nakedjaybird

PHEVs and EVs: Plugging into a Lump of Coal

Thomas Brennen - actually, the old, comfortable path is very rewarding; the questions are: for whom, and how long???

Change for the sake of change is not necessarily beneficial; but, change to fix what is broken --- now, that's beneficial.

Knowing what's really broken is the key!!!!!

The rest is floundering, which looks very familiar.

PHEVs and EVs: Plugging into a Lump of Coal

Let's make that Dr. Chu.

PHEVs and EVs: Plugging into a Lump of Coal

Der Chu - are you listening??

PHEVs and EVs: Plugging into a Lump of Coal

JIC - regarding HYBRIDS ......

nakedjaybird: Comments (609) Follow

Fred Linn (and John) - as some of us know, in the near future (I'll tell you more after I've finished acquiring my positions - selfish greedy little me!), the ONLY ONBOARD STORED ENERGY in hybrid vehicles will be a small GRASS TANK refillable at every yet existing refueling pump dedicated to renewable non-food-chain-threate... BIOFUELS which will be burned in a NO-MOVING-PARTS BURNER (non-ICE) while capturing 70-80% of the energy in solid-state direct conversion THERMIONIC DEVICES for the electric drive HYBRID. Possibly, just possibly, they may be an onboard quick charge/discharge device, but small at best, and more than likely NOT an electrochemical device (why bother with all that messy manufacturing stuff to then contend with its charge/discharge inefficiencies). This market will grow in concert with the an exaggerated biofuels market (assuming aircraft demand does not cause an initial delay in the available biofuel supply).

Then, look out! As you well know, the first 10% reduction in crude consumption has already arrived (for the second time - the first being 1973!). So the world is awash in crude all the way to zero - while the folks continue to play their pricing games.

But the replacement market for the new hybrid vehicles need only grow at a few percent a year to make huge new markets for much stuff, while the crude traders die with buggywhips in their hands.

Aug 30 03:14 PM |Report abuse| Link | Reply 00

PHEVs and EVs: Plugging into a Lump of Coal

Dave Marsh - hey, I've got a novel idea for you; another Gov't program called "Nukes for Clunkers" (the coal type). That way the coal generators will be equally or overly compensated and won't have to totally waste their assets already sunk (not to mention the uproar and lobbying we'd see from the whole coal mining industry).

But, hey, maybe we can also compensate them somehow too.....we'll call it "OBAMASIZED".

Hey, even better, let's dismantle, ship and reconstruct all the US coal fired plants in China (and then sell China all of our coal - you know, why keep it - we'll never use it!! Everyone will be pleased!!). And then we can also export all our clean coal technology, services and equipment - help the trade imbalance.

That's what we should have done with all the auto clunkers instead of just squashing them - China could have used the vehicles til they wore out - (and helped keep the world oil demand up!); they're going to get the scrap iron, regardless!!!!

Marsh said- "John's last sentence about will power goes equally for nuclear power. It is not cost prohibitive when done properly, only when re-starting a dormant program as we have here. China is building 45 reactors, and twenty or so other countries are building nuclear plants also. I believe John spends time in France, where they derive >80% of their power from nuclear, have the cleanest air in Europe, and if they are not laughing at us, they should be. One hundred fifty two-unit plants could eliminate coal-burning completely. Staggered over twenty-five years it's completely possible, as is restarting fuel reprocessing which will close the loop on the nuclear fuel cycle, and qualify nuclear power as largely renewable. Onl then will your EVs become CO2 free and not "plugged into a lump of coal." Grid-scale storage for intermittent wind and solar is not going to be economically viable in our lifetimes, if ever. Storing a single ten-hour night's worth of power from a single two-unit nuclear plant (e.g. Diablo Canyon - two 1100 MW reactors) would require 22,000 Megwatt-hrs of storage, i.e. 22 million kilowatt-hrs. Even at $100/kW-hr, that's 2.2 trillion dollars. How absurd. No amount of Rube Goldberg "smart grid" shell-gaming will get around this. We need nuclear power to make things like pure EVs - largely recharging at night - viable over the long haul. As has become all too common, the rest of the world is passing us by, and we will deserve our fate. Step up to the plate Energy Secretary Chu." Aug 30 11:24 AM

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

PS - today's buggywhips even resemble Freddie Maes and Macs, Citi, etc.

