elcopone

Optimistic About Ford

Mad, most of the time I enjoy your comments, but this time I think you're a bit off. There is good reason why Toyota and GM will be slower to market and less fuel effiicient with their electric models. Two words for you... safety and reliability. If you take Hyundai as a history lesson you learn that they came to the US with unsafe and unreliable cars. As a result they have been spending the last 20 years trying to prove that their cars are safe and reliable. Despite independent proof their cars are indeed safer and more reliable then virtually everyone, they have yet to shed that image.

So before you start crowning some Chinese company as the next big thing, understand that they have yet to prove they have either safety standards that are required or the reliability that is demanded. Many smart companies have gone belly up trying overcome these two major hurtles before. Additionally, Toyota has not launched these products not because they have inferior technology, but because they understand that all it takes is one battery exploding to ruin a 50 year reputation. Besides, there are about 200-300 auto companies in China already competing on the same value proposition.

I'm just saying, lots of question marks there, and I'm not ready to anoint them just yet.


On Jun 30 01:45 PM Mad Hedge Fund Trader wrote:

> Yes, but will they be able to beat BYD? Like Paul Revere on his midnight
> ride, I feel a patriotic duty towarn you of the foreign invasion
> that is headed our way. No I’m nottalking about the British, but
> redcoats of a more Eastern origin. I’mreferring to the Chinese electric
> car company “Build Your Dreams” (seekingalpha.com/symbo...
> www.byd.com/company.php). CEO Wang Chuan-Fu, who Charlie Munger
> describes as a combination ofGeneral Electric’s (seekingalpha.com/symbo...)
> legendary manager, Jack Welch, and inventorThomas Edison, scraped
> up $300,000 from relatives to start a knock off cell phone battery
> company in Shenzen in 1995. He grew the company into a massive, vertically
> integrated conglomerate, employing 130,000workaholics at 11 factories,
> including those in Hungary, Romania, andIndia (interesting choices).
> BYD bought a defunct car company in 2003and re-engineered it to launch
> the $22,000 F3DM sedan last year, an old technology ferrous oxide
> based plug-in hybrid that gets 62 miles on a charge. General Motors
> (seekingalpha.com/symbo...) Volt and Toyota’s (seekingalpha.com/symbo...)
> plug in Prius,which won’t come out until next year, will only get
> 40 miles per chargeand cost more. All-electric models are coming
> out this year. WarrenBuffet was so impressed, he made a rare foreign
> investment last year,asking for a 25% stake and settling for 10%
> for $230 million. Wang, who has already earned himself a place on
> the Forbes 400 list, intends to build BYD into the world’s largest
> automaker, and quickly. Why do Ifeel like this war is over before
> the first shots were even fired?

Why I'd Buy Toyota, The #1 Automaker in the U.S.

Great article with fantastic points. I couldn't agree more. As always, it all about the product. Something Mr. Toyoda clearly understand.

John, spreading lies only hurts you and your UAW buddies in the end. Evidence on 9/11 contributions...

www.snopes.com/rumors/...
web.archive.org/web/20...

Also, many GM vehicles sold in the US are actually produced in Mexico, Canada, and soon yes, China. So what really is an American car company anyway???



On Jun 26 01:21 PM John Eickholt wrote:

> Has Toyota help to build a American Hospital? Ford and GM have. What
> did Toyota give after 9/11? But Americans gave them free land and
> tax abatements for years. Toyota still imports almost 50% of what
> they sell here. I say lets hope Americans wake up and support American
> Co's.
> When our Governments lets foreign products in this country cheaper
> than where they were made. Its very sad. The Prius is 100% built
> in Japan and sold for $1000 less here.

Why I'd Avoid Toyota, The #1 Automaker in the U.S.

That's an utter and complete lie. Evidence please? Here, I have done your work for you...

www.snopes.com/rumors/...

web.archive.org/web/20...


On Jun 23 11:50 AM Richard/Babyface wrote:

> If Americans like driving Japanese cars so much, they should move
> there.I agree that the automakers did not do themselves any good
> building cars with problems, but it is time for ALL Americans to
> support american made products and companies.
> After 9/11, Gm,Chrysler and Ford donated $10 Million each to our
> cause. Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi and Suzuki donated a total
> of ZERO!
> If you want to support companies that are one sided towards their
> own,then buy imported products. I question your loyaltyas an American.

Why I'd Avoid Toyota, The #1 Automaker in the U.S.

"fearsome of competitors – government owned companies"

You're kidding right... The beuracratic, self-serving, special interest driven, US Gov. as a "fearsome competitor?"

And Jimmy I understand your point, however, there is a huge difference between partnering for success and outright ownership.

Closing Car Dealerships: Congress Says 'Not So Fast'

"Bailey Wood, a lobbyist for the National Automobile Dealers Association, which is pushing the legislation"

Why any lobbyist is allowed to "push" legislation is beyond me. The NADA have virtually written state franchise laws with no regard for anything but themselves. The fact that our elected officials jump to there every demand is disgusting.

Why Ford Is a Goner

The one other point that will do Ford in is the fact that they have the most debt of any automaker at the moment. If it wasn't for them getting "lucky" by refinancing that debt right before the credit markets exploded, they would have been in the exact same situation as GM and Chrysler.

