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NoFate
150 Comments
Don't Fear an October Calamity
C'mon! A reduction in housing sales and MEW means a reduction in consumption. This means a reduction in GDP which will result in a recession.
We have just experienced a 5 year expansion based primarily on housing debt ...why would the reduction in that same debt not put a HUGE drag on the economy?
Of course maybe all the new jobs created by the new FORCLOSURE industry will be enough to dodge the recession bullet ...NOT!
Citigroup Upgrades Four Homebuilders In Attempt To Call Bottom
The C-S futures index on the CBT has houses bottoming in 2-3 YEARS! Citigroup analysts must be complete MORONS!!
Buybacks in Fashion, Market Headed Higher
Lets buy back our stock at the peak and increase stock prices. Like they always say ...buy high, sell low!
Christ ...put it in R&D or give out a dividend or buy another company ...but to buy your own stock at the peak???
I guess if the company does it, then it's supposed to be sophisticated or something ...it's still retarded in my view!
Things Have Normalized... Or Have They?
Sorry David, but I know you can do better than this! I like many of your other articles...
Is the S & P Expensive?
Do two things ...draw a horizontal line across the graph at about PE=18 and ignore the 90s (since it was a bubble). What you find is that 18 is close to the peaks in all cases ...and the valleys dip down to about 6.
The only other period it stays significantly above PE=18 is pre1929 ...of course this doesn't strengthen your argument either.
Final Note: A financial trick to determine expected return on a stock is to calculate 1/PE. When PE=18 you are expecting about a 5.6% return on your money. If this works for you then go for it.
Robert Shiller's Real Track Record
Robert Shiller's Real Track Record
Further, he is the best economist at predicting bubbles ...I don't think he would claim more than that.
Finally, for you to discredit him for more than that says more about you than it does Dr. Shiller.
Survey Says No Recession In Sight
You are comparing the numbers right after the NASDAQ crash and 9/11 to today and then draw conclusions from this?
The poll said that 2/3 of Americans thought they were in a recession or would be IN THE NEXT 12 months. That means you have to also show the 12 months prior to March 2001 to accurately compare. I'm guessing they don't look too different from today huh?
Wall Street and Main Street: How Long Before They Get it Right?
online.barrons.com/art...
Here are a couple choice quotes:
"The moral imperative that inspired Mr. Bernanke to take down interest rates half a point instead of a quarter was to ease the pressure off the reeling housing market. In the event, though, he managed to steepen the Treasury yield curve, which means that the longer-term obligations, which effectively determine the level of mortgage rates, went up. Not, we suspect, the ideal medicine for what ails homebuilding."
"It's also reckoned, they say, that a 15% decline in house prices -- not exactly outside the realm of possibility -- could wipe out $3 trillion of household net worth."
"The incidental devaluation of the U.S. dollar sent the price of crude, which is denominated in dollars, barreling to an all-time high above $84 a barrel before it paused to take a breath. And the fresh debasement of our coin, coupled with prospects of a surge in inflation, powered a spurt in gold to nearly $745 an ounce, the highest price since January 1980, when it hit $850 as bungling Bunker Hunt tried to corner the market for the yellow metal."
Wall Street and Main Street: How Long Before They Get it Right?
Regarding the growing housing inventory ...it is growing because few people are buying. When few people buy homes it puts people out of work. It also means they don't buy new things for their homes.
Also, when MEW dries up due to stricter lending and higher rates above $417k loans this is going to drive down consumption alot.
Further, when all these ARMs reset two things will happen. Some will walk away leaving the bank holding a huge loss. Others will pay the higher amount, but it will cut into their consumption since wages have been flat for 7 years. A small group will refi into 30 year fixed, but only people with excellent credit will qualify.
Anyway, the main point of this list was that these issues were generally unknown prior to July (except #6), yet the markets are nearly back to these high levels. What has happened that could possibly warrant this other than psychology?
I used to think the markets were future looking by 6-12 months, but I now think they actually look backward. After all, the market has been great for 5 years, so how could this possibly change??
Wall Street and Main Street: How Long Before They Get it Right?
1) Housing at a 9.5 month inventory and rising fast.
Wall Street and Main Street: How Long Before They Get it Right?
1) Housing at a 9/5 inventory and rising fast.
2) MEW dropping drastically in Q3 after credit tightening.
3) Rate of forecloseres more than doubling in August after credit tightening.
4) ARM resets peak 3-6 months from now (much higher than current).
5) Housing values declining for the first time since the depression (have you SEEN the Case-Shiller Index??).
6) Trillions in debt added because of the housing bubble.
7) US $ at a historic low.
8) Huge deficit spending by the government.
9) Mortgage companies and builders going bankrupt.
10) A run on an over leveraged bank in England.
11) Hedge funds leveraging exotic financial instruments (i.e. CDOs) 80 to 1.
12) Unknown risk from mortgage backed securities spread around the world.
13) Oil, Gold and other commodities at multi-year highs.
14) Equity PEs based on peak earnings expectations.
15) New Job creation went negative last month.
16) Durable goods sales are down, except for autos last month (which got HUGE incentives).
17) US Consumption very low in the Q2 GDP number.
Is that enough? I'm sure I could dig up more...
Do you think Ben dropped the rate 50bp because he just LIKES you guys? Something wicked this way comes my friend. The Fed sees it coming or they would not have dropped so far and sacrificed the dollar.
What Happened the Last Time the Fed Cut 0.5%?
Housing will take longer to unwind too though. In the tech bubble, VC dried up immediately, geeks were immediately laid-off and stocks dropped quickly. In housing we get the slow burn of housing defaults eating away at US consumption a bit at a time and chipping away at valuations.
But hey, if the dollar drops enough maybe our property will get so cheap foreigners will rush to buy it! We can all send our rent checks to China and Japan to help cover their loss in the value of their $2 trillion in US Treasuries!
Are More Signs of a Slowdown on the Way?
It goes deeper than that though. I'm no genious, but I figured out over a year ago that housing had peaked and this was going to end very badly based on the Case-Shiller Index. All the extra home equity money drying up, plus a huge oversupply of homes was going to create one hell of a nasty hang over. I didn't even know about CDOs or NINJA loans back then!
Consumer Confidence Number Comes Through
I honestly don't know, but if I had one thermometer telling me the temperature increased 0.4 degrees outside and another telling me it dropped 18.2 degrees, I would be very suspicious!
Anybody out there know what's up?