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

Fred Linn (and John) - as some of us know, in the near future (I'll tell you more after I've finished acquiring my positions - selfish greedy little me!), the ONLY ONBOARD STORED ENERGY in hybrid vehicles will be a small GRASS TANK refillable at every yet existing refueling pump dedicated to renewable non-food-chain-threate... BIOFUELS which will be burned in a NO-MOVING-PARTS BURNER (non-ICE) while capturing 70-80% of the energy in solid-state direct conversion THERMIONIC DEVICES for the electric drive HYBRID. Possibly, just possibly, they may be an onboard quick charge/discharge device, but small at best, and more than likely NOT an electrochemical device (why bother with all that messy manufacturing stuff to then contend with its charge/discharge inefficiencies). This market will grow in concert with the an exaggerated biofuels market (assuming aircraft demand does not cause an initial delay in the available biofuel supply).

Then, look out! As you well know, the first 10% reduction in crude consumption has already arrived (for the second time - the first being 1973!). So the world is awash in crude all the way to zero - while the folks continue to play their pricing games.

But the replacement market for the new hybrid vehicles need only grow at a few percent a year to make huge new markets for much stuff, while the crude traders die with buggywhips in their hands.

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

Jack Lifton, Don and John - regarding FAST CHARGING: fourty years ago (yup 40 yrs), we were successfully fast charging (at 1 hr rates) large alkaline batteries (in excess of 20kwh) by pumping and cooling the electrolyte (since in alkaline cells the electrolyte only transfers the electrons and does not enter into the electrochemisty). The limit (within reason) is a function of the charger size and electrical supply. The concept has industrial or large service station application. Same concept would support flywheels.

Appropriately placed Bus stops with quick connects for respin; taxi recharge stations while in que at airports, etc.; even underground coal hauler connects at dump stations.

However, today, I'm most in favor of the small (to none) battery in a biodiesel hybrid for any type of individual commuter/short distance traveler.

And transit systems inside beltways for the masses.

And electrified ferries (above/alongside or in place of) the intra/interstates highways between major cities for people/hybrids and goods transport.

And the high speed trains along the high density corrridors of US coast lines and less than coast to coast busy ways if we don't put wheel-tugs on commuter planes; maybe even if we do.

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

Don - w.r.t. (with respect to) your comments:

Don Harmon: Comments (297) FollowBlog: lifebatt.com/•Biz.

Naked- Do you work for Chorus or are you an investor? Full disclosure please.

And also:

Don Harmon: Comments (297) FollowBlog: lifebatt.com/•Biz.

Naked - i seriously doubt anyone on this forum knows much about the Chorus solution except you! That would make your remark of my being "ignorant" apply to the rest of us here also? Those kind of remarks are common on other forums, but seldom seen here on SA, which is why i prefer to hang out here - peace!

oh - and keep your eyes open for Eestor as they are supposed to conquer the entire market with their true "game changer" any year now!

My answers remain:

Don - Investor! Or is it Inwestor?

Either way, w.r.t. (the company you do own and) Eestor: the Chorus motor, with Boeing participation, was demonstrated taxing a loaded Boeing 767 both forward and backwards on the strip during a hot summer day in Phoenix several years ago (without using it's main engines). The video can be seen on

wheeltug.gi

So some real proof exists. Roadblocks and fluff, on the other hand, are shameful. Aug 27 03:07 PM |Report abuse| Link | Reply 00

And if you are questioning the parenthetical "(and the company you own)" which refers to the company that comes up in your SA Profile, my reply w.r.t. that is that I'm just an inwestor in Chorus, which if being a shareholder still implies ownership, an owner, by default, by being an inwestor.

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

Sorry Don - didn't mean to imply that you were dumb or stupid, only lacking knowledge of the Chorus solution to not needing any Neodymium for electric motors, which you already knew - therefore, I'm not sure what to think! But I am overjoyed that you do know about it.

Peace!

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

Don - your "ignorance" stems from the fact that there is a solution requiring NO Neodymiun for motors as if you were ignorant to the fact that there was a solution AND since you have confessed knowing of it, makes your "IGNORANCE" even more serious.

As to the major car companies using, testing, etc. the Chorus - the car companies have been blind to many disruptive technologies which is one of the reasons they are in the trouble. The roadblocks are many, but the Chorus Technology is not the roadblock.

Maybe, just maybe, the hybrid airplane will have to lead the way if the form of Wheel-Tug, see

www.wheeltug.gi

In the meantime, maybe the other readers would like to be informed about the super motor that requires NO Neodymiun at

www.choruscars.com/cho...

Thanks for listening, and keep your eyes open for something "better".

How PHEVs and EVs Will Sabotage America's Drive for Energy Independence

John - right on! Simply stated: small battery hybrid.

Only thing better is: small battery biodiesel hybrid.

As for Don Harmon's ignorance: he needs to read about the Chorus Motor requiring no Neodymiun while surpassing existing magnet- motor performance at:

www/http:chorusmotor.gi

8 Energy Storage Stocks that Can Expect Explosive Growth

John - pumped hydro stuff-

www.hydroworld.com/ind...

8 Energy Storage Stocks that Can Expect Explosive Growth

John - over the weekend I toured Grand Coulee Dam; the first and largest dam on the Columbia at over 6000 MW (yup, in excess of 6 standard nuc plants at 1000 MW each). Of 6 generators in the third powerhouse, 1 or 2 were generating; all 6 were spinning (four were spinning on in-house power, not on water going thru the turbines). Each of these 6 are rated at roughly 500 MW each.

They are using hydro as peaking power (our CHEAPEST power is for PEAKING!).

They can produce power from the idling generators within 15 seconds (plug that into your regulation issue data bank).

However, what I wanted to reremind you of is that the Columbia and Snake with their 15-20 dams generate 50% of the hydro power in the US.

There are numerous (100's) steep, deep and long canyon-feeding opportunites for pumped hydro storage; three significant ones which can probably be googled. Grand Coulee's existing pumped hydro capacity is some 300 MW.

I have not read the pumped hydro reports you mention, but the manner in which the current dams are being operated as PEAKING POWER, and the fact that hydro is 20% of our US capacity (if not use), makes me wonder about how the planners are really planning and writing, etc.

By the way, LOT'S OF T&D CAPACITY must also be underutilized if this is how the Bonneville Power et.al. folks regulate dam generation.

White House Report: GM Volt Is Not Ready for Prime Time

Right on, John; time to push the "BULLSHIT" button.

We're talking about productive, effective, efficient transportation; moving cargo, goods, and people both long and short distances. Right Thinking Required!

Hence, more electrified steel-wheeled rails takes care of cargo and goods and gets that off the interstates and off of diesel (less imported oil - do I still have to say that?? Well yes, even if it's biodiesel/biofuels). And no, I have not given up on electrified interstate FERRIES for goods and people (and their hybrids).

Electrified high speed rail will handle the busy people between major cities and get them out of commuter planes and also off the interstates (ahem! - less oil).

Inside beltways, electified rails takes care of the willing (yet, selfish) commuter, softened maybe by some rubber tired diesel/hybrid buses to take care of the last mile, doorstep issues, both ends.

As for the willing flex-route commuter, it's going to be a small-battery biofuel-hybrid with waste heat recovery thermionics powering a ChorusMotor (same as the busses, only smaller).

All these are possible maybe without the gas tax if we stop subsidizing oil, gas, coal. And by the way John, don't push the compressed gas rigs; push the biofueled diesel which you like, as a small-batteried hybrid.

Are you listening Steven Chu??

SouthernCEO - as for your ilk, the selfish thrillseeker - you will always be around just as the maucho off-road bigwheeler - some of that is in us all; that's why whores exist and we have what's called Adultery - but what's your normal everyday ride; sans Shakespears "no sooner had than wished not"?