dw57

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

there wasn't that much in the old gold standard days. all they had to do was change the exchange rate. or mine more gold. or both. it never stopped any of the governments before


On Jul 07 04:08 PM DONE_SONZ wrote:

> In a fiat monetary system, there is no restrain on the amount of
> money that can be created. This allows unlimited credit creation.
> Initially, a rapid growth in the availability of credit is often
> mistaken for economic growth, as spending and business profits grow
> and frequently there is a rapid growth in equity prices. In the long
> run, however, the economy tends to suffer much more by the following
> contraction than it gained from the expansion in credit. This expansion
> in credit can be seen in the Debt/GDP ratio.

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

well so far they have been. its been the baby boomers that have driven the economy. we have had the majority of income and spending. the other generations don't have the incomes to be really big spenders. they do spend on other things that maybe relative to their incomes sizable. but they haven't driven the economy yet


On Jul 07 03:02 PM bricki wrote:

> I too hope future generations reject the mad materialism of the past
> few decades.
>
> However I think that demographics isn't as favorable a factor as
> you might think. Retirees will soon realize that being dead and bankrupt
> is no different from being dead and solvent and will not feel constrained
> in their borrowing.
>
> The gen x cohort that echos the baby boom is the second largest generation
> in the history of the US, and is just entering their prime consumer
> years.
>
> And of course the final driving factor behind consume until the economy
> drops, modern marketing and advertising is becoming more sophisticated
> with time. Today's young adults are well brain-washed by modern media.
>
>
> On Jul 07 02:45 PM Fred Voetsch wrote:

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

wonder what you did wrong. so far they have cut taxes. and haven't spent much of stimulus.


On Jul 07 04:16 PM Pstoneki wrote:

> Which of your taxes have gone up due the new administration? Can
> you be specific with your statement?

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

well if what you mean national default is that you and I and the business community default, you may be correct. that is the largest by far of the debt that is outstanding.


On Jul 07 12:40 PM Jeff Nielson wrote:

> Superb article, and many insightful comments. I believe I detect
> the influence of a couple of my own favorite commentators/analysts
> in the author's writing, notably John Williams and Chris Martenson.
>
>
> Yes, the big-picture numbers do not lie. The "terminus point" regarding
> U.S. debt has already been reached - and exceeded.
>
> What the author does NOT include in his analysis is that once beyond
> this "tipping point" of indebtedness, this implies national default
> as an eventual outcome - and likely sooner than later.

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

besides most of that stimulus is tax cuts


On Jul 07 11:18 AM baldskits wrote:

> Corporations do not pay any taxes now!

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

some of your observation have already happened without any new taxes and even with tax cuts!
we had the lowest job growth in a long time. we will have less than we had in 1999 soon.
we had the lowest incomes in decades. we will soon back to 1990 levels.
people are already (and have been for a while now) challenging the rational for higher education. ROI on it has been negative for some time as the jobs you get with it, tend to be easily sent else where.
and that doesn't include the seeming national thought that its not worth it anyh way


On Jul 07 01:34 PM Chancer wrote:

> With a reduction in growth rates, comes reduction in tax revenue
> to pay for massive debt. That requires either increased tax rates,
> but not enough rich people to pay the highest rates; therefore, new
> taxes, as in VAT.
>
> VAT may start low to get it enacted; but will ramp up rapidly to
> increase cost of goods (and possibly services) throughout society.
> VAT revenue must be large enough to convince foreign treasury investors
> (China and Japan) that US is serious about paying down debt.
>
> That will suck more out of economic growth, increase national cost
> of living, reduce the savings rate, and prevent many Americans from
> owning a home, as they cannot make a payment nor save enough for
> a down payment. That will reduce housing demand and the driver of
> higher home prices.
>
> Unemployment will be permanently higher. US business profits and
> growth will be flat. The value of a college education, especially
> considering the cost, will be seriously questioned, as good jobs
> won't be there for graduates.
>
> Liberal democrats will push for even more socialism to solve the
> problems created by socialism.
>
> There is nothing positive in America's future unless you are a socialist.

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

well we gave them tax cuts.

and we got

nothing but a credit blown economy from it

and how is that working for us now?


On Jul 07 01:18 PM kohalakid wrote:

> I think the point he was making is that corporations are effectively
> just tax collectors for government. An increase in corporate tax
> rates doesn't mean less profit for the corporations. It means they
> increase their prices to compensate, and become less competitive
> on a global basis.
> On the other hand, if tax rates are lowered, it allows corporations
> to cut prices and become more competitive on a global basis, hire
> more workers etc etc.
>
> Lower taxes = more economic activity.

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

oddly enough the current stimulus that has been done so far is all TAX CUTS! there has been little else done as of yet.
and the results of these tax cuts has been underwhelming as usual!


On Jul 07 09:03 AM dixie wrote:

> Discard the present costly "stimulus" focused on the public sector.
>
>
> Instead, cut the corporate tax rate by 50% for two years and eliminate
> all capital gains taxes for the same period. We must jump-start
> innovation and investment.

California - And by Extension the U.S. - Headed for Permanently Smaller Economy

i doubt that we get either choice. we have seen the unshackled economy that runs roughshod over consumers and employees. and the predictable results of that are seen today. we have shipped so much of the jobs that consumers used to pay for this economy and those that remained have had collapsing incomes.
if we continue doing that, we won't have to worry about economic growth. as there won't be any.
and income growth is the only way to have real sustainable growth. some thing we have forgotten

and


On Jul 07 06:00 AM User 353732 wrote:

> Soon the American voters(not the people as a whole) will be forced
> to make a choice they have , so far, refused to make: a permanently
> larger and corrupt Govt and a shackled economy that produces far
> below its potential or a much smaller , more transparent and reformed
> Govt and a regenerated economy that produces wealth and income at
> a rate noticeably higher than population growth.
> Essentially, it is choice between the new world and the old world,
> oligarchy and democracy, the smothering of the American Dream
> for 75 to 80% of Americans or for the renewal and restoration of
> the American Dream for all who really want it.
> In refusing ,so far, to choose, we have indeed chosen to elevate
> entitlements over obligations, consumption over production, penalties
> over incentives and delusion over reality. We have convinced ourselves
> that we are exempt from the laws of economics and even of nature.
>
> There was nothing inevitable or fated about America's great and inspiring
> rise over the past 100 years or even its improbable and remarkable
> birth. It was a result of hard choices made and ideals honored with
> sacrifice and perseverance.
> There is nothing inevitable about America's decline and fall either.
> It is happening because of choices made( actively or by default)
> and ideals casually or wilfully dishonored.
> There is certainly time yet to recall and renew what made America
> exceptional, great and inspiring but there is not much time. In a
> few years the window will close and we will not be able to count
> on either the kindness of strangers or our legacy to rescue us.<br/>
>
> American elites tell the people no choices need be made since all
> is under (their) control and all will be well.
> The first decision for the American voters, then, is to stop believing
> or being intimidated by the self annointed and self perpetuating
> elites. In that decision is also the choice between renewed freedom
> , prosperity and national security or a growing and irreversible
> serfdom.