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Deere: Incredible Company, But Still A Cyclical

May 20, 2023 9:55 PM ETDeere & Company (DE)39 Comments
Philip Eriksson profile picture
Philip Eriksson
1.16K Followers

Summary

  • DE is pioneering the next huge phase of productivity growth in agriculture since the first tractors were brought to the market.
  • Tractor autonomy, see and spray technology, drone usage, digitalization, and electrification drive DE's LEAPS ambitions.
  • The LEAPS ambitions will reduce DE's cyclical sales cycles, with The Company estimating 10% recurring revenue by 2030.
  • While share prices are around all-time highs, remember, DE is still prone to cyclicality.
  • Wait until a downturn in demand to buy DE shares.

John Deere Vintage Classic Tractor Show with US flags

Wirestock/iStock Editorial via Getty Images

Investment Thesis

Deere & Company (NYSE:DE) is historically a cyclical company that experiences swinging sales cycles, depending on demand for equipment from farmers and construction companies. For example, I find that Deere's share price is correlated

This article was written by

Philip Eriksson profile picture
1.16K Followers
I believe that successful investing boils down to the following question: is this company important and why? A company's financials are or will be a reflection of that. I want to invest in companies that I believe are / will be important and hold them over the long term. I have 7 years of investing experience and ardently follow company performance. I am currently a master's student at the Stockholm School of Economics. I hope that my insights and our discussion will lead to better long-term investments.

Analyst’s Disclosure: I/we have a beneficial long position in the shares of DE either through stock ownership, options, or other derivatives. I wrote this article myself, and it expresses my own opinions. I am not receiving compensation for it (other than from Seeking Alpha). I have no business relationship with any company whose stock is mentioned in this article.

Seeking Alpha's Disclosure: Past performance is no guarantee of future results. No recommendation or advice is being given as to whether any investment is suitable for a particular investor. Any views or opinions expressed above may not reflect those of Seeking Alpha as a whole. Seeking Alpha is not a licensed securities dealer, broker or US investment adviser or investment bank. Our analysts are third party authors that include both professional investors and individual investors who may not be licensed or certified by any institute or regulatory body.

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Comments (39)

The Stock Stooge profile picture
While farm incomes are pointing down from the 2022 peak, expected farm incomes this year are still really great and support farmer purchases of DE equipment sufficient for $30 EPS. I don't see farmer incomes dropping much further considering low global grain stocks that need to be replenished. In fact, farmer incomes could increase due to lower fertilizer and shipping costs.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@The Stock Stooge very interesting perspective, thank you! You are right that incomes will still be high over the next year. But the question is rather about 2,3,4 years from now?
f
Deere up 5.24%. Agco up 6.97%. United Rentals up 6.57%. Caterpillar up 8.39%. Economy looking better after job report today. Also,congress agreed to settlement on debt fiasco. So,that is another worry off the table for the economy. Is it a beginning to an upside in the industrial sector? Time will tell! Many AI companies had a down day today! Valuation concerns? Perhaps its the beginning to a sector turnaround! When the dust clears, profitable companies stock price will eventually go up. Fundamentals matter in the long term! Technical and momentum trading matters in the short term! Your not going to get rich off of Deere stock unless you invest much money but it has been a steady performer over the years. Much better than Verizon or AT@T! 5 year return for Deere stock is up 136%. Verizon minus 30%. AT@T minus 40%! What good is a 5-6 percent dividend when you keep having stock losses! Deere stock might not be as sexy as Nvidia or Amd, but its much less volatile.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@foxtown Agreed! And it may be even more sexy than Nvidia & AMD when it releases fully autonomous products ;)
f
Yes, I will look up autonomous products coming up from Deere. The big thing is cost. If they can keep the cost down, it could be very profitable for Deere. Of course another thing is reliability.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@foxtown yes great point! 👌
f
I don't know how Deere can be classified as overvalued when revenue has been up 30-40 percent for the past three quarters. Also,their EPS has gone up big time compared to historic averages. If you look at the stocks Agco,United Rentals, and Caterpillar they been under the slow bleed for the past few months. Very similar stock charts. All these stocks have also been very good in terms of their profitability but their stock price does not reflect that. It seems like it is just a sector downturn and in the long term these stocks will rebound. On the opposite side, the AI craze has been nuts. There are companies that are rising big time though they are not very profitable now. Its all based on speculation of what they possibly can make! It seems like these industrials are being dragged down by the speculation of a future recession. If a recession does happen next year, Deere should still be OK. The basic need for people is food. The problem it seems is that Deere is in a bad sector right now. Profitable companies can still go down in a bad sector. Non profitable companies can still go up in a good sector. Lately that's been the tech sector!
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@foxtown Yes I agree with you, it has been crazy following the market in the past few weeks! And Deere will be doing really well in the long-term and don't have a problem if we enter a recession. But, they are definitely not as immune to the downturn as they might be in 5-10 years. I'm looking forward to them rolling out consumption based AI features (See & Spray + Autonomous driving) which will lower the cyclicality since farmers plant every year regardless of the price of crops.
P
Nah, they ll be pumping Deere to 500, just need some Ai powered tractor 🚜.
H
@Paul.Y

