, especially in other markets across the world.
    4 May 2013, 11:39 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    There is another factor in quoting hybrid sales numbers. Automakers themselves quote new vehicle deliveries to dealerships as "sales". These are the numbers that get released from the Automakers early each month for the previous month, and those numbers are regulated under franchise sales laws. By law, Automakers sell products to the Dealerships, not directly to consumers, and it is those sales that they report.

     

    Other organizations tally up dealership deliveries to consumers, and rental and government fleets, etc., and new vehicle registrations in each state, to generate their numbers, using state registration records.

     

    The differences between the two numbers include such things as unsold dealership inventories, which may increase or decrease each month, and the differences in number of business / sales days each month as some dealerships operate on weekends while others do not, and other things like inventory build-up before model year changes, where automakers place vehicles on parking lots as reserves for dealerships while the factory is shut down for extended tooling changes, and old-school "channel stuffing", where dealerships are given large incentives to take on extra vehicles to sell down cancelled orders and unwanted production lots.

     

    Fortunately, most hybrids are selling off dealership lots rapidly these days, usually within a few days of arriving if not immediately on arrival, due to reservations and pre-orders with deposits, particularly in "greener" states like California. Folks are finally discovering that - at least in the case of Ford's hybrids - that there are no significant compromises in performance and comfort, and that the vehicles can be driven just as "hard" as their non-hybrid counterparts if desired (achieving comparable fuel efficiency numbers), or they can be driven carefully with "hyper-miling" techniques to very significantly beat the quoted EPA label fuel economy ("mpg") figures.
    5 May 2013, 08:56 AM Reply Like
  • Rufux Xavier
    , contributor
    Comment (1) | Send Message
     
    Unfortunately this discussion on the Ford Hybrids vs. Toyota Hybrids on most discussion boards ends up as a nationalistic debate i.e. American cars vs. Japanese cars. By the way the Fusion and C-Max are all European design. So far no noteworthy hybrid in the Ford line-up is a homegrown design. How come?
    16 May 2013, 12:40 AM Reply Like
  • Tdot
    , contributor
    Comments (5003) | Send Message
     
    RX: "By the way the Fusion and C-Max are all European design. So far no noteworthy hybrid in the Ford line-up is a homegrown design. How come?"

     

    Your question assumes some very false premises. First of all, Ford developed the original Escape Hybrid (2004-2012) and Fusion Hybrid (2010-2012) exclusively in the US

     

    For 2013 and beyond, the Hybrid Powertrain Systems (Regular and Plug-In versions) in both the C-Max and the Fusion were developed exclusively in the US, not in Europe. Those hybrid powertrains are not even available in Europe yet.

     

    While the current C-Max body and platform were originally developed in Europe, the integration of the Hybrid Systems required a redesign of the body structure to support the extra weight, and to meet crashworthiness requirements. That redesign for extra strength was done in the US, and is to be fed back to the European versions.

     

    While the previous Fusion/Mondeo ("CD3") was developed in Europe, but heavily revised in cooperation with Mazda for the US market, the New Fusion/Mondeo ("CD4") was developed exclusively in the US on an all new platform, and is also not available yet in Europe.
    16 May 2013, 05:32 AM Reply Like
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