nakedjaybird

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

China and India have been hoodwinked to a degree. Any energy used for the past 60 years was patterned after many foreigners producing whatever in their country (chinese hydro) or their neighbors (the US has been consulting in India, etc., long before the 60's in chemicals, etc., plus many were educated and trained in the US, learning our ways). China recently announced they are not going to build 30 planned coal fired plants; they have made a commitment to solar, ...

Solar, wind, tidal have not been the first choice; China and many developoing countries has learned what pollution does and that there are now alternatives. They will switch just as Europe, Brazil, Switzerland, Germany, Spain, Holland when "foothold" power defeated - just as what the US is fighting right now in big oil, coal, etc. Alternatives have a difficult row to hoe. Just as defeating unions required elimination of mfg, outsourcing, etc. The energy transition will be slow but sure here and worldwide. Guess we just get to watch, should we live that long.

Do you think hydro would have ever made it in the US if it was strickly based on private business push and cost/benefit analysis?

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

We have all been paying the freight for import, import, import and will also pay for drill, drill, drill, regardless; it just got a little more expensive recently. So we might as well pay for solar and wind now for a little while and then no more, which is not true for drill, drill, drill or import, import, import.

Where were they and/or what happened to all the objectors to oil rigs during the last 100 years (while farmers throughout the Nation huggged and blessed their windmills)?

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

I hear you old wizard - yes, let's contine producing from what we already have in place and import all we can, while drill no new and we like crazy reduce the crude consumption via every possible method with as much emphasis as possible. Every reduction in consumption can come off our own production first (like it has for 30 years) if we want to keep our resources in the ground for the future for many reasons, and then apply our reductions in crude to imports (unless gasoline goes to $10/gas and the balance of trade becomes an even higher priority, which some say it is at $5, but I won't believe it until we start reducing crude consumtption seriously).

We must address our consumption with more than mileage targets, clean air reasons, etc, and Al Gore tribe global warming noise. Deliberate conversion from crude to many free "somethings else" in parallel, like a house afire. Again, we are a very resourceful people under wise leadership.

Hey, according to this mornings paper even Al Gore agrees with 1/2 of my argument (no hydrocarbons for POWER GENERATION; now if we can convince folks of no hydrocarbons for TRANSPORTATION). So, now we're getting somewhere; well the Democrats are. Goodness! If the drill, drill, drill Republicans are not careful this election will go to the Dems. And they (the Republicans deserve it -and I am one; well, have been one!).

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Obviously, what sickens me is that too few folks address the fact that of all the consumed crude we both import AND produce which is then burned in TRANSPORTATION (85% of the ~20+ mbbl/day or the ~40 Quads/yr), only 7 Quads is actually converted to useful energy, while 80% of the energy is wasted in exhaust stacks, cooling water, tail pipes, etc.

Whereas, if crude-based TRANSPORTAION were electrifed, requiring even fewer than those 7 Quads of useful enengy for the same work, and those < 7 Quads were supplied from "forever available on the surface" solar, wind, tidal, etc., at current conversion efficiencies which are pure gain, we would need only to add to the 12 Quads of electricity we already generate, transmit and distribute from source to end user.

We know how to electrify and find wind, sand and water to do solar, wind and tidal, etc.

We should strive much more to put solar and wind into place than to ever explore and drill or mine coal, oil, or gas, etc.; it would be simpler and easier, including the electrification of TRANSPORTATION, starting with the diesel-electric rails, and the others to be built, etc.......

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

And here's additional wind to existing facilities: successful.

Siemens To Power Washington State with 130 Wind Turbines Apr 1, 2008 ... Siemens To Power Washington State with 130 Wind Turbines. ... wind farm and 58 for the Windy Flats wind farm near Goldendale, Washington. ...

azom.com/News.asp?News... - 40k - Cached - Similar pages

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Theoldwizard- here's some wind for you:

www.pse.com/SiteCollec...

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Ithinkbig - we'll get our answers in the future to the quandry you have and also those questions the rest of us have. U cn cont on it.

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Right, Felix - I'm going to go mow the lawn while it's green and growing.

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Alternatives may be our Nation's BEST DEFENSE!!

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Solar, wind, nuclear, tidal, geothermal, bio and go totally electric without burning natural hydrocarbons of any sort would be a better use of all our resources than all the manhours and dollars consumed in the complex industry cobwebs of coal, oil, and gas including the regulation, legal, politics, lobbiests, power folks, etc. We should just shut down all of those industries and retrain everyone for alternatives and total electric (no new lobbiests allowed). Hey, at least we don't have to bother with all the manufacturing lost during the past 30 years. And many of the new services, well they are already in India etc. So, create some more old rust belt and new silent underground, while we go electric above ground. We know how to do it all, without drill, drill, drill.

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

And possibly SECURE OUR NATION'S FUTURE - now that would really be an unintended consequence.

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Oh yes, and in the above process we may also SECURE OUR ECONOMIC AND FINANCIAL FUTURE - UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES!!!

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Amen, old wizzard (except for the drill, drill, drill stuff).

Build, buid, build alternatives and convert, convert, convert to electric as if time-was-of-the-essenc... a Manhattan Project or Moon Program emphasis for stopping the burning of crude in TRANSPORTAION and coal and natural gas in GENERATION.

Result 1: Emergency situation solved within 5 years;

Result 2: Future secured in 10 years.

In the meantime import, import, import; and if that fails, we automatically conserve, conserve, conserve, just like we did in the 70's: we know how to do that; and it hurts - but apparently not enough to stop using it. DUH!

The differnce this "meantime" is we wean ourselves off the CONSUMPTION of oil, gas, and coal with methods that provide use of free and readily available energy, forever, at whatever conversion efficiency which is pure gain, and leave the hydrocarbons in the ground - even better than digging the gold or oil to again just store it in the ground - and that not only secures our future, but makes us basically energy independent FOREVER - NOW THAT'S A GOAL. MAKE IT A POLICY. AND, OF COURSE, THEN DO IT!

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

And, if only 20% (5.3 Quads of 40 Quads) of oil/gas becomes useful TRANSPORTATION work why not electrify it and use ZERO crude. Now that's putting a dent in it!

We already produce and handle over 12 Quads of electricity with our existing grid - so lets increase it to 18 Quads (which we know how to do). That would require 5 Quads (per year) of new electric generation by wind and solar and tidal and geothermal and new nuclear; all of which is less than we now produce with our current 100 nuclear plants in the US.

RESULT: Crude consuption in TRANSPORTATION goes to ZERO.

Now, that's a target; it should become a policy.

Go Boone. Get that wind going. Stop burning the natural gas.

And when we've done that, make more solar and wind electricity and stop burning coal to make 50% of our electricity, of which 60% is waste heat (not electrical transmission and distribution losses, which are minimal). NOW WE ARE REALLY MAKING PROGRESS.

GET IT???

Offshore Drilling Isn't the Answer - Supply and Demand Is

Madman - I did read your post. Maybe $10 gasoline will finally push you to stop commuting with your gas guzzling truck.

If you study the chart I suggested above, you will note that 64% of all hydrocarbons (25.7 of 39.8 Quads) goes to TRANSPORTATION, whether gas or diesel doesn't matter. Only 14% goes into non-fuel uses.

AND, actually 80% of all that energy is wasted; only 5.3 of 25.7 Quads becomes useful work.

Study the chart. It may give a mathman plenty of new ideas.