Already exists, though it's not widespread yet. See & Spray is widely available, though. AI-controlled herbicide spraying.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Paul.Y should be coming with higher adoption in the coming years!
H
I see the value in See & Spray. If you're going to use herbicides, you might as well use less of them. That saves money and has environmental benefits as well. But I'm not sure about autonomous tractors. Growing row crops like corn and soybeans is already extremely labor-efficient. It seems like the area where automation would be a huge labor saver in agriculture is with tasks like picking fruit and vegetables. Does Deere have any plans in the works to address that aspect of farming?
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@HPBunker I see what you mean there. But, one thing is that autonomous tractor allows farmers to work longer hours with the help of autonomy (for ex. the tractors can run at night). Fruit picking & vegetables would be huge, I agree. I can't find anything concrete on it right now, but I have seen that Deere has a joint venture with a company providing autonomous vehicles for fruit farmers.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@HPBunker fruitgrowersnews.com/...
here it is. Not picking fruit yet, but spraying.
H
@Philip Eriksson

Interesting. Thanks for the link.
R
Really good piece, thank you, I learned alot.

Which is actually troubling because I started buying yesterday!
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Robin Heiderscheit hehe well thank you for the read! It could be good to purchase a little bit at a time with Deere. I still think your investment will do well long term!
T
I love the idea of holding Deere for the long haul, but it doesn't generate enough FCF to justify this valuation, imo. I can't bring myself to pay a massive premium for a company so sensitive to interest rates and commodity prices.
d
My rough estimate, the stock needs to be close to 200 (+/-) to be a fair price.
T
@ding dong That seems pretty fair. I was thinking a little higher but not much. At that valuation, they would still have cash flow concerns but some of that cyclicality risk is taken out.
d
DE was an OK stock until 2020, when it went parabolic. In 2020 the deranged Fed threw so much money into the economy that stocks went up.

DE is not very expensive based on their PE ratio, but as you point out it is highly dependent on farm income and I suspect the farm income will fall over the next few years and DE's EPS will also fall, thus DE may end up being expensive on forward earnings (classic cyclical pattern.)
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@ding dong yep agree, and its easy to ignore or 'forget' when times are as good as they are now for DE.
d
You state in your summary that share prices are around all-time highs. The 52 week high was $448.40, now trading at $363.55-am I missing something?
j
@duinmd I was going to write the same thing - It is ~ 20% off it’s high. Thanks
I
@duinmd Correct, it is down 18% from its ATH. Zooming out to >5 year time horizon, though, the author probably views this as essentially at ATH and a much larger correction due. (I'm not agreeing or disagreeing)
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Integr8byDarts @joelav @duinmd Hey good point, you are all right about that. I wasn't so precise with my wording there, and I just meant it to say over the long term it is around all-time highs. As @ding dong mentioned above, Deere went 'parabolic' after 2020. But, i do believe the stock price growth is merited since DE's margins have grown, sales have grown like crazy, and new product launches have been impressive. Thanks for the feedback :)
slam stocks profile picture
DE is cyclical and regretted selling years ago. Bought at $13 and later sold for $95. It was a huge mistake and repurchased recently on the dips at $387.