Nasty Implications of the UAW Owning Too Much of the Auto Industry

Regardless of where the ownership of GM's shares reside over at the UAW, please explain why the interests of UAW should be any more or less protected than a) the interests of the state of Indiana's secured bonds b) previous bankruptcy laws and precedents c) the interests of all other bondholders? Additionally, why should they be entitled to more than their secured interests?

Please enlighten me.


On Jun 08 05:44 AM ROBERTGM wrote:

> I feel that a lot of people don't understand that the money is not
> going to the UAW. Its is going into a fund for the workers that is
> part of their wages that is owed to them for the work they already
> have done on the production line and the workers already made a profit
> for the stock and bond holders they had already recieved over the
> yeats. GM pays their electric bill, their bill for parts, etc., etc.
> this is GM'Slabor bills that they owe too & needs to be paid
> before any profit is paid to anyone else. Thank you.

Ford: Will Mulally Be Able to Continue His Masterful Job?

Talking purely on product, Ford does seem to have momentum (very recently) and for that Mullay should be praised. Sure, he's had a product blunder here and there (See: Taurus, I mean 500, err I mean Taurus), but overall the lineup has been moving in the right direction.

As others point out though, the debt structure is not sustainable. It may have bought them some time but they still have a tremendous debt burden, too large a dealer body, large legacy costs, and a unionized work force. This all points to continued losses.

But again, talking purely product and marketing, he has done a good job for a "non car guy."

More on White House's Strong-Arming of Chrysler Hedge Fund Hold Outs

First, the only one here with even a morsal of sanity is Alfredo Martinez.

Second, the political bickering/name-calling... fingers between the Repubs and Dems is just sickening. As an Inde, both parties disgust me as I fell BOTH parties are now "Party First" with neither having any real altruistic motives. Both parties have been reduced to extremmely biased, whining, cry-babies with nothing real to say.

GM Forcing More than 1,000 Dealerships to Close

David is correct in that they will look to act on technicalities within the dealer franchise agreements. While I agree that they are fully within their rights, state franchise laws are the "greesiest" laws around. They favor the dealer tremendously. GM, Ford and Chrysler know this and is why they have never attempted to dramatically reduce their dealer network before (despite the obvious need). What will happen is the dealers who are shut down will sue GM. They will either battle in court or GM will probably end up paying them. State franchise laws are an absolute gold mine for lobbyists (and politicians) and one could look at these laws as a very clear example of just how corrupt our elected officials are.

Warning: U.S. Auto Crash Ahead

I agree that the Fiat deal is simply absurd. However, I'm not sure of this "crash" you speak of. Are you talking a crash of car sales, stock prices, and/or companies? It is not clear to me in your post.

I think a good argument can be made that after the short-term supplier chain disruption, the remaining OEM's could be looking at 5-25% of the US market share up for grabs. Long-term this is very positive for the remaining automakers.

Looks Like GM, Chrysler Are Goners

We are learning that our governement not only makes poor business decisions, but they also have no clue how to negotiate!

Cars: What It Means to 'Buy American'

It pains me when people say that all "Foreign company profits leave the US". It's funny, you would think on a site like SA people would actually understand the stock market.

True the profits go back to the company's home country. However in this thing called the "stock market", companies pay these things called "dividends", to these other people called "shareholders". And guess what, they pay the dividend to shareholders regardless of where they call home. So if you are an american and want some of Toyota's profits, you can have some. Buy the stock and part of the profits actually do come back to you. Buy enough of the stock and it is no longer a foreign company.

Toyota Motors: A Fantastic Short if We Soon Retest Market Lows

While I think you may be right, in that shorting TM may be a good move, I totally disagree on how you come to that conclusion.

For me, the reason to short TM is due to the general economy and weakness in auto sales. To suggest that TM is going to lose business to the "lil 3" is absurd in the short-term. Don't forget that TM has already come down from their highs in the 130's. This is not a company on the brink of bankruptcy like the American counterparts. To compare the two in this fashion is laughable. TM is making the hard decisions and cutting costs faster than GM could even dream of. TM R&D budget still outpaces GM by 10:1.

You mention Prius sales slowing but forgot to mention that this is completely typical of any car leading up to a new version coming out. You do know that the all-new Prius is coming out in May, right? Which is why sales for the Prius has slowed.

Cash for Clunckers is very short-sighted and may provide a one-time boost. Ultimately this does not lead to a sustainable advantage.

In sum, you may be right about shorting TM, but to suggest that they warrent a single-digit price like the "little 3" is rediculous.

Five Reasons Not to Buy American Cars

Second, for all the "buy american" people out there, I'm assuming you also don't believe in free markets and capitalism as well. Oh wait, you do believe in that unless you have a self interest in the matter. Let me ask you, have you purchased a new TV lately? Did you buy American there? Why not? Do you own a watch? Did you buy American there too? The list goes on and on....

Fact of the matter is that most people buy the best product for them, period. This is clear by the 20-yr decline in American market share. GM assembles some cars in Mexico and Canada, while Honda and Toyota assemble some cars in the US. The parts from both come from all over the world. In today's global economy the lines between American and Not-American are so blurred that no matter how hard you try you are always supporting a foreign company in some way.

By the way, true the profits go back to the company's home country. However there is this thing called the stock market, where companies pay these things called dividends, to these people called shareholders. And yes, they pay the dividend to shareholders regardless of where they call home. So if you want some of Toyota's profits, you can have some. Even if you're a yankee.