There is so many reasons the stock is a buy. Growing population, global warming, decline crop yield, smaller workforce, fertilizer costs, Ukraine etc. Automation and efficiency to feed the world will depend on companies like DE.

It was a huge mistake selling years ago and will continue adding shares on further weakness.
d
387 may have been too soon. I think on a trend line from 2010 to 2020 projected in the future when the EPS reaches the trend and the PE is about its average PE from 2010 to 2020 is when it will be a good buy.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@slam stocks Ah man, well you got a good upside at least. This time, don't sell! Deere might just be worth holding for 20-30 years especially with their LEAPs ambitions.
R
@slam stocks well I can top you for stupidity, having bought DE at $37 in I believe 2001 and sold at $39 the same year!
S
Thanks for sharing your insights. There are tens of thousands small farmers that keep chugging along. Companies like DE are going to change that (over time) by giving the big/more sophisticated farmers the ability to offer landlord $100+ more per acre than the mom & pops. The bigs will be able to do that via technology (think DE) wholesale pricing of inputs, less labor/acre, etc. I agree with your current thesis, but I’m looking for the day (maybe 5-6 years out) when DE is able to expand its market due to this massive shift I see coming.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Skih20 Interesting idea. So to clarify, do you think that big farmers will expand their acreage share over time since they better/ more efficient technology?
S
I am a very happy long-term investor in DE with a cost-basis about 30.50, and I have no inclination to sell,-- even aside from the tax liability on disposition. The major concern I have currently is with the "right to repair": www.cnn.com/... 'The memorandum of understanding with the American Farm Bureau Federation (AFBF) gives farmers access to the same Deere documentation, data and diagnostic tools used by the company’s authorized repair shops. Farmers will be able to diagnose and fix broken down equipment on their own or by choosing an independent repair facility, which will also have access to the proprietary tools and data on the same fair and reasonable terms, according to the MOU.'
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Sugar Charlie great point. I agree with you on this, it certainly is a risk. The question though is, how much of Deere's revenue & profit is based upon repair?
S
@Philip Eriksson Services are a steady and reliable source of revenue for companies which sell capital goods. This will tend to depress the growth of such revenues, though how much cannot reasonably be estimated. Aside from volume of services sold, DE will have to keep its rates down so as to avoid farmers' doing their own servicing, One issue is what position DE can take when the farmers try to service themselves, and do so in a faulty manner, and then look for help.
Investor_JR profile picture
Thank you for a good article.
DE's business is definitely cyclical. But that concern seems overblown. This stock has been locked in Valuetrap for 2 years and 2 months. Until this year, the order has already been set. From 2024, sales over the next five years are unlikely to decline significantly. The adoption of AI technologies has greatly expanded the added value. In addition, the industry is changing from a simple machinery business to a technology monopoly business. Similar to ISRG, it can be given multiples. I don't think there is a significant downside to the share price. It is likely to be supported at around $300 per share. Upside is over 100%.
1. Healthy balance sheet
2. Long-term annual average cash flow of $10B
3. Multiple for FCF of 30x.
The stock has a fair value of over $800.
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Lion capital Thanks! And great comment. I have been contemplating when to continue purchasing shares. But, time and patience are on our side to purchase little by little at favorable prices.
Seeking ROI profile picture
Given your "hold" recommendation, do you consider AGCO a better alternative at this point. I believe AGCO has some excellent SaaS capability. What are your thoughts?
Philip Eriksson profile picture
@Seeking ROI hey good question. I've looked a bit into AGCO in the past as well as now recently. From what I understand, they are focused on digital farm-management tools & precision agriculture (similar to John Deere), but from what I understand AGCO has not released an autonomous tractor (as Deere has). Deere has actually already launched a fully autonomous working tractor that is being used in pilot projects, which is incredible, while AGCO has some autonomous robots (www.futurefarming.com/...). Another thing i would like to mention about the companies is that Deere had operating margins of around 24% last quarter (expecting 25-26% FY) whereas AGCO had 11-12%. I believe DE's high margins are a reflection of there incredible products and strong brand name